Vadrigos Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Oh boy, that makes a lot of sense, I'm against 'freedom of choice' I literally just said YOU HAVE ALL THE FREEDOM IN THE WORLD in Warframe, you choose who you play with, no one else does, and you darn well know that, so at this point I can only conclude you are being stupid on purpose. I really didn't want to say that, but that's the only way to say it, I cannot believe you cannot understand the simple concept that you can 100% control who plays with you in warframe at all times, you're not an idiot, I know you're not, so why do you insist on behaving like one? Continue to make personal attacks like this and you'll be reported. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NocturneOfSolace Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) Continue to make personal attacks like this and you'll be reported. I'm not making a personal attack at all, I didn't call you stupid, I said you're being stupid on purpose, aka you're being difficult on purpose. I know full well you're not an idiot, so when you sit there and act as if you don't get that in Warframe, you can 100% control who does and doesn't play with you, a very simple concept... I can only conclude, you're being stupid on purpose, for the purpose of being difficult, or trolling me There is nothing difficult about the concept 'Hey, if I want to do a mission, I can recruit people of my choice, and if I don't like them, I can quit the mission, and restart with a new squad, and if I really don't like them, I can mute them to block them from whispering me for invites so that I never have to play with them again.' Why is that difficult? Why is that so hard to understand? I can't understand how you could think it's difficult, so I can only conclude as mentioned earlier, you're deliberately being obtuse about it Edited August 17, 2015 by NocturneOfSolace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vadrigos Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 I'm not making a personal attack at all, I didn't call you stupid, I said you're being stupid on purpose, aka you're being difficult on purpose. I know full well you're not an idiot, so when you sit there and act as if you don't get that in Warframe, you can 100% control who does and doesn't play with you, a very simple concept... I can only conclude, you're being stupid on purpose, for the purpose of being difficult, or trolling me Saying that I'm being stupid is a personal attack. Rather than provide actual feedback, all I've seen you do so far is try and blow off my ideas and feedback and act like I don't know what I'm talking about. This is disrespectful conduct, and I've reported you for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NocturneOfSolace Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) Saying that I'm being stupid is a personal attack. Rather than provide actual feedback, all I've seen you do so far is try and blow off my ideas and feedback and act like I don't know what I'm talking about. This is disrespectful conduct, and I've reported you for it. Okay, whatever you wanna believe, it's amusing you'd say that considering you've done the same, but I didn't say you're stupid, I said you're doing it on purpose, big difference. And no, I have not 'blown off' your ideas, I've countered them with logic, and the only thing you've done in response is blow me off, but saying ad hominem style that I simply 'don't know what I'm talking about' Edited August 17, 2015 by NocturneOfSolace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortris Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Uh, yes you do? I have all the choice in the world who plays with me, just because it's public doesn't mean I have no control, it's really easy mate, that's what RECRUITING IS FOR The ONLY people that ever get to play with me are the ones I specifically invite from my friends list, clan list, or from recruiting, and even then rarely do I ever run into 'griefers' to the point it's an actual problem It could be said you're being obtuse on purpose now, or worse things No, because he effectively wasted everyone's time. That's what he wants, to annoy you. Having to reform squads is annoying, the purpose of griefing is to annoy. He wins because he successfully annoyed you. Kicking would be so much simpler, especially since host should have the choice anyway. PUBS are a different story. In PUBS, no one is effectively the "host", only one person is hosting the game on their machine. Giving the "host" of pub lobbies shouldn't have kick for the reasons everyone has been crying about, but PRIVATE LOBBIES should have kick. If I invite a player to my game, using my key, I reserve the right to just as quickly "uninvite" them by kicking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RavenCorella Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/506443-ability-to-initiate-a-votekick-for-the-host-during-a-mission/ In that topic we came up with a solution to prevent abusing. A.Only host can initiate a votekick. B.In order to be able to votekick, your matchmaking mode must be set to "Invite only". This will allow a host to kick idiotic children who can't handle their urge to troll in a mission, and frankly, I see no way to abuse it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsukinoki Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/506443-ability-to-initiate-a-votekick-for-the-host-during-a-mission/ In that topic we came up with a solution to prevent abusing. A.Only host can initiate a votekick. B.In order to be able to votekick, your matchmaking mode must be set to "Invite only". This will allow a host to kick idiotic children who can't handle their urge to troll in a mission, and frankly, I see no way to abuse it. Until you're invited into a T4 mission by a group of 3 friends and right before extraction the host initiates a kick and kicks you out of the game denying you the rewards that you just went through the effort to earn, and you have no way to counter or prevent that. That doesn't "prevent abusing" it merely limits it to the host of the tower missions, which isn't much better than having it be unlimited vote kicking. Plenty of games have "Only host can initiate vote kicks" as an option and you still commonly end up being kicked from the game even if you are the MVP of the group. I've played tons of games, from Payday to Left 4 dead, and in those games I have been kicked for no reason. Such as getting right to the end of a Framing Frame on DW difficulty in perfect stealth (and getting half of the objectives on the final day by myself) and being kicked by the host at the last second so I get nothing for all of the effort I just spent. Happens all the time. Think how painful it would be to spend an hour in T4S missions, only to be kicked in the last 30 seconds and be denied all those rewards with absolutely nothing you can do about it. If a vote-kick system is going to be introduced it would need preconditions to be met before it can be started. Such as: -Can only start a kick on someone holding a datamass for X time while everyone else is in the tile to use it or extraction -Can only start a kick on someone after spending X time in the same tile dealing no damage to enemies or interacting with consoles -Can only start a kick on someone after spending X time out of the objective tile in Mdef/defense/excavation/earth sabotage -Can only start a kick on someone after spending X time Y tiles away from the rest of the group (eg someone bouncing between 3 rooms to avoid the condition of spending X time in the same tile) Conditions like that would catch most of the trolls while actually preventing the kicking from griefing. Just leaving it up to the host to initiate the vote would do absolutely nothing to prevent abuse. Edited August 17, 2015 by Tsukinoki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortris Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Until you're invited into a T4 mission by a group of 3 friends and right before extraction the host initiates a kick and kicks you out of the game denying you the rewards that you just went through the effort to earn, and you have no way to counter or prevent that. That doesn't "prevent abusing" it merely limits it to the host of the tower missions, which isn't much better than having it be unlimited vote kicking. Plenty of games have "Only host can initiate vote kicks" as an option and you still commonly end up being kicked from the game even if you are the MVP of the group. I've played tons of games, from Payday to Left 4 dead, and in those games I have been kicked for no reason. Such as getting right to the end of a Framing Frame on DW difficulty in perfect stealth (and getting half of the objectives on the final day by myself) and being kicked by the host at the last second so I get nothing for all of the effort I just spent. Happens all the time. Think how painful it would be to spend an hour in T4S missions, only to be kicked in the last 30 seconds and be denied all those rewards with absolutely nothing you can do about it. If a vote-kick system is going to be introduced it would need preconditions to be met before it can be started. Such as: -Can only start a kick on someone holding a datamass for X time while everyone else is in the tile to use it or extraction -Can only start a kick on someone after spending X time in the same tile dealing no damage to enemies or interacting with consoles -Can only start a kick on someone after spending X time out of the objective tile in Mdef/defense/excavation/earth sabotage -Can only start a kick on someone after spending X time Y tiles away from the rest of the group (eg someone bouncing between 3 rooms to avoid the condition of spending X time in the same tile) Conditions like that would catch most of the trolls while actually preventing the kicking from griefing. Just leaving it up to the host to initiate the vote would do absolutely nothing to prevent abuse. Then make kicks not prevent you from getting rewards. All of these excuses are REALLY bad, hosts have a right to expel people they invited. SERIOUSLY, in the YEARS I played Payday I got kicked from a game unfairly TWICE. TWO TIMES. I'm not even lucky, I've never heard kicking be so rampant people are in constant outcry for it to be removed, lobby kicking is a thing, and will ALWAYS BE A THING, but in game kicking is so rare it's a terrible excuse to not implement a feature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsukinoki Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) Then make kicks not prevent you from getting rewards. All of these excuses are REALLY bad, hosts have a right to expel people they invited. SERIOUSLY, in the YEARS I played Payday I got kicked from a game unfairly TWICE. TWO TIMES. I'm not even lucky, I've never heard kicking be so rampant people are in constant outcry for it to be removed, lobby kicking is a thing, and will ALWAYS BE A THING, but in game kicking is so rare it's a terrible excuse to not implement a feature. Except your first part "make kicks not prevent you from getting rewards" wont work at all in non-endless missions, such as T4Sab. Further, just because you have gotten lucky in the groups you have joined in Payday doesn't mean that you're the normal average case. I get unfairly kicked at least once a day. Latest one was that DW Framing Frame. Others have been the Golden Grin or Alleso heists right near the end. Just because it doesnt happen to you, doesn't mean that it doesn't happen often. You've just been lucky. And you didn't even comment on the important part of my post, adding conditions before a kick can be started. Because no one should have the right to kick everyone right before extraction just to prevent others from getting the rewards that they earned. So therefore, conditions have to be implemented in order to prevent that type of abuse of kicking. Just kicking at the hosts whim is a bad idea. Edited August 17, 2015 by Tsukinoki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kleerr2 Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Until you're invited into a T4 mission by a group of 3 friends and right before extraction the host initiates a kick and kicks you out of the game denying you the rewards that you just went through the effort to earn, and you have no way to counter or prevent that. That doesn't "prevent abusing" it merely limits it to the host of the tower missions, which isn't much better than having it be unlimited vote kicking. Plenty of games have "Only host can initiate vote kicks" as an option and you still commonly end up being kicked from the game even if you are the MVP of the group. I've played tons of games, from Payday to Left 4 dead, and in those games I have been kicked for no reason. Such as getting right to the end of a Framing Frame on DW difficulty in perfect stealth (and getting half of the objectives on the final day by myself) and being kicked by the host at the last second so I get nothing for all of the effort I just spent. Happens all the time. Think how painful it would be to spend an hour in T4S missions, only to be kicked in the last 30 seconds and be denied all those rewards with absolutely nothing you can do about it. If a vote-kick system is going to be introduced it would need preconditions to be met before it can be started. Such as: -Can only start a kick on someone holding a datamass for X time while everyone else is in the tile to use it or extraction -Can only start a kick on someone after spending X time in the same tile dealing no damage to enemies or interacting with consoles -Can only start a kick on someone after spending X time out of the objective tile in Mdef/defense/excavation/earth sabotage -Can only start a kick on someone after spending X time Y tiles away from the rest of the group (eg someone bouncing between 3 rooms to avoid the condition of spending X time in the same tile) Conditions like that would catch most of the trolls while actually preventing the kicking from griefing. Just leaving it up to the host to initiate the vote would do absolutely nothing to prevent abuse. Good ideas. I just want to mention one little thing. If Votekick is implemented ONLY for the INVITE ONLY mission types and you can have the option to see what is the mission type, upon entering an INVITE ONLY squad that has Votekick and enter such a mission it means that you understand the risks and accept the ''terms of use''. If you run these missions with friends/ clan mates you trust, it will probably not get to the point of you getting kicked. So if you want to not be kicked you will need to stay away from INVITE ONLY squads, and if you want to lets say do a keyshare, you can make a INVITE ONLY squad, and not have to deal with trollers/ girefers and such, plus the ideas you give will further benefit such endeavors. As long as a Votekick is not implemented in PUBLIC mission types which is where everyone can join the actual MISSION at random it will not be a drawback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortris Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Except your first part "make kicks not prevent you from getting rewards" wont work at all in non-endless missions, such as T4Sab. Further, just because you have gotten lucky in the groups you have joined in Payday doesn't mean that you're the normal average case. I get unfairly kicked at least once a day. Latest one was that DW Framing Frame. Others have been the Golden Grin or Alleso heists right near the end. Just because it doesnt happen to you, doesn't mean that it doesn't happen often. You've just been lucky. And you didn't even comment on the important part of my post, adding conditions before a kick can be started. Because no one should have the right to kick everyone right before extraction just to prevent others from getting the rewards that they earned. So therefore, conditions have to be implemented in order to prevent that type of abuse of kicking. Just kicking at the hosts whim is a bad idea. Ok, I don't think I've been lucky, you've just been extremely UNlucky. None of my friends have had this issue, I rarely see anyone posting about being unfairly kicked and obviously I've never kicked anyone without due warning/reason. As to "make kicks not prevent rewards" just tie the rewards to the account, so if they get disconnected or kicked they still get what they've earned. Worst case scenario someone misses a rotation C reward. Honestly this wouldn't be a problem if DE put in the reputation system a LONG time ago like they said they would, you'd immediately see if someone has been reported often for things like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kleerr2 Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) Honestly this wouldn't be a problem if DE put in the reputation system a LONG time ago like they said they would, you'd immediately see if someone has been reported often for things like this. When/ where did DE mention puting a reputation system ingame? I'd like to see/ hear that. I don't think it will be that hard to ruin someone's reputation in a videogame. Like the baiting we saw in the previous page. Edited August 17, 2015 by kleerr2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickBoay Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 worst idea, just play private so you know who you can rely on , i can see this happening: 3 lower lvl players, 1 player steals kills becuz he is epic , kicked for being OP... no kicksystem, bad bad idea, its possible to dogde twerps by having friends/clanmates/anyone u can rely on in your squad instead of public matches, encountering dwerps is one of the risks of playing public and this might be harsh but if u go play public then its ur own fault , rlly no hard feelings or anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RavenCorella Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Ok brats. What about the most common case in which you invite a guy to a T4 survival, using YOUR OWN key, then he goes around triggering all capsules, going AFK, not doing his job properly. Tell me it's still unfair for everyone else. ALSO, Why in the world would YOU get kicked in the first place? If you're afraid the host will kick you, don't join his mission in the first place or don't troll. If you DO get kicked, just ignore them and you'll never join their squad again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[DE]Danielle Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 This thread is turning sour quickly. Locking to prevent any further toxicity. Please remember to respect one another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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