The Tenno Are Infested?

[ragingdeamon]

tenno and the infested are "like of flesh". 

J golem says "consume us, be reborn", while phorid says "let us in". 

it's pretty clear that warframes are made of infested, but the tenno can control it.

[SilentMobius]

Argue your position, but take into account the materials used to build the frames.

Here's my theory that ties lore together without being "black and white cannon":

As I understand it, the Technocyte virus creates such pain that anything it infects loses individuality/higher brain function, goes insane, or simply dies in Dark Sector. Hayden Tenno was born with a genetic condition where he could not feel pain and was able to exercise control over the Virus with a clear mind and use it to mold his body without consequence.

 

This is the lore from Dark Sector, not Warframe.

 

It's obvious from the building materials that the Warframe involve technocyte materials. I see no reason no to go with the default assumption that each entity is as described. The Tenno are humans tainted with the power of the Void, the Warframes are symbiotic suits made with non-infecting technocyte material (as described in devstream 10) that integrates with the body when worn. The RPC simply shows us a creature that will eventually become part of the Rhino Warframe, not a Tenno. The Infested can feel the material in the Warframe and yet can't control it, hence "let us in" "we are your flesh"

 

Having the Tenno be infected _and_ tainted by the void would be very messy storytelling, like a teenager writing a hybrid werewolf-vampire protagonist because: moar-angst is better.

 

In Dark Sector Hayden Tenno was infected with the virus and that is what "made him a monster" from a storytelling perspective (and what redeemed him)

In Warframe the Tenno are "demons of the void" it's quite clear that being "twisted" by the void is what sets us apart and makes others fear us. that is the "hook" that makes our characters monsters, We don't need _another_ one.

Edited October 5, 2015 by SilentMobius

[Ziegrif]

Didn't J-3 also refer to a specific frame made of infestation?

[Amphyy]

Just throwing this into the discussion since it seems relevant, another quote from Jordas Golem is "Useless, hollow shells." Something to consider?

[TARINunit9]

Didn't J-3 also refer to a specific frame made of infestation?

He's talking about the dead Tenno wearing the Atlas frame that wandered in and got his ! kicked. Apparently the Atlas tenno was "petrified", but there's no way to tell if he's petrified by the same fossilization process that creates Ancient Healers, or petrified by his own Void power 

 

 

Just throwing this into the discussion since it seems relevant, another quote from Jordas Golem is "Useless, hollow shells." Something to consider?

Considering a Hive Mind's hosts are braindead hollow shells as well, that quote could go either way

Edited October 5, 2015 by TARINunit9

[SilentMobius]

He's talking about the dead Tenno wearing the Atlas frame that wandered in and got his ! kicked. Apparently the Atlas tenno was "petrified", but there's no way to tell if he's petrified by the same fossilization process that creates Ancient Healers, or petrified by his own Void power 

 

That said, Ordis said that Jordas had been adrift for centuries, so we don't know how long ago the Tenno wearing Atlas was defeated. Given the revelation in the Mara Detron flavour text that the modern Corpus equipment aesthetic existed in the Orokin Era (Just not for the Orokin themselves) It's possible that an Tenno-in-Atlas was defeated before the retreat to Cryo after the War.

 

Also, it's interesting that Atlas wasn't used by the Infestation, I mean, perhaps that lends more credence to the Infested Mesa being explicitly "puppeted" rather than actually Infested. Also perhaps suggests the notion that Warframes can't be consumed by the Infestation (potentially unlike the Tenno themselves) 

Edited October 5, 2015 by SilentMobius

[Morec0]

That said, Ordis said that Jordas had been adrift for centuries, so we don't know how long ago the Tenno wearing Atlas was defeated. Given the revelation in the Mara Detron flavour text that the modern Corpus equipment aesthetic existed in the Orokin Era (Just not for the Orokin themselves) It's possible that an Tenno-in-Atlas was defeated before the retreat to Cryo after the War.

 

Also, it's interesting that Atlas wasn't used by the Infestation, I mean, perhaps that lends more credence to the Infested Mesa being explicitly "puppeted" rather than actually Infested. Also perhaps suggests the notion that Warframes can't be consumed by the Infestation (potentially unlike the Tenno themselves) 

 

There was definately a time when the Tenno were awake and fighting the Infestation - Corrupted Ancient Synthesis - but I'm actually surprised I somehow missed that centuries bit... I suppose that means he was an Orokin vessel... 

 

 

But something of interest I noted:  "I have a reward. Another warframe was defeated here, some of it's petrified parts may still remain."

 

To the best of my knowledge, metal DOESN'T PETRIFY! This means the Warframes AREN'T just suits or armor - they ARE made of organic matter, which means they ARE alive in some sense. This lend credence to the Technocyte-tissue theory, and helps explain what about us seems to be the Infestation the hivemind is sensing.

[Elenortirie]

Having the Tenno be infected _and_ tainted by the void would be very messy storytelling, like a teenager writing a hybrid werewolf-vampire protagonist because: moar-angst is better.

 

 

ever seen underworld movie? :P

 

namely: Underworld: Evolution

[Devran]

Jordas Golem's chatter, and the random message you get loading into missions with 17.5 sometimes, makes me think the Warframes are actually considered the suit and what's inside (some infested meat and bones to control).

The tenno is a remote "operator", thanks Ordis, handling the usage of the constructs during missions by linking into the mind of the inhabitant.

To me it helps explain some of the gender bender aspects of switching frames. RPC demonstrates the control the tenno have over the constructs. The mysterious message, to me, could be perceived as a desync message to the operator. So it's like a hi tech game, except when you die in the game you die in real life.

Edited October 5, 2015 by Devran

[Campaigner]

Give me a Warframe to dissect and I'll let you know.

Edited October 5, 2015 by Campaigner

[Institute-Marksman]

Tenno's suits(Warframes) consist of organic material corrupted by Technocyte material.

[SilentMobius]

ever seen underworld movie? :P

 

namely: Underworld: Evolution

 

Unfortunately yes. My point stands ;)

[Morec0]

Jordas Golem's chatter, and the random message you get loading into missions with 17.5 sometimes, makes me think the Warframes are actually considered the suit and what's inside (some infested meat and bones to control).

The tenno is a remote "operator", thanks Ordis, handling the usage of the constructs during missions by linking into the mind of the inhabitant.

To me it helps explain some of the gender bender aspects of switching frames. RPC demonstrates the control the tenno have over the constructs. The mysterious message, to me, could be perceived as a desync message to the operator. So it's like a hi tech game, except when you die in the game you die in real life.

 

The issue with this theory is that it makes zero sense they why Mirage could be lost or why Vor equipping our Warframe with the Ascaris was any kind of issue - Lotus cared about the Tenno, not the Warframes, and Vor was after the same - if they weren't bound in some physical way, if the Tenno was operating them remotely, we could have just ditched the frame and been perfectly fine.

 

We're called Operator by Ordis because we Operate the Orbiter/Landing craft, it's the Cephalon equivalent of us calling a ship's captain "Captain".

[4MostlyHarmless2]

It's possible, but the more general theory I assign my belief to is that the Warframes are made of the same base stuff as the Infestation - the Technocyte.

 

Pretty sure this is the case. 

 

You know how the J3 Golem and Lephantis share this line that goes along the lines of "We are your flesh, why do you defile us?" We'd usually interpret it as them saying "Yo we kinda share the same traits as you why do you do this to us".

 

But then let's imagine for a moment that the Technocyte Virus is a sentient thing (has a mind of its own). Since it is sentient, with the proper host and channels (like we see in the Jordas Precept) it is capable of creating powerful monstrosities like Lephantis, Phorid, and the Jordas Golem that seem to be individuals.

 

The key word, however, is "seem". In reality, forms like the Golem, Lephantis, and Phorid are just incredibly potent concentrations of the Technocyte Virus. This means that when those bosses use the pronoun "we", it is because it is the Technocyte Virus speaking. We actually see this a lot in the Jordas Precept, when you have Jordas constantly fighting and arguing with a multitude of voices.

 

Now, a Warframe has a Chassis, a System and a Helmet. If we imagine that a Warframe is specifically engineered as a host that can channel the Technocyte Virus into a particular form and control it, then it makes sense that we could share the same "flesh" as Golem and the others. Since we have no good idea as to how the Tenno control the Warframes, we can imagine that when the Technocyte Virus speaks to us through vessels like the Golem, it could be referring to the fact that it knows the Warframes are manifestations of itself, and that the Tenno are somehow overriding the Technocyte Virus' will. 

 

So in fact, when the Technocyte Virus says "We are your flesh, why do you defile us?", it could in fact be saying that "I am quite literally your physical body, Tenno, so why do you keep doing this to me?"

 

 

tl;dr The Tenno are not Infested, but it's highly likely that the Warframes are made of Technocyte Virus, and are therefore technically Infested, which is why the Golem and all the Infested Bosses keep saying that they are our flesh. 

Edited October 5, 2015 by 4MostlyHarmless2

[ndantony]

Yeah. I believe it's like the guyvers or sort of like the t-virus in residential evil, etc... There are some infected and "perfected" resulting in and becoming super-human. The others, failed and commonly resulted, become mindless zombies and monstrously chunks of mutated flesh.

[SilentMobius]

Jordas Golem's chatter, and the random message you get loading into missions with 17.5 sometimes, makes me think the Warframes are actually considered the suit and what's inside (some infested meat and bones to control).

The tenno is a remote "operator", thanks Ordis, handling the usage of the constructs during missions by linking into the mind of the inhabitant.

To me it helps explain some of the gender bender aspects of switching frames. RPC demonstrates the control the tenno have over the constructs. The mysterious message, to me, could be perceived as a desync message to the operator. So it's like a hi tech game, except when you die in the game you die in real life.

 

Unfortunately, that makes the intro make no sense. Where did the Tenno come from? Why was Vor a threat to the Warframes-with-meat-inside if the Tenno is elsewhere? If the Tenno is in the Lisete what happened when the first Lisete (that came to get us) was destroyed? Why is there no mention of going to get the Tenno-consciousness after the Warframe-with-meat-inside was recovered.

 

The 17.5 Radio message is not likely to be about a Warframe, after all, you get the message while on the Liset not while actually "remote" from your supposed consciousness. It's much more likely that this message is all about the Liset's connection to the Void that allows the Liset to travel straight to the Orokin Void Towers. Which is going to change circa U18 (With the "void explosion" and the starmap revamp)

 

I mean, from a story perspective, which of these is more likely:

* Foreshadowing a know story change that is explicitly stated in the title of the message "Void Link Severed"

or

* Referring to a completely unknown and speculative connection between the Tenno and Warframe that we have no reason to be know about?

 

I mean, really, we know we're losing access to the void and we get a message titles "Void-Link severed" and people assume it's about the Warframes? It's a hell of a stretch.

 

(And FYI "EVM" in the message is more likely to be "Error Vector Magnitude" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Error_vector_magnitude it's just normal signal theory stuff . "selenic lensing" is basically "moon lensing" with makes sense as gravitic lensing of signals in space is a thing and the Orokin-Moon is unlikely to be used in any theorised Tenno<-> Warframe connection.)

Edited October 5, 2015 by SilentMobius

[Devran]

The issue with this theory is that it makes zero sense they why Mirage could be lost or why Vor equipping our Warframe with the Ascaris was any kind of issue - Lotus cared about the Tenno, not the Warframes, and Vor was after the same - if they weren't bound in some physical way, if the Tenno was operating them remotely, we could have just ditched the frame and been perfectly fine.

We're called Operator by Ordis because we Operate the Orbiter/Landing craft, it's the Cephalon equivalent of us calling a ship's captain "Captain".

I'd imagine the loss of Mirage resulted in the death of the remote operator in this theory. And that the Ascaris locks their consciousness into the frame, essentially binding them physically. Remote controlling them in a way similar to the linking in you might see in the matrix. Where to properly control all motor functions with such precision your consciousness has to be completely invested.

I always figured Ordis' use of operator referred to the ship, aka Captain, but started thinking that it could also be a play on words on DE's part.

Like everything else, it's just my personal theory that I use when playing the game. Besides the gender swaps, it helps me explain the very different personalities that a single Tenno can have as they swap frames. Lotus' original purpose, to defeat the Tenno, seems more possible as well if we all rely on remote operations and we've allowed her into our network as a trusted ally. How else was she going to wipe out space ninjas on her own?

It does raise a lot of other questions though. There are holes just like any other theory, but it works for me as a player until DE comes out with the truth =).

[(PSN)Silverback73]

Jordas Golem's chatter, and the random message you get loading into missions with 17.5 sometimes, makes me think the Warframes are actually considered the suit and what's inside (some infested meat and bones to control).

The tenno is a remote "operator", thanks Ordis, handling the usage of the constructs during missions by linking into the mind of the inhabitant.

To me it helps explain some of the gender bender aspects of switching frames. RPC demonstrates the control the tenno have over the constructs. The mysterious message, to me, could be perceived as a desync message to the operator. So it's like a hi tech game, except when you die in the game you die in real life.

I believe we have yet to see/meet the "originals"...that is, the men and women (or Zariman boys/girls if you prefer) who became the VERY first of each given frame.

Being proprietary, and following campaigner's remote control theory then the military scientists, in need of an army, set to the task of:

1. Successfully reverse-engineering the creature that is the frame and then weaponizing and mass producing production models.

2. Successfully cloning the Tenno within for mass production.

[-Krism-]

Well, if you remember the name of this "Doctor", he created the Technocyte Virus with Warframes DNA.

[Lakais]

Eh, you know what? I'll wait for whenever U18 comes out. Last I heard that update's gonna blow everyone's mind with all the anwsers. And cinematic quests and new planet-chart and all that other tasty, tasty jazz.

 

Patience. I know how strong the urge is to be the one going "Told ya so! I was RIGHT!" But... patience.

[(PSN)Silverback73]

Eh, you know what? I'll wait for whenever U18 comes out. Last I heard that update's gonna blow everyone's mind with all the anwsers. And cinematic quests and new planet-chart and all that other tasty, tasty jazz.

 

Patience. I know how strong the urge is to be the one going "Told ya so! I was RIGHT!" But... patience.

No soup for you! Water cooler talk more fun!

[Lankander]

I swear the day we get update 18 the forums are gonna explode.

[Etriia]

Part flesh, part void energy. The corruption from where they draw their power.

[Domesticon]

It's possible, but the more general theory I assign my belief to is that the Warframes are made of the same base stuff as the Infestation - the Technocyte.

 

 

 

The issue with that means that it would be literally confused by EVERYTHING attacking it, then. And with the Hivemind clearly having a pretty strong intellect behind it - it set a @(*()$ TRAP man! - that seems unlikely.

It's possible the infestation is essentially comprised of uncontrolled and unfocused warframes, both using the technocyte as a base building block, with the warframes it is shackled and contained so that it can be utilized by the Tenno, while with the infestation it is merely let run rampant, this could explain the lore entry in which the empty Rhino frame mindlessly attacked until coming into proximity to the Tenno. Meaning if the Tenno weren't using the warframes and the frames were merely let run rampant they could be far worse than the infestation we see today.

[Coryphaus]

No no no. The Warframes are Infested. The Tenno are energy.

 

*Sarcasm*.