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SymphNo9

'building Contracts' For Clan Dojo Projects - Utilise Rescue Missions

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Ok, this is my take on improving the Dojo system regarding the building costs.

What about:

Introduce us to "building contracts", just like in real life where you undergo a building contract with engineers and building workers etc. and link this together with hostages we rescue from Rescue missions.

Since the hostages we rescue already kind of look like engineers/workers and not military soldiers (they never use their gun anyway!). So why not, everytime we complete a Rescue mission, we gain a "building contract" or some kind of token to use for Dojo projects, as a symbol / reward for rescuing the hostage.

"...Dude, why do we need these "building contracts" you speak of?".

Well, to put it simple. We need them in order to build new labs for the Dojo. Consider it as like this; the Tenno are trained warrios and not exactly workers / engineers. So, logically, we would only be able to provide the building bricks but not being able to build the lab. This is where the rescued hostages comes into place. We "hire" them to build the labs for us.

So my proposal is as follow:

- Gain a "building contract" from Rescue missions akin to BPs. These can be used to deploy a worker/engineer in the Dojo. High level Rescue missions should yield near to 100% success rate for a drop, giving an incentive to play high level missions with high risk and reward ratio.

- Lower the material requirements. These are no longer the main focus!

- Remove Forma requirements completely from building projects. Keep them exclusively to gear.

- Increases the building timer to a higher value. These are now the main focus! Time..."Rome wasn't built in a day".

- Introduce us to "worker slots", e.g. building a new lab requires a worker/engineer to occupy a "worker slot", otherwise the timer will not decrease.

- The more worker/engineer occupying a construction project, the faster the build timer decreases.

- Every new project has a limit on how many workers/engineers may occupy the slots at the same time.

- Make purchasable workers/engineers to fill out the slots with platinum, for the impatient folks.

- Workers/engineers expire after X amount of time. They could also have static ranks, with higher ranks mean more time before expiration.

Alternative 1: When expired, a new worker/engineer has to replace the old one if the building process shall continue as fast as before.

Alternative 2: When expired, the clan must pay a fee to the deployed worker (possibly through credit sinks), in order for the worker to continue his work. Cost could be rank dependent.

Suggestions raised from the discussion:

- Make worker/engineer lower the total cost of materials required.

This could either be a flat or percentage value. The reduction could also be material based, where higher ranked workerd/engineers reduce the cost for rare materials where lower ranked workers/engineers only reduce common materials.

--

Example:

Each worker will contribute a flat decrease of 0.5 tick / sec, to the build timer.

Level 1 worker : 0% material reduction, will work for 3 hours, cost 250k credits per refill.

Level 2 worker : 1% material reduction, will work for 6 hours, cost 400k credits per refill.

Level 3 worker : 2% material reduction, will work for 9 hours, cost 550k credits per refill.

Where level 3 may only be obtained through high level Rescue missions, such as on Pluto. Giving an incentive to go to Pluto etc.

--

Own reflections:

I think with this proposal, it would be fair for both small and large clans. Because the amount of materials are no longer the main focus and the main wall. Now what is important is to undergo these Rescue missions to obtain these construction contracts so that the projects may get started. This is something both small and large clan can do, while larger clan will inevitably have an advantage due to sheer number of players and thus have a larger pool of contracts available and may have much more credits to spend. But it is also still fair for smaller clans because they can also just farm the contracts at a same rate but may not always be able to occupy all the available slots at the same time, but that is naturally just what comes with being in a small clan anyway.

So what do you think? Bad, good, any potential abuse?

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Yes. Abuse? Maybe, but it will lead to extracion missions more popular.

 

But, the materials probably won't change due to the amount that has already been spent.

 

+1!

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How about just lowering the resource costs with every building contract? More engineers would know how to spend the resources more efficiently. No messing with the current system, just lowering the costs a bit by effort. The amount/percentage that each engineer would lower the costs could also scale with the amount of people in the clan.

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How about just lowering the resource costs with every building contract? More engineers would know how to spend the resources more efficiently, which would lower the cost.

 

Good point. But I think there should be a cap to how much a "discount" you can get off by deploying more engineers. After all, the building can't be built out of air :)

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Good point. But I think there should be a cap to how much a "discount" you can get off by deploying more engineers. After all, the building can't be built out of air :)

Make it a percentage, then the following engineer always cuts the costs a bit less than the last one.

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Honestly, I quite like the current building system, it's just the costs. If DE scales them based on the clan size, clans would be encouraged to kick players who aren't donating resources worth their weight. This system would avoid that while still being able to scale in my opinion.

 

I don't quite like the idea of being time-based, waiting doesn't feel as rewarding. Might be personal preference though.

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Sounds like an awesome idea! Oh... and if we are going down this road.. we might as well utilize the Capture missions as well... I can imagine having a Corpus NPC walking around in the dojo as a slave... ;o

 

Lol. jk. But yea... maybe for a future part of the dojo; the resource is like the souls of the Corpus guys that we captured.. ;O

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remove forma, introduce and implement "building contracts" instead. makes life a little easier for us tennos.

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Honestly, I quite like the current building system, it's just the costs. If DE scales them based on the clan size, clans would be encouraged to kick players who aren't donating resources worth their weight. This system would avoid that while still being able to scale in my opinion.

 

I don't quite like the idea of being time-based, waiting doesn't feel as rewarding. Might be personal preference though.

 

I see your point that time might hampering the motivation for some.

 

However, isn't the idiom something about ..."Rome was not built in a day" ? ;)

 

remove forma, introduce and implement "building contracts" instead. makes life a little easier for us tennos.

 

I agree, remove the forma completely from the building requirements and keep them exclusively to gear.

 

Now DE has to find another source that can generate revenue from the Dojo. This is where I suggest you can purchase workers/engineers with plat to work on the projects. This will still be balanced because you can still get workers from Rescue missions.

 

Also, to make it fair, have the higher level Rescue mission a near to 100% success rate to get a building contract after a completed mission, while the lower / entry level Rescue missions have their drop rate lowered a bit, in order to give incentive to play the higher levels with greater risk and reward ratio.

 

The bad thing I have noticed so far is, rushers won't be able to rush anymore and actually start to care about the hostages. No more leaving the hostages behind a corridor or using the elevator before the hostage is there as well.

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I really like this as then you would be questing for your Dojo rather than just mindlessly grinding for it. For the truly hardcore, the engineers could then also feature a bartering system where you'd have to bribe the people you capture with credits.

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1) limit ammount of members per clan. 15-20

2) rebalance resources costs based on new statistics.

3) ...........

4) PROFIT

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1) limit ammount of members per clan. 15-20

2) rebalance resources costs based on new statistics.

3) ...........

4) PROFIT

 

I don't see why you should punish people for wanting to expand their clan, when the servers can handle it. That is like telling the local grocery manager that he is only allowed to own one store and have 8 employees hired at any given time.

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This issue is brought up well in this topic where me and others are showing constructive complain about the problem https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/52312-forma-needs-to-be-removed-as-a-construction-material/

Indeed, I upvoted your post and thought you covered the points nicely, already. They really need to let the forma go off the building lists.

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The one thing about this that I dislike is that escort missions SUCK.

Making them more rewarding isn't going to make me like them more, rather it will make me not contribute at all to my Dojo.

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The one thing about this that I dislike is that escort missions SUCK.

Making them more rewarding isn't going to make me like them more, rather it will make me not contribute at all to my Dojo.

it will make more people want to do them to reduce the cost/build time of their dojo.

i think this system would be great. make them reduce cost and time by a % with a max of 10-20%

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The one thing about this that I dislike is that escort missions SUCK.Making them more rewarding isn't going to make me like them more, rather it will make me not contribute at all to my Dojo.

 

That is a valid point. But I truly think by providing an incentive to do rescue missions will increase the motivation. And by that, I mean emphasising the aspect of co-op. The hostage will actually be valuable and people will stick together and move to the extraction strategically (if they aren't already doing that).

 

it will make more people want to do them to reduce the cost/build time of their dojo.i think this system would be great. make them reduce cost and time by a % with a max of 10-20%

Yes, something like that. I was thinking that maybe a lab could hold up to 50-100 worker slots and with each slot, the timer would decrease faster. Additionally, say, the first 10 slots provide a bonus reduction, where each yields a 1% reduction in cost/time process.

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This is a pretty sweet idea. Ideally every mission type should have a unique reason to farm it.

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This seems like a really awesome idea, it would definitely give me motivation for extraction missions, and give them a purpose. Plus it would just make building rooms in the dojo much better and also in a way, more realistic.

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Alright I like this idea so I will put my 2 cents in and hope its read by someone who can do something.

Firstly I agree with the idea of all mission types having a reason to farm as otherwise end game all you do is endless defense. So based on this concept having the rescue missions give you an point to see the people you rescued again in amazing. Perhaps when you look through the doors in the dojo at unfinished rooms you could see them milling around working?

Further I agree that each rescued engineer should only be contracted for say 12 hours or so and naturally more builders result in faster building. Conversely if there are no engineers, incomplete buildings should begin to deteriorate! This encourages regular play by our fellow tenno.

My final comment relates to the research trees and capture missions, like above you would need to assign certain captured scientists in order to research the race specific weapons, all that would be required would be changing the skin of who you capture to be something infested and grinder instead of always being a corpus tech.

Hope you all like the ideas. Naturally the above is easy to implement in the platinum market.

The simplest solution for this I believe is to make it possible to complete rescue missions if the hostage dies and give the hostage a high priority to kill instead of the Tenno so it is difficult to escape with the hostage alive. Higher rank missions provide higher quality engineers but like how fusion core mods are ranked. Naturally these can be purchased in the market.

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remove forma, introduce and implement "building contracts" instead. makes life a little easier for us tennos.

Going off of this idea maybe the contracts replace forma and then the workers lower costs. But, specific workers lower specific types of materials by a flat rate(add worker level like sentinels over work them and they expire. The higher the level the more less the area requires, worker specific mods?). The diff types would be like electrician(rubedo,gallium)/metal worker(scrap,alloy?) etc.

Maybe add scientists as well? Faster lower(samples only) research

Sorta misread quoted post :P

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-snip-

 

Yes, a workers/engineers could have a rank just like mods do. However, it would sound odd if they were labeled common, uncommon and rare. So perhaps, novice, intermediate, expert workers/engineers.

 

Also, in conjunction with the ranking, the affect they have would naturally have an impact on the timer. This could be for how long they last till expiring.

 

For example.

 

Rank 1 worker : 3 hours

Rank 2 worker : 6 hours

Rank 3 worker : 9 hours

 

So, let's say we want to build a hallway and the ticks is just the amount of seconds, e.g. one hour = 3600 ticks.

 

The equations would look like this; For simplicity, we just assume the active slots are identical regarding the rank quality. And each worker has a tick rate of 0.5 tick / second.

 

total_ticks = 60 * 60 * num_hours

 

ticks_per_hour = active_slots * 0.5 * 60 * 60

 

total_hours = total_ticks / ticks_per_hour

 

total_workers = active_slots * (total_hours / expire_value)

 

--

Let's put that into perspective.

 

Assuming we have 10 rank 3 workers with an expire time of 9 hours. And it takes 2 weeks to build a hallway. How long would it take and how many workers would we need in total?

 

60 * 60 * 336 = 1209600 ticks are needed in total, for two weeks.

 

10 * 0.5 * 60 * 60 = 18000 ticks / hour

 

1209600 / 18000 = 67.2 hours are needed

 

10 * (67.2 / 9) = 75 workers are needed

 

--

Ok, let's take another example. Assuming a big clan with resources to 40 rank 2 workers with an expire time of 6 hours, simultaneously. And it takes 3 weeks to build a lab.

 

60 * 60 * 504 = 1814400 ticks are needed in total, for three weeks.

 

40 * 0.5 * 60 * 60 = 72000 ticks / hour

 

1814400 / 72000 = 25.2 hours are needed

 

40 * (25.2/ 6) = 168 workers are needed

 

--

Of course, the specific variables can be tweaked to be more balanced, but it should give a rough estimate of how long things take to be built and how many workers you need. Obviously, the better rank, the less workers you need.

 

Notice that the second example has a relative fast build timer, but requires a lot of workers. This is quite suited for big clans where many member can contribute at the same time. While the first example is more a reflection of small clans with limited resource of active workers at the same time but may confidently undergo high level missions together to obtain the better ranked workers.

 

 I'm with you.

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/53524-list-of-suggestions/?p=553156

 

A few suggestions I made, inspired by this thread.

 

I support your ideas, very nice suggestions!

 

 

 

Edit: On a side note, yes...the workers may also lower the cost in conjunction with the build timer, be it a flat increase or percentage, I don't really mind. The examples were just mainly focused on augmenting a building process with how long it would take.

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