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$6.66 For A 10 Meter Hallway?


Kahruvel
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I'd be fine with the wait if 80% of the content of U8 wasn't locked behind Clan Dojo research.

I don't think people want grand palaces. They want to be able to do what other people can do. If you can't reasonably do it for free, you can't call it anything but Pay to win. People throwing around platinum will have rocket launchers or laser guns, and people without it won't.

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100 plat worth of items for the rooms, I am ok with, and should earn DE some cash, nice work...... 100 plat for a hallway that is that tiny? no way!

 

Make it 1 Forma for the tiny hallway and increase its length a bit, and 2 Forma for the other connectors at max

 

5 forma for rooms is fine

 

right now its to spendy to make the hallways and make a cool design, we are going to just slap in what we need to get the few rooms we need and that is it, cant drop 5,000 plat to make a few cool corridors

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I'd be fine with the wait if 80% of the content of U8 wasn't locked behind Clan Dojo research.

I don't think people want grand palaces. They want to be able to do what other people can do. If you can't reasonably do it for free, you can't call it anything but Pay to win. People throwing around platinum will have rocket launchers or laser guns, and people without it won't.

Having plat only items for looks in the Dojo is a great idea, and would be really cool.... and 5 Forma for a major room is fine, save up, you want it, so get it...but a damn hallway? hehe no way

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My clan is pretty small and just to make a hallway is going to take at least a week unless someone wants to buy Forma with plat or we get lucky with RNG. And that's before we can even get a reactor in to get bigger rooms. This is extremely punishing to smaller clans.

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According to DE dojos should have been fairly accessible to small number of players that don't want to join a Mega Corp clan, cause you know they joined with 3 other friends to play a 4 man Co-op game, instead we get this S#&$ that costs an alert only material in pretty big quantities of it as well? So basically in a freaking co-op game where the max number of players in a mission is 4, you lock content behind ridiculous concepts like dojo research that costs a S#&$ton to build. Good job is all I have to say.

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5 Forma for a hallway really isnt that much considering how many ways you can get them. Yes, it'll take a smaller clan much longer to build them up without spending plat but it will also take a small clan considerably longer to build up all of the other resources. I think the approach they are taking is one where every single room in your Dojo should be an accomplishment. For smaller clans it'll just be that much more rewarding to finish each new room. 

 

Also where is everyone getting this idea that they are alert only rewards? You can get them in void missions, alerts and as login rewards. 

Edited by FaustNight
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but still, a rare material to make a hallway, can you really justify that? unless they make the forma optional, forma hallway == decorated and shiny, non-forma hallway == simple hallway with minor furnishing, because if you wanna wait for someone to forma their favorite set up 26 times min(6*3 per weapon + 8 for frame), be my guest.

 

Of course a small clan can have what a large clan has, eventually, if the dojo doesn't get infinitely expanded with new content, cause then there is a cap to what you can build, in which case smaller clans eventually catch up.

 

Well yes, that is probably a valid point--maybe the hallway at least is too expensive.  I actually kind of like the idea of a more shabby version of rooms/hallways for the smaller clans that can't afford the bling.

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5 Forma for a hallway really isnt that much considering how many ways you can get them. Yes, it'll take a smaller clan much longer to build them up without spending plat but it will also take a small clan considerably longer to build up all of the other resources. I think the approach they are taking is one where every single room in your Dojo should be an accomplishment. For smaller clans it'll just be that much more rewarding to finish each new room.

"Yeah man look at that new bright corridor we built, ain't it just a beaut'?"

Except it's pretty useless practicaly and the useful rooms cost a fortune to small, tight knit groups. It's a bad game design choice no matter how you look at it. This is a 4 player co-op, just putting an 'MMO' stamp and pretending it actually is one doesn't change it.

It doesn't make you feel satisfied you finished it, it just makes you think that you finished a stupid chore and you have more to go on after that if you want to actually accomplish something.

And I honestly apologize for the 'charged' nature of my comment, I mean no offence, but this update genuinaly upsets me on so many levels and my trust on the devs is pretty severely damaged about their design ideas.

EDIT: Hopefully you don't have to connect rooms with these so smaller clans can avoid the hassle of even building them.

Edited by EchoLG
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Well its too late to make changes with costs because guess what, as soon as they make things slightly easier for smaller clans, the guys who dropped big bucks on the game will be crying on forums about "Why did I have to pay for this, only to see others get it for free or for less?" and then the majority of the people will be happy about the change.  its a tough call on DEs part, but its just how things are in life.  Nothing is fair, nor certain.

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Well, i have a small clan. We are currently 6 people in total, with 2 of us being a bit more active (others play like 2-3 hours a day).

We cant afford the hallway.

 

A clan with 500 members will likely build everything possible in their dojo in a week, maybe slightly more.

 

But for small clans this is a catastrophe.

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How are you going to split platinum/RNG?

 

More importantly, why does this rare material have to be required for a hallway.

 

Let me say that again.

 

A hallway.

 

S25EO.gif

You dont have to buy the formas alone you know.... Thats how you split the prices...

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There is no ingame need to be in a bigger clan but 4 people (a full cell).

 

Why do they force me to put up with people outside of my cell of 4 friends?

We were looking forward to having our very own dojo and now we have to find out that such a dream is impossible in this game.

 

It's really getting on our nerves because the devs seem to think that being in a clan makes the game more socially appealing.

Guess what, it's not.

 

I don't want to run around in a clanhall crowded with 200 other Tenno!

 

If I had wanted that I could have played any other MMO. What were you thinking?

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There is no ingame need to be in a bigger clan but 4 people (a full cell).

 

Why do they force me to put up with people outside of my cell of 4 friends?

We were looking forward to having our very own dojo and now we have to find out that such a dream is impossible in this game.

 

It's really getting on our nerves because the devs seem to think that being in a clan makes the game more socially appealing.

Guess what, it's not.

 

I don't want to run around in a clanhall crowded with 200 other Tenno!

 

If I had wanted that I could have played any other MMO. What were you thinking?

How about you stop wasting time with making complains about the current dojo (its not like they already know that there is an issue about it) and get your tenno in game and gather mats.

If people would put the same effort into mat gathering as they do in complaining, they would definitly already have at least one other room....

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How about you stop wasting time with making complains about the current dojo (its not like they already know that there is an issue about it) and get your tenno in game and gather mats.

If people would put the same effort into mat gathering as they do in complaining, they would definitly already have at least one other room....

Except you need alert material to make rooms or you can farm in these Orokin places, that require keys to enter which is not up to you wether you get or not cause you know, RNG, RNg everywhere. :/

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What, does everyone expect the clan dojos to be grand palaces by day two of U8?  

 

I read your subsequent posts, btw, but I'm choosing to respond to this.

 

No one really expects that, but if you read above and other threads on the same topic, for a clan of 10, it'll take a very long time to build just one hallway. I just mean resources aside from Forma (I can afford forma just fine if need be; I can sugar daddy my clan with forma). Do you really think 6 months is a good amount of time to build one hallway? No weapon crafting, no sparring, just a hallway. Not everyone can play 6 hours a day either, in the most efficient resource farming way possible.

 

And then to  readdress your question, the huge clans will be able to have grand palaces by day two. With 300 members (the biggest clans have way more than that), each person could contribute 2000 ferrite, for 600,000 ferrite. I realize not all 300 members will contribute that amount, but it's quite plausible. As for 10 people, it's not just implausible, it's impossible to do in 2 days, 2 weeks, even 2 months. Clearly if this all came cheap, it would be bad for DE as people would just clamor for more stuff. Other threads have already suggested what to do, and hopefully DE will get some ideas from them. It doesn't make palaces possible for small clans in a few days. It just makes things reasonable, it still gives large clans a clear edge for having so many members, but it doesn't create this gap between one clan working for months to get one room and another getting every room easily within a week.

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Our group has Sixish people playing, and we are currently facing the monolithic task of building our first cross connector hallway, I give it a month or two maybe.  Then after that another couple months for a single generator, then another couple for the prerequisite room to be able to build the reasearch rooms, then who knows how long to build those. And of course, there will have to be more connectors and generators involved there too, because it looks like many of the rooms are dead ends.  Then after at least 6 months we can actually access the greater part of the content added in this update.

 

Judging by looking at every other f2p game out on the market, this looks like the beginning of the grind to gamble to grind more to gamble more stage of progression for the game. 

 

You hope you get lucky and find a key only so you can unlock the thing you hope you get lucky and get a Forma from.  Or you just buy the stuff.  And so begins the money sink on the tools with deep pockets and no self control. The primary source of income for these games.

Edited by SanguineXIII
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What, does everyone expect the clan dojos to be grand palaces by day two of U8?  

 

TIL a short hallway makes a home a grand palace. Brb, gonna drive down to the local apartment complex to dole out the good news.

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I read your subsequent posts, btw, but I'm choosing to respond to this.

 

No one really expects that, but if you read above and other threads on the same topic, for a clan of 10, it'll take a very long time to build just one hallway. I just mean resources aside from Forma (I can afford forma just fine if need be; I can sugar daddy my clan with forma). Do you really think 6 months is a good amount of time to build one hallway? No weapon crafting, no sparring, just a hallway. Not everyone can play 6 hours a day either, in the most efficient resource farming way possible.

 

And then to  readdress your question, the huge clans will be able to have grand palaces by day two. With 300 members (the biggest clans have way more than that), each person could contribute 2000 ferrite, for 600,000 ferrite. I realize not all 300 members will contribute that amount, but it's quite plausible. As for 10 people, it's not just implausible, it's impossible to do in 2 days, 2 weeks, even 2 months. Clearly if this all came cheap, it would be bad for DE as people would just clamor for more stuff. Other threads have already suggested what to do, and hopefully DE will get some ideas from them. It doesn't make palaces possible for small clans in a few days. It just makes things reasonable, it still gives large clans a clear edge for having so many members, but it doesn't create this gap between one clan working for months to get one room and another getting every room easily within a week.

 

I appreciate you saying that you read my other responses.  That context helps both of us I think. Kahruvel would do well to read threads first as well.

 

My position now, after further discourse, is that I think that tying the dojo's size and "richness" to the effort put in by its members is pretty fair.  A smaller clan should have a smaller, or less shiny, dojo.  I do agree that a smaller dojo should be able to build simpler corridors in order to access more of the content provided by the new dojo bits.

 

Hopefully DE will balance that out appropriately, but I still say that the dojo should take considerable effort and sacrifice to build by the players.  It seems to me like a large portion of the player base is just miffed that they need to expend Forma (which they don't have), instead of the resources that they've been banking for so long, and to them I say, have patience and work with your clan.

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What, does everyone expect the clan dojos to be grand palaces by day two of U8?

Appearantly they do, so making long lasting content in a game seems to be bad for people, they oddly want 2 days of content, and then just leaving the game cause you have nothing to do anymore. Edited by tatcher
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How about you stop wasting time with making complains about the current dojo (its not like they already know that there is an issue about it) and get your tenno in game and gather mats.

If people would put the same effort into mat gathering as they do in complaining, they would definitly already have at least one other room....

 

 

Except you need alert material to make rooms or you can farm in these Orokin places, that require keys to enter which is not up to you wether you get or not cause you know, RNG, RNg everywhere. :/

 

I couldn't care less about resources. Take them, take them all!

I can farm those reliably and will eventually have my 50000 alloy plates. No big deal.

 

My problem is Forma because I can't farm it in a reliable fashion.

 

And this is why it is a terrible idea.

Small clans won't buy into this because it costs too much real money.

Huge clans will make a one-time investment and then a huge amount of players will profit from it without spending a piece of platinum.

This will hurt the devs badly. Surely, this can't be in their interest.

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I'm surprised this many people care about the Forma aspect of the Dojos. While I think it sucks due to the vast quantities required I'm far more annoyed by the absurd amount of farming required to actually build the things that the Dojo brings that impact the game play. 390k salvage, 140k polymer bundle, 175k circuits, 15k alloy plate, 35k ferrite and 120k nano spores, and even then you might have to build another cross section just to get all of the buildings placed. The absurd amount of materials there is a massive barrier to entry for any small clan no matter whether or not they have the plat required to buy all the Forma or not. There's no way to speed up the acquisition of materials aside from months of farming by everyone, and perhaps there are people out there who like farming that much, but to me that detracts massively.

The real money aspect is hardly a thing if you can't even get to the point where that's what is stopping you from building the Dojo. I'm not saying that it doesn't need to be addressed, but I am saying that it is not the major problem or barrier here.

For my suggestions on changing and full costs: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/49327-dojo-thoughts-from-someone-not-interested-in-larger-clan-play/

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Is it just me, or does it feel like the person in charge of making changes to DE's economy or adjusting it for new content is this guy:

gqSeA.jpg

I mean, you think that at least for once somebody would try just lowballing their usual guestimate prices. Or ask those people meant to have a help with the development of Warframe. Or even just ask a random person off the streets of London whether these prices sound good or not.

Edited by RealityMachina
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