Bad Game Design - Stalker, Infested, Etc.

[BlackCoMerc]

He darkens your screen during his stupid taunts, making it harder to see - and enjoy - your gaming experience. That's problem number 1, and he isnt even on screen yet: You are actively decreasing enjoyment already.

 

He then spawns in - good luck finding him on frantic missions, such as Excavation - and one shots you. Boom; dead. And I'm talking about rank 30 frames here with Redirection 1-2 ranks from max, not some low rank frame I just started using. This is not fun.

 

In fact, nothing about Stalker is fun. Nothing. Not the taunts. Not the screen effects. Not the automatic need to revive just because you feel like punishing me for playing your game. Nothing.

 

 

You lock frames behind grind walls that locked behind grind walls. We deal with it. You lock anything useful behind a grind wall or a wait wall or both. and we deal with it. You introduce dozens of new enemy attacks that rob players of control and half the time of their ability to even see the game play on their screen. And we deal with it. 

 

But how much is too much, DE? How many of these things can you shove on us before its simply more than most players are willing to deal with? Any more I think this game is more social experiment than video game - grind them down until they just stop playing so we can finally turn off the servers without being the bad guys. 

 

Give us back control. Give us useful loot. Stop with the one shot deaths, the cheap tactics of invulnerable enemies and taking control from the player and let us play an enjoyable game the bulk of which is locked away behind time and remorseless grind barriers.

 

Because I dont know exactly how much is too much. But I think I'm not too far from finding out.

[homiedudemanguy]

well stalker isnt fun in general but he is definitely not OP like that at all...many people hunt him really. and one shot him... definitely has become a punching bag for his weapons and such, i wish he turned into an actual threat than anything

[BlackCoMerc]

well stalker isnt fun in general but he is definitely not OP like that at all...many people hunt him really. and one shot him... definitely has become a punching bag for his weapons and such, i wish he turned into an actual threat than anything

He is a glass cannon. I recognize that. 

 

The problem is that he is an extremely stealthy glass cannon, often spawning into the middle of already hectic firefights, then on shotting the player before you have a chance to see him, more less defend yourself. 

 

Nothing about this is fun. 

 

Even players who hunt him only offer thoughts such as, 'He isnt all that hard' and 'We can one shot him, too.' Great; now tell me what about Stalker is actually FUN. Because so far, no one has been able to do so. Kind of like Manic and the new Infested that way.

 

Last time I checked, I played game to have fun. And Warframe is getting less and less fun by the week.

[WaRDeMoN787]

Reminds me of how I use to feel, until I maxed all my mods. After that he becomes pretty easy. If the flickering bothers you try upping the brightness, it helped me out. :) best thing to do with the stalker is run, if he's yours, and let your teammates deal damage towards him.

[-Mandachordian-Tenno-]

 the Stalker is abit ironed-out now, some few kinks but it's working as intended. if you wanted an easy game maybe you've been acclimatized with the fact that games should spoonfeed you.

i'd agree on grind walls being a little bit steep, but this is because most players are actually grinding more often than not, this is a way for DE to prolong the game distraction, would hope for a rechange even for a bit.

Enemy CC seems to be varied, but i think this is also working as intended.

[DecapitatingJim]

Mate Stalker hasn't killed me in almost a year. The trick with stalker?

 

Think for half a second.

 

The screen flashes so you know he's on the way so why not use that couple of seconds to prepare? Reload and move to a spot where you can engage him without distractions. Yes even in Survival and excavation. Find an empty room or use an AOE to give yourself some breathing room. When he does spawn, he has a short standing up time before he moves, Use this to put a mark on him so you can track his movements. 

 

Make sure you have a decent weapon out and not some half ranked mastery fodder gun. If you don't have one of those on you then tough, if you have a mark expect an encounter on every map and prepare accordingly.

 

After he spawns don't stand still. He can one shot you, but he doesn't have hitscan, so don't give him the chance to get that one hit kill on you. Keep something between you and him, and never stop moving. Do not get close to him, if he takes out Hate or Despair you're pretty much boned. As long as he has Dread you can keep avoiding him. 

 

Stalker is a glass cannon that requires a small amount of planning and preparation before engaging. If you're struggling against him, then you have to improve. Stalker is actually pretty damn easy once you get the feel for his attack and movement patterns. 

 

So to summarize:

Screen flashes? Stop. Realize what's coming for you. Get yourself some cover and breathing room. Make sure everything is reloaded. When he spawns put a mark on him and keep your distance. 

Edited July 26, 2015 by DecapitatingJim

[(PSN)WiiConquered]

I actually don't mind the Stalker, because he is one enemy that appears in a rare scenario that can be kind of fun. But when every other Grineer hits like the Stalker (with hitscan weapons to boot) that's just annoying.

[H3RRD0KT0R]

I cant really agree, its not like he spawns out of nowhere slash dashing you from the shadows, there s the flickering lights, then he spawns kneeling and then slowly stand up, most of the time you can one shot him before he even does anything...

[CheeZeWiz]

Just because you suck at dealing with stalker doesn't mean we all do. How about you ready his wiki entry and figure out how he works, instead of whining about it. 

[BlackCoMerc]

Biggest problem with Stalker - he always comes at me when I am alone. This last time: Triton, with Nyx to get keep enemies off the Excavators. Didnt matter that I had a maxed Hek (300% Multishot) and a maxed Vaykor Marelok with all the bells and multishot whistles.

 

I never saw him.

 

Even with Chaos active, I never had a chance. Too much going on screen to stop and look for him. 

 

Maybe next time, I will just sit there in Absorb mode with a Recharger under me...cause that's a fun way to be forced to play the game.

[DecapitatingJim]

Biggest problem with Stalker - he always comes at me when I am alone. This last time: Triton, with Nyx to get keep enemies off the Excavators. Didnt matter that I had a maxed Hek (300% Multishot) and a maxed Vaykor Marelok with all the bells and multishot whistles.

 

I never saw him.

 

Even with Chaos active, I never had a chance. Too much going on screen to stop and look for him. 

 

Maybe next time, I will just sit there in Absorb mode with a Recharger under me...cause that's a fun way to be forced to play the game.

Then how about you chaos, then move to an empty room while he's still spawning? He'll spawn wherever you are. Put some distance between you and the enemies. 

 

If you're on Excavation then that's even easier, the enemies will focus on the drills so let them. Move to somewhere empty and prepare to take on Stalker. If the drill dies, who gives a S#&$? There's no penalty at all for losing them. 

 

Being alone isn't an excuse. I'm pretty much a solo player and I still can't remember the last time he's actually killed me. 

Edited July 26, 2015 by DecapitatingJim

[Dillon_J]

stalker isn't supposed to be "fun".  he has been following you for an extended period of time waiting to strike when you are at your weakest.  He is literally a stalker, an assassin of the night.  You should be glad he even announces himself at all instead of instant death.  The reason the effect is so dramatic is to alert your allies he is arriving since they do not receive a message, only the one being attacked.  Honestly they should remove his warning. he should just come out of nowhere.

[letir]

Well, some people like spooky elements. It's their fun.

[Konga]

Is someone getting mad over Stalkypoo making the lights flicker a bit? Wha. Also, dude, if you dont like the enemies oneshotting you, get out of the T4 void and go back to Jupiter or something. 

 

Biggest problem with Stalker - he always comes at me when I am alone. This last time: Triton, with Nyx to get keep enemies off the Excavators. Didnt matter that I had a maxed Hek (300% Multishot) and a maxed Vaykor Marelok with all the bells and multishot whistles.

 

I never saw him.

 

Even with Chaos active, I never had a chance. Too much going on screen to stop and look for him. 

 

Maybe next time, I will just sit there in Absorb mode with a Recharger under me...cause that's a fun way to be forced to play the game.

 

Maybe next time you should think before casting Chaos. Think a moment, hes immune to abilities, and can also dispel them at will. Whats it gonna do? Also, hes easy to spot, he'll teleport next to you and stand up. Just hold still and dont freak out until hes up. Nobodies forcing you to use Absorb, btw. And a recharger? You mean energy restore? I'm not certain that even works on that ability. Please dude, check your stuff.

 

The grind wall?.. Not sure you'd call it a wall, honestly, but the grind is there, and I believe the new star chart will fix at least some of it. Give DE some time, its not easy making WF. 

[.corvon.]

I cant really agree, its not like he spawns out of nowhere slash dashing you from the shadows, there s the flickering lights, then he spawns kneeling and then slowly stand up, most of the time you can one shot him before he even does anything...

Good username, medic ftw.

———

Anyways, you probably have a lightly armored frame on and/or there are a lot of enemies attacking you at once. Try clearing the area before you deal with him.

And keeping a cool temper about it might help.

[KoshLovesYou]

He's honestly there to eat revives, and to encourage players to have multiple warframes to keep playing on, which requires getting plat either from trading or from a direct purchase, or to wait and come back. 

 

That isn't a disagreement with your post, however, OP. I honestly agree with a lot of sentiments (did you know his Nyx style absorb can also one shot defense objectives? Fuuuun.), but he can be easily defeated once you reach a certain threshold.

[bad4youLT]

He darkens your screen during his stupid taunts, making it harder to see - and enjoy - your gaming experience. That's problem number 1, and he isnt even on screen yet: You are actively decreasing enjoyment already.

 

He then spawns in - good luck finding him on frantic missions, such as Excavation - and one shots you. Boom; dead. And I'm talking about rank 30 frames here with Redirection 1-2 ranks from max, not some low rank frame I just started using. This is not fun.

 

In fact, nothing about Stalker is fun. Nothing. Not the taunts. Not the screen effects. Not the automatic need to revive just because you feel like punishing me for playing your game. Nothing.

 

 

You lock frames behind grind walls that locked behind grind walls. We deal with it. You lock anything useful behind a grind wall or a wait wall or both. and we deal with it. You introduce dozens of new enemy attacks that rob players of control and half the time of their ability to even see the game play on their screen. And we deal with it. 

 

But how much is too much, DE? How many of these things can you shove on us before its simply more than most players are willing to deal with? Any more I think this game is more social experiment than video game - grind them down until they just stop playing so we can finally turn off the servers without being the bad guys. 

 

Give us back control. Give us useful loot. Stop with the one shot deaths, the cheap tactics of invulnerable enemies and taking control from the player and let us play an enjoyable game the bulk of which is locked away behind time and remorseless grind barriers.

 

Because I dont know exactly how much is too much. But I think I'm not too far from finding out.

 

1. stalker suposed to be a chalange , mark him , be a god dam ninja avoid arows and you can deal whit him , whit squad its even easyers .

 

2. the game is f2p , its busnes DE has to make money some how , you have to work and wait to get something or pay money to get it , I been playing f2p games for some time and warframe has propably most fair model ( and before to mention tf2 , tf2 wasesnt made f2p in first )

 

3. A lot of pleople been asking for chalange and thoes DE made nulifaers , grek masters , manics , jugernaut , riot moa , you have to find ways to deal whit whem weakling arent welcome in the batlefield.

 

4. RNG is RNG deal whit it , its just like in others games to.

 

edit: pardon my bad english

Edited July 26, 2015 by bad4youLT

[InoxMaximus]

wut ? I like the screen affects and the taunts, i want MOREEE

[(PSN)ZammnZaddy]

ROFL are you really complaining about one of the easiest enemies that mark you to defeat? lol either get better at the game or move on to another that's easy for new players it's simple

Edited July 26, 2015 by (PS4)GHOSTBEAST1000

[(PSN)ZammnZaddy]

Also the infested are not hard at all lol all you need is good mods.

Edited July 26, 2015 by (PS4)GHOSTBEAST1000

[Wolfssenger]

He darkens your screen during his stupid taunts, making it harder to see - and enjoy - your gaming experience. That's problem number 1, and he isnt even on screen yet: You are actively decreasing enjoyment already.

He then spawns in - good luck finding him on frantic missions, such as Excavation - and one shots you. Boom; dead. And I'm talking about rank 30 frames here with Redirection 1-2 ranks from max, not some low rank frame I just started using. This is not fun.

In fact, nothing about Stalker is fun. Nothing. Not the taunts. Not the screen effects. Not the automatic need to revive just because you feel like punishing me for playing your game. Nothing.

You lock frames behind grind walls that locked behind grind walls. We deal with it. You lock anything useful behind a grind wall or a wait wall or both. and we deal with it. You introduce dozens of new enemy attacks that rob players of control and half the time of their ability to even see the game play on their screen. And we deal with it.

But how much is too much, DE? How many of these things can you shove on us before its simply more than most players are willing to deal with? Any more I think this game is more social experiment than video game - grind them down until they just stop playing so we can finally turn off the servers without being the bad guys.

Give us back control. Give us useful loot. Stop with the one shot deaths, the cheap tactics of invulnerable enemies and taking control from the player and let us play an enjoyable game the bulk of which is locked away behind time and remorseless grind barriers.

Because I dont know exactly how much is too much. But I think I'm not too far from finding out.

Seeing as you have only played a few months I think you should take a chill pill. Stalker is a joke, I've solod him with both frames and weapons i was leveling for mastery. Keep moving, stick to cover, light him up when he uses his crappy hate, ggwp l2p stalker nub.

Personally seeing and being killed by the stalker for the first time two years ago was one of the coolest and vengeance inducing events i had in this game. I still pummel the little $#!t with extreme prejudice to this day and teabag him to death after i beat him.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

My thoughts on bad mechanics from an older thread:

 

 

I like the mechanic of regening shield with non-regening health and limited health pick-ups.  I would like to see more shooters return to this as opposed to hiding behind cover until the red jams slides off your screen.  However, this system is pointless when it is subverted by things such as Toxic or Slash. There is no real skill involved with it, as it stands.

 

AT THE VERY LEAST, I would like to see status bars added.  That way when you are exposed to something like toxic, you get a bar that pops up and when it fills completely, you are afflected with the status ailment. That way you have a warning and time to get the hell out of the way. It makes the system less numbers-based, more skill-based, less cheap, and just more fun in general.

 

EDIT: I am talking about a bar that takes a few seconds to fill, not 10 seconds+ without mods as some people seem to think. It makes the status effects more fair but doesn't render them harmless either.

[BlackCoMerc]

Nowhere was I complaining because these enemies are hard. They can be hard, at times and depending on circumstances. That's true. 

 

But it has nothing to do with this thread.

 

I was complaining because they arent FUN. Because. They. Are. NOT. Fun. They do not add enjoyment to the game. They do not make the game more fun to play. They are an annoyance, a cheap method for forcing revives, which in turns forces the need for more frames, which encourages plat purchases. 

 

I play games to have fun. Challenge is fun. Being one-shotted at random times, just because I played the game, isnt fun. I dont care how easy or hard they are. Not the Stalker, not the Manic; not the Infested. 

 

What I care about, is people having fun. How much fun do you think a new player is going to have, when he is auto killed as a "reward" for beating his first boss?

 

People play games that are fun. And if people dont play games, the games dont make money. Do we all know what happens to games that dont make money? Or did we all miss THAT point, too.

[Slaviar]

Stalker's one of the most awesome enemies in game. Flickering lights, ghostly whisper and that music... If anything he's too easy, not too hard. He's of course hard for newbies but for experienced players, even solo, he's not that difficult. He can bring excitement to otherwise boring missions.

Personally, I'd like him to draw Hate and engage in duel if player is close enough, blocking and hitting. He usually simply slash dash through you. Coward...

[(XBOX)ZDragonLord X]

First let's start with Stalker:

Sounds like somebody doesn't know how to fight Stalker. Lol does he give you bad dreams? He's SUPOPOSED to be scary, he's SUPPOSED to be challenging.

 

> The screen flashes for less than 2 seconds, if you you say that is a game-breaking mechanic, you need to seriously just quit the game now. It adds a sense of "oh shiz he's coming for me!" to the mission, both in a good or bad way (farming vs fear).

 

> He is an assassin, he's not supposed to beaming with a pillar of light with "hey, here I am!" That would be both idiotic and degrading to his character.

 

> Busy missions? Let's see, what to do in a mob of enemies? Clear them out? Nah. Get to a safe empty area? No, too much work. Use a stealth frame/companion to sneak away? Nah, too much effort. I know, do nothing and complain about it! Yeah!

 

> I can run as a glass frame (limbo, ember, etc) with a maxed redirection/vitality and a decent steel fiber (3-7) and take 2-3 shots. The arrows are fairly easy to dodge as well. Most weapons can destroy Stalker very quickly, check his weaknesses and always carry a weapon that can destroy him. I have my wonderful Galatine that can 1 shot him.

 

I have all of his gear that took me about a year to get. For me he took 5 months just to spawn first time from my first mark. Then I got maybe one visit every other month. Be glad you get to see him at all.

 

Now your other points:

> Grind is a part of the RPG genre. DE is not going to just up and give you their best gear. RNG is also a major part in any game. If you want to be spoonfed, you need to just leave.

 

> Infested are IMO the easiest race to fight against. Fire imbused slash melee, done.

 

> We have control, we have good loot most of the time (depending on RNG), and we have good management of the game (unlike *cough* Destiny *cough*). If you want a game that babies to your needs, go play almost anything from Nintendo.

 

Edit: PS, Stalker has been hinted at getting a major rework to be even more feared as Manics have begun to outfear him. Lol will love to see your reaction then.

Edited July 26, 2015 by (XB1)ZDragonLord X