Some Kind Of Auction House? [Megathread]

[OneMember]

AH has been requested so long and only thing we have is hope... that someday it will turn into in-game function.

[Syln]

Strawpolls are not reliable.  They can easily be cheated since they only rely on your IP as identification. What's more, more people thinking one way or another does not make them right or wrong.  Additionally, the forums are a small vocal minority. They really don't speak for the entire community in general.

 

That's no official strawpoll that will have any influence on anything thus anyone trying to cheat for such a trivial reason might use a little help if you know what i mean :p 

 

The point is not to state if this is "right" or "wrong" but to see what most of the forum community (since it looks like it need to be precised :p) think of it.

 

Now i hope it doesn't speak for the majority since it doesn't go my way still i can't hide behind such an excuse as "small vocal minority" because actually it's kind of easy to let your voice be heared so if you don't bother then maybe (and i said "maybe") you don't care that much for this aspect of the game hence lessening the value of your opinion.

 

EDIT : when i said "you" in the last section, i'm not talking about someone in particular (just to be clear^)

Edited October 29, 2015 by Syln

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

So. Its not 3 per day its a 3 at the same time - but it also have 36 hours duration - that is not one day ?!?! Dude do you even logic ?

Uh . . .

 

1.  A day only has 24 hours, so no, 36 hours is not a day.

2.  If you list an item with a buy now price it can sell in less than 1 minute, meaning you can list another item almost immediately.

 

That doesn't mean you can list an item, remove it, list an item, remove it, and so on ad nauseam. 

 

Additionally, I did not suggest that 36 hours would be the default or even the only duration available.  I simply suggested that listing 3 items and choosing a set amount of hours for their duration would lock you into waiting until either they had 1. sold or 2. the amount of time you had selected when you listed them had passed.

[SilentFears]

Uh . . .

 

1.  A day only has 24 hours, so no, 36 hours is not a day.

2.  If you list an item with a buy now price it can sell in less than 1 minute, meaning you can list another item almost immediately.

 

That doesn't mean you can list an item, remove it, list an item, remove it, and so on ad nauseam. 

 

Additionally, I did not suggest that 36 hours would be the default or even the only duration available.  I simply suggested that listing 3 items and choosing a set amount of hours for their duration would lock you into waiting until either they had 1. sold or 2. the amount of time you had selected when you listed them had passed.

 

Oh ok so now we are back to the merry-go-around that you descarded.

I put 3 of my items for 20 min duration and buyout. Do a mission - return to the hub - see that now Life Strike is once again dirt cheap - switch to Blind Rage that had an increase of price - put 3 of them for 20 min duration - do a mission - repeat.

 

I see you are slowley lower the number of points you adress - thats fine i didnt expect much to begin whit.

 

And lastly you are still avoiding to adress the elephant in the room.

I have one maxed Blind Rage that fits my 20 frames. How would you fix that. Aka infinite supplie - limited demand.

[PrivateRiem]

Just make a bulletin board where buyers can setup "I'm interested in buying or trading X or Y", that you can browse by item and see if somebody is interested in something you have.

 

Instead of listing items, you're listing buyers.

 

You want to buy something in particular? You get much more visibility than 3 second scrolling text in trade chat.

You want to sell something? Browse the bulletin board for a buyer or keep spamming trade chat.

[lolmaster222]

Just make a bulletin board where buyers can setup "I'm interested in buying or trading X or Y", that you can browse by item and see if somebody is interested in something you have.

Instead of listing items, you're listing buyers.

You want to buy something in particular? You get much more visibility than 3 second scrolling text in trade chat.

You want to sell something? Browse the bulletin board for a buyer or keep spamming trade chat.

There are sites like this I will find one in a sec

Here ya go https://warframe.market

Edited October 29, 2015 by lolmaster222

[PrivateRiem]

There are sites like this I will find one in a sec

Don't even bother.

[lolmaster222]

Don't even bother.

Too late :/

[TheBrsrkr]

Truth be told, we just don't have enough useless crap. Games with AH have tons and tons of consumable goodies to trade and drive the economy all the time. Warframe doesn't really have that. Parts aren't that versatile, since you only need 2 at the most, whereas in games such as Runescape you can trade thousands of some common thing such as wood and always find a buyer. It just wouldn't fit.

[MagPrime]

Okay, assuming an Auction House was put in; would it be credit based or plat based?

 

I personally dislike plat purchases (come on, if you're trading a digital representation of real money, it's not a 'trade' it's a purchase) and would prefer more credit transactions or pure trades.

 

My ideal market place would have a handful of options available;

 

post item for X amount of plat

 

post item for X amount of credits

 

post item for X item

 

post item for X item and X amount of plat

 

Each clan could "rent" a stall (tab/page/window) in the market place and players with no clan would have the ability to put items up via a player - clan agreement (be it renting for plat, items or help running missions/raids) or rent a stall of their own.

[aoguro]

1. No auction houses.

 

2. You not being able to sell something is a matter of your personal luck and skill. Do not try to sell something that no one wants to buy- and you will have no issues. Most stuff everyone already has or does not want.

 

3. NO AUCTION HOUSES. They kill economies.

 

which economies do you talk about in the tradechat, from all the economy-less stoners which kill every value ? thats a laugh ...

 

i know, there are "players" which live in the tradechat or the pvp, doesnt mean that the maturity of warframe-tennos have to follow every BS some people are halluzinating =:P

 

 

Why cant we have auction house in warframe.

 

number of item in auction house = mastery rank

 

D.E ( the auction house )

 

will get 0.5% from the sales.

 

It takes too long to get a decent buyer ( lots of unnecessary comments )

 

yes, im with you, auction-house for everybody ... ! ^^)

Edited October 29, 2015 by Ken_Jutsu

[Aggh]

Even if we can't get an auction house, having a way to check sales data on items  (especially average plat traded for an item) would be nice.  Most of the people objecting to some form of asynchronous trading are really just afraid of losing the layer of obfuscation that the trade plat provides on prices. 

 

It will drive down prices for sure, but that happens naturally as demand on items are lowered by drop table changes, new items being added etc. etc..  All asynchronous trading (plus publicly available trade data) would do is bring prices to their real value more quickly since an item's real value will be realized much faster.

 

If you're afraid of asynchronous trading, you've be relying to heavily on people not knowing the trade value of items to earn plat.  You can argue the semantics of whether or not it's scamming people til you're red in the face, but at the end of the day that is not a completely honest tactic and it's completely reasonable for DE to make trading more honest and accessible than it is now.

Edited October 29, 2015 by Aggh

[TriggerHappyWhiteGuy]

Truth be told, we just don't have enough useless crap. Games with AH have tons and tons of consumable goodies to trade and drive the economy all the time. Warframe doesn't really have that. Parts aren't that versatile, since you only need 2 at the most, whereas in games such as Runescape you can trade thousands of some common thing such as wood and always find a buyer. It just wouldn't fit.

We actually have a bit more then you think. Prime parts will always have some sort of value even if their value goes off of the amount of Ducats they are worth.You are also not going to get the newest prime set for dirt cheap or any of these parts that have a god awful drop rate. If the majority of trash prime parts get too low the easy fix is just to have DE put in another ducat sink(more items for void trader). We do have an abundance of mods but we will still see that Corrupted,Syndicate, PVP, Stance, Event Mod Sets, Possibly archwing, Some normal hard to find mods, Transmutation only mods, R5 cores, Rank 10 mods will still have good value to them.   

 

I would like something to sink all the trash mods into because transmutation is not a very good way to do it.

[Kintair]

Not sure if this is 32 pages of merged threads or everyone dogpiling because someone said the "A-H" words.

 

Either way I'm going to assume it's 32 pages of people saying "yes" and "no" and why it will and will not ruin the "economy" of this game. With a few alternative ideas sprinkled in here and there. (If I'm wrong, feel free to point me to any exceptional posts, I'd be interested in seeing them!)

 

So, I'd like to toss in my idea, details found here: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/547763-my-dream-trading-system/#entry6151627

 

It is, essentially, a UI-based version of what Trade Chat is now, thus making everyone's arguments about how it'll ruin the economy moot.

 

It only got one response when I first posted it, but I am still interested in hearing what people from all sides of this argument think.

[--IDWS--ArmsDealer]

Okay, let me convey my thoughts:

A) the auction house idea is not horrible, to certain kind of online games, yes, like WoW or Guildwars where they got gold (or whateva the name is) as the ingame currency. HOWEVER warframe would only let us to use PLATINUM to trade, not our credits! IF DE implement auction house, only people that can buy lots of plats steadily will get easy access to this game, TL;DR it will translate to pay2win games. Less than 10% of f2p player base willing to spend cash to buy things, IF DE implement this stupid auction things, they'll lose the majority of players, FAST

B) It will totally mess up the liquidity of currency; Auction House will force people to sell prices at certain range (if they want it to sell quick, they have to set it to the low price range), things will go downhill to any virtual realm where supply is virtually infinite (AND DE drop system is ridiculous, same item drops for the same number of party members in that particular runs). TL;DR it will turn lots of rare items to 1p each, FAST.

C) There are demography of player's buying power: from freebie noobies that beg 24/7 for free items in trade chat to wallet warriors that wont mind buying overpriced items as long as they got it quick. Along with time, that freebie noobies can learn how to tweak and manipulate prices to meet up the demands of those wallet warriors (that's public secret, sharks does exist, and every shark born from an egg). IF and When auction house does exist, it will greatly hinder the economic progress of low tier freebie noobies as they will be forced to stick to dictated prices (read point B if you don't get what the implication is). That will make only the wallet warriors to become tyrant and the only demography of playerbase that can enjoy the full contents of the game.

TL;DR auction house is not bad for general MMORPGs, it just WILL NOT suits or may harm Warframe Economy.

I agree that we need a better interface than the current trading chat, it's obsolete and bothersome, but please no auction house, something else out of the box will be much preferable.

[Karamethien]

To say auction house kill economies is like saying Online Stores kills economies.

 

What it does do is standardize prices - it might be lower it might be higher.

 

Common items will be cheaper in the long run because supply and demand.

 

Conversely rare items will be more expensive in the long run because supply and demand.

 

No more will you get Gaia's Tragedy for 400p, when the seller seems the average price on the AH to be 1000p.  It is so rare that if you see someone sells it for 300-400, you can just buy it up and puts it up for double.

 

You can make a profit in any system.

[ChameleonDude]

To say auction house kill economies is like saying Online Stores kills economies.

 

What it does do is standardize prices - it might be lower it might be higher.

 

Common items will be cheaper in the long run because supply and demand.

 

Conversely rare items will be more expensive in the long run because supply and demand.

 

No more will you get Gaia's Tragedy for 400p, when the seller seems the average price on the AH to be 1000p.  It is so rare that if you see someone sells it for 300-400, you can just buy it up and puts it up for double.

 

You can make a profit in any system.

 

Common items are already worthless. They won't get cheaper, they'll literally become junk. Rare items won't become expensive, because supply and demand doesn't work like that. Each player only needs one of a rare item, one. Once they have that one copy, they'll never need to buy it again. Demand will drop. If there is a supply of the item, that will increase when the auction house is added, then stay constant.

 

If a system has 99% of items not even worth one platinum, it's impossible to make a profit out of them. Then again, this isn't about profit, this about keeping the economy alive.

[--IDWS--ArmsDealer]

To say auction house kill economies is like saying Online Stores kills economies.

 

What it does do is standardize prices - it might be lower it might be higher.

 

Common items will be cheaper in the long run because supply and demand.

 

Conversely rare items will be more expensive in the long run because supply and demand.

 

No more will you get Gaia's Tragedy for 400p, when the seller seems the average price on the AH to be 1000p.  It is so rare that if you see someone sells it for 300-400, you can just buy it up and puts it up for double.

 

You can make a profit in any system.

 

Please read my post (post #641) before u said that everything is dictated by "supply and demand", this is a virtual realm with virtually limitless supply only to meet limited actual demands.

[Karamethien]

Common items are already worthless. They won't get cheaper, they'll literally become junk. Rare items won't become expensive, because supply and demand doesn't work like that. Each player only needs one of a rare item, one. Once they have that one copy, they'll never need to buy it again. Demand will drop. If there is a supply of the item, that will increase when the auction house is added, then stay constant.

 

If a system has 99% of items not even worth one platinum, it's impossible to make a profit out of them. Then again, this isn't about profit, this about keeping the economy alive.

 

People leave the game all the time, and people join the game.  Economy doesn't just mean items are static.  

 

Auction house itself makes no DIFFERENCE than for someone to post on the Trade Forum, and or Spam Trade Channel.

 

It's most dramatic effect is establish publically share prices that is accessible by all.

 

To think that it will kill the economy is pretty strange.

 

That is like saying, Get rid of Trade Post Forum because it kills the economy.

 

Nothing about person needing 1 copy of a Mod changes with or without Auction House.

 

The supplies is the same (since it doesn't alter drop rate in anyway)

 

Demand is the same (since it doesn't alter how many players need something)

 

If what you predict is true then the issue is the actual economy, and not Auction House.

 

All an AH does is make it easier for people to get what they want, and for sellers to sell their stuff easier as well.

 

As for items not worth 1p.  The strangest assumption is that people because of Auction House will all of a suddenly want to put items up for 1p.  And if someone is WILLING to sell their items at 1p, then that is how it should be.  If someone is foolish enough to sell for 1p when the item is worth 10p, then just buy it and relist it.  That is what working the AH means in any game.

 

You want to sell your trinity system at 300p, then someone wants to buy at 150p.  Will anyone take that price in the trade channel? That is up to the individual.  To make the assumption that the buyer who would have paid 300p would suddenly refuse to pay 300p because of an AH is wrong.  AH have a downward pressure because sellers compete for lowest price.  It doesn't change the buyer's willingness or internal measure of how much they are willing to spend.

 

The whole idea of unlimited supplies for limited demands have been proven time and time again in other games.  Many games have equipment that only need 1 copy of.  Do the prices on those items drop to strangely low levels?  It depends on demand and most of the time it does not if the item is hard enough to get.  Which in DE's case is pretty hard.  Especially things like Event Mods.  I paid 500p for my Lighting Set.  Will it drop to 200p because of AH?  I don't think so.  It might even go up if all the sellers see that it has been sold at 750p just 2 days ago.  However, it will drop to 10-20p once you can get them from Spy missions.  But all that would happen with or without an AH system.

 

Auction house does have one obvious effect.  It makes it harder for players to get taken for a ride when they don't know the prices - both Buyers AND Sellers.  You can try to sell that Prisma Grakata for 1000p, but with Auction House there would be less chance of someone taking that price.  or a newbie won't be selling that Gaia's Tragedy for 100p because it sounds like a lot to him.

Edited October 29, 2015 by Karamethien

[DxAdder]

Okay, let me convey my thoughts:

A) the auction house idea is not horrible, to certain kind of online games, yes, like WoW or Guildwars where they got gold (or whateva the name is) as the ingame currency. HOWEVER warframe would only let us to use PLATINUM to trade, not our credits! IF DE implement auction house, only people that can buy lots of plats steadily will get easy access to this game, TL;DR it will translate to pay2win games. Less than 10% of f2p player base willing to spend cash to buy things, IF DE implement this stupid auction things, they'll lose the majority of players, FAST

B) It will totally mess up the liquidity of currency; Auction House will force people to sell prices at certain range (if they want it to sell quick, they have to set it to the low price range), things will go downhill to any virtual realm where supply is virtually infinite (AND DE drop system is ridiculous, same item drops for the same number of party members in that particular runs). TL;DR it will turn lots of rare items to 1p each, FAST.

C) There are demography of player's buying power: from freebie noobies that beg 24/7 for free items in trade chat to wallet warriors that wont mind buying overpriced items as long as they got it quick. Along with time, that freebie noobies can learn how to tweak and manipulate prices to meet up the demands of those wallet warriors (that's public secret, sharks does exist, and every shark born from an egg). IF and When auction house does exist, it will greatly hinder the economic progress of low tier freebie noobies as they will be forced to stick to dictated prices (read point B if you don't get what the implication is). That will make only the wallet warriors to become tyrant and the only demography of playerbase that can enjoy the full contents of the game.

TL;DR auction house is not bad for general MMORPGs, it just WILL NOT suits or may harm Warframe Economy.

I agree that we need a better interface than the current trading chat, it's obsolete and bothersome, but please no auction house, something else out of the box will be much preferable.

 

A) Gold can be bought directly from Blizzard for RL $$$

 

B) As long is there is transparency for past sales of an item people will list it for what has the best chance to sell and Buyers can see if the price is in-line with the current "True" value of an item. (Supply and demand will still be the biggest factors).

 

C) This is way harder than you think and we have a limited number of trades we can do a day. Add it a listing fee of some sort and a selling fee to reduce the supply of plat and most of these issues never happen.

 

The #1 one reason people don't want to see an AH is because Buyer/Sellers will be able to see what the true value of something is based on past sales. Supply and demand will determine what something is worth.

Edited October 29, 2015 by DxAdder

[(XBOX)MAXsandwich]

We need a player shop.

Possibly a selling station that can be accessed on the relays, complete with reliable search functions and filters. Items stay "listed" for 24 or 48 hrs. as to not gum up the system.

Theres no use for an auction house.. 80% of the tradable items have little to no value to the player base anyway.



 

[TriggerHappyWhiteGuy]

Okay, let me convey my thoughts:

A) the auction house idea is not horrible, to certain kind of online games, yes, like WoW or Guildwars where they got gold (or whateva the name is) as the ingame currency. HOWEVER warframe would only let us to use PLATINUM to trade, not our credits! IF DE implement auction house, only people that can buy lots of plats steadily will get easy access to this game, TL;DR it will translate to pay2win games. Less than 10% of f2p player base willing to spend cash to buy things, IF DE implement this stupid auction things, they'll lose the majority of players, FAST

 

Did you forget that you can sell stuff and make platinum without paying a dime=not pay2win. It would be the same as if you say because we have trade that this game is P2w. The only thing that we want to do with this Player market is Buy and Sell stuff without having to deal with people. Its a simple and clearer UI that everyone gives a price instead of dealing with people saying "offer" all the time.

 

We can still use trade chat for those people who wants to find/give better deals but people like me who are willing to pay a bit more to have a hassle free buy/selling experience.

[aoguro]

Did you forget that you can sell stuff and make platinum without paying a dime=not pay2win. It would be the same as if you say because we have trade that this game is P2w. The only thing that we want to do with this Player market is Buy and Sell stuff without having to deal with people. Its a simple and clearer UI that everyone gives a price instead of dealing with people saying "offer" all the time.

 

We can still use trade chat for those people who wants to find/give better deals but people like me who are willing to pay a bit more to have a hassle free buy/selling experience.

 

thats exactly what im thinking about too

 

normally the seller creates the price, in warframe tons of people "BEG" for plat by not giving a clear price but let everything open or sell everything for no value which is longrange very unhealthy for the life of the beggars for plat

 

i mean the hours which are needed to get some parts together is unbelievable for the values which the things are sold mostly

 

you have to be full on weed or smth for not being able to check healthy values

 

i turned off tradechat now because i have really better things to do in warframe then watching an dealing with that mess, maybe its halloween ... so i let this pass by for a few days ... im also tired of waiting for new waves of players which are in the need for their things ... ^^)

 

i thought i can have fun by trading sometimes, as well as i found out there is no fun, this is also not crazy, this all is a bit sick (i have no better word for) ... ))

Edited October 29, 2015 by Ken_Jutsu

[Catacomb]

Maybe make it so that you can't resell items you buy off the auction house?

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Rare items won't become expensive, because supply and demand doesn't work like that.

Say that after a bidding war starts for a Primed Chamber.

 

AH increase demand as well, because you get much more visibility, aka more demand for items because more people that want the item can easily find your item.