Amprex: Get Punch-Through Or Add Range?

[YashiroSora]

I know adding either of these in will lower my DPS or namely my damage at that moment, but i feel its better if i add utility of these in for low lvl clearing and worry about damage for high lvls with a different build. So would it be better to add punch through or more range?

[Darzk]

The branching works like this;

 

Without PT - 5ish (? Can't recall if it's 5 or 9-10 with MS) branches spread from the enemy hit, dealing 50% damage, to enemies within range. This range is effected by SR. If only 2 other enemies are in range, only 2 branches will be created. If the enemy is on it's own and nothing else is within range, no branches will be created.

 

So SR is most effective with sparsely crowded rooms, as you can go from only hitting a few enemies with branches (2-3 in small packs) to all 5. 200% damage to 350% or so, a 75% increase. The massive range increase from SR means you're almost always hitting enemies with the electricity arcs - and arcs work when hitting dead bodies, so this can help prevent overkilling from being wasted ammo like on most weapons.

 

With PT - branches are spawned from every enemy hit by the main beam, not just the first contacted.

 

PT is most effective when hitting large crowds, where you're already spawning the maximum number of arcs. If you hit 2 enemies in a row, both will spawn arcs, dealing 350% damage to the crowd from each enemy (700% total). In addition, if the enemies arc to each other you can treat that as a 50% dps increase to your primary target.  However having enemies on their own or in small packs the benefits of PT are mostly wasted.

 

 

Personally, I prefer SR - it means you're almost always using all of your arcs, no matter who you shoot at. Using PT means that you need to plan your shots and aim for multihits in tightly packed crowds to be most effective.

 

To save some forma, try out a Viral/Elec proc/SR build with Ammo mut. A LOT lower damage than a 6 forma setup but it will deal pretty decent dps and also lock down a room pretty effectively, for only 2-3 Forma. Gives you a good idea of what the weapon is capable of: http://goo.gl/43dgvf (You can use a High Voltage in place of Ammo Mut if you don't worry about ammo consumption).

[fortris]

Punch-through is worthless unless you REALLY want to hit people through walls (as in the person your crosshair is over not the chain targets).

 

The problem with range, is the damage drops off drastically the farther the enemy is/longer it chains. Honestly just stick with ammo mutation or something (or go raw damage/crit).

[Krak_Nihilus]

Why not both? I use both on my amprex, especially when dealing with missions where there are huge groups of enemies.

[fortris]

Why not both? I use both on my amprex, especially when dealing with missions where there are huge groups of enemies.

I guess this works for lower levels but if you're taking it in T3/4/Raids you're gonna want the damage honestly.

 

Hell you might as well use Atomos with the range mod since it's damage doesn't drop off.

[(XBOX)ChantingSheep]

Punch-thru is great for big crowds, but you don't want Shred (because increased fire rate is detrimental to Amprex imo), and given a choice between Metal Augur and Sinister Reach, Sinister Reach wins every time (in terms of overall usefulness). I used Sinister Reach for a long time until I hit higher level stuff, when the trade-out for damage became *almost* necessary.

So, to answer your question, imo range wins hands down. Be ready when you take it off, though...it takes some adjustment to get used to the short range again lol.

[Cyborg-Rox]

Hell you might as well use Atomos with the range mod since it's damage doesn't drop off.

 

Yeah, really hate crit-based weapons that need additional utility. You lose so much damage no matter what mod you try to replace.

[Valkyr-Umbra]

Punch-thru is great for big crowds, but you don't want Shred (because increased fire rate is detrimental to Amprex imo), and given a choice between Metal Augur and Sinister Reach, Sinister Reach wins every time (in terms of overall usefulness). I used Sinister Reach for a long time until I hit higher level stuff, when the trade-out for damage became *almost* necessary.

So, to answer your question, imo range wins hands down. Be ready when you take it off, though...it takes some adjustment to get used to the short range again lol.

^ this. Punch-thru is generally awesome for crowds and shooting through cover, but for something like amprex I'd have to agree that range wins. On the other hand, if you're modding boltor/soma prime, I'd highly recommend shred (it lowers your single-target dps less than metal augur and will chew through crowds/cover). Some shotguns, like hek or phage, will also benefit substantially from punch-through (one shot from my hek typically kills a crowd).

Edited August 16, 2015 by Snowman486

[YashiroSora]

Punch-through is worthless unless you REALLY want to hit people through walls (as in the person your crosshair is over not the chain targets).

From research, wiki states that punch through makes the chain that branches off the main beam branch off to even more targets. With range, I'm planning to use Sinister Reach, so I don't understand why there would be drop off from distance.

[YashiroSora]

^ this. Punch-thru is generally awesome for crowds and shooting through cover, but for something like amprex I'd have to agree that range wins. On the other hand, if you're modding boltor/soma prime, I'd highly recommend shred (it lowers your single-target dps less than metal augur and will chew through crowds/cover). Some shotguns, like hek or phage, will also benefit substantially from punch-through (one shot from my hek typically kills a crowd).

Well fire rate as I'm aware will kill its already hellish ammo efficiency, I have watched some review videos. So if punch through from what I read on wiki increases the branches, would more range give more branches than Metal Auger?

[fortris]

From research, wiki states that punch through makes the chain that branches off the main beam branch off to even more targets. With range, I'm planning to use Sinister Reach, so I don't understand why there would be drop off from distance.

I don't know why there is, but during the time I used Sinister Reach I noticed quite often enemies far away would be taking 0-20 damage as opposed to the hundreds to thousands I normally dealt. 

 

Test it yourself if you don't believe me.

[YashiroSora]

I don't know why there is, but during the time I used Sinister Reach I noticed quite often enemies far away would be taking 0-20 damage as opposed to the hundreds to thousands I normally dealt.

Test it yourself if you don't believe me.

So would that mean that, in comparison of branching, punch through would work better?

EDIT: Can someone also explain to me in detail how does branching of Amprex actually works and behaves?

I have played for quite a bit and I understand how punch through works in most cases, but it seems this is a very... Unique weapon.

Edited August 16, 2015 by YashiroSora

[fortris]

So would that mean that, in comparison of branching, punch through would work better?

I've never done in-depth testing, I suppose you could try each for yourself. I'd test it but I'm heading out soon so I have no time.

[(XBOX)ChantingSheep]

From research, wiki states that punch through makes the chain that branches off the main beam branch off to even more targets. With range, I'm planning to use Sinister Reach, so I don't understand why there would be drop off from distance.

Basically, when the main shot hits someone or something, it makes x branches (increased by multishot iirc), so with punch-thru, if the main shot goes through a target and hits something else, it creates another set of branches from the second target. To me, this is what limits its effectiveness, because there's not always an opportunity to hit two or more targets in a line (unless, as said before, huge crowd).

I believe Sinister Reach also affects how far the branches reach, though I'm not 100% sure about that.

[FutureClem]

Put 20 max level bombards/heavy gunners in simulacrum and see which mod equipped will get you more kills.

 

Punch through will win for sure.

[YashiroSora]

EDIT: Can someone also explain to me in detail how does branching of Amprex actually works and behaves?

I have played for quite a bit and I understand how punch through works in most cases, but it seems this is a very... Unique weapon.

I would be grateful if anyone can answer this for me.

[(PSN)redman74]

AFAIK each branch deals 50% of the damage of the preceding hit, (modified by element resistances of the enemy).

There is the Simulacrum, it could be tested out.

[YashiroSora]

AFAIK each branch deals 50% of the damage of the preceding hit, (modified by element resistances of the enemy).

There is the Simulacrum, it could be tested out.

One problem, I do not have a 6 forma Amprex at hand as mine is literally fresh out of the foundry to be used for its first time. If any can test this for me I'd be grateful.

[(PSN)redman74]

One problem, I do not have a 6 forma Amprex at hand as mine is literally fresh out of the foundry to be used for its first time. If any can test this for me I'd be grateful.

An unranked, unpotatoed, unforma'd Amprex will work just as well for the test.

[smithf]

unless you are in a mission which is so thick with enemies lined up that your punch through is always active (which afaik, is very very rare) , I'll go for range.

[KIREEK]

Range is better, have no clue why Punch-through is being considered as a better alternative

 

Range will make the arcs hit enemies arond the 1st target, including the ones behind, making Punch-through worthless.

[Darzk]

Range will make the arcs hit enemies arond the 1st target, including the ones behind, making Punch-through worthless.

If you hit two enemies in a row without PT, the arc from the first will hit the second enemy, causing 50% damage to them - 150% damage total (100% tot he first enemy, 50% to the second).

 

If you install PT, the arc from the first will still hit the second, causing 50% damage, but then the main beam will hit the second, causing 100%, plus the arc from the second will hit the first, causing 50% damage to him - 300% total, 150% to the first enemy and 150% to the second.

 

Not to mention more arcs means more status chance (if we care).

 

So in that scenario, PT is worth +50% to the primary target and 2x damage in total. Far from worthless.

[KIREEK]

The problem is that without reach enemies need to be relatively close and lined up for that to work.

 

With reach you simply attack whatevers comes in your sight, while it may do "less damage" it will work for the large majority of the situations, utility is my choice here.

[Omnimorph]

I think if you have enough forma you can switch between them at need - but you'd only need to switch (and you'd only need to worry about having HC in) if you were doing ultra high-end stuff.

 

For most content up to 40 mins/40 waves, SR is going to be more useful more often, and HC is going to be less useful (because you need the aim precision because you're usually precision-burst-firing at the closest mobs in sparse mob groups in the distance).  Darzk's 3 forma build is excellent as a "starter" Amprex that's really powerful - and tbqh, I doubt most players would need anything beyond it.

 

OTOH, if you're doing something more high-end with lots of corridors (e.g. 40-60 min and beyond ODS) where mobs are often bunched up and coming at you, then the PT+HC will be more useful, because you're effectively using the Amprex more like a shotgun, and you're talking more like a 5-7 forma build.