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[DE]Danielle

Shotgun Buffs (U17 Megathread Topic)

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Boar Prime is WORSE after the change than before and here is proof:

 

 

Exact same build. It now takes more ammo to kill in more time with a longer reload. Also it can no longer proc enough to remove armor quickly and completely before killing the target so if the targets are even higher level than this it will take significantly longer to kill than just slightly.

Even if it was the exact same that would still not be a buff.

Come on, do you have absolutely no internal quality control?

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Boar Prime is WORSE after the change than before and here is proof:

 

 

Exact same build. It now takes more ammo to kill in more time with a longer reload. Also it can no longer proc enough to remove armor quickly and completely before killing the target so if the targets are even higher level than this it will take significantly longer to kill than just slightly.

Even if it was the exact same that would still not be a buff.

Come on, do you have absolutely no internal quality control?

#SaveTheBoar!

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so the patch actually LOWERED the boar primes DPS not increased it......so much for the "2 or 3 times more damage in ideal ranges."

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so the patch actually LOWERED the boar primes DPS not increased it......so much for the "2 or 3 times more damage in ideal ranges."

 

excuse me wile i remove the foot from my mouth, it does indeed do more DPS now. just no where near the 2 or 3 times you had lead us to believe it would. 

 

 

(forgot to add the base damage back into my calculations when doing the math, the first numbers i came up with was just the end DPS on the element damage...)

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excuse me wile i remove the foot from my mouth, it does indeed do more DPS now. just no where near the 2 or 3 times you had lead us to believe it would. 

 

 

(forgot to add the base damage back into my calculations when doing the math, the first numbers i came up with was just the end DPS on the element damage...)

See:

Boar Prime is WORSE after the change than before and here is proof:

 

 

Exact same build. It now takes more ammo to kill in more time with a longer reload. Also it can no longer proc enough to remove armor quickly and completely before killing the target so if the targets are even higher level than this it will take significantly longer to kill than just slightly.

Even if it was the exact same that would still not be a buff.

Come on, do you have absolutely no internal quality control?

It was, indeed, nerfed.

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Also raw damage buffs are boring, meanwhile there's STILL no designated crit viable shotgun.

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See:

It was, indeed, nerfed.

 

it does do more damage then it did, by about 50% but this is far off from where the 2 or 3 times we were told to expect. as it is now this buff does little for the weapon. you can do almost just as much damage with the somaP at all ranges without worrying about fall of or damage spread.  

 

 

only prime shotgun. still not worth using.

 

maybe if the reload was shortly like the patch notes actually suggest it would be different. 

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How about testing it against enemies that aren't ridiculously high level? I would imagine a very high percentage of players never fight level 95 gunners.

 

Also, I don't think they said they would multiply every shotgun's damage by 2x or 3x, only some.

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It's so weird

 

One the one side, the shotguns that needed nothing more than a utility buff, getting a huuuuuge damage buff

 - Dragkoon was perfectly fine, it had virtually no fall-off, now it's much harder to use at mid range. So it's a buff in damage vs a nerf in ease of use

 - Tigris is still the hardest weapon to use in the whole game, and a gazillion damage isn't gonna change that. It only needed a reload speed buff to make it at least bearable to use, and make it a shotgun version of the vectis

 

Nota Bene: I'm not sure this amount of slash damage is any more effective in practice, unless you rely on procs. At least you get more elemental damage.

 

 - Hek is now the best in slot. The damage was already nice, the syndicate mod made ot even better, and now it's almost tripled? wtf

I'm not gonna complain, it's just that it was clearly unnecessary.

 

 

And on the other side you have what seems like random changes that change absolutly nothing or make the weapon even worse 

 - Boar Prime status was nerfed, and it didn't even get a substantial damage buff to compensate.

Trading reload speed for more mag size doesn't change much in terms of dps, nor in terms of practicality

 - The Strun reload nerf is just unexplicable, and we all hope it's only a bug/mistake

 

 

Conclusion: the hek buff is huge, Hek fans are happy.

The rest doesn't change much about the horrible state shotguns are, even making it worse in some cases.

It's just a bit mitigated by the positive fall-off mechanics changes.

It's another failed attempt imo, we already got the same "changes" one year ago. 

 

Scott needs to play more.

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Makes Doom's super shotgun proud:

lJlMwe9.jpg

DOES need a mechanical rework though, needs to have BOTH barrels shoot at once, alt is one barrel.

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How about testing it against enemies that aren't ridiculously high level? I would imagine a very high percentage of players never fight level 95 gunners.

 

Also, I don't think they said they would multiply every shotgun's damage by 2x or 3x, only some.

 

Why not? I do, do I not count? Also if you only want to fight level 20s you didn't even need the damage buffs. Shotguns killed those fine just before, what would be more helpful to you would be utility buffs like bigger magazines, faster reloads and more ammo. The Boar Prime was nerfed in all those aspects as well.

 

And no, they didn't say anything specific about how they'd buff them, they just said everything except the Phage would be buffed. The Boar Prime was not, it takes longer to kill and needs more ammo to do it. There is no defending this that's the exact opposite of what was promised.

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as it is now this buff does little for the weapon

 

As you can see above that actually made it worse. Your dps calculation probably does not factor in procs completely and correctly. The 10% decrease in proc chance (spread across all pellets mind you) is what kills it, even with more damage per shot.

 

Also sorry for the double post, I don't know how to edit my post to include another quote.

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The Strun reload not being interruptable gives it a nasty disadvantage.

Also that single reload animation at least once glitched and my Tenno was reloading the magazinea after every shot, very counterproductive.

Still have to test other shotguns.

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Why not? I do, do I not count? Also if you only want to fight level 20s you didn't even need the damage buffs. Shotguns killed those fine just before, what would be more helpful to you would be utility buffs like bigger magazines, faster reloads and more ammo. The Boar Prime was nerfed in all those aspects as well.

 

And no, they didn't say anything specific about how they'd buff them, they just said everything except the Phage would be buffed. The Boar Prime was not, it takes longer to kill and needs more ammo to do it. There is no defending this that's the exact opposite of what was promised.

I'm not sure why you're assuming I'm using these weapons against level 20 enemies. Well I probably know why - to be condescending - but whatever.

 

They've said that weapons and frames are balanced up to levels 40 or 50. I can't remember the exact number, but it sure as hell was't 95, so I'm guessing their QA process did indeed not include hour+ long T4 survivals. The overall decrease in falloff, and the increase in damage and mag size on the Boar Prime might actually make it a more effective weapon against <50 lvl enemies.

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I'm not sure why you're assuming I'm using these weapons against level 20 enemies. Well I probably know why - to be condescending - but whatever.

They've said that weapons and frames are balanced up to levels 40 or 50. I can't remember the exact number, but it sure as hell was't 95, so I'm guessing their QA process did indeed not include hour+ long T4 survivals. The overall decrease in falloff, and the increase in damage and mag size on the Boar Prime might actually make it a more effective weapon against <50 lvl enemies.

ProTips:
  • You were the one being condescending by saying that his target group and therefore he does not matter.
  • It's worse universally.

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ProTips:

  • You were the one being condescending by saying that his target group and therefore he does not matter.
  • It's worse universally.

 

Did you read the part of my post where I said DE does not balance weapons for his target group? I wasn't being condescending; that's the simple reality of the situation. However, assuming that I'm using these weapons for entry level content because I'm not fighting level 95 enemies is actually pretty condescending.

 

edit: Do you any stats backing up that it is universally worse? Having taken in out for a spin on a T4E, I'd say it feels marginally better than before but honestly I've never used it that much and I haven't invested any forma in it.

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Pretty good overall, except for Boar Prime.

 

Seriously, what the hell. I don't understand what happened there. 

 

 


 

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Why exactly was my post proving the Boar Prime has gotten worse been removed? I'd like an explanation.

Here is the video again for anyone who missed it:

 

Edit: Never mind, the threads got merged in a way that my first post was behind my later posts so I didn't see it.

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So Hek has three times its old damage output.  Awesome.
 

Kohm got no changes other than reduced damage falloff with every Shotgun.  Fair enough.

 

Drakgoon's received a major damage buff despite having no damage falloff.  Perhaps the damage will finally compensate for the clunkiness of handling the thing.

 

Tigris can now tear a black hole through enemies in much of the same way as the Hek.  Cool.

 

Shame about the Strun and Boar series receiving such awkward tweaks.  Really hope that's addressed.

All in all, this turned out better than expected.

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