Disappointment With Warframe.

[TurbanSenpai]

Although I thank the Devs for the immense content and hard work. I'm still faced with a lot of disappointment with te direction the game is taking.

A lot of new content now requires immense amounts of resources. Specially the weapons that can be obtained from the dojo. The problem is that, there is a lot of demand for resources and not enough supply or opertunities to obtain resources in large amounts. The "Time to Build" mechanic does not help either considering some blueprints are stalked and can only be build one at a time.

The more I play this game, the more I feel that this game is turning into a grind fest. Not that grinding is a bad thing in games, but it is a bad thing for a PvE game. Granted it has been made clear that PvP content shall always remain limited. I can't help but dislike the games for the forced, now long, grind sessions.

[Jun-Mai]

A lot of new content now requires immense amounts of resources. 

The more I play this game, the more I feel that this game is turning into a grind fest.

the S#&$ton of ressources, /dojo was intended to be a longterm goal, not something you should get in 1-2 weeks they've probably planned 2-3 months to get a complete dojo as a 30man-clan

the problem though is, grinding isn't appealing that's pretty much all

Edited May 30, 2013 by SeiraSunmin

[CormacMccarthy]

i think its perfect, i love working hard, i get more gratification when i finally get what ive spent months trying to create. you just need patience.

[KogSothoth]

You didn't watch the livestream, did you?

[Mallyx]

Watch live stream #6.

Also if you strip away any game that doesn't have a grinding portion in the game, then the game will just burn out within a few hours, especially with warframe since most of it is repetition.  if there is nothing to work towards, to look forward to then people will leave within a week or even days of playing the game.

[MaraudingZebra]

First off, I like your username! :D

 

Second, I just feel the need to remind everyone that the game is in BETA. This means that anything and everything is subject to change. An example of this is the Dojos. People are really upset at the amount of the resources required for them, but the fact of the matter is that they're simply not done.

 

I see where you're coming from. It takes a long time to get what you want without paying money. But the thing is, this is probably going to change. When Void Towers came out, the Reaper Blade, and Latron Prime stock (maybe it was receiver, I'm not sure)  were barely dropping. So DE raised the drop rate.

 

The point I'm trying to make is that they ARE listening, and we shouldn't give up hope yet. I'm probably in the minority (based off of the forums) when I say that I have a lot of faith in DE to make things right.

Edited May 30, 2013 by MaraudingZebra

[TurbanSenpai]

the S#&$ton of ressources, /dojo was intended to be a longterm goal, not something you should get in 1-2 weeks they've probably planned 2-3 months to get a complete dojo as a 30man-clan

the problem though is, grinding isn't appealing that's pretty much all

I was referring more to the blueprint you get for your own personal use. Like one specific weapon requires 5 fieldron to build. Each fieldron uses 10 fieldron samples to construct. That's 50 fieldron samples. Fieldron samples drop in quantities of 1 and are rare to uncommon. On top of that, each takes 12 hours to construct and only one can be constructed at a given time. Also the other resources for that weapon are 1000 salvage, 1000 nano spores, and 1 forma.

Do the math.

Edited May 30, 2013 by Mark_Nuttt

[Jun-Mai]

I was referring more to the blueprint you get for your own personal use. Like one specific weapon requires 5 fieldron to build. Each fieldron uses 10 fieldron samples to construct. That's 50 fieldron samples. Fieldron samples drop in quantities of 1 and are rare to uncommon. On top of that, each takes 12 hours to construct and only one can be constructed at a given time. Also the other resources for that weapon are 1000 salvage, 1000 nano spores, and 1 forma.

Do the math.

 

you've got fieldron problems?

 

I can get easily 50 in 2-3 days o.O

 I've got around 25 just rushing through maps and killing bosses for bps, in my opinion these stuffs are simply trash for me, getting them a S#&$ton if you keep farming for a week

 

edit and I never do 1 boss more than 10 times, simply because the rng god loves me and I get all bps in an average of 5-7 runs xD

 

edit; (thought I wrote that sorry)

1000 nano spores and 1000 salvage = 5min farming, (I do solo runs and get these stuff in 700-1200 quantities)

forma = that's a little bit troublesome still got 5 just by doing void runs (and for myself only used 1 single t1 key xP)

Edited May 30, 2013 by SeiraSunmin

[EvanTheNewbie]

I was referring more to the blueprint you get for your own personal use. Like one specific weapon requires 5 fieldron to build. Each fieldron uses 10 fieldron samples to construct. That's 50 fieldron samples. Fieldron samples drop in quantities of 1 and are rare to uncommon. On top of that, each takes 12 hours to construct and only one can be constructed at a given time. Also the other resources for that weapon are 1000 salvage, 1000 nano spores, and 1 forma.

Do the math.

They have said on the stream that they will be looking into changing the resource requirements for them.

[RogueDarkJedi]

I was referring more to the blueprint you get for your own personal use. Like one specific weapon requires 5 fieldron to build. Each fieldron uses 10 fieldron samples to construct. That's 50 fieldron samples. Fieldron samples drop in quantities of 1 and are rare to uncommon. On top of that, each takes 12 hours to construct and only one can be constructed at a given time. Also the other resources for that weapon are 1000 salvage, 1000 nano spores, and 1 forma.

Do the math.

 

Yeah the bp requirements are quite rediculous.

[Solstic]

The more I play this game, the more I feel that this game is turning into a grind fest. Not that grinding is a bad thing in games, but it is a bad thing for a PvE game.

I don't understand. Grinding isn't bad for games? In PvE games you're usually against the AI. You're definitely going to need to grind mobs or levels to obtain items you want. Not everything is going to be obtained in one run. If you meant long term grinding that's what the dojo research is. It's long term goals to be achieved over time. Don't like it? It may be adjusted but DE mentioned they're going to throw out content for smaller clans in the livestream.

[SirNerdsAlot5]

Although I thank the Devs for the immense content and hard work. I'm still faced with a lot of disappointment with te direction the game is taking.

A lot of new content now requires immense amounts of resources. Specially the weapons that can be obtained from the dojo. The problem is that, there is a lot of demand for resources and not enough supply or opertunities to obtain resources in large amounts. The "Time to Build" mechanic does not help either considering some blueprints are stalked and can only be build one at a time.

The more I play this game, the more I feel that this game is turning into a grind fest. Not that grinding is a bad thing in games, but it is a bad thing for a PvE game. Granted it has been made clear that PvP content shall always remain limited. I can't help but dislike the games for the forced, now long, grind sessions.

Then this isn't your type of game. If you haven't noticed the entire game is built on grinding. Grinding to get weapons, equipment, and warframes, is a part of the experience and that will never change.

[Mikki79]

i think its perfect, i love working hard, i get more gratification when i finally get what ive spent months trying to create. you just need patience.

 

If you love "working hard" stop playing video games, this isn't working it's wasting time.

[Katakuna]

If you love "working hard" stop playing video games, this isn't working it's wasting time.

 

"Your definition of 'work' is different than mine, therefore you are wrong."

[holdenmcclure]

Overall I think they should strongly consider "rare" drops obtained through difficulty and not repetition. Although this is where the F2P compromise comes into play. If the process of obtaining an item were entertaining, then the amount of people willing to shortcut that process to purchase it with real money would significantly diminish. So instead of creating a progressively more challenging environment that tests player skill and determination, you get a difficulty curve that looks like a hill instead of an upward slope. The start being simple, the middle being the peak where you encounter more difficult missions before you've acquired and equipped strong weapon and warframe mods, and the downward slope where you've past that hill and have the tools and resources required to easily overcome any obstacle, and the metagame basically reducing to playing all the content over again with different gear in order to increase your mastery, or farming the same missions again and again for materials and blueprints.

 

Many conflicting concepts come into play with this game. The desire to create incentive to purchase gear instead of earn it, the need to emphasize going back and playing old missions to keep the game cooparative instead of a barren landscape while keeping the game feeling fresh and entertaining, etc... Personally I believe the game could benefit from more creative and challenging boss fights, and more interesting objectives. Right now the difference between objectives is rather superficial, with some drastically different ones being Defense  or Assassination vs. just about anything else, with everything else sort of blending together in a largely inconsequential heap of fetch quests that don't really have an interesting dynamic around them that challenges the player in any way other than to ask him to pay attention to the little orange diamond on his minimap.

Edited May 30, 2013 by holdenmcclure

[Ashnal]

Watch live stream #6.

Also if you strip away any game that doesn't have a grinding portion in the game, then the game will just burn out within a few hours, especially with warframe since most of it is repetition.  if there is nothing to work towards, to look forward to then people will leave within a week or even days of playing the game.

That isn't true at all. Look at something like Counter Strike as an example., or Civilization V, Starcraft, or even Nethack. None of those games have grinding, but they all have fairly good replay-ability.

 

Your post speaks more about your own personality as a gamer who like to work in his games, but loses interest in anything that presents an ever evolving challenge. It does not however, speak for games as a whole.

Edited May 30, 2013 by Ashnal

[Jun-Mai]

That isn't true at all. Look at something like Counter Strike as an example., or Civilization V, Starcraft, or even Nethack. None of those games have grinding, but they all have fairly good replay-ability.

 

Your post speaks more about your own personality as a gamer who like to work in his games, but loses interest in anything that presents an ever evolving challenge. It does not however, speak for games as a whole.

 

counterstrike offline sucks

civilization v is another story, you can have an absolute different story depth and gameplay in general, starcraft 1 has the nostalgia feeling and the nice story, also it's not a coop shooter, again it's a rts the gameplay is different, starcraft and cs have simply their god-tier pvp, and there's no real competitive pvp in warframe, dueling isn't balanced at all, it's a pve game first, it's even a coop shooter.

 

what lacks is story, cutscenes, combos/synergy with other frames (what would force players to stick with the same frame over and over which isn't that good), trap and platforming, warframe also lacks puzzles

 

oh wait if you strip the grinding you can still have the stuff listed above woops

[Waagabondh]

Although I thank the Devs for the immense content and hard work. I'm still faced with a lot of disappointment with te direction the game is taking.

A lot of new content now requires immense amounts of resources. Specially the weapons that can be obtained from the dojo. The problem is that, there is a lot of demand for resources and not enough supply or opertunities to obtain resources in large amounts. The "Time to Build" mechanic does not help either considering some blueprints are stalked and can only be build one at a time.

The more I play this game, the more I feel that this game is turning into a grind fest. Not that grinding is a bad thing in games, but it is a bad thing for a PvE game. Granted it has been made clear that PvP content shall always remain limited. I can't help but dislike the games for the forced, now long, grind sessions.

 

Honestly: Those Dojo weapons, which would be what people is after, seems far worse then the regular weapons.

 

Play for fun, with friends, do defence missions.

Forget about the grind and the must to have certain things.

It will be there eventually.

 

Once a game gets you to feel as if your grinding, working, then quit it for a while, thats not the reason we play.

And since there is NO pvp elements in this game, there is zero reason to ever feel like you must grind for anything.

 

After playing most frames, owning almost all weapons in the game, I can tell you this:

 

Strun is among the most powerful weapons, you can buy it for 17.500 credits straight off, at rank 1.

Braton is the best rifle once fully modded. Snipetron came a long way but have been removed from the game.

Braton you can get for 25k credits, without grinding for blueprint mats.

 

Melee weapons: Sure Ether swords and Dual Ethters, but the mats for those are easy to get. Above all you will have them since.....

Cronus kicks butt: You will get Cronus from your first boss encounter, and this sword is very good.

 

Right now, there are no enemies that can stand in your way once you have aqquired the right amount of mods.

 

The only reason in this game to farm is to get mods, and since you farm for mods, you also farm for mats. It all goes hand in hand.

 

Pluto: You need a lightly modded weapon to run through most missions here.

I ran through Pluto the first time with a mediocred bodded Strun and 1-2 shotted most enemies.

With the Shotgun mods I later and have now, its not even a challenge anymore.

 

But all of all...I am personally waiting for resets to be available again so I can reset my account and start all over.

Mainly cause I wasted platinum on things I now know I never need.

 

And also, I kind of look forward to start over again. The game is fun especially from the beginning.

 

Forget about this grinding for Dojo stuff. Play some defence missions, have some fun, and at the same time you will aqquire your mats.

 

All you need to do is, plan where to make your runs to ensure you maximize your chances to recieve the mats you need.

[Bennyworld]

Although I thank the Devs for the immense content and hard work. I'm still faced with a lot of disappointment with te direction the game is taking.

A lot of new content now requires immense amounts of resources. Specially the weapons that can be obtained from the dojo. The problem is that, there is a lot of demand for resources and not enough supply or opertunities to obtain resources in large amounts. The "Time to Build" mechanic does not help either considering some blueprints are stalked and can only be build one at a time.

The more I play this game, the more I feel that this game is turning into a grind fest. Not that grinding is a bad thing in games, but it is a bad thing for a PvE game. Granted it has been made clear that PvP content shall always remain limited. I can't help but dislike the games for the forced, now long, grind sessions.

Well - you have t grind in most games - but warframe does seem to need something other than simply grinding for resources to make weapons. I think that a level up reward scheme - or when you finish a planet - you should be rewarded with a new weapon or a blueprint and a ton of resources to make it.

[TurbanSenpai]

Well - you have t grind in most games - but warframe does seem to need something other than simply grinding for resources to make weapons. I think that a level up reward scheme - or when you finish a planet - you should be rewarded with a new weapon or a blueprint and a ton of resources to make it.

 

See, lets take Guild Wars 2 as an example. Grinding has many incentives. Every kill gives you XP for your character level. Every kill also drops specific items every time depending on the mob. Every kill also drops a certain amount of in-game money. The drop system and drop rates are excellent therefore grinding is worth it and is fun.

 

In Warframe, none of that exists. Drops are random, kills only count as kills, kills do not yield anything. At most, killing an enemy has a CHANCE to drop something which furthermore has a CHANCE to be a resource which has a CHANCE to be a specific resource which has a random amount which is no longer substantial given the demands on resources.

 

Example - Did a full run through of Europa, only got around 100 rubedo.

            Or Ran the hyena mission 11 times before I got only ONE control unit. Before, I got around 50-60 ferrite.  

[Skeloton]

Does anyone know how much it took to make a gorgon via BP? because being new I don't know if it always cost 5morhphics, 5000ferrite, 6000salvage, 1000rubedo. I don't mind this but its the inconsistency that bugs me lol.

[Jun-Mai]

Does anyone know how much it took to make a gorgon via BP? because being new I don't know if it always cost 5morhphics, 5000ferrite, 6000salvage, 1000rubedo. I don't mind this but its the inconsistency that bugs me lol.

do terminus on mercury for ferrite: 700-1200 per solo run (if I go duo: only 200 ferrite but solo surprisingly high 6min per full run killing everything and everyone and open every container)

do io on juptier for salvage: you can do it in a grp to get 500-1000 till wave 5

I find usually rubedo on kappa: around 200-300 per run. (6-10min)

 

and morphics I hate morphics I need around 12 runs to vor to get enough morphics (full run takes 3min)

[Phoenix86]

if i'm notmistaken they are going to increase resources gathered... isnt it? (info taken from the live stream)

[Skeloton]

do terminus on mercury for ferrite: 700-1200 per solo run (if I go duo: only 200 ferrite but solo surprisingly high 6min per full run killing everything and everyone and open every container)

do io on juptier for salvage: you can do it in a grp to get 500-1000 till wave 5

I find usually rubedo on kappa: around 200-300 per run. (6-10min)

 

and morphics I hate morphics I need around 12 runs to vor to get enough morphics (full run takes 3min)

Didn't answer my question....Ive already made it (ok so I got 10hrs) the getting the mats was easy....ok so the rubys took while but im still interested if they upped the costs in some patch before I joined.

[Tulzscha]

if i'm notmistaken they are going to increase resources gathered... isnt it? (info taken from the live stream)

 

Yes, they plan to have resource rewards for ? alert missions.