So Wait... The Stalker Was Right? (Spoilers?)

[ZzVinniezZ]

i belong to nobody i do what i want and no one telling me what i should do in my mission....except Darvo, he's cool

[Leavith]

i belong to nobody i do what i want and no one telling me what i should do in my mission....except Darvo, he's cool

Wow WE HAVE A REBEL RIGHT HERE except for the fact unless your doing a quest Lotus is telling you what to do.....Specially in Mobile defense

[Guest (PS4)Baby0Shaq34]

This is about the Natah quest so dont read on if you havent done it.

So good ol' Stalker telling us to chill with all the killing that "Lotus" was sending us to do was right all along!

I think it's time for DE to let us pick sides here because i dont know about you people but.... i dont want some lady with baby issues waving keys in front of me so she could feel better about herself.

After ........ getting equinox i dont think i will kill any more bosses "Lotus" sends me to kill.

And i say after because i didnt do the quest right away.

So we need some "The Stalker was right" T-shirts on the merch store.

We need new mission controllers.

And we need a mission where like the G-dilemma where people get to break from the "Lotus."

That event will be some Tenno attacking "Lotus" home base attempting to kill her and some defending.

Please dont give the defending sides the better weapons, DE.

This should be the FIRST totally even contest.

The Stalker Army gets the Stalker Grakata (wraith?) and the Lotus Faithful get the Dex Grakata.

^This. Death to the lotus

I want to be on my own actually.

Edited August 10, 2015 by (PS4)Baby0Shaq34

[KozaTheShadow]

All these people saying "I want to be on my own" you do realize Stalker is the only independent one because he can actually think? 

 

The Tenno are weapons lol 

[Fari]

You had me until you said "Grakata" I like events with different sides and would love alternate guides (though I don't dislike Lotus) but no stay away grakata.

[ravend]

Lets look at the peices of breaking apart the tenno from the lotus.

 

First off, the grineer will still hunt us

Second. the coprus will hunt us and study us

Third, the infested will still run thru the system

Fourth, the stalker will still hunt us regardless of who we side or side with.

 

So you want to add further chaos into the system and splitting apart the only force that bring peace to the system?

[Mak_Gohae]

Technically every enemy faction (save the Sentients) is some variation of human - evolve, ascended, or cloned, perhaps, but still human. And the Perrin Sequence and Steel Meridian aren't technically Corpus and Grineer, they're splinter groups. Sort of like how the American South no longer considered itself a part of the U.S. during the Civil War, but instead it's own entity.

 

Grineer's those who are loyal to the Queens.

 

Corpus' those who work for that big megacorporation of theirs.

 

And I'd wager that's because no Tenno are being as horrendously monstrous as the Grineer and Corpus (though really the Corpus are more greedy $&*^ than insufferable fascists).

 

To me the Grineer are clones. Who their rulers are is not what defines them. 

And the Perrin S are EXACTLY like the Corpus except they dont "use violence."

 

So if everything is human then we should be like the Jedis helping everyone be peaceful instead of continuously destroying stuff.

And why do we continue to destroy stuff? Because we are continuing with the mission the "Lotus" had which she succeed in.

 

I think everyone here is missing the big picture.

"Lotus" was successful in her mission. The only thing she didnt do was her last job to kill us.

And because of that we are now still performing that mission of destabilizing everything.

We are probably on a path to bring up the second collapse.

 

The devs have mentioned previously that the large part of the solar system is just baseline human settlements with no military value, EG: We don't go there to blow S#&$ up because it's nothing but civilians.  The Grineer talk alot about how they are the "police" for the human colonies, the colonies that they take over and subject to their iron rule. 

 

There are civilians, a lot of them, we just don't go there because of animation budgets and it's not crucial to the game play at the moment.  How many civilians did you ever see in Halo or Mass Effect? Maybe a 100 over the whole series, maybe. But that doesn't mean their universes are solely populated with cyborg super soldiers and super-powered alien soldiers.  There are civilians, they are just uninteresting so we don't see them.

 

In Halo and Mass Effect the information was pretty clear.

In this game the writing seems to be taken from some of the worst episodes of Lost.

Freaking get to it and setup a world.

[Morec0]

To me the Grineer are clones. Who their rulers are is not what defines them. 

And the Perrin S are EXACTLY like the Corpus except they dont "use violence."

 

So if everything is human then we should be like the Jedis helping everyone be peaceful instead of continuously destroying stuff.

And why do we continue to destroy stuff? Because we are continuing with the mission the "Lotus" had which she succeed in.

 

I think everyone here is missing the big picture.

"Lotus" was successful in her mission. The only thing she didnt do was her last job to kill us.

And because of that we are now still performing that mission of destabilizing everything.

We are probably on a path to bring up the second collapse.

 

What I get from the Perrin Sequence is that they don't use War profiteering and are more interested in spreading the wealth rather than keeping it to themselves - both of which are key elements of the Corpus' activities. As for the Grineer... well, we have what Cordylon said, but I do agree that cloned Grineer are probably a step-up in whatever hierarchy is there than non-cloned. "True Grineer", if you will.

 

If you think that's how interaction between human groups works you clearly haven't followed anything in human history. Just because we have the same genetic roots doesn't mean we get along. As for the fighting, at this point I think it's just as much a matter of Tenno survival as it is stopping the Grineer and Corpus from becoming what the Orokin were - a virtually unchallenged space-faring superpower.

 

Honestly, given what the Grineer and Corpus do and how they act another collapse might do some good - maybe some actually GOOD powers can get in charge this time? Provided we don't go back into cryosleep again. All things considered, if not for the Twin Queens the fall of the Orokin MIGHT have worked out a lot better for all parties involved.

Edited August 11, 2015 by Morec0

[TrockBronze]

Nothing about what the Lotus did or has asked of us makes the stalker right with what we know. We need more info.

[Etsoree]

-snip-

 

There's nothing to support what the Stalker says, because the Lotus did not lie to us. She never said she wasn't a Sentient, nor did she ever say she WAS one. She just withheld information for our benefit. Is that so bad?

 

Ya you know the orokin were awful right? They made the sentients, the made the infested to fight the sentients, then when the infested just started killing everyone they experimented on children to make the Tenno. They used the grineer as slaves and that's what made the grineer turn.

Like the orokin committed hella war crimes.

 

They didn't make the Sentients; where did that come from? They did not experiment on children, either, to make Tenno.

[Kaotyke]

i belong to nobody i do what i want and no one telling me what i should do in my mission....except Darvo, he's cool

Lotus: Keep the enemy busy while a Tenno Operative searches for supplies, ready? Trigger the alarm.

ZzVinniezZ: I DO WHAT I WANT, YOU CANT TELL ME WHAT TO DO!!

Lotus (thinking): Wait for it.

ZzVinniezZ: ...... *triggers the alarm*

Lotus: Who is your daddy momma?

ZzVinniezZ: ... you are.

 

------

 

Lotus: There's a large platoon of Grineer Marines stationed here, leave no one standing.

ZzVinniezZ: ARE YOU TELLING ME WHAT TO DO?!

Lotus: Pecking Order.

ZzVinniezZ: YES MA'AM! KILL 'EM ALL!!

[TARINunit9]

I don't see how Stalker could have ever been wrong. We're all the Tenno. Us, the players. That's DE's official stance on the matter. And the Lord British Postulate states that the Orokin were doomed to die by our blades from the moment we stepped into existence. All the Natah quest changes is that it reveals why we attacked them when we did

 

Lotus: Hey Tenno, you know what would be awesome? Killing all the Orokin

Us: Sounds good! We were waiting on an excuse to do that, really. Who should we violently disembowel first?

[TARINunit9]

They didn't make the Sentients; where did that come from? They did not experiment on children, either, to make Tenno.

 

The Sentient thing is implied by the Detron Crewman Synthesis entry. It's unclear, but most people think the corpus "hand-shaped" creature was a proto-Sentient

 

The children thing, though, has LONG since been confirmed. Orokin tortured innocent people, many of them kids, to make Ember Prime and Rhino Prime. There's no debate here; it happened

[immolator1001]

They didn't make the Sentients; where did that come from? They did not experiment on children, either, to make Tenno.

They did to both of those... If you're gunna argue lore at least have read it all. 

 

Sources are crewman synthesis and ember prime codex

[TrockBronze]

They did to both of those... If you're gunna argue lore at least have read it all. 

 

Sources are crewman synthesis and ember prime codex

the latter seems stronger, but the sentient being made by Orokin, while pretty convincing I still need a bit more on that. 

[Leavith]

the latter seems stronger, but the sentient being made by Orokin, while pretty convincing I still need a bit more on that. 

FROM what i understand the Corpus did not actually make the Sentient cause if that was the case we would still have sentient made at this point.

What i did read was that was that the previous to the discussion of the Sentient they had just got done cancelling the Crewman project.

Which from what i understand we still have crewman.

 

the Archimedian erupting into a flash, jade-like and blinding. I knew her. She was the greatest scholar of genetics who ever lived. Except now she was nothing but mist and gore.

A voice boomed from within, "The Crewmen project is cancelled. Send in the next."

 

 

"An appeal comes at a price. Should you fail, you and your corpus will pay dearly."

 

"They already suffer in this growing wasteland. They have already paid. Will you also sacrifice the royal futures by ignoring my solution?"

 

well this are the main references we get in regarding the corpus in the Lore of Crewman to the corpus...And from what it seen to me since crewman are corpus that the their is strange occuring here that crewman were not meant to exist and that they were gonna discontinue this.

And the main fact being that the Archmedian  was being brought in for the creation of the Sentient as well.Maybe the corpus they refer to were a project he was also in charge off.You begin to charge people of crimes when things have been found out and from what i understand you always save the best for last so they would Di-commission everything that does not matter since it looks like Balas was manipulating the court and left Archmedian trail to end to prove a point.

 

If suggest that all the researcher that had not provided any fruit were being punish.

Also what throws me off the most is that Archmedian says THEY while in the previous line they had group them together with the corpus.So that why i kind of suggest that this Archemedian was over seeing the corpus,the previous one was over seeing other project s before he was fried.

But this archemdian had also created sentient.

[Morec0]

 

<snip>

 

 

The Crewman project... lord knows what that is. If I had to speculate it was a plan to have actual people try to build the rails from Origin to Tau - which was an obscenely impossible idea - but we know nothing. It maybe was just a light justification to have this Sentient teaser be in this particular bit of lore.

 

As for the corpus, keep in mind that corpus in the Orokin Era is some sort of family unit - as it helped contextualized by the kid in the Anti-Moa synthesis. The Orokin were basically threatening to wipe out this entire branch of the Archimedean (or all Archmideans, based on how their organization worked) based on what this guy had created.

 

But it was indeed not a Sentient as we know them now, over time it evolved, becoming immune to more and more things, and eventually returning for and due to currently unknown reasons. 

[Etsoree]

They did to both of those... If you're gunna argue lore at least have read it all. 

 

Sources are crewman synthesis and ember prime codex

 

I didn't know there were more sythesized targets, but, after reading the Crewman one it's possible, but not really any specific evidence.

 

As for Ember Prime, no, they did not experiment on children. I've read this before. They had nothing to do with the children in there.

[Leavith]

-snip. 

Yeah i can agree with that considering the Lotus is sentient and she seen to have mind and gender.But kind of the way i see it might just be more speculation

But i feel like sentient work like the game spore if you ever seen how it works all sentient start the same way since they all deal with different situation they begin to evolve to adapt at some point they begin to earn humanoid like features which from what i see it looks like they need to be damaged 1st and taken apart so that they evolve so the newest Sentient is smarter and better then the last sentient but the last sentient while it regenerates is not as good as the new one.Now this is can be good and bad.

[TARINunit9]

As for Ember Prime, no, they did not experiment on children. I've read this before. They had nothing to do with the children in there.

I think you need to go back and read it again, since you're not understanding what happened: a civilian ship was shunted into the Void with the possible purpose of poisoning everyone on board, then fished back out. The survivors, mostly children, were abducted by the Orokin military with the VERY CLEARLY STATED purpose of experimentation

[Morec0]

Yeah i can agree with that considering the Lotus is sentient and she seen to have mind and gender.But kind of the way i see it might just be more speculation

But i feel like sentient work like the game spore if you ever seen how it works all sentient start the same way since they all deal with different situation they begin to evolve to adapt at some point they begin to earn humanoid like features which from what i see it looks like they need to be damaged 1st and taken apart so that they evolve so the newest Sentient is smarter and better then the last sentient but the last sentient while it regenerates is not as good as the new one.Now this is can be good and bad.

 

I think Lotus and Burning Lotus' humanoid features may not be something they have normally, the line "Natah, who have you become? Does this form remind you of what you once were?" seems to suggest they have some ability to shape shift - whether this is done through external means or is just something they can do is unknown.

 

As to their evolution, the Crewman Synth shows us that when damaged by something - or at least when dissected a bit - the Sentients can not only adapt an immunity to what hurt them but any bits that were separated from them regrow into new Sentients - ala Starfish. "Their surface had changed however", "their" imply a plurality of both. I don't doubt that if they'd used something else on one of those but left the other untouched only the one they'd tried to kill would spit and adapt, but it seems to me that even the assaulted one gets the enhancement... But I could be wrong, given me something to think about.

 

As for personality, we need more evidence on Sentients to truly understand but they DO definitely have individual cases of personality. And as for gender, given the seeming asexual reproduction I don't really think that's a thing for them, at least not how we understand it - after all, Burning Lotus had a distinctly male voice but kept talking about his womb.

I think you need to go back and read it again, since you're not understanding what happened: a civilian ship was shunted into the Void with the possible purpose of poisoning everyone on board, then fished back out. The survivors, mostly children, were abducted by the Orokin military with the VERY CLEARLY STATED purpose of experimentation

 

Actually it WAS a military vessel, making the presence of children on the ship all the more shocking and helping to cement the implication that it was a controlled experiment and most certainly NOT just "an accident".

[RpTheHotrod]

Can someone clarify why everyone thinks Lotus is a Sentient? I thought she said the "lotus people", if you will, were designed to kill off the Tenno after the war, however, the Tenno were created to kill the Sentients. I was under the assumption that some faction, maybe the Orokin, created the Lotus "race" to manage the Tenno, and once the war was over, the Lotus race was to dissolve the Tenno. However, one Lotus race person decided against the plan and instead of destroying the Tenno, turned the Tenno against the Orokin. Once both the Sentients and Orokin were laid to waste, Lotus and her "children" was free to manage the galaxy. Am I completely off base here? I just don't see cutting Lotus' arm off and another Lotus popping out like a "Sentient" is supposed to do as making sense. She's not machine-like, at all.

[TARINunit9]

Can someone clarify why everyone thinks Lotus is a Sentient? I thought she said the "lotus people", if you will, were designed to kill off the Tenno after the war, however, the Tenno were created to kill the Sentients. I was under the assumption that some faction, maybe the Orokin, created the Lotus "race" to manage the Tenno, and once the war was over, the Lotus race was to dissolve the Tenno. However, one Lotus race person decided against the plan and instead of destroying the Tenno, turned the Tenno against the Orokin. Once both the Sentients and Orokin were laid to waste, Lotus and her "children" was free to manage the galaxy. Am I completely off base here? I just don't see cutting Lotus' arm off and another Lotus popping out like a "Sentient" is supposed to do as making sense. She's not machine-like, at all.

Because Lotus's dad was a Sentient. You're completely off base. Don't feel bad, I didn't put 2 and 2 together at first either, because I was so floored by everything else being talked about while trying to kill Grineer. I'm a bad multitasker

 

I'm not sure where you get "Lotus people" from; I just checked all the transcripts, and nothing matches what you're saying. LotusDad is very clearly not an Orokin, and Teshin and Lotus both outright call it a Sentient

 

And yes, Lotus isn't a traditional Sentient, she looks human. But then, she was a sleeper agent. She would need to pass for human. LotusDad at one point mentions he can shapeshift ("Does this form remind you of what you once were?") so Lotus should be able to as well

Edited August 11, 2015 by TARINunit9

[S3EK3R]

And yes, Lotus isn't a traditional Sentient, she looks human. But then, she was a sleeper agent. She would need to pass for human. LotusDad at one point mentions he can shapeshift ("Does this form remind you of what you once were?") so Lotus should be able to as well

Or not. Maybe Lotus's human form removed her ability to shapeshift. Another price to pay.

[SilentMobius]

Can we please stop referring to "The Corpus" when talking about the Orokin era?

 

The the term "Corpus" is simple a collective noun, seemingly a replacement for the concept of "family" during the Orokin era. the Crewman synthesis show the term being used to mock-threaten the Archemedian's own personal "Corpus" if he should fail in his challenge.

 

The Anti-Moa synthesis show us the change _after_ the fall of the Orokin when the ex-imperial subject began breeding and forming their own "Corpus" which because a singular "Corpus" by the time of the modern Warframe era.

 

Were the ancestors of the Corpus all Orokin, all engineered slaves, doomed to fulfill roles like "Archemedian" or a mix? We don't currently know. All we know is that "The Corpus" as we know it in Warframe didn't exist and the beings who created the void-sensitive entity mentioned in the Crewman Synthesis (That _may_ be the precursor to the Sentients [Yes plural because while it is used in the singular in the Natah quest the single entity _in_ that quest refers to the existence of others, hence ultimately the plural is used]) created it in service to the Orokin Empire. So the notion that "The Corpus made it" is nonsense.

 

Kind of like suggesting that the Peoples Republic of China came up with the Horse-backed battle tactics of the Genghis Khan's army. There is a connection, but the two groups are far removed and simply didn't exist at the same time, even though the words did.