Mag Shouldn't Be A Starter Frame

[Nosferagon]

It's a good thing she didn't start with Loki then. She would have dropped the game in a heartbeat.

what's wrong with picking loki? i picked loki and i loved it. it was a worthy challenge. i still do though its hard to give equal love and time to all the warframes.

[Aesthetic_Dialectic]

@silkygoodness:

-snip-

I actually have played the early game experience very recently. I know it's issues that's why I said she may seem squishy prior to being able to get good mods and subsequently put them on. But the thread was saying Mag shouldn't be a starter frame when in fact I think she is a perfect fit when she fills a different niche than Excalibur and Volt. Now the early game content doesn't have a problem with being too hard to be completely honest. The problem is end game is too easy and the game has a tendency to think difficultly is causing cluster fucks. Anyways I digress. Yes the difficultly curve is messed up. Yes we should have way to introduce new players to catalysts and reactors, better weapons and mods. But none of these issues have to do with Mag.

[Flibbertigibbety]

My biggest issue with Mag was the extremely short range of pull. It seemed to never work until you were right on the enemy. At higher lvls, she's great. Shield polarize was also pretty much pointless at lower lvls as an offensive ability, as most lower lvl enemies are non corpus. The shield polarize restored far too low shielding at low lvls for how long it takes to cast. Bullet attractor (at the time you get it) is too effective against weak enemies. They die so fast, it can't even be used as an effective defensive ability. At higher lvls, all of these abilities are much better (post range increases)... but at low lvls... they're very frustrating to use.

 

Maybe if they increased the low lvl range of pull, it would be more fun/useful.

 

Shield polarize having a faster cast or restoring more shields at low lvls might be nice.

 

Bullet attractor might be more fun it if it redirected bullets at whatever it is you're aiming at... that way it could be used as a defensive tool (sort of like zephyrs turbulence) but still work like it currently works. Would be useful at low lvls, and I think more fun to use at high lvls.

[KnightCole]

My biggest issue with Mag was the extremely short range of pull. It seemed to never work until you were right on the enemy. At higher lvls, she's great. Shield polarize was also pretty much pointless at lower lvls as an offensive ability, as most lower lvl enemies are non corpus. The shield polarize restored far too low shielding at low lvls for how long it takes to cast. Bullet attractor (at the time you get it) is too effective against weak enemies. They die so fast, it can't even be used as an effective defensive ability. At higher lvls, all of these abilities are much better (post range increases)... but at low lvls... they're very frustrating to use.

 

Maybe if they increased the low lvl range of pull, it would be more fun/useful.

 

Shield polarize having a faster cast or restoring more shields at low lvls might be nice.

 

Bullet attractor might be more fun it if it redirected bullets at whatever it is you're aiming at... that way it could be used as a defensive tool (sort of like zephyrs turbulence) but still work like it currently works. Would be useful at low lvls, and I think more fun to use at high lvls.

 

I actually thought that was how it worked.  It would be amazing if it did.  suck em all, in, look at a mob and KAPOW!

[Hypernaut1]

When i started with Mag i thought crush was awesome. At low levels it felt like it stopped a room and killed everyone. Mag is a great starter frame.

 

As a new player, it took me a while to understand what was useful about SP did though, i rarely used it. It probably had to do with the fact that you fight Grineer first and rarely had enough time to react to low shields before you were dead.

[Paradoxbomb]

Mag seems like a decent starter frame to me. Only alloy-armored enemies are resilient to magnetic damage, so her powers are still effective enough on earlier planets (save for the odd Bombard). Pull can deal decent damage and CC multiple enemies, Shield Polarize admittedly isn't as useful against the Grineer, but it can still be used for instant shield restoration for yourself and your teammates. Bullet Attractor could potentially be useful for taking down problematic enemies like heavies (its energy cost is definitely too hefty though), and Crush is your standard press 4 to kill stuff button.

 

She does fall off at higher level Grineer planets, but hopefully by then the player has acquired new frames or better weapons/mods to compensate for those weaknesses.

[Carl_Bar]

@sillkygoodness: you make no sense. You admit that there's a whole bunch of problems with low level play that mag as a frame doesn't do anything to mitigate, then state she's a good starter frame.

 

The two concepts are mutually exclusive.

[SteaKnight-X]

I don't say that Mag shouldn't be a starter frame.

Because she is actually fine(was even my starter frame^^)

 

But I would like to give starters the choice choosing between different classes of frames

Now you might asking which classes?
Here is how I would arange the classes.

 

Just an example:

Tier 1: Tank, Damage, 
Tier 2: Support, Offtank(Bruiser),

Tier 3: Utility, Mobility

 

And for starters I would like to see the Tier 1 classes

Like

one damage frame = Something like Ember

one inbetween frame = Excalibur(the balanced dude^^)

one tank frame = Frost, the best starter tank starter in my Opnion

Players would learn the basics for the frames:

-tanky means lesser mobilty

-damage means lesser survibility

....

 

 

 

But this thing could be implemented after the reworks. (At least after the ember rework is done^^)

Because of the reworks Forst and Excal are perfect suited for starters.

[TheBrsrkr]

I think Ash would be a better pick for a starter frame than Mag, since most of his moves aren't as direct with their effects, in the steamrolling sense. Players will learn a lot about damage and utility, and he isn't as squishy but can still get really messed up if you make too many mistakes, since health regent is virtually nonexistent in the beginning. He can also compete with Rhino in every aspect, so Rhino isn't the absolute best choice in the early game.

[AstroLord]

Mag need rework because nobody use her.

And as a starter we have 50 armor mag and 15 armor volt (Volt still the best on starter) but Excalibur 225 Armor thats good but where is balance with other starter frames

[Aesthetic_Dialectic]

@sillkygoodness: you make no sense. You admit that there's a whole bunch of problems with low level play that mag as a frame doesn't do anything to mitigate, then state she's a good starter frame.

The two concepts are mutually exclusive.

The problems with low level play have nothing to do with Mag, Mag herself for the most part is fine and is even better than the other two starter frames out of the box. What is so hard to understand about that? Also I mentioned that the difficultly curve is a problem. End game being too easy is the REAL issue.

[Vaskadar]

Been here since almost the very beginning. The three original starters were Excalibur, Volt, and Loki.

[Tveoh]

started with Mag, and didn't have issues..  ya was fragile but also learned to move around early on, and even how to use the abilities to the best that i could.   

 

Pull is good for knocking down groups of enemies and running away,  good for those missions that you don't have to kill everyone.

 

Shield Polorlize is good to recharge shields, and make corpus go BOOM..

 

Bullet Attractor, is weird, but good for bosses or elite units,  as it gives you a bigger target to aim for while running around avoid other units.  Just shot at the bubble rather then the unit, and will still hit, plus its own shots will hurt it and any any "friendly fire that hits the bubble"   Heck can even cast it on someone in the front of a line of enemies and have its friends take him out :p.

 

Crush.  has changed from when I started.   but is still a good power, good for doing damage and knocking down the enemies if it doesn't kill them.   

 

yet best thing to do with any glass cannon is to never stop moving unless you know your safe.

[AstroLord]

The problems with low level play have nothing to do with Mag, Mag herself for the most part is fine and is even better than the other two starter frames out of the box. What is so hard to understand about that? Also I mentioned that the difficultly curve is a problem. End game being too easy is the REAL issue.

Yea mag can destroy everything in ult range and fast regenerate shields good powers, and volt 15 armor Rescue by more shields, shields skill, fast moving and very offensive powers for quick destroy enemy.

[RealPandemonium]

started with Mag, and didn't have issues..  ya was fragile but also learned to move around early on, and even how to use the abilities to the best that i could.  

This reminds me of how it was when I started in U11.  I picked Excal and he didn't have win-buttons back then except for RB, which didn't become one until you had a full suite of mods.  Excal did, however, have movement-augmenting powers, which taught me the virtues of mobility and the value of powers that don't play the game for you, rather opening up different ways for the player to do things.  It made me learn fundamentals as a player, and since Nekros was my second frame, my independence from powerspam remained strong for the remainder of my formative time in this game.  Coming from an environment where powers aren't the only thing that mattered made me a better player, for sure, and helped me to appreciate all powers, not just the ones that make the game a snoozefest.  I fear that giiving Excalibur a noob stick on his 4 is only going to make the newer generations of players even worse than ever before.  Mag having limited, but potentially strong powers is a good thing.  It's a good thing in game design in general.  Players that reach the endgame will have plenty of time to learn AFK farming strategies; growing up coddled by powerspam is unecessary.

[MumblesMcphatty]

Lolwut?

I absolutely slaughtered with Mag from Mercury to Europa ... No good as a starter? Ha!

[MagPrime]

Lolwut?

I absolutely slaughtered with Mag from Mercury to Europa ... No good as a starter? Ha!

I solo'd most of the older star chart with Mag.  .-.

 

With how mods are given at early levels, I really don't see how she's bad as a starter.  I guess it's time to make an alt and test out the newbie experience.