Forma. The Current Dojo Issue

[CubedOobleck]

Currently you can get Forma by:

Platinum, Login Rewards, ? Alert Rewards, or possible Mission Complete Rewards for missions in "The Void".

 

It is indeed rare, but can be obtained several ways...

Platinum - Of course, nothing is bad with that, devs are human and need money for food and commodities like all of us.

Login Rewards - As if, I'll let you know Rebecca when I get one from a login reward, but it will probably take months

?Alerts - Something else we cannot control, I wonder how long it will take for one to pop in my timezone.

The Void - For a CHANCE to get forma, when usually all you get is a reaper or latron handle, not to mention the Void Keys are rare as well.

It's not like Forma is only for Dojos, we all have lots of weapons and warframes we'd like to prestige (multiple times). When you look at how much you need of the stuff it is probably a lot harder to acquire a decent number of forma than it is to acquire a decent number of orokin reactors or catalyst.

When you complete a void mission the player who used the Void Key should get a forma besides the random reward that every team member gets.

[Crimduval]

That looks like Pay to Win

 

 

Pay to Win is buying advantages others don't have access too without paying themselves. Warframe is pay for convenience, you pay to get stuff faster.

 

 

 

Anywho...on topic. I personally don't care for the Dojo sololy because of the Forma cost. Getting 200k+ mats for just a hallway is hard enough but needing multiple Forma? The dojo may be a way to get fancy new weapons, but right now I don't see a decent enough reason to really work on one.

[evilfluffy]

I think it would be best for clans of all size to replace forma with control module (or another rare material) change 5 forma for a bloody hallway) to 5 control modules(or whatever) same for rooms because most players aren't going to want to use forma on dojo instead on warframe or weapons to improve themselves.  This is alpha version as said by DE, but I seriously hope they change this requirement.

[Pisirk]

Pay to Win is buying advantages others don't have access too without paying themselves. Warframe is pay for convenience, you pay to get stuff faster.

 

 

 

Anywho...on topic. I personally don't care for the Dojo sololy because of the Forma cost. Getting 200k+ mats for just a hallway is hard enough but needing multiple Forma? The dojo may be a way to get fancy new weapons, but right now I don't see a decent enough reason to really work on one.

 

Pay to avoid their flawed RNG system.

[Broddr]

several absurdly dumb ways, yes

 

dont like F2P then find another game, I don't get how people can complain over f2p games... I got my saryn in 5 runs, just because some people have bad luck doesn't mean to complain

Edited May 24, 2013 by Broddr

[Zantestsuken]

but I seriously hope they change this requirement.

 

We all hope

 

dont like F2P then find another game, I dont get how people can complain over f2p games...

 

It was okay to buy slots, potatoes an whatsoever. But crafting material itself? Hell! I'm okay with the Void keys and even Vauban's parts being a ? drop. But letting people charge you real money for crafting material is nuts! Next thing you'll be paying plats for some rubedo ;)

[Vashramire]

As many ways as Forma is claimed to be had, no one in my clan has seen it or the void. There is a direct issue with large clans being able to get mats quicker and at less cost per individual to get stuff done. I've only got 7 people in my clan and it is going to take months to research anything at this rate, and that's if we don't use forma to repolarize our gear. I'm really close to just abandoning my friends just to get into a bigger clan so I can actually progress. I don't like feeling like my friends are gimping me.

[xection9]

Seems like void missions are the main way to get Forma, but void missions themselves are RNG so its RNG ontop of RNG making it uber rare......

Sir your post, i like your post.

+1

[ArsVampyre]

Pay to Win is buying advantages others don't have access too without paying themselves. Warframe is pay for convenience, you pay to get stuff faster.

 

 

 

Anywho...on topic. I personally don't care for the Dojo sololy because of the Forma cost. Getting 200k+ mats for just a hallway is hard enough but needing multiple Forma? The dojo may be a way to get fancy new weapons, but right now I don't see a decent enough reason to really work on one.

And you are buying advantages others can't get without buying them. It's becoming more and more apparent that Forma is rare enough that the costs to be able to get the dojo to research size so you can access the other content are too large and that the dojo's of small clans will never be finished.

I'm sure I could get my clan mates to contribute 20 or even 50 plat each to our dojo, but that's going to get us a single hallway, maybe two. That's not going to get us past the huge up-front cost to get the research areas.

The way things are now, Forma is too rare from the RNG to be considered for anything other than occasional weapon/frame changes. We're not all in big clans.

I already contributed $50 to DE. I may not have spent my all my plat yet, but I don't have enough to do this on my own anyway. So we're at the point where to get what I could get in a full-priced game, I have to pay more. That doesn't encourage me to give DE more money.

One forma is an impulse cost. 5 forma is a bit questionable. 30 forma is a joke. I'm willing to bet I'll personally be able to farm the materials for the dojo's hallways and rooms before my clan could farm the necessary forma.

Leave forma just for the prestige system and get it out of the dojo. It's not pay for convenience, it's pay for access, and these things aren't just cosmetic changes like add-ons for sentinels.

[Crimduval]

Pay to avoid their flawed RNG system.

 

Not that it's flawed, people just don't like it.

 

I'm getting kinda tired of RNG systems to be honest. Why can't we just have a "work for loot" system? Like materials could be actual nodes as well as drops. Could make a "resource" tileset that spawns in each mission, we just need to find it, or even make a mission just for getting resources, seems weird we need to steal mats from everyone. D:

 

But that's just mats...other things will be tough to take out of an RNG system. RNG systems are just easier to do.

 

 

 

 

And you are buying advantages others can't get without buying them. It's becoming more and more apparent that Forma is rare enough that the costs to be able to get the dojo to research size so you can access the other content are too large and that the dojo's of small clans will never be finished.

 

 

 

Forma is a bit too rare compared to how much we need for the dojo, but it's still pay for convenience to me since you're not buying an advantage other player's can't get, you would just be buying to build something faster. Building it faster would be the advantage, which is a convenience, not winning. To me, and probably most, Pay to win is being able to buy power other players can not get without putting in a lot of effort, or not at all.

 

 

But yes, I agree that Forma shouldn't even be touching the Dojo, as stated above, it's pretty much what's making me not bother with the dojo at all.

[rhoenix]

Look guys. Defense missions give you a pretty good chance to get at least one Void Key. Once you have at least one Void Key, you can get at least a few Forma from enemies and scouring the Orokin levels.

Yes, the Forma amounts for each piece of a Clan Dojo are substantial - but with a good and thorough crew, you can get enough keys to get the Forma you need.

Of course, you can also do boss runs, since all bosses have an uncommon chance to drop a Void Key as loot. This method also grants you the bonus of getting to mug the Stalker.

So - mod/materials farming through defense missions, or boss runs where you get to mug the Stalker as a bonus. Either way is both fun and profitable.

[evilfluffy]

I remain on my position forma should be replaced for another rare resource and keep forma for one purpose changing of polarities for weapons/warframes/sentinels.

[Pisirk]

 

I'm getting kinda tired of RNG systems to be honest. Why can't we just have a "work for loot" system? Like materials could be actual nodes as well as drops. Could make a "resource" tileset that spawns in each mission, we just need to find it, or even make a mission just for getting resources, seems weird we need to steal mats from everyone. D:

 

 

Exactly that. Give people control over their chances. And not some completely random lottery like system that also seems to favour people who play more.

Edited May 24, 2013 by Pisirk

[Boxyninja]

Update 8 has only been here for 1 day. It seems people are getting impatient and don't feel like farming at all. Sure, it takes a lot of formas to expand the dojo, but considering clans are capable of contributing to the cause, it really isn't that much work. Some clans have 50+ members, so 5 forma is really not that big of a deal. 

 

I think scaling the material requirements to clan size is much more important.

 im in a 200+ clan and it is taking us a good amount of time to get 5 forma.

 

Look guys. Defense missions give you a pretty good chance to get at least one Void Key. Once you have at least one Void Key, you can get at least a few Forma from enemies and scouring the Orokin levels.

Yes, the Forma amounts for each piece of a Clan Dojo are substantial - but with a good and thorough crew, you can get enough keys to get the Forma you need.

Of course, you can also do boss runs, since all bosses have an uncommon chance to drop a Void Key as loot. This method also grants you the bonus of getting to mug the Stalker.

So - mod/materials farming through defense missions, or boss runs where you get to mug the Stalker as a bonus. Either way is both fun and profitable.

forma from the void isnt all that common either because it is only as a end reward. each time i have done void it has given me latron prime.

[kig1056]

I remain on my position forma should be replaced for another rare resource and keep forma for one purpose changing of polarities for weapons/warframes/sentinels.

with forma as it is you need to be a 100+ clan with a  people who love to play to win to really make clan man this game is still in "beta" and they are getting money hungry and I really like this game but if it keeps going like this and Vauban being alert only and things like that it is killing this game man

[evilfluffy]

From what I have read in forums most people (if not all) would much prefer rare resource that you can farm actively rather than having to decide to use one forma you got for clan or buff yourself up.

 

Edit:  I think main issue derives from rarity of forma for even large clans I don't want dojo handed to me on a silver platter just want to be able to farm for a material to build it not hope that I have made right sacrifice to the RNG Gods

Edited May 24, 2013 by evilfluffy

[rhoenix]

From what I have read in forums most people (if not all) would much prefer rare resource that you can farm actively rather than having to decide to use one forma you got for clan or buff yourself up.

If it was a rare drop from enemies in Orokin areas, I would be okay with that. Forma costs for things in the Dojo are substantial, especially considering that one also needs Forma to set polarity slots in weapons & warframes.

If this is not changed, then grinding this out will take some time.

[Pariax]

Look guys. Defense missions give you a pretty good chance to get at least one Void Key. Once you have at least one Void Key, you can get at least a few Forma from enemies and scouring the Orokin levels.

Yes, the Forma amounts for each piece of a Clan Dojo are substantial - but with a good and thorough crew, you can get enough keys to get the Forma you need.

Of course, you can also do boss runs, since all bosses have an uncommon chance to drop a Void Key as loot. This method also grants you the bonus of getting to mug the Stalker.

So - mod/materials farming through defense missions, or boss runs where you get to mug the Stalker as a bonus. Either way is both fun and profitable.

 

 

its pretty easy to tell that you commented based on the patchnotes, not actual gameexperience or you are the luckiest guy in the world.

 

"a pretty good chance"? we played like 10 defenses today, various ones, from venus, kiliken to xini and got not a single key, 15+ waves each. We havent got a single key, thats pretty good indeed.

 

Atleast a few Forma with atleast one key? Sine we bought a key package and run the 5 missions it gives i can tell you there is NO way you get A FEW forma with only one key. we havent got one in 5 runs. Not to mention you can only get 1 per player with one key even if you are so lucky to get one at all.

 

bosses got an uncommon chance to drop them? where you pulled that one from? we got a few bossruns done by the clan and its definitley not uncommon whatever you are referring to with this. On the note with the stalker: have you got anything from him so far? its said you have to burst the last 25% of his hp to get anything at all...

 

 

On topic:

There are two major problems with the update 8: you are expanding on the RNG system even though you noticed what a flop it was for vauban. You just implemented a core feature (dojo research) with the need of a material you have to go through TWO cycles of the RNG system for, which makes it so inconcistant that no one can even vaguely guess the progess he is making. I mean even if they werent as rare as they seem to be, every one of could just be on the bad side of this really unpredictable system and see nearly no forma at all. No healthy tenno can tell me that he would bet on his forma progress.

 

This one leads to the second problem: you implemented a core system with an obvious need to pay for it. Its so frustrating and so unpredictable to go through two RNG cycles that people just lose their faith. I invested 100$ because i really loved the way you were going, and i still love the style of the game. Its a niche game but one i wouldnt like to miss. The core systems like combat and movement are so well designed that this game has great potential please dont throw it overboard by wrong business desicisions just to make some quick money. Right now, i feel forced to spend my money on formas to access one of my favorite aspects of the game, the dojo research and you leave me no hope at all that i could get there without paying.

 

Concider if you wanna force people to pay to enjoy the game or make them pay because they enjoy it. I know that I will quit with the first one and go on with the second one. I experienced a lot of free to play games shine or fall with this decision. its yours to make now, and better dont roll it like your loot table.

sincerly,

a Tenno at heart

Edited May 24, 2013 by Pariax

[Maikky]

Currently you can get Forma by:

Platinum, Login Rewards, ? Alert Rewards, or possible Mission Complete Rewards for missions in "The Void".

 

It is indeed rare, but can be obtained several ways...

 

So basically your going to have to buy them if you want to get anywhere in a decent pace .

 

I'm pretty sure that the ? Alerts are going to be same if not higher then potatoes drop rate, Mission Rewards for the Void make you have to farm keys (which in itself are pretty hard to get) or obvious PAY to get them . Login rewards ? That is laughable .

[Boxyninja]

On topic:

There are two major problems with the update 8: you are expanding on the RNG system even though you noticed what a flop it was for vauban. You just implemented a core feature (dojo research) with the need of a material you have to go through TWO cycles of the RNG system for, which makes it so inconcistant that no one can even vaguely guess the progess he is making. I mean even if they werent as rare as they seem to be, every one of could just be on the bad side of this really unpredictable system and see nearly no forma at all. No healthy tenno can tell me that he would bet on his forma progress.

 

This one leads to the second problem: you implemented a core system with an obvious need to pay for it. Its so frustrating and so unpredictable to go through two RNG cycles that people just lose their faith. I invested 100$ because i really loved the way you were going, and i still love the style of the game. Its a niche game but one i wouldnt like to miss. The core systems like combat and movement are so well designed that this game has great potential please dont throw it overboard by wrong business desicisions just to make some quick money. Right now, i feel forced to spend my money on formas to access one of my favorite aspects of the game, the dojo research and you leave me no hope at all that i could get there without paying.

 

Concider if you wanna force people to pay to enjoy the game or make them pay because they enjoy it. I know that I will quit with the first one and go on with the second one. I experienced a lot of free to play games shine or fall with this decision. its yours to make now, and better dont roll it like your loot table.

sincerly,

a Tenno at heart

i totally agree with this post 100%

[Zantestsuken]

On topic:

There are two major problems with the update 8: you are expanding on the RNG system even though you noticed what a flop it was for vauban. You just implemented a core feature (dojo research) with the need of a material you have to go through TWO cycles of the RNG system for, which makes it so inconcistant that no one can even vaguely guess the progess he is making. I mean even if they werent as rare as they seem to be, every one of could just be on the bad side of this really unpredictable system and see nearly no forma at all. No healthy tenno can tell me that he would bet on his forma progress.

 

This one leads to the second problem: you implemented a core system with an obvious need to pay for it. Its so frustrating and so unpredictable to go through two RNG cycles that people just lose their faith. I invested 100$ because i really loved the way you were going, and i still love the style of the game. Its a niche game but one i wouldnt like to miss. The core systems like combat and movement are so well designed that this game has great potential please dont throw it overboard by wrong business desicisions just to make some quick money. Right now, i feel forced to spend my money on formas to access one of my favorite aspects of the game, the dojo research and you leave me no hope at all that i could get there without paying.

 

Concider if you wanna force people to pay to enjoy the game or make them pay because they enjoy it. I know that I will quit with the first one and go on with the second one. I experienced a lot of free to play games shine or fall with this decision. its yours to make now, and better dont roll it like your loot table.

sincerly,

a Tenno at heart

 

Sir, I feel you. Agree on all. Wrote something much more short to DERebecca. After I asked her if this Dojo policy was the way they intended to go through, she answered me that she appreciate my feedback. Nothing more. I'm fearing that sooner or later I'll ragequit this game.

Edited May 24, 2013 by Zantestsuken

[Zenaku]

Currently you can get Forma by:

Platinum, Login Rewards, ? Alert Rewards, or possible Mission Complete Rewards for missions in "The Void".

 

It is indeed rare, but can be obtained several ways...

You may want to correct the wiki page then

it currently doesn't say anything about alert missions but thanks for letting us Know :) 

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Forma

 

[DAWGUNITALPHA]

Hey warframe I heard you like RNG.

So we put some RNG in your RNG.

So you can RNG while you RNG!

[MyXmaN]

 

On topic:

There are two major problems with the update 8: you are expanding on the RNG system even though you noticed what a flop it was for vauban. You just implemented a core feature (dojo research) with the need of a material you have to go through TWO cycles of the RNG system for, which makes it so inconcistant that no one can even vaguely guess the progess he is making. I mean even if they werent as rare as they seem to be, every one of could just be on the bad side of this really unpredictable system and see nearly no forma at all. No healthy tenno can tell me that he would bet on his forma progress.

 

This one leads to the second problem: you implemented a core system with an obvious need to pay for it. Its so frustrating and so unpredictable to go through two RNG cycles that people just lose their faith. I invested 100$ because i really loved the way you were going, and i still love the style of the game. Its a niche game but one i wouldnt like to miss. The core systems like combat and movement are so well designed that this game has great potential please dont throw it overboard by wrong business desicisions just to make some quick money. Right now, i feel forced to spend my money on formas to access one of my favorite aspects of the game, the dojo research and you leave me no hope at all that i could get there without paying.

 

Concider if you wanna force people to pay to enjoy the game or make them pay because they enjoy it. I know that I will quit with the first one and go on with the second one. I experienced a lot of free to play games shine or fall with this decision. its yours to make now, and better dont roll it like your loot table.

sincerly,

a Tenno at heart

 

I have to agree.

[Pisirk]

 

On topic:

There are two major problems with the update 8: you are expanding on the RNG system even though you noticed what a flop it was for vauban. You just implemented a core feature (dojo research) with the need of a material you have to go through TWO cycles of the RNG system for, which makes it so inconcistant that no one can even vaguely guess the progess he is making. I mean even if they werent as rare as they seem to be, every one of could just be on the bad side of this really unpredictable system and see nearly no forma at all. No healthy tenno can tell me that he would bet on his forma progress.

 

This one leads to the second problem: you implemented a core system with an obvious need to pay for it. Its so frustrating and so unpredictable to go through two RNG cycles that people just lose their faith. I invested 100$ because i really loved the way you were going, and i still love the style of the game. Its a niche game but one i wouldnt like to miss. The core systems like combat and movement are so well designed that this game has great potential please dont throw it overboard by wrong business desicisions just to make some quick money. Right now, i feel forced to spend my money on formas to access one of my favorite aspects of the game, the dojo research and you leave me no hope at all that i could get there without paying.

 

Concider if you wanna force people to pay to enjoy the game or make them pay because they enjoy it. I know that I will quit with the first one and go on with the second one. I experienced a lot of free to play games shine or fall with this decision. its yours to make now, and better dont roll it like your loot table.

sincerly,

a Tenno at heart

 

Bravo. +1 Well said.