(PSN)Onyxflamegod Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 I'll reserve my judgement on the rework until it officially drops and we see what players can do, buildwise. Devs obviously don't test everything or we wouldn't have ended up with slwova or Tonkor Zeph. I'll also reserve my judgement on how effective it is until Saryn Prime drops, seeing as nowadays Primes are bandaids for old frame problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)SancticuS Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 (edited) It's a rework. They're adding more value to duration for her, which in turn buffs all of her other skills. It's definitely not a nerf. As the person below states, how can you even decided that it is definitely not a nerf when you have not tried said changes. The pendulum swings both ways. If one can not state that it is a nerf then you can not state that it is definitely not a nerf. I don't know what else I can say other than "I agree". I think people should wait until the actual changes come out before we criticize them. True Yeah great rework now we press 1 2 3 4 just to kill a level 40 bombard much op >_> Rebecca did all sorts of pressing and still did not manage to put a dent in the bombard without going all melee on it. Same goes for the rest of her showcase. So I will wait until she is released on PC for a final verdict but that she is in that state now and is releasing next week is VERY worrying. Time to pick a new main I guess. Edited October 30, 2015 by (PS4)SancticuS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyus Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 All because the current "stack negative duration, press 4 to delete everything" build won't be optimal anymore. It's inevitable that you'll reach a point in time in which your current favored build on just about anything will change. You will have to get out of your comfort zone, and you will have to adapt. It's not all that bad, really -- change is good and prevents stagnation, and Saryn desperately needed something to give her more gameplay than the age-old "press 4 to win" that's much-loathed by many players. It's a rework. They're adding more value to duration for her, which in turn buffs all of her other skills. It's definitely not a nerf. EDIT: Currently, based upon the devstream, some of the devs actually fear Saryn might be overpowered post-rework. So there's that too. Change for the sake of change alone is not good, it is just different. In this case, time to kill has been shown to increase on Saryn. An Increase in time to kill means a decrease in total damage output, a damage output decrease is a nerf. There are many other options they could have persued to make her other abilities more viable, but they didn't. So instead of pressing 4, you now have to roll your face across the keyboard and back again. Do you know what happens when you make something simple needlessly complicated? People ignore it and move on. That is what is going to happen with her, people will just drop her and move on to another frame that fills the same role. Example: Sleight of Hand. Extremely complicated ability, that barely does any damage. No one uses it, on top of that explosive Ledgermain destroys loot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-InV-igo95862 Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 Saryn was good at clearing room with one nuke. What is new rebalance good at? Why would I ever want to pick her? Volt or Ember would be way better at nuking. Chroma or Valkyr would be way better at survivalbility. New rebalance puts Saryn in to jack of all trades master of nothing category right next to Oberon or Hydroid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)kira4715 Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 True Rebecca did all sorts of pressing and still did not manage to put a dent in the bombard without going all melee on it. Same goes for the rest of her showcase. So I will wait until she is released on PC for a final verdict but that she is in that state now and is releasing next week is VERY worrying. Time to pick a new main I guess. Yeah fact they will release her in that state is disappointing but go figure frost/excal get awesome reworks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PsychedelicSnake Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 Yeah fact they will release her in that state is disappointing but go figure frost/excal get awesome reworks People thought the Frost & Excal reworks would be horrible too. I don't know about anyone else, but I'm going to sit here on my salt throne and wait before passing judgment on something that was repeatedly stated to be a work in progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)kira4715 Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 People thought the Frost & Excal reworks would be horrible too. I don't know about anyone else, but I'm going to sit here on my salt throne and wait before passing judgment on something that was repeatedly stated to be a work in progress. Yes both reworks worked out great problem is from what They showed us saryn will run out of energy fast and it gives us forced synergy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PsychedelicSnake Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 Yes both reworks worked out great problem is from what They showed us saryn will run out of energy fast and it gives us forced synergy What they demonstrated has been repeatedly described as work in progress and in no way final. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TennoPain Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 OP not everything is worth changing . sure nothing but the progress is infinite Tho progress is relative term . So i give u 2/5 for your post for your post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkmoone1 Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 They changed Excal from "press 4 to win" to "press 4 to win but little bit slower". Frost was changed from "defence only" to "hey you can actually kill now with your skills". We have to see what Saryn will be about. Because devstream showed us not the best gameplay. I mean if your frame can't kill lvl 40 bombard after being potatoed and having build...that's a very bad news Ok first off, Excal being "Press 4 to win, but a little bit slower" is a total false statement and does that ability zero justice. Any kill from that ability comes completely from both player interaction and planning. The ability by itself does not kill for the player rather it's the player that guides the ability to kill other enemies. It never guarantees that you will kill you enemies just because you casted it because you can still very much die while using it. Huge difference from Exhalted blade to the 4's of certain other frames that can just auto track and hit enemies in an entire room. Secondly I think we've seen from Atlas that DE are starting to be a bit more forthcoming with quick warframe changes. Let them do their thing and if it doesn't do well, make a topic or two in the feedback sections. Nowadays they get the hint regarding the balance of some aspects within the game. In short, patience everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhisperByte Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 (edited) Ember will be the next FotM. I wouldn't be so sure. Temple Guardian skin seems complete or at least almost complete Edited October 30, 2015 by WhisperByte Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)kira4715 Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 What they demonstrated has been repeatedly described as work in progress and in no way final. I'm curious what they can do in a week because how likely are they actually going to make it better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PsychedelicSnake Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 I'm curious what they can do in a week because how likely are they actually going to make it better? A lot can change in a week. Let's not forget that Rebecca straight up said she may have fudged the modding while demonstrating, and that the skill did just fine (even when not optimized) against other units as well. I'm no developer, but I have worked with some in the past. Things can change very quickly, in surprising ways. Regardless, I advise everyone to wait until it drops before passing judgment. By all means, be cautious or even a tad negative. Just don't drop your toxic spores all over it before its even born. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)kira4715 Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 A lot can change in a week. Let's not forget that Rebecca straight up said she may have fudged the modding while demonstrating, and that the skill did just fine (even when not optimized) against other units as well. I'm no developer, but I have worked with some in the past. Things can change very quickly, in surprising ways. Regardless, I advise everyone to wait until it drops before passing judgment. By all means, be cautious or even a tad negative. Just don't drop your toxic spores all over it before its even born. I can agree that things can move quickly problem i have is if we don't give criticism now DE will be unlikely to change her after the rework i'd much rather call bloody murder now and be a slight pessimist then say nothing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crimsonspartan1 Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 (edited) i dont see the point why everyone is crying about saryn being reworked. she needed 1 badly anyway cus people just call saryn the best frame just because of 1 stupidly over powered skill. im sorry but it HAD to be done... and im happy for it *prepairs valkyr army against the army of saryn fanboys* p.s. sorry if i offended u but she seriously needed that rework badly. Edited October 30, 2015 by crimsonspartan1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mak_Gohae Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 (edited) De-"We dont want people running on one power alone on Saryn. That's why we made all channeling abilities super cheap and makes people run on one power alone on other frames." Sorry, but this "excuse" makes absolutely no sense with the stuff that DE has done with other frames. Really, i cant believe anyone would actually accept that as an actual reason. Edited October 30, 2015 by Mak_Gohae Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vargras Posted October 30, 2015 Author Share Posted October 30, 2015 Example: Sleight of Hand. Extremely complicated ability, that barely does any damage. No one uses it, on top of that explosive Ledgermain destroys loot. Why in the world are you using Sleight of Hand as an example of a damage ability? Cause I mean, it's never really meant to be one. It's always done poor damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)kira4715 Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 i dont see the point why everyone is crying about saryn being reworked. she needed 1 badly anyone cus people just call saryn the best frame just because of 1 stupidly over powered skill. im sorry but it HAD to be done... and im happy for it *prepairs valkyr army against the army of saryn fanboys* p.s. sorry if i offended u but she seriously needed that rework badly. Sorry but the reason myself and many saryn fans don't like this rework is not because She's getting one but because it fixes none of her issues just now we press 1 2 3 4 to deal less damage and run out of energy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vargras Posted October 30, 2015 Author Share Posted October 30, 2015 Sorry but the reason myself and many saryn fans don't like this rework is not because She's getting one but because it fixes none of her issues just now we press 1 2 3 4 to deal less damage and run out of energy Rebecca was running +strength and -duration and -efficiency on most of the testing she's been doing. I highly, highly doubt it'll be less damage than what it is now. And the devs already said they'll look at other changes to Saryn to make up for the increased skill usage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Xewkeryx Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 Not optimistic to see Contagion's staying. I get the whole synergy thing, that's cool, but how would the power work alone? Couldn't it strengthen firearms to a lesser extent? Couldn't it apply a bonus to teammates? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PsychedelicSnake Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 Not optimistic to see Contagion's staying. I get the whole synergy thing, that's cool, but how would the power work alone? Couldn't it strengthen firearms to a lesser extent? Couldn't it apply a bonus to teammates? I'd love if Contagion gave a bonus to teammates at well. Heck, I'd even take it at 50% effectiveness for teammates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gr3vi3R Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 (edited) lel. RIP Saryn. Long live Loki Master Race, lulz. Edited October 30, 2015 by Gr3vi3R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weltraumfred Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 p.s. sorry if i offended u but she seriously needed that rework badly. She totally needed a rework. It's just that I am not all that enthusiastic about the current concept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaverickZero Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 RIP Saryn/Saryn Prime Contagion is a prime candidate for the worst skill in Warframe and somehow Saryn is supposed to rely on using it. Post rework WIP shown on Devstream is as terrible as Negative Duration Miasma spam. Except now you have to be stuck in melee range to spread some damage around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyEnneract Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 Even when she combined all four of her powers, she ended up doing nothing to a level 40 bombard. Not sure why they would think "overpowered." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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