Plorf Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Title says it all. I've been enjoying Parkour 2.0 for the most part, not having to worry about stamina for melee and various actions is nice, and the new movement options feel more fluid (though they still need to design the maps better around them...) However there is one mechanic that I feel got completely shafted with the removal of stamina. Blocking essentially got a gigantic nerf in effectiveness. In my opinion it was the one mechanic that actually made sense for stamina to affect: Temporary damage negation that requires your melee to be out and not attacking. Now, not only does it provide varying levels of protection that don't approach full negation, but if you DO want to block all damage you have to use channeling, which not only has LUDICROUSLY bad efficiency but poor damage reflection too. I would suggest tweaks to the values which would alleviate these issues but honestly I think that the blocking mechanic would be better off reverted to pre-U17 traits. Just rename the stamina meter the blocking meter or whatever. That, or SEVERELY buff the blocking damage negation value and make channeling not only MUCH more efficient but make it scale with enemies and accept efficiency mods. Oh, and make Sword & Shield type weapons the best-in-class at blocking, bar none. Sorry for the rant, but this is the one sour apple in all of U17 for me and I needed to get it off my chest. I hope you agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motorfirebox Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Give blocking 100% effect for the same duration as aimglide/wall-latch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p3z1 Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Well there is no cost for blocking (aside from equipping a melee weapon), so TBH there should be a downside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ranks21 Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 stamina gone but blocking is shorter and the effect/ animation ( when stamina is depleted remains) + you can count the bullets blocked like 15 and youre in that funk<< what a waste they should have left it, it was much better with stamina than without stamina. oh well less meleeing for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)ShuhanX Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Well there is no cost for blocking (aside from equipping a melee weapon), so TBH there should be a downside. Blocking already has an inherent downside. The fact that you can still be pelted with flurries of bullets from behind and that you are limited to a melee ranged weapon is "downside" enough. In a game where you're consistently surrounded by high damaging aimbots, being able to completely protect only one side of yourself is not so advantageous that it needs additional drawbacks added to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pacheon Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Blocking needs a tweak, yes. But how long will it take that DE realizes a new mechanism for blocking? I was pretty satisfied with blocking, not only on Excalibur's Exalted Blade, but somehow... rather playing stealthy and survivable classes, which won't rely on blocking that much. But that's just me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p3z1 Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Blocking already has an inherent downside. The fact that you can still be pelted with flurries of bullets from behind and that you are limited to a melee ranged weapon is "downside" enough. In a game where you're consistently surrounded by high damaging aimbots, being able to completely protect only one side of yourself is not so advantageous that it needs additional drawbacks added to it. This is why not all frames can do "The Sword Alone," because they don't have something that can keep their butts (barely) alive. It's meant for frames with high armor (even if it's broken), a sort of survival skill (iron skin/hysteria), massive CC (keeps them in place or something), or a mix of those. There are others I missed, but you get the idea. So frames like Valkyr and Rhino can probably do sword alone, while Banshee and Vauban can't, to some extent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpl_Facehugger Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Well there is no cost for blocking (aside from equipping a melee weapon), so TBH there should be a downside. There is a downside. You can't shoot. This is a bloody huge downside in a game where your guns are already just as powerful as your swords but massively more convenient. While that nikana user has to bulletjump to his enemies, Mr. Boltor just has to hose them down from any range. The other downside is how blocking is only from the frontal arc. Enemies who're behind you can shoot your unprotected fanny with impunity, which means blocking takes good positioning and skill to pull off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p3z1 Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 There is a downside. You can't shoot. This is a bloody huge downside in a game where your guns are already just as powerful as your swords but massively more convenient. While that nikana user has to bulletjump to his enemies, Mr. Boltor just has to hose them down from any range. The other downside is how blocking is only from the frontal arc. Enemies who're behind you can shoot your unprotected fanny with impunity, which means blocking takes good positioning and skill to pull off. But...but... Ok that's a good point DE pls buff melee in general Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradoxbomb Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 (edited) Yeah, I'm not thrilled about the changes to blocking myself. If anything making 100% blocking tied to Channelling is even worse since Stamina could at least recharge quickly and innately. Plus as others have already pointed out being able to stop incoming bullets from one direction in a game where you're almost constantly surrounded by enemies with guns wasn't exactly overpowered and still wouldn't be even if you could do it indefinitely. Edited August 19, 2015 by Paradoxbomb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven_Face Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Blocking should always be frontally effective, not this penalizing crap we have now. To go with that, I propose that each weapon should have block speed, similar to attack speed. Block speed determines how fast a weapon can be used to block bullets. Lighter weapons would have faster movements when blocking, giving less windows for bullets to go past them. Larger weapons would have slower movements, letting more bullets hit the rest of the body. This would create a non-arguable balance between offensive and defensive values behind each melee weapon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JalakBali Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 They should give blocking some sort of limit like wall latch. Maybe with a fall-off in effectiveness in time. Like, the first 5 seconds of blocking initiated it blocks 100% of the damage, then 75% for the next 5, then 50% for the rest. The clock resets after 5 seconds of initiating an attack/changing weapon or while not actively blocking. This would make blocking great for closing distance but terrible for standing there for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoosterTheRed Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 I think the larger the melee weapon, the more effective the blocking. For example, blocking with daggers is going to be less efficient than blocking with Scindo Prime. Also, it's always driven me crazy that the sword/axe and shield combos don't have a blocking buff of any sort. You have a literal shield that serves no purpose other than as an aesthetic plus. Why? What's the point? At least give us a blocking bonus, or remove the percentage completely. If we can't shoot through those Blunt backpacks the Grineer carry around, why can they shoot through our awesome shields? I sort of like the idea of 100% blocking efficiency if all enemies are shooting your front. Shots from the sides and rear should do normal damage, of course. It would help melee weapons keep up with firearms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ograzzt Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 I think some kind of blocking bar definetly should be added. And something like low and high caps of nullifier's bubbles for damage on this new blocking stamina bar will be really great. For example, you can block for 2000 damage, but if enemy's attack deals less than 100 damage it scales up to 100, if it is more than 400 it scales down to 400. With this system it will still be useful on high levels and not completely overpowered on lowlevel enemies. Numbers of course can be different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Why didn't they leave in the stamina bar and make it effect blocking and wall clings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)MonkeysUnkle1 Posted September 6, 2015 Share Posted September 6, 2015 Blocking already has an inherent downside. The fact that you can still be pelted with flurries of bullets from behind and that you are limited to a melee ranged weapon is "downside" enough. In a game where you're consistently surrounded by high damaging aimbots, being able to completely protect only one side of yourself is not so advantageous that it needs additional drawbacks added to it. Agreed, melee should block all regular damage (not explosions) from the front. Aside from the downsides you listed, you can't attack while blocking. DE needs to stop gimping melee when it's already lagging behind guns in effectiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashnal Posted September 7, 2015 Share Posted September 7, 2015 Give blocking 100% effect for the same duration as aimglide/wall-latch. Honestly, for all their talk of removing "stamina" they need to put the meter back in and have it affect block/aimglide/walllatch. Having an invisible timer is just clunky compared to having a visible bar. They could name it anything they wanted to to stop people from calling it stamina, but dammit a bar is just better UI design for usability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ve1indian Posted September 7, 2015 Share Posted September 7, 2015 Should have block bar that depletes based on the attack type (each weapon/projectile type could have different drain values associated). Channeling while blocking would use energy if the stamina bar depletes (kind of like a second, backup bar), and that would also drain according to the enemy's attack type blocked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted September 7, 2015 Share Posted September 7, 2015 Why isn't blocking with shield weapons 100% damage reduction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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