Parkour 2.0 (U17 Megathread Topic)

[[DE]Danielle]

 

U17 brings major changes to player movement with the introduction of Parkour 2.0. Discuss your experiences with the new movement system here! 

 

The following additions and changes to key mechanics have been made to improve the Space Ninja experience: 

 

 

• Double Jump: Players can now use a second jump while in mid-air. Players will be able to jump again immediately after touching any surface or enemy.

• Bullet Jump: Pressing the ‘Jump’ button after sliding will send the player into a mid-air dash, temporarily improving movement speed. Players can use a Bullet Jump as a double jump in any direction.

• Wall Latch: Pressing the ‘Right Mouse Button’ button against a wall will allow players to latch onto flat surfaces for a limited duration. Players may fire their equipped Primary or Secondary weapon while using Wall Latch.
• ​Wall Dash:  Pressing the ‘Jump’ button while against any surface will allow players to hop along the surface in any direction.  This can be used to scale vertical surfaces, and can be chained indefinitely.
• ​Aim Gliding:  Using the ‘Aim’ button while in mid-air will slow the player’s fall speed, enabling a slow glide that players can fire their weapon in any direction from.
• Ziplines:  Pressing X while near a zipline will allow players to jump directly onto the zipline.  Players can now run or dash along ziplines, and X to jump on a zipline can be done after a double jump.
   
• Stamina has now been removed from the game
• Parrying now only blocks a base percentage of incoming damage.
       - Channeling while parrying will block 100% of incoming damage, and reflect a percentage of the damage back       at the cost of Energy.

 

 

Chroma + Stamina Related Changes: 

• Chroma's green energy perk now gives a buff to holster and reload speed instead of affecting Stamina.
• Mods that previously affected Stamina have now been converted to the appropriate level Fusion Core.
• All Alternate Helmets that had Stamina-related effects have been given new abilities:

             - Arcane Chorus Helmet: This helmet is worn by Banshee, and adds Power Efficiency, but reduces duration  
                of Aim Glide and Wall Latch 
             - Arcane Flux Helmet: This helmet is worn by Nova, and increases duration of Aim Glide and Wall latch, but
                reduces Health.
             - Arcane Storm Helmet: This helmet is worn by Volt, and increases Power Strength, but reduces duration of
                Aim Glide and Wall Latch.
             - Arcane Gambit Helmet: This helmet is worn by Vauban, and increases velocity of parkour maneuvers, with  
               a reduction to Power Duration.
             - Arcane Scorpion Helmet:This helmet is worn by Ash, increases duration of Aim Glide and Wall Latch while
               sacrificing Power Efficiency.
             - Arcane Menticide Helmet: This helmet is worn by Nyx, increases velocity of parkour maneuvers with a drain
               on Shields.

 

 

 

*PLEASE NOTE*

The above thread is for feedback only, if you have a bug to report please post them in the U17 BUG REPORT MEGATHREAD. Thank you!

 

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

U17 MEGATHREAD NAVIGATION: 

(Coming soon) NEW QUEST: NATAH  l NEW WARFAME: EQUINOX l PARKOUR 2.0 l URANUS TILESET EXPANSION l NEW WEAPONS l NEW MODS l FROST REWORK l SHOTGUN BUFFS l CONCLAVE CHANGES AND ADDITIONS 

[Sajt]

Im going to barge the Rhino into the china room. I already miss coptering. Ran a few missions with the new parkour system and me and my clan love it. The options the verticality is great. The feel of the thing is perfect. Then i just want to run a bit faster and it hits a brick wall. Yes the new dash is awesome but it launches me into the air, wich is great at most ocasions, yet there are tilesets where room is limited and it actualy makes me hit walls,

 

Coptering could have been another asset as now there is no way to increase my momentum on the ground. Maybe keep the weapon slide attack the same but add this as a warframe stat? Or use the new utility system to give slides and slide attacks a boost.

 

Generaly the parkour and the air movement is amazing but the ground movement is limited now. Either you go to air or you slug around. 

[SlyStrike5]

Been enjoying the changes, but the fact that I have to press sprint again after every slide now (after releasing crouch, used to be you could just hold shift and keep sprinting) is messing with my rhythm.

[Void_Vis_Vires]

Can you aim glide when you melee weapon is equiped? So far its not working for me. =/

[Rakshal]

After a slide you stop sprinting, even when holding shift.

 

It is kinda annoying to have to keep repressing shift.

Edited July 31, 2015 by Rakshal

[rehspuhkuh]

but the fact that I have to press sprint again after every slide now (after releasing crouch, used to be you could just hold shift and keep sprinting) is messing with my rhythm.

 

Same here. This change wasn't mentioned anywhere in the patch notes nor livestream demonstrations. Would like to know if this is a bug or an intentional change. Feels like a bug and it doesn't feel good.

[SirSkellington]

My smile and optimism for this game are gone. I want my coptering and simple but highly effective parkour back. This new parkour is slow, clunky, sticky, and just not appealing. It doesn't seem to be something a space ninja would do. If simply kicking off a wall would help maintain contact with said wall, wouldn't it just make more sense to crawl along the wall, or slide across it?

[Shifted]

Crouch feels kinda unresponsive now. Ignores the inputs if pressed during bullet jump.

[MochaNeko]

Definitely loving Parkour 2.0. The movements are amazing. It's going to take me a while to stop doing aerial melee though. It's like it's ingrained after all that time.

 

One thing though, is the tutorial re-doable? The tutorial was super easy, but it felt too short and I'm not sure I have everything down. I know a few things I've forgotten. The one thing I can remember the most is actually one that wasn't in the tutorial (the "advanced move" Rebecca did in the last Dev stream).

 

TL;DR - new movements are fantastic, but would love an extended tutorial or at least the ability to re-play it.

[Ryjeon]

Initial Impressions from a melee oriented player

 

+ Aim Gliding feels good combos nicely with aerial melee for style kills

+ Double Jump gives some nice bounciness to combat

+ Slide and Aerial Melee are still good for short redirections and in melee combat. Slide Mechanics are still intact

. Bullet Jump seems like a reskinned slower and less maneuverable slide-jump. Maybe when I get used to it and try the velocity enhancing mods I'll get more from it.

- Wall-Hop is less satisfying then previous wall-run. Wall-vault is sorely missed. Going up is faster but adds nothing to horizontal movement.

 

So now I grab walls less then previously and spend more time flying and sliding around. Aim-Glide is the most exciting new feature. It just about makes up for the loss of the wall-vault.

 

3 hours in: I picked up the Mobility mod and started to feel more control and more dynamic interactions. I found I could dodge-roll in the air now, and started to get a little better bullet-jumping from a wall-latch. It's all clicking for me now and I'm looking forward to getting better at it. The aerial control feels great. I do have a harder time jumping up to second floors though in comparison to old aerial melee. Maybe when I have a better grasp of bullet jump I'll be able to use it better vertically.

 

Overall I like the system. But I think wall-running should be re-introduced as something you can do from a wall-latch.

 

3rd Edit: I'm really enjoying the new system more and more every time I play it. I was worried that the maneuvers would feel "dumbed down" compared to the previous system. But it really has even more depth and power than before. I'm happy it didn't introduce any new keybinds and fit right into the approach I was already using. Once I started using the aerial "dodge roll" I started learning how to gain more control over the system. I still think I have a ways to go learning how to make the most of using walls. But the changes are already feeling very rewarding and refreshing.

 

** 5 weeks later: The new Parkour is definitely more finicky than the previous system. But I see that it also might have more potential. The quick horizontal re-positioning power of coptering worked quite well. It's harder to recreate that with the current leaping somersault consistently. Maybe I feel that way comparing playing a few months on one system to two years on another. Perhaps two years on 2.0 will straighten me out. I miss the strengths of the old system. But I'm glad there are new things to learn with the new.

Edited September 9, 2015 by Ryjeon

[Ryjeon]

Can you aim glide when you melee weapon is equiped? So far its not working for me. =/

 

Bind Aim and Block to the same button. Works well for me. I have both bound to shift. In general their functions don't overlap and they both have the property of anchoring your camera orientation. Block-Glide makes me feel like batman.

Edited July 31, 2015 by Ryjeon

[Cerenax]

The worst thing about movement in warframe before u17 (and what parkour 2.0 was supposed to fix) was that the engine handled inertia and momentum in bad ways, for starters; collision with static and solid surfaces does not immediately brings you to a stop, thus if you run into a wall at a very high speed you will continue to be pushed against it by a 'ghost force' for a few instants. This force happens to be your momentum which is slowly dwindling instead of simply being broken on impact.

 

But this was not the worst part of the 'ghost momentum' phenomenon, the worst part was how it affected directional melees; melee strikes did not seem to be able to differentiate when your character were moving at a high velocity or a low velocity. Thus if you were moving at a certain direction at a very slow speed (ex: 0,5 m/s) while wielding a very fast 'coptering melee (ex: Tipedo) and you quickly looked sideways and threw a sliding melee strike, you would be violently pushed diagonally to the direction you threw your melee strike into! As through your sideways velocity were much faster than it actually was. This affected air melees as well: If you were doing a straight upwards wallrun, did a wall jump backwards and tried to do a air melee in the forwards and upwards direction at the apex of the jump when there is very little momentum pushing you backwards, you would be strongly pushed upwards, but not forwards.

 

But did parkour 2.0 fix the weird way in how the game treats momentum in order to make movement smarter in general? No. Instead it just changed it so that any momentum acquired from a quick movement such as sliding or bullet jumping quickly dwindles once the animation ends (like you were hitting a wall in the old system, only all the time). Bullet jumping carries on the same bugs as coptering in that momentum left from a previous movement can strongly displace the direction of the following bullet jump away from where you were aiming.

 

Wallrunninghopping is also carrying on old issues, having any bit of leftover momentum can prevent you from doing a wall hop and this makes the whole system feels unresponsive.

 

And the nerf to the momentum acquired from melee slide attacks only hides the fact that old bugs persist, 'ghost momentum' is not as perceptible when the momentum in question is many times lower, but if you try to spam bullet jump you will see that the issues are still there.

 

The end result is that movement feels just as clunky as aways, but now - with the quickness in which momentum is lost - what we achieved is that quick movements such as bullet dodge make coming out of their animations feel even sluggier than before. Movement as a whole feels way too slow now.

 

EDIT:

 

I did like to add that most of the issues with parkour 2.0 all relate to bullet jump in one or the other way. It is a poorly fleshed out movement in several ways. For starters, look at this gif of me trying to perform a bullet jump in a straight line:

 

http://i.imgur.com/1waSKnr.gifv

 

As you can see from the gif, bullet jump contains a glitch that makes it tilt itself towards the right away from the direction the player is aiming to under some circumstances. This glitch happens with varying intensities (sometimes it pushes away from the direction you are aiming by 45º+ and at other times it just pushes slightly and almost imperceptibly). I can't quite put my finger to all the circumstances that cause this glitch, but I have noted that it happens more often when the player has tried to chain it in a combo of speed gathering movements.

 

Additionally, bullet jump seems to 'cancel' any momentum that was acquired before it was executed and aways starts out at the default sprint speed of the warframe, this happens to such a degree that if you execute a bullet jump with an warframe that had his base sprint speed increased (by means of mods such as rush and armored agility or the arcane vanguard helmet) bullet jump will actually reduce your speed as it starts out. A movement that is supposed to be the base for speedy movement under the new system should never cancel the speed that has been acquired before it is executed.

 

I have a theory that the reason for the bullet jump bug I have described might be that sometimes bullet jump tries to cancel the player's momentum, but fails and transforms it into a rightwards force.

 

This issue of 'momentum canceling' tied to bullet jumping also spreads out to parkour 2.0 as a whole since momentum conservation no longer exists when you aren't doing movements such as slides or double jumps, ceasing to do these momentum preserving movements causes an immediate loss of momentum that feels slow and unnatural (it feels like you were walking in the bottom of a pool). For this reason, some players even figured out that the fastest way to move currently is to constantly spam 2 of the only few movements that still preserve momentum (double jumping and rolling). This means that players who seek to gain speed are forced to skip bullet jump entirely.

 

Yet another issue we have with bullet jump is that while it grants good vertical mobility it has very poor horizontal mobility. The velocity it grants when aimed to the horizon is three times smaller than the one it grants when aimed upwards. It is also not a immediate boost in speed, but a slow acceleration from the beginning to the ending of the animation (which takes quite long to fully play btw).

 

Adding to this poor horizontal mobility that bullet jump offers, we have the fact that no movement in parkour 2.0 can grant a quick horizontal impulse while maintaining the player close to the ground. This leads to players constantly colliding with ceilings and low doorways while attempting to gather speed, which feels very clumsy and unpleasant. This lack of horizontal impulses that maintain level altitude is also particularly hurtful to melee weapons, since hitting enemies in melee requires being on the same level of height as them and most melee combos can't move the player forward (see, for example, Crimson Dervish).

 

In short, parkour 2.0 must be improved with:

 

*More momentum conservation when there are no collisions against walls.

*An faster bullet jump (the amount of time between the start and the ending of the animation should be smaller).

*More horizontal impulse and speed with bullet jump.

*A way to gain immediate horizontal impulse while staying close to the ground.

Edited August 3, 2015 by lvl999ArchNecromancerIRL

[Casardis]

The "ghost force" is easily noticeable by performing bullet jump in the Liset.

 

But I do have to agree with this reply.

 

None of that is about parlour 2.0.

If the moment is of the root engine is still an issues that that can be corrected.

Parlour 2.0 is about the movement abilities themselves.

Edited July 31, 2015 by Casardis

[SilentMobius]

None of that is about parlour 2.0.

If the moment is of the root engine is still an issues that that can be corrected.

Parlour 2.0 is about the movement abilities themselves.

[Charoy]

I already miss my tipedo :(

 

From parkour 2.0, I only like the aim glide.

[ComfyOlivia]

None of that is about parlour 2.0.

If the moment is of the root engine is still an issues that that can be corrected.

Parlour 2.0 is about the movement abilities themselves.

  

This is definitely something that should be noted. It's the engine folks.

I already miss my tipedo :(

 

From parkour 2.0, I only like the aim glide.

Keep played, friend. The coptering was broken. You'll get used to it.

[KiteoHatto]

The only thing that bugs me about the new movement system is glide and wall running.

 

Glide just feels really static and stiff and i dont know if im doing something wrong but you can't change the direction once you start gliding.

 

Wallrunning is...a lot more active now, but it's almost too much effort to do it now.

 

OH, another annoying thing is the camera shake during wall grab is a tad too strong in my opinion.

 

I can't believe DE missed an opportunity to implement charged jumps(hold space bar and release before grab runs out) from wall grabs, it would have been perfect.

Edited July 31, 2015 by kiteohatto

[Hrodgrim]

I would like to add that the second jump resets your vertical velocity if chained from a bullet jump. If anything, it should add to the velocity. Also, sprint speeds across the board are much too slow.

[Psycho1848]

New Tutorial Fail:

Last Part Zipline: The Tooltip say´s just press "space" but nothing about pressing "x" it seems like there´s a second Tooltip in the middle of the Line but i just saw it for a half second dunno what it says.

 

(german Version)

[Ralathar44]

Love Parkour 2.0 with the exception of wall hop.  I like the increased mobility in the wall hop but it's lame and less precise than wall running.  Gimme my wall running back with no stamina limitations....I want to be a space ninja not a space bunny...

Edited July 31, 2015 by Ralathar44

[zoboso]

reserving this post for comparing the timers on aim glide and wall latch to stamina. Will update after testing.

 

Edit: testing complete. The similarities are uncanny but with both aim glide and wall latch being mechanics that are supposed to be a movement brake, limiting that brake feels totally different than the stamina system which basically is a brake. Good work DE.

Edited August 2, 2015 by zoboso

[Mr__D]

Hi there DE people

 

Just two small things I`m having problems with:

 

Right now I can`t use ziplines, wether with the jumpbutton on my xbox360-controller nor with the spacekey of my keybord.

 

I like the additional types of movement you added. Except for one.In exchange for the wallhopping you kicked out wallrunning,both horizontal and vertical and also the backsalto which is sad.

The thing is: for the first time I`m having trouble to move along the pipes and ventilations in Grineerlevels. Also the wallrunning looked better in my opinion. (No offense, I`m not a troll, please don`t shoot me. Just a gentle orc.

[weezedog]

So wall jumping is almost like wall running. It feels pretty good. You don't have to hold down sprint even. You just have to hold down jump and that's all. The animation for horizontal wall jumping is much improved, it's like a cross between running and jumping. It's like long-stride running.

Vertical wall jumping still very much looks like hopping and not the Matrix-style vertical running we are used to, but I suppose that is the trade off for unlimited vertical climbing. The benefits definitely are there.

[Buzkyl]

Animation wise it might get used to, but control wise it's pretty much the same. If you hold space you run at your current rate, spamming space horizontally allows you to climb to fall. During any point you can wall latch to attack or stop yourself.

[S7ORM]

Been enjoying the changes, but the fact that I have to press sprint again after every slide now (after releasing crouch, used to be you could just hold shift and keep sprinting) is messing with my rhythm.

 

Oh? That does sound horrible. Sounds to me like a bug though -- at least, I hope like hell it is.