Decrease Effigy Power Cost On Chroma?

[SgtFlex]

I've been playing chroma for a fair while, and I absolutely love him actually. He's the tankiest mofo that a tank can be. I have a vex armor build, and a effigy/vex armor build going for him

 

On my effigy build tho, I have max efficiency, but unlike other channeling abilities (like Exalted blade, which costs 2.5 energy per second BASE, or so on) it becomes extremely hard to sustain, even at max efficiency, and requires you constantly picking up any energy orbs, and makes it difficult to use any other abilities while effigy is out

 

Without efficiency, or negative, it becomes nigh impossible to use because of how quickly it will drain. Even worse, for the first few seconds it doesn't really attack, it just does some CC that takes about 5 seconds or so, then starts doing what it usually does.

 

I propose at least lowering the base power cost down from 10 energy a second to 7.5 instead.

 

Right now, considering how hard it is to use other abilities with effigy due to it's power cost, I'd rather just stick to my vex armor build

Edited August 3, 2015 by SgtFlex

[Ironlixivium]

Um, exalted blade is the lowest energy consumption channel ult.

 

effigy is pretty on par, actually.

 

Imo we should just be glad we're allowed to pick up energy orbs at all during it.

Edited August 3, 2015 by Ironlixivium

[SgtFlex]

Um, exalted blade is the lowest energy consumption channel ult.

 

effigy is pretty on par, actually.

I realize, but it's also one of the most powerful ults as well

 

I like effigy, but I feel as it's usefullness is just hard to use in conjunction with the rest of chroma's abilities considering how difficult it is to keep it up with energy. Unlike things like soundquake, you have to keep it up if you want to see it's usefullness (at least longer than 30 seconds or so). I feel like Chroma is a mix of a support and a bruiser, but helping him keep effigy out (you should still have to get energy, just not as often) makes him an even better support, especially in things like defense that could help thin the crowd and CC them.

 

As it stands, the effigy isn't even entirely useful due to it's nature of when to use it's CC and when to kill enemies, it's power cost just makes me want to stray farther from an effigy build due to how powerful a vex armor build is.

Edited August 3, 2015 by SgtFlex

[AdunSaveMe]

Um, exalted blade is the lowest energy consumption channel ult.

 

effigy is pretty on par, actually.

Exalted Blade is also powerful as all hell, doesn't weaken the user and isn't controlled by weird AI.

 

Effigy needs to be a bit cheaper to be a more viable option.

Edited August 3, 2015 by AdunSaveMe

[(PSN)COGSPARTAN117]

I agree 100%

 

It's energy cost, and usefulness makes it hardly worth it. Also, it's hard to make a good hybrid build, because of the energy cost.

[Ceryk]

No, I don't think that's a good idea. Effigy is extremely powerful. It's drain cost is appropriate for what it is capable of. This is one of the few powers that is legitimately balanced in the game. I don't want anyone tinkering with it and making it even more powerful.

Edited August 3, 2015 by Ceryk

[IX-44]

No, I don't think that's a good idea. Effigy is extremely powerful. It's drain cost is appropriate for what it is capable of. This is one of the few powers that is legitimately balanced in the game. I don't want anyone tinkering with it and making it even more powerful.

 

So only being able to use it for 35 seconds from a Primed Flow energy bar is okay?

 

I agree that Effigy needs an energy drain change. It's not even viable to use even for a few seconds on a Vex Armor build, you're sacrificing way too much energy.

 

Even if it needs a slight decrease in damage, I'd like to keep it up more often when I'm not 175% efficiency.

[(PSN)zanebrtn]

I would greatly appreciate such a change. It is a beautiful, stylish ultimate that I seldom if ever use because of its hefty cost and often dangerous armor debuff.

Plus, I LOVE chroma's de-pelted look and would welcome anything that would let me marvel at its majestic form for longer.

Edit: this brings to mind an augment idea: effigy now follows you at a distance of about 5 meters and possibly gets an efficiency boost.

Edited August 3, 2015 by (PS4)zanebrtn

[seniledark]

He needs it, I'm all for it.

[Archwizard]

No, I don't think that's a good idea. Effigy is extremely powerful. It's drain cost is appropriate for what it is capable of. This is one of the few powers that is legitimately balanced in the game. I don't want anyone tinkering with it and making it even more powerful.

 

Thing is for Effigy, even with regards to its power, it takes several seconds of activity for the pelt to actually begin its attack - during which time you're just spending energy to lose half your armor.

 

I'd just like them to either reduce the initial cost to make up for the seconds of its uptime lost waiting, or increase the attack speed of the pelt.

Or just have it only burn energy whenever it attacks.

Edited August 3, 2015 by Archwizard

[(PSN)zanebrtn]

Ooh, I like that idea. Only costing energy when it attacks would accomplish a great many things, from the useful to the completely aesthetic.

[(PSN)inuyasha279]

And he still doesn't have the highest drain... poor mesa.

[Sines314]

Or just have it only burn energy whenever it attacks.

 

I'd like that. I like to leave it somewhere to guard one entrance to a room, while I deal with another. But since I deploy it where I stand, and it takes too much energy to leave in place, it usually just wastes energy for most of it's duration. This would be really helpful so that I could really leave it as a Sentry. Otherwise, I'm already there, why don't I just shoot the enemies myself?

 

Alternatively, let it be deployed at a range so I can toss it up at some distant point to keep enemies busy until I'm ready to go over there myself (if the Effigy didn't finish the job).

[swizzybeatzjamz]

Yeah I like this idea it will make chroma my fav frame even better. My only problem with him is effigy drain. And spectral scream range and dmg

[swizzybeatzjamz]

Yeah I like this idea it will make chroma my fav frame even better. My only problem with him is effigy drain. And spectral scream range and dmg

[swizzybeatzjamz]

Yeah I like this idea it will make chroma my fav frame even better. My only problem with him is effigy drain. And spectral scream range and dmg

[swizzybeatzjamz]

Yeah I like this idea it will make chroma my fav frame even better. My only problem with him is effigy drain. And spectral scream range and dmg

[Cryhunter059]

Um, exalted blade is the lowest energy consumption channel ult.

effigy is pretty on par, actually.

Imo we should just be glad we're allowed to pick up energy orbs at all during it.

You can pick up orbs during any power that doesn't immobilize you during it, why is that so special?

[(NSW)BlaineKodos]

Slight necro because this is a problem that should be addressed. Equinox and Excalibur both have ultimates with way better use in high-level missions and they have piddly drains compared to a stationary ultimate with a max range and slow attack speed which at maximum efficiency still takes 4 to 5 energy per second. You need to build specifically for efficiency to bring it down to the level that Exalted Blade starts at, which is an ultimate you can take anywhere and keep going indefinately by yourself without forcing someone to be your pet energy generator.

 

Chroma's Effigy is one of my favorite powers we have now, because I love turret classes in video games. The ability to set a sentry in a place and have it act as either a deterrent to the enemy or an early warning system ("My pelt is back and I still have plenty of energy, something important is over there.") is great in defensive mission types and especially Interceptions. I don't want to have to stop what I'm doing and sit on an energy restore to build up enough energy at the start of the mission to be able to put it down and have it stay up long enough for me to get orbs off of enemies. Just bring it down in cost and the rest can fall into place.

[SteaKnight-X]

To much drain?
Definitely the wrong build then. 

 

Try full efficiency, (primed)flow, and rage. 
With this I can go like forever(except for ancient energy drain^^)

 

Dude really, sometimes I don't even notice that my effigy is still up.

Ofc, you need to keep the enigine working.
Life Strike against low health.
Or "Elemental Ward"(fire).
Focusing on losing some health for energy also helps alot for "Vex Armor".(That dmg buf*_*)

[(NSW)BlaineKodos]

Try full efficiency, (primed)flow, and rage. 

With this I can go like forever(except for ancient energy drain^^)

If I'm building purely for Effigy use, that's what I use. That's half of my mods to bring Effigy somewhere resembling stable drain. Excalibur and Equinox can get the same amount of uptime with less.

 

At a max Primed Flow, my Chroma has around 638 energy according to the Warframe Builder. Let's call it 640 purely for number purposes. It is listed as draining 3 energy a second while up with +70% efficiency (as this is what most players operate on). At 3 energy a second it would take 214 (213.333333) seconds with no assistance from pickups or Rage to go through all of it. This is ignoring the startup time.

 

Excalibur will hit 425 energy with the same Primed Flow, so to give Chroma the absolute best chance we'll call it 420. According to the Builder, at max efficiency Exalted Blade will take less than one energy per second with the same mods, so we're going to round that up to 1. 420 seconds of uptime without pickups. It's almost twice as efficient (with my slants towards Chroma it could actually be twice), gains mod support from your weapon, moves with you, kills faster, has a greater maximum range and does not have periodic stopping points to do a radial AoE.

 

Equinox hits the same energy total as Chroma exactly, so we will use 640 again for the sake of fairness. The Builder does not list her drain per second on Maim, but with the same efficiency setup and doing a super scientific method of casting Metamorphosis and then Maim and seeing how many times the number drains per second of Metamorphosis, I am comfortable saying the drain is functionally 2 energy per second. It would therefore take 320 seconds to drain fully, which is still better than Effigy. Maim moves with the caster, hits a MUCH further range because it can be modified to do so and most players likely do, and it gains power as each enemy inside its area of effect dies based on a percentage of health they lost inside the AoE, which means it scales incredibly well into lategame as the damage does not fall off as fast.

 

Why test these three? Because they are the most recently added ultimates with energy drain uptime. Since Chroma, two ultimates with more general utility have been added with a better efficiency than his. There's also one point left to make here as well: you do not start at maximum energy. If you have 640 energy, you must find that energy and build it up before use. This means that while he can sustain Effigy for long periods of time once fully stocked, he cannot use it for very long when starting a mission off. Meanwhile, Excalibur and Equinox can get going very quickly and keep their moves going long enough to actually build their energy up from drops and Rage. Chroma has to leave his ultimate behind in one place while he goes to do this, which not only makes it unable to help him, it actually hinders his survivability to do this because it reduces his armor total without the pelt on his person.

 

Even Mesa, who drains energy like she's stuffed it in a mesh bag, at least has the benefit of functionally infinite range once she sees the target and a far, far, FAR faster attack speed. I'm not saying Effigy needs to drain less than one energy a second. I'm saying his current drain is too much compared to how useful it is. Even dropping it down to 2 per second to match Equinox would be a large benefit. I would like to incorporate Effigy into my average play for longer than a few seconds due to needing the energy it is bleeding out of me to fuel my Elemental Ward and Vex Armor.

[SteaKnight-X]

Ok, lets say that the drain of effigy is much higher than Excal, Mesa,  and Equinox.
 

So to the menitioned full efficiency build. You get like 213 secs of effigy, without picking up any energy orbs.
213s are about 3:30 min(More than enough). 
Then again, Chroma is a tank, you force yourself to take health damage just for the "Vex Armor" dmg boost.
Thats why putting in "Rage" is so beneficial.
 

 

 I would like to incorporate Effigy into my average play for longer than a few seconds due to needing the energy it is bleeding out of me to fuel my Elemental Ward and Vex Armor.

Few seconds?

Dude like I've said. As long as you have enemies, you can go like forever with effigy.
You're a tank. So play like one. Go in, risk some health damage(and let effigy+ vex do the rest) Try to keep elemental ward for the healing(fire type).

I promise you, you will not notice that effigy is still up.

 

 

 I'm not saying Effigy needs to drain less than one energy a second. I'm saying his current drain is too much compared to how useful it is. 

Not usefull enough?

 

One of the best ults for late game(In my opinion)

F*** that damage of Mesa. Who needs it anyway if you have stunlock.^^





I don't know why you want to reduce the energy cost.
Do you want to afk after activating it?

You even could do that right now. For like 3 minutes^^

Edited August 14, 2015 by SteaKnight-X

[S7ORM]

Part of the problem is that [DE] has to adjust the cost for max efficiency builds -- because why wouldn't you use it.

The only way the initial costs could be toned down would be if there wasn't such a massive gap between "No Efficiency" and "Max (or near-max) Efficiency" builds.

I tried to address that here: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/508158-efficiency-calculation-adjustment/?p=5675759

[aef8234]

I'd say just use a rage build, but that's incredibly risky.

[IX-44]

snip

 

Spot on.