How Do We Feel About The Stagger Mechanic

[Ada-Man]

We all know the stagger kills. Staggering comes along with most warframe abilities. We are talking 75% of abilities used.

I have no clue what DE wants to turn PvP into, but allowing a less skilled player to go around killing everyone because noone can react is terrible. It is so cheap. In anyother PvP game out there a noob can in no way kill better players because of a cheap trick and be called fair.

Also we are tenno flipping around and flying like birds. And you are telling me that a simple attack renders you useless as a baby because you lost your balance?

Not only does it not fit in with the theme PvP goes for, but its also used and abused to the point where it can't even be fun.

Please remove staggering from the game.

And if you just so happen to be a stagger spammer please leave your idea on how in the world that is considered good gameplay.

Edited August 5, 2015 by Ada-Man

[SquirmyBurrito]

Isn't there a PVP mod that negates all/most staggers? Why not just use that mod?

[Rexlars]

So I'm gonna go ahead & assume you're the "more skilled player" & got killed by some "noob" that was able to stagger you?

[-Amaterasu-]

Stagering is a form of balance in PvP for abilities since they can't be as strong/serve their purpose Mind Controll can't actually controll anybody so it staggers them, if you get hit in the face with a wall of fire chances are you're going to lose your balance

[Rakshal]

It should be removed, any PvP game that has a mechanic that takes control away from the player is garbage. I just played PvP too test some of the changes that seemed good, in the match I joined I know I had better aim and movement than a player, but came out negative because Slash Dash and it's stupid stagger and huge hit box. At that point I thought to myself, "Yup, I'm done with PvP until staggers get removed."

[oinkah]

I'm generally against anything that takes away control from a player in arena shooters. It's only tolerable if it takes a fair amount of skill to pull off (like rocket juggling in TF2).

[Tchesco]

Stager is necessary in the current PvP meta. Parkour 2.0 allows fast paced combat, rendering most guns incapable of hiting the target.
The thing the should be overlooked is HOW the stagger is being applied. For example, Slash Dash. You are certain to kill the enemy if you hit, but the autotarget mecanic turns you into a sitting duck if the lucky guy moves to the sides

[Feyangol]

Stagger stuns your frame longer than a knockdown and you are also easier to hit in the stagger animation. This seems kinda wrong imo xD .

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

I think most staggers with powers are manageable with the exception of slash dash, sleep and paralysis which I believe were just fixed yesterday

[Nlim]

Stagger stuns your frame longer than a knockdown and you are also easier to hit in the stagger animation. This seems kinda wrong imo xD .

 

I think most staggers with powers are manageable with the exception of slash dash, sleep and paralysis which I believe were just fixed yesterday

 

I´ll go with these two for the moment. x)

[rockscl]

the only problem i have with staggers and knockdowns is that their animation is so bad that it breaks the feeling of the game, in battlefield when someone stabs you, you lose all control of your character but it feels right,  here, it gets into my brain every time, it just visually wrong, im getting staggered on the air, doesnt make sense, the character should have dinamic animation towards the direction of his own movement+the origin of the staggering attack using ragdoll

Edited August 5, 2015 by rockscl

[Rhaenxys]

Stager is necessary in the current PvP meta. Parkour 2.0 allows fast paced combat, rendering most guns incapable of hiting the target.

The thing the should be overlooked is HOW the stagger is being applied. For example, Slash Dash. You are certain to kill the enemy if you hit, but the autotarget mecanic turns you into a sitting duck if the lucky guy moves to the sides

100% agree.

[JeyciKon]

as a player that used to play pvp a lot(not anymore after update 17) stagger ruins pvp, you get stagger.. you dead, simple as that.
People saying that now is harder to hit someone thanks to the new movement you sure didnt play before U17, you dont know what coptring was or did you just forgot?

and balance? necessary? that just doesn't make any sense? fun is holding a weapon and learn how to use it, not just pressing numbers and that's the best you can do.. that takes away all the fun from pvp..

 

 

This how i see 50% of pvp players atm:

"I love shooting defenseless and moveless foes, so hard , so much fun, im so skilled.

do you guys wanna know my trick? i run across the map looking for energy, when i see an enemy i press a number and shoot them while they stay still. try it, can you? of corse not, you are not skilled enough to press a number and shoot a moveless enemie, that's just for skilled people.."

 

Sorry for the hostility, it's just really bad loving something and it turned into crap.

[Rexlars]

any PvP game that has a mechanic that takes control away from the player is garbage

 

This is literally every PVP game ever to exist in life within this universe....so, I guess every game that has versus multiplayer is garbage. 

[-InV-igo95862]

Stager is necessary in the current PvP meta. Parkour 2.0 allows fast paced combat, rendering most guns incapable of hiting the target.

The thing the should be overlooked is HOW the stagger is being applied. For example, Slash Dash. You are certain to kill the enemy if you hit, but the autotarget mecanic turns you into a sitting duck if the lucky guy moves to the sides

 

Maybe it is the issue of Parkoour 2.0 that such tanks as Frost Prime or Rhino Prime can fly around and don't care about their supposedly low movespeed?

[Feyangol]

Maybe it is the issue of Parkoour 2.0 that such tanks as Frost Prime or Rhino Prime can fly around and don't care about their supposedly low movespeed?

Na, this is warframe, this is normal in warframe.

You are ninja (well, now bunny), you are always fast :P .

[-InV-igo95862]

Na, this is warframe, this is normal in warframe.

You are ninja (well, now bunny), you are always fast :P .

 

As I said the parkour speed being fast speed to everyone raises a lot of problems:

1). Tanks are much better then fragile frames. Tanks don't pay with anything for their increased ehp.

2). Projectile weapons are underpowered unless they deal crazy damage and then they are overpowered point blank. How would you balance Lanka without making in overpowered close range?

3). Any stager or stun is overpowered as in short amount of no parkour you can easily kill opponent.

 

My suggestion is to differentiate warframes. Tanks have lots of health but be slow, fragile and agile frames have little health but fast movespeed and parkour.

[TaylorsContraction]

I'm okay with stagger so long as it's not spamable and is a 2 way streak.

2 way streak meaning, mag. You pull, are locked in place open to enemy fire and can die doing it. If you succeeded, you stagger an opponent and open them for damage. Nyx mind control is similar but with the current iteration I don't like that the nyx can kill a mind controlled target.

A 1 way streak stagger is excal's slash dash. No risk to self, adds mobility, if landed deals damage and staggers. Now I don't mind that but it can be used repeatedly. I think staggers should have a cool down without a band aid mod. I played versus a slash dash spam excal yesterday, he only got me twice. First time because I has no idea they can chain stagger, second time he snuck up on me and I failed to dodge it. It can be dodged though and avoided for the most part, so can melee stagger spam. Usually rolling is enough for me.

[InoxMaximus]

nope stagger is needed now

[AlphaSierraMike]

Stager is necessary in the current PvP meta. Parkour 2.0 allows fast paced combat, rendering most guns incapable of hiting the target.

The thing the should be overlooked is HOW the stagger is being applied. For example, Slash Dash. You are certain to kill the enemy if you hit, but the autotarget mecanic turns you into a sitting duck if the lucky guy moves to the sides

.... So what you're saying is that because some people can't keep up with Parkour 2.0, they should get an easy kill?

 

Besides, the only thing that's hard to hit in Parkour 2.0 is the head, the speed itself is nothing compared to Bo P users before the update.

 

I wouldn't mind staggers as long as they gave me the ability to shoot back. That's what pisses me off the most about staggers and knockdown in Warframe. It doesn't let me to anything proactive, I can only wait for that stupid animation to finish. Like in most modern shooters, you have stun and flashes, yes those limits your movement for easier kill, but you can still shoot back. But in Warframe, no, if getting locked in place wasn't bad enough, I can't even shoot back.

 

If they changed Staggers to just a movement speed decrease, I wouldn't mind it as much, and it will still aid melee users. No idiotic animation that stops me from doing anything.

[R3DBelmont456]

Staggers in General just feel like a Crutch to help bad players boost their K/D... This is why I hated Equinox sleep post nerf because it would force the person to stand still so they could get an easy kill on you, that doesn't take any skill at all...

[Tchesco]

.... So what you're saying is that because some people can't keep up with Parkour 2.0, they should get an easy kill?

 

Besides, the only thing that's hard to hit in Parkour 2.0 is the head, the speed itself is nothing compared to Bo P users before the update.

 

I wouldn't mind staggers as long as they gave me the ability to shoot back. That's what pisses me off the most about staggers and knockdown in Warframe. It doesn't let me to anything proactive, I can only wait for that stupid animation to finish. Like in most modern shooters, you have stun and flashes, yes those limits your movement for easier kill, but you can still shoot back. But in Warframe, no, if getting locked in place wasn't bad enough, I can't even shoot back.

 

If they changed Staggers to just a movement speed decrease, I wouldn't mind it as much, and it will still aid melee users. No idiotic animation that stops me from doing anything.

If you get punched too hard in the face, you'll get staggered. Your argument is invalid

[Aggh]

If you get punched too hard in the face, you'll get staggered. Your argument is invalid

This is a video game, realism arguments are always trumped by game balance.  Your argument is invalid.

[Tchesco]

This is a video game, realism arguments are always trumped by game balance.  Your argument is invalid.

It's Warframe. Your balance is invalid

Edited August 8, 2015 by Tchesco

[JeyciKon]

It's Warframe. Your balance is invalid

 warframe is a videogame, how is this argument invalid? did you study filosofy?