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Pc Psa: Covert Lethality + Exalted Blade Changes


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Why punish Loki / Ash players for another problem? Just make it so Exalted Blade doesn't benefit from it as mentioned and leave the mod as is.

 

Stealth finisher change just made it worthless of a slot, oh and daggers too. Whelp, back to a non-dagger melee weapon again.

yup, you just said what i want to said

daggers are useless again 

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this is a typical overreaction blanket response by overnerfing

 

at least make the effort to balance the nerf, remove most abuses of lethal damage like exalted blade etc but dont remove it entirely except for stealth finishes otherwise it really hurts legitimate uses of the mod and daggers

 

for example allow loki and ash to still have lethal damage non-stealth finisher attacks under their respective invisibility on unaware enemies 

 

dont make the mod and daggers useless after going to all the effort to give them purpose and a niche with a generic blanket nerf, make the changes more specific otherwise its a complete waste

But if it was just limited to stealth then it would be the same "issue" as exalted blade is going thru. People would be locked into using those 2 frames (or companions) with covert lethality.. 

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It does matter.

 

For example, if I use Prisma Skana I'd likely to use Bright Purity. Which is ignored by Exalted Blade. Which means I waste a mod slot for exalted blade.

 

So what?  You've got to make a choice now.  Do you build your melee weapon to be used in melee mode (which the Prisma Skana is viable for, mind you), or do you build it to make EB better?

 

Now you've got a decision to make.  You cannot have your cake AND eat it too.

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Syndicate mods affecting exalted blade never made sense to me. I would like for the damage buffs to still persist, just have the syndicate effects removed from it ie, purity,truth,justice, etc. But still, removing the sydicate mod effects completely would also make sense since the exalted blade is not the weapon that the mod is for.

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After considering the use of Covert Lethality for Exalted Blade a debate ensued about the use of melee Mods that are specific to certain weapons; again, it was decided that while we intended for certain melee Mods to amplify Exalted Blade it didn't make sense for all melee Mods to apply. For example, currently the buff from Justice Blades works for Exalted Blade even though the mod is an augment for the Dual Cleavers.

 

A couple things I hope DE has either thought about, or are willing to consider:

 

Covert Lethality's lethal damage finisher should clearly not work with ex-blade; however, CL has a flat 100 damage bonus to consider.  If Covert Lethality does not affect ex-blade at all, using Covert Lethality on a dagger would almost always be a waste of a mod slot for any Excalibur that wants to run a dagger.  By keeping the 100 flat damage bonus for ex-blade, at least daggers on Excalibur remain late-game viable, even if it is no longer top-tier.

 

Alternatively, DE may choose to say that Covert Lethality fits the "weapon-specific" category, and just decide it should never work with ex-blade.  If this is their stance, I hope that means more "weapon-type specific" mods show up, like Covert Lethality, for other melee weapon types.  This would allow multiple weapon types to start developing niches in combat, and level the playing field when you compare potential weapon load-outs.  Furthermore, this would give ex-blade a viable "weapon-specific" category to benefit from, because ex-blade is technically a long-sword.  Nonetheless, this would almost entirely narrow Excalibur build options to long-swords, even if it expands frame-specific load-outs in the meta.  I still think the first option is the best.

 

Another issue: the lack of weapon-specific mods affecting ex-blade negatively impacts the meta, by removing an interesting frame-exclusive melee meta from Excalibur.  This narrows the overall meta by pushing Excalibur right back to generic top-tier builds.  If the "weapon-type specific" mod idea I mentioned were enacted, this would partially solve this problem.

 

Lastly, while I like the idea of "weapon-type specific" mods, I find that Covert Lethality is a powerful mod that slipped into Warframe to poorly patch up a clear problem: stealth, finishers, and their respective modifiers are incredibly flawed, especially in terms of what weapon-types receive which bonus.  Heavy Blades have the largest finisher modifier, while daggers have the lowest.  Covert Lethality seems like an attempt to address this issue, without having to actually fix the mechanics themselves.

 

I don't know if this will be read by anyone.  I just hope the ramifications of these changes, and the potential solutions, are being considered.

Edited by Ithloniel
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But if it was just limited to stealth then it would be the same "issue" as exalted blade is going thru. People would be locked into using those 2 frames (or companions) with covert lethality.. 

But that's the entire point. It's in the name; Covert Lethality. Of course it's going to be locked to two frames that specialize in stealth. The mod is already locked to just daggers only anyway.

Off-topic from your comment for a moment and just to repeat myself; keeping undetected insta kills wouldn't be OP purely due to the fact that daggers have S#&$ range, you'd have to get close to enemies and thus risk bumping into their hurtbox and thus ruining your undetection, and it wouldn't be viable for mass room clearing. Team mates with abilities specialized in that would make that tactic really ineffective unless you were solo-ing.

But if they kept it the way it was and just removed some of the exploitative nature of it (aka radial blind + 'F***-you' energy waves from exalted blade, and ground slamming aoe instakills), it would have had a solid, balanced purpose: targeting some of the more dangerous targets.

Dagger users would have a purpose if they kept the undetected insta-kill factor in; taking care of some of the more dangerous units. Energy draining tank leaders and what not. Isn't that what covert lethality is supposed to be design wise? Something to assassinate VIP enemies? That's what I always pictured it as. Now it's just ruined if you ask me.

Edited by Triburos
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But that's the entire point. It's in the name; Covert Lethality. Of course it's going to be locked to two frames that specialize in stealth. The mod is already locked to just daggers only anyway.

Off-topic from your comment for a moment and just to repeat myself; keeping undetected insta kills wouldn't be OP purely due to the fact that daggers have S#&$ range, you'd have to get close to enemies and thus risk bumping into their hurtbox and thus ruining your undetection, and it wouldn't be viable for mass room clearing. Team mates with abilities specialized in that would make that tactic really ineffective unless you were solo-ing.

But if they kept it the way it was and just removed some of the exploitative nature of it (aka radial blind + 'F***-you' energy waves from exalted blade, and ground slamming aoe instakills), it would have had a solid, balanced purpose: targeting some of the more dangerous targets.

Dagger users would have a purpose if they kept the undetected insta-kill factor in; taking care of some of the more dangerous units. Energy draining tank leaders and what not. Isn't that what covert lethality is supposed to be design wise? Something to assassinate VIP enemies? That's what I always pictured it as. Now it's just ruined if you ask me.

I dunno, I could see it being useful cause that "hurt box" thing can be really annoying, but even still whats the point of literally locking it to those 2 frames to be useful if they are changing EB for the reason they are? I mean you could just put on Shade or the Huras kubrow and its gg. Its not really balanced when Loki and Ash can stay stealthed for extended periods. Now if it turned off stealth after the 1st melee kill, THAT would make it fit the description that you are giving it more so. At least you would have to keep recasting to keep one shotting. 

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(..) limiting the thing to stealth-finishers only is beyond a terrible design choice. For two reasons:

First, the more situational a mod is, the S#&$tier it gets.

Second, stealth finishers are a terrible design choice as a whole... In their current state. They're nifty, but incredibly cumbersome. It's the same reason you guys had to change Ash's Blade Storm to add clones; S#&$ takes too long. So unless you want to give everyone who performs a stealth finisher a mini version of Blade Storm, I can't really agree with the change here you guys :[.

(...)

 

I've used daggers... I didn't like them, but they're -very useful- especially when dealing combos. The whole thing for the Covert Lethality, from what I experienced, is that, compared to most Melee weapons, its finisher damage ends up being lower than the average finisher damage from the rest of the Melee weaponry. Covert Lethality was made to compensate, and offer significant damage bonus, to all stealth finishers that are currently possible to do. When a mod becomes entirely situational, it doesn't mean its crap. It uses up a mod slot that could be used to boost damage, but the relevance of Covert Lethality on a dagger is a lot higher than using either Fury or Reach/Primed Reach on a dagger, which are buried underground and not at the bottom of the pyramid. Its a helper to use stealth finishers.

 

A suggestion for DE to speed things up a bit when concerning finisher animations is to do the same treatment they did to Radial Javelin and Radial Blind. Get rid of the "idle animations". The problem with the Stealth Finisher animations is not on the strike itself, its entering and exiting the Stealth Finisher itself. Valuable time is lost during those two moments.

 

Awesome, does this mean that we'll finally see the Soma and Boltor prime nerfed to facilitate further diversity in primary weapons?

Can't wait to see people rocking the Hind.

More seriously, I'm not sure how I feel about this.

I dust Excalibur off every so often, my melee weapon's an afterthought as it's slotted up with mods for when I need or want to use exalted blade - perhaps this brings it back down to the point it was at with the initial release, more or less, bar no longer having frontal invulnerability due to the parkour stamina overhaul, but, it's not this that's the issue here; it's the feeling for some that this taints their experience over what they see as a knee jerk reaction to a problem that they called before the release of the mod that brought this about.

 

... I would've reworked Stamina to work with Melee only and call it... Whatever, Stamina works as well as any other name...

Anyway, having your Melee weapon with mods slotted just for Exalted Blade is a valid choice, but causes situations such as these. Grabbing this example, when this fix appeared, in what standing did you find yourself in? You'll have to change a few mods here and there because the ones you're probably using won't affect Exalted Blade anymore. This is pretty much where most are right now, and they're annoyed not just because of Syndicate mods not affecting Exalted Blade, but also because Covert Lethality is fixed to Stealth Finishers... Like I said a few pages ago, the more someone focus on the meta, the more restristed they will feel and will be, because they can't think about the specifics of what they will find. They need to focus less on the meta, and more on the general picture. That's how I'm focusing on the thing and I haven't had any problems with the so-called "nerfs". Everything DE does, considering adjustments and fixes, end up being a boost for me because I seem to be on the same page as them.

 

Many weapons have been released but I didn't bother getting any of them. I already have my equipment, it works perfectly well up to lvl170, reasonably acceptable from lvl170 up to lvl215, and I don't feel the need to get better equipment. In case I decide to use another dagger, which won't be long since I have one building on the Foundry right now, I'll probably get Covert Lethality and use it as it should be used. As a complement for Stealth Finishers, which I seem to be doing a lot with my scythe. In fact, my equipment allows me to do stealth finishers and kills on anyone, anywhere and at anytime. One simply needs to have a good tactical awareness, as a player, with multiple targets and directions/angles and great with timings.

 

... Yes, I know its hard to stealth. That's especially true when the ones running the mission are more interested in a Time Attack method with the rest of the squad instead of a proper method. Being careful and vigilant isn't going to make you last 3 hours on a single mission, I can stealth my way through a mission at the same time most run a mission without being stealthy, excluding objective-only focused runs... Because I'm pretty sure that one can complete a Deception mission in less than 20 seconds, just to name an example of a Time Attack run I made 2 days ago.

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So what?  You've got to make a choice now.  Do you build your melee weapon to be used in melee mode (which the Prisma Skana is viable for, mind you), or do you build it to make EB better?

 

Now you've got a decision to make.  You cannot have your cake AND eat it too.

 

That's just silly. 

 

People will continue to mod for Exalted Blade. It's a no brainer.

 

With max efficiency and a Carrier sentinel sucking up energy orbs from all the dead bodies laying around, there is almost no need to ever use your normal melee weapon. Since the weapon doesn't matter anymore, you could just stick with the free skana you're given at the beginning of the game and not craft anything else.

 

The only choice people have now is do they fit Life Strike and Focus Energy into their build with the syndicate mod gone, or not?

 

That's two mod slots taken where one did the job before.

Edited by Rebellis
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The fact that Excal's blind reverts enemies into an locked undetected state (sounds like a coding patch to keep them from targeting players) seems like a problem that should be addressed instead of taking a mod that made daggers useful and making it useless. I can stealth finish any enemy with a any decently modded melee weapon already. In what scenario would a player have this rare mod and not a ranked and potato'd dagger? None. 

 

I've played many missions with this new mod on Ash and Loki and found it was a nice buff to their killing potential. It seemed this synergy was intended. Setting up enemies for undetected skills does require a bit of effort. You can't "run and gun" and need to try and stay invisible or hidden. I can already 1-hit most things with Scindo Prime anyway, and I don't have to be stealthy to do it. This just made it so players who preferred to plan, gather up a horde, flash invisible and take them down had a better way to do it. Ash and loki with this mod aren't breaking the game, not compared to heavy weapons with 5x slams in their combos. Just fix Excal's use of the mod and you're done. 

 

NOBODY does stealth finishers frequently, if ever. A Few reasons:

- There is just currently no reason to perform a finisher 99% of the time. They are slow, even in spy missions if I have stealth it's far better to just skip an enemy than risk a finisher. You lose valuable time as your ability's timer counts down and if you screw it up or another enemy comes around the corner you're hosed. So the obvious location to use stealth finishers, spy missions, is already undermined. But that's not the main reason...

 

- By the time you get to a lvl where you need a finisher to 1-hit an enemy, the use of finishers is obsolete. Why? The reason is you're in a long survival or defense mission and you either need quick frequent kills for life support or quick frequent kills to defend the pod. I have run high wave missions with loki, and I find the painfully long time it takes to sneak around behind things just to perform a slow animation is just dumb. I mean sure it's possible, but I could have ended his life with a slingshot filled with marbles at that rate. The only time I've actively performed finishers with is an ability that opens enemies up to them, but it is STILL faster to use something like Tigris or Boltor P to effectively take down your foe. But that still isn't the main reason...

 

-There is no time where you are in a mission so high level that you want that lethal finisher where the enemy is also going to be open to it. FINISHERS ALREADY ARE LETHAL WHEN YOU NEED THEM. I can think of maybe 1 or 2 times I didn't kill something with a fully modded weapon finisher, and that is because it was a lvl 90+ bombard and I was using Tipedo, a low damage weapon. Was it an issue? No, that weapon wasn't my damage weapon and that opportunity came up so rarely I would NEVER mod for it. I don't know anyone who would.

 

 

So finally, I'd like to be a bit positive, I think there are fairly easy solutions to this problem.

 

If DE is still concerned that some crazed Loki player will try to do an infinite dark sector with this mod or something (such a bad bug, not like mesa-frost-trin or anything, oh no) ((sorry, negative again)), I have an idea. Just revert the mod to what it stated day of release: 400% undetected damage. You don't even need the +100 damage if you really want to make this a specialty mod and useless to most players. Compared to things like Scindo P, D. Nikana, and Dakra P it won't be overpowered at all, even underwhelming. However that functionality will finally throw a bone to your niche stealth players, who are currently using a mechanic that doesn't even exist for nearly everyone in the game but is still fun to think about and use. 

 

 

vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

 

TL:DR

- Excal's use of CL is dumb, and easy to remove (It already is being remove along with other good stuff)

- Ash and Loki's use of CL isn't game breaking compared to other melee options

- Nobody uses stealth finishers

- If a change is absolutely required, go with 400-600% damage undetected instead of on finishers (god anything but finishers)

 

If you disagree, please see above wall of text for my full argument. DE goes back and forth on stuff all the time, I'm sure nobody will mind if this mod gets addressed again instead of becoming useless. 

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That mean you will have to perform finisher to kill such enemy. 

 

Well finishers as they are now should be letal witout any mods... They takeing sooooooooooooooo much time to perform.

 

I really hope that DE will make finisher animation more swift/shorter/faster.

 

P.S: can we have Covert Lethality mod being equipable on dual daggers too?

Edited by Haldos
Cleaning.
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... I didn't mention that he can't match his gear, I said its Primed ridiculous... For all I care, again I apologize for my bluntness, he could even use a thong as a Warframe and a rubber companion as a Melee weapon. I think that neither me or you have any power over his choice. As far as I know, I expressed an oppinion. Since you reacted to it, I assume you also like to match your gear. I'm not going to share my oppinion on your gear matching, as you already reacted to an oppinion that wasn't even directed at you in the first place.

You pretty much jumped him for wanting to use his Skana Prime with his Excalibur Prime. Well, assuming he didn't sell Excalibur Prime, but why would a founder need/want to? It would be interesting if DE released those items,if only for the riot in the forums over 'breaking immersion'. It was more your self proclaimed bluntness making your reply look like an attack on someone's choices that earned my reply. I generally don't bother with matching past color palette.

 

 

... Last time I checked, I have gas... Mostly generated when people end up quoting me the way you just did. Definitely and exponentinally generated when people quote me for stuff I didn't even wrote like, as an example, the quote "All of this post, really." you just did... When that happens, like in all natural reactions, the atmospherical venting process gets rather noisy... And no, unfortunately for you, I didn't go to the beach...

 

Also, stop looking at your nether regions, assume that its the same for everyone, and throw their status on public display as a justification for an ending remark. its quite disturbing and disgusting.

It was either that or quote your post in it's entirety again and I didn't feel the page needed stretching. I suppose ~snip~ would have worked, unless that offends you too.

 

The PG rating enforced on these forums can make certain messages difficult to get across. I'll take it as the one I was trying to send you is not one you are familiar with, so here's the gist: 'You seem very irritated over something trivial. It's not worth getting worked up over.'

 

Side note: while I understand you were referencing flatulence the first message I got was that you were full of hot air.

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...having your Melee weapon with mods slotted just for Exalted Blade is a valid choice... [snip].

 

Having logged in to review my setups and what would change mechanically as as opposed to to what I would perceive to change or be the issue, I find myself somewhat saddened.

Mechanically, I would merely change one mod to counter the loss of synergy between Excalibur and the syndicate mod as I never aquired - and would not have seen an issue with the loss of interaction between them had I done so - the dagger mod that sparked this.

The weapons I use will continue to have setups capable of either finishing off something with quick melee while I reload my weapon of choice, or knocking down/stunning the crowds they are capable of striking with high status chance.

The advent of parkour 2.0 meant that I no longer required several of my weapons as crutches for mobility. Perhaps I lost speed, but what I gained provided me with more entertainment and flexibility. No longer could I cast myself across a vast room in under a second, instead, I could vault off the head of an enemy, turn about in the air and pull him off his feet.

Note the important part here from my perspective is that I no longer required several weapons, as I gained where I lost.

When you take what I perceive in this case, it is that the glittery toy that I set up specifically for Excalibur - something thats appeal has been tainted by all of this - does not offer anything that my go-to weapons do in terms of the utility or potential to finish off a threat due to their exceptionally low range.

I'll continue to use - or not use - Excalibur as I desire, but there's a distasteful element lingering now that is going to nag at me and have my leanings go towards another go-to frame and weapon combination.

Even if ultimately, this doesn't mechanically change things much beyond how the overhauled Excalibur worked at release.

Meta be damned, I just want to play my first frame, the frame that I wanted to see new potential in with its rework, without feeling disgusted by what is to come.

Those shiny toys are going into the pile of things that collects dust, the crutches are getting sold.

The overall diversity in the weapons I use is thus shrinking.

To echo you, I already have my equipment, it works perfectly well for what I need it for. It works reasonably acceptable for dragging things out to the point fun is replaced with grind. I don't use daggers or stealth finishers as they're cumbersome and break the flow of the game by locking you into sometimes jarringly broken animations.

I'm tired though, tired and grumpy.

Perhaps sleep to approach this on a fresh mind is wise - though I have doubts it'll have the lingering digust dissipate, or my melee weapon diversity bloom.

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Wait, wait, hold on. STOP.

 

Covert Lethality will only trigger from Stealth Finishers... I hope you do not refer to those clumsy, tediously slow and utterly exposing attack animations that play when you accidentally walk too close to the group of 12 grineer and which ends up with you eating a handful of bullets because you are literally forced to wait for the animation to end before being able to get out of the line of fire.

 

Here's the main problem: As much as you guys enjoy your animations and all, they're not viable for Warframe's fast gameplay and super-low time-to-kill ratios. At low levels, the Tenno can kill everything waaaay faster by swinging their sword (read: one-shot, stealth XP bonus and all) at them compared to repeatedly using the stealth finisher, and at higher levels they will DIE before the stealth finisher ends, because of how slow they are. Fury, Berserker, etc should all be affecting the finisher's animation speed in that case (perhaps even moreso than the normal attack speed bonus), just so we actually use - and even then, they're still speed bumps in our otherwise hyper-fast gameplay sections.

Edited by ScorpDK
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positive note in whiny thread: yay it will finally trigger with prolonged paralysis :D

 

well this mod is still far from useless. From the very beginning I though it is supposed to work this way and imagine my dissapointment when one of my fav auguments were rendering it unusable because "it not stealth atack - its finisher n ragdolled enemy"

 

about all these guys with "finishers are lethal when needed" well it seems you never had situation when chanelled finisher from channeling-finisher build weapon faild to kill the guy - for me it happened way too often (playing on too high leveled enemies? :P)

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Balance, you say? How about you fix your broken channeling blocking first? The moment Excalibur start channeling, even if it is just for single life strike attack in EB, his energy will be depleted in seconds because of autoblocking and insane energy drain. 

 

yay it will finally trigger with prolonged paralysis :D

No, it won't. Prolonged paralysis triggers ground finishers, not stealth finishers.

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Regardless of Covert Lethality, daggers are still no fun since it doesn't fix that they are trash in combat with their terrible stances. Even if it did let you 1 shot anything knocked down, it's just a shiny bobble to distract everyone from how bad they are. Did people really commit to a playstyle about trying to 1 shot enemies with a stupid long animation lock because that's impractical. The mod is basically made for stealth runs and if you didn't see this coming then you must be really naive.

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Finally  this gets fixed...

Whas hoping for a exalted Blade patch for a long time....

I mean, it was so OP, everyone knew it would be nerfed. Same thing was with Greedy Pull. It was nerfed BECAUSE it was abused...

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I feel, after reading 21 pages of comments from this post, that many players would be very unhappy to see Syndicate augments go from Excalibur’s Exalted Blade.  However it appears that DE is likely to move forward in this direction.  Removing Syndicate augments for Exalted Blade, for nearly all Excalibur users, is a nerf; Syndicate Augments offered both damage and utility to Exalted Blade.


 


Exalted Blade is a weapon in it’s own right, it has it’s own stats and it’s own stance with unique combos.  Here are Exalted Blade’s stats:


 


Base damage is 33.3% Impact, 33.3% Puncture, and 33.3% Slash.


2.0x Critical Strike Multiplier


15% Critical Strike Chance


10% Status Chance


 


And for the Energy Waves:


 


Base damage is 20% Impact, 10% Puncture, and 70% Slash.


2.0x Critical Strike Multiplier


15% Critical Strike Chance


10% Status Chance


 


As we can see, any melee weapon with an optimized build taking advantage of a high base status chance will not prove as useful as a weapon with a high base critical strike chance.  The same is true for weapons of Impact and Puncture damage that, if optimized, would not use Buzzkill.  This is simply because weapons which do not have stats similar to Exalted Blade will emphasize their strengths, leaving Exalted Blade weak and vis versa.


 


The suggested change is to give Exalted Blade It’s very own Upgrades tab, accessible in the Excalibur Upgrade UI or next to melee weapons in the main Arsenal UI.  Here players can add a build which is purely designed for their Exalted Blade and DE can directly control what mods are available.  If this were to be implemented It would be very nice if players didn’t need two of every mod they’d need to build an Exalted Blade and a similarly stated weapon, please allow us to just double dip.


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Regardless of Covert Lethality, daggers are still no fun since it doesn't fix that they are trash in combat with their terrible stances. Even if it did let you 1 shot anything knocked down, it's just a shiny bobble to distract everyone from how bad they are. Did people really commit to a playstyle about trying to 1 shot enemies with a stupid long animation lock because that's impractical. The mod is basically made for stealth runs and if you didn't see this coming then you must be really naive.

Incorrect.

 

Before this change, any enemies that were unalerted to your presence caused the lethal damage to proc. Stealth finishers and knock down finishers didn't play any part to it.

 

In other words; if you were Ash or Loki and you went up to an enemy's face and slit their throat in invis, you would kill them. No long animation, just a quick swipe. There's a difference between stealth / grounded attacks and unalerted attacks.

 

Stealth finishers as far as I know only work if an enemy is not currently in it's combat mode. So basically if yer playing any mission that forces all enemies into combat, the mod is near enough useless.

 

UNALERTED attacks occur when the enemy - weither they're in combat or not - have not had their aggro on you recently. Bumping into enemies in stealth for example would make you alerted, and thus you would lose the unalerted damage bonus. But if you are in stealth and an opponent is shooting say... A team mate and they havn't aggro'd you in awhile (or at all), you could get an Unalerted attack off.

 

Problem though is that Covert Lethality's instakill mechanic failed to account for things that it obviously shouldn't proc on, such as Radial Blind and AoE ground slams. THIS was the mod's problem.

 

But now, it's one of those dumpster bin mods like Intruder, Undying Will, Warm Coat and so forth because they changed it to be way too situational.

 

People can complain that it woulda been broken in the hands of Loki or Ash even if they fixed to the exploits. To which I reply; they probably have never seen the nuke tier damage of a Scindo P or Galatine modded for single hit burst against an unalerted enemy.

 

Thing is; Covert Lethality would just make for a nice change of pace. Lokis and Ashs one shotting S#&$ with absurd damage numbers in stealth melee is nothing new. It's just ironic that I'm going around with a giant ! sword or axe as my STEALTH melee weapon because Daggers are absolute S#&$e. Atleast with Covert Lethality before they were a nice equal to those giant ! blades. And even then they have shorter range.

 

The nerf was unnecessary. The exploits needed to be targeted.

Edited by Triburos
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