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[DE]Danielle

Sortie Missions [U18 Megathread]

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Right now sorties are the ONLY way to fix that decision you made at the end of second dream.   (with no data unless you went fishing for spoilers - How was I to know that the "know our enemy tree" would be all melee-only crit buffs?  )

 

That said, as long as you don't have to hack and they are non-endless missions, they are fun and intense. I'll just not try the ones I know I can't do, and try to PUG the ones I think I can, and hope I can get a lens for a different school I can put on something to grind up the thousand missions worth of focus I need to unlock the new school. 

 

 

However, everything comes to grinding halt when the lockdown gets triggered, or for missions where you need to hack. 

 

First off: no ciphers: Surprise!  This is the first mission that you don't have to find a blueprint and build a key for that has that feature. 

 

Second: The Grineer locks rules have changed from normal.  There are shocks, changes in speed and direction and hitbox size changes. Hard to firgure out when you only get one shot (spy) or when you are getting shot,

 

Third: Intruder's description does not imply that it helps Grineer hacking. There is no timer, so extra seconds don't do anything. 

 

Suggestion: Add a fix for those who want to play space ninja instead of clickme.  Make intruder slow down the pointer,  add a super-cipher,  add a new secondary or companion that is absolutely useless for combat but does hacks for you, something. 

 

 

And as least hand out a lens or two as Gifts of the Lotus so folks like me who regret our blind decision at the end of Second Dream aren't cluttering up the ranks of PUGS trying to fix it. 

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I could write up quite a lengthy post about this, but other people have already done that before me and it would end up being quite redundant. So I will keep it short:

 

- Harder missions, better rewards: Sorties are meant to be endgame-missions with endgame-rewards, right now they have been quite easy though (even keeping in mind that you are able to tackle these from MR4 onwards). Suggestions: make them harder so you will require a full team or top-notch solo-play and adjust the rewards accordingly.

 

- Make us look forward to the rewards, not regret them: Considering that you can get doubles of the items in the pool, you end up getting a lower return-of-investment the more days you spend on completing each sortie in a season. Reward players that keep coming back every single day - by adding drops per subsequently finished missions in a sortie (every 5, 10, 15, etc. completed days) or get rid of redundant drops.

 

That's about it, really. I do like the missions and "mutators" - together with the new login-rewards they give me personally a reason to keep coming back every day. I do think it needs some more work to be perfect, but it's already really enjoyable!

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I think after finishing the missions the game should give you 3 rewards out of the pool you can choose from, I know too many people that got duplicates from this. Nobody would want 25 cores over a limited time weapon part of a legendary core. At least give us a little bit of room when trying to fight RNG.

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That's weird. When I did Phorid's Excavation sortie mission I was able to leave as soon at the first excavator was finished. I got a Karak Wraith Barrel on that sortie. And another one on the next sortie.

And somehow my first sortie reward vanished, which was a Karak Wraith Reciever, which I got on the second day after the update. The same happened to a friend of mine, their first sortie reward vanished from their inventory, and their was from the first day after the update.

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Looking for a challenge, Tenno? Think you’ve got what it takes to face level 90 enemies with only your melee weapon in hand? Sortie Missions are here to test your adaptability and combat skills:

 

        • Sortie Missions are difficult endgame Missions for experienced Tenno that can be completed alone or with a group. You           must be Mastery Rank 4 or higher to play these highly specialized missions.

 

soooo i did my sortie missions today and ended up with the best reward possible..... a greater lens bp which i can buy on the market for credits..... for real this is the most usless item in the drop table and it should be removed it is totally pointless. the sorties claim to be the "endgame" yet provide rewards i can buy with credits? is this some kind of joke :D i just dont get it.

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Sortie defense missions need to be shortened. The one I just did wasted 1 hour. It shouldn't take even 1 hour to run all 3 missions. Also, Spy missions are a massive pain. 

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Personally I'm just a little confused about the execution. Aside from the blueprints the reward pool looks solid. And it does give that endgame pulse-pounding experience but...

 

Well, I'm just going to outright say it. With the difficulty and time involved in each mission (varying), and the existence of the greater lens blueprints which can be bought from the market, a thing endgame players should have no problem buying in the first place given their stock of millions of creds (12 mil for me)... could lose those and maybe at least offer 2 rewards per sortie, or one per mission. It doesn't need to be diluted or anything to compensate, just would be a more fair exchange for the effort. Afterall, working hard to succeed in these Sorties should be a high rewarding experience for us end-game players.

 

Also, think of it like this: sorties are like mini tactical alerts that reroll every day. There are three missions, but only one reward when a Tactical Alert offers 2-3 things.

 

Edit: I just think that would make the Sorties a far richer and rewarding experience for the time and effort involved.

 

Edit 2: And since it is the only way to get lenses.

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Is anyone else CONSISTENTLY getting duplicates from Sorties? The only reward I've gotten so far is the Dera Vandal Blueprint. 

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A few big complaints here. First off, why ARE rewards repeatable? I've gotten 2 dera receivers for an awful lot of time spent in this. It is a minor thing to add an additional system to track prior received rewards for each player, and eleminate them from the drop list.

Second, I'm not a big fan of seeing things that can be dropped that can be purchased with credits, like the greater lens blueprint, are kind of pointless. I don't forsee getting 4 lenses without a decent amount of grinding/luck/plat anyways, and you get about 200k credits... why can't I just buy a greater lens BP when I want it?

Finally, Why do I have to do a 20 wave defense, when there are zero incentives between waves? It makes sense for tower. Each wave gets harder, each wave gets better stuff, like a gamble. In these defenses, if you're kitted out correctly, the first 15 waves are a yawn fest, and the last 5 are a blast. Why can't we just play the last 5 waves, and skip the rest? Same with 20 minute survivals (though those have the decency to be interesting throughout the entire duration) and with extractions... Why do I have to complete 17 extractors? Seems a bit... much.

Spys and sabotages can stand to be a bit more interesting, as well... Super easy to complete with Loki. Maybe insta-nuke energy while in vault?

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Or just increase the amount of rewards you get for the effort and time invested with those long survivals and defenses put in place. Heavily against the nuke idea though. Though individual rewards and reward tracking would be s nice addition. You can't trade the parts so no point in stacking them.

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I can agree 20 waves is too many waves. Levels 80+? 20 waves? Put that all together and if you play with half a team or solo it takes you a stinking hour to do or better. I just wasted an hour in this sortie tonight when I could of been doing something with the new stuff instead of that. I work all the time and this sortie... I want the rewards but this is making it increasingly irritating getting defense last hour + time. Enough to make me say I wanna quit. That's bull.

 

For my reward after doing the sorties tonight and wasting an hour plus of my life for so damned 25 fusion cores. Which turned out to be R3's... Really? REALLY? Maybe I am being over dramatic but sum up the time on all 3 sorties to about 2 hours for 25x Rank 3 rare fusion cores. If it'd been R10's I wouldn't be complaining so much.

 

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I can agree 20 waves is too many waves. Levels 80+? 20 waves? Put that all together and if you play with half a team or solo it takes you a stinking hour to do or better. I just wasted an hour in this sortie tonight when I could of been doing something with the new stuff instead of that. I work all the time and this sortie... I want the rewards but this is making it increasingly irritating getting defense last hour + time. Enough to make me say I wanna quit. That's bull.

 

For my reward after doing the sorties tonight and wasting an hour plus of my life for so damned 25 fusion cores. Which turned out to be R3's... Really? REALLY? Maybe I am being over dramatic but sum up the time on all 3 sorties to about 2 hours for 25x Rank 3 rare fusion cores. If it'd been R10's I wouldn't be complaining so much.

 

I don't think you are being too dramatic, that is actually pretty rough. Why R3? Is that a glitch? As I'll preach on and on, why only one reward? You'd get more from investing time in the void than this and that isn't actually a good thing for endgame content.

 

I understand though that it is in its infancy, and it has potential to be some great endgame fun. It is like a series of mini Tactical Alerts. Just feels weak in the actual returns for enduring it.

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Some quick feedback.

Reward table:
@Fusion cores, Exilus Adaptor and Potatoes-I don't mind that they're in table, but they can be gotten elsewhere, so I'm not overly thrilled that they're there. Still better than some other things on the list, though, and I can certainly understand that not every sortie reward needs to be awesome.

@Dera Vandal and Karak Wraith components: Honestly, I feel like these weapons could have been better re-implemented into the game elsewhere, if only because the the sorties are aimed at veteran players, whom have likely been around long enough to have gotten the karak wraith(or dera vandal for ps4 players), already. Dera Vandal by itself might've been ok(and of course, ps4 would have karak wraith on the table instead).

@Legendary cores and Lenses: These are the really good rewards, obviously, though I question how the lenses will be obtained after the first season of sorties is up. Are they going to be a constant sortie drop or will they be moved to something else like random alerts?

@Greater lens bps: These shouldn't be here for 2 reasons. Firstly, they require 4 lenses to build, and I doubt most players have gotten that many. Secondly, they're in the market, and it's really not that hard to earn the 100,000 credits required to buy them.

Sortie Conditions:
@Sniper only, Shotgun only: I feel like these types of conditions should just disable all weapons that aren't in the right category once you've launched the mission, rather than forcing you to equip the weapon category and unequip everything else. That way players that haven't gone out of their way to obtain all the weapon types aren't punished by being unable to progress in the sorties for that day and can still participate, albeit unarmed. The existence of the "hidden" recovery mission type also proves that this mechanic shouldn't be too difficult to implement.

The other conditions are fine as is in my personal opinion.

Mission types:
@Defense and Excavation: How long a given mission should last is up for debate, but either way, these two missions are pretty tedious, especially defense. Throw in some "curve-balls" part way through to make things more interesting. Perhaps more special "one-time-appearance" enemies like corrupted vor or the stalker, but exclusive to defense/excavation missions. Or perhaps a quick secondary objective that must be accomplished every now and then before the mission can continue. Something that encourages activity that isn't just standing in one place firing weapons and spamming abilities for an hour.

@Spy: I'm a little unclear on what mechanics got changed here. Ran the mission one time against grineer and got booted from the console I was hacking for a reason I wasn't able to figure out(there were no enemies around). Ran another against corpus and the countdown alarms went off the minute I started hacking the console(I was invisible, so I couldn't have been spotted), though I suppose this could be explained if my teammates were dumb enough to enter the vault after I'd already gone in. All three vaults got the countdown triggered though so I'm a bit suspicious that the cause is a sortie-specific mechanic(like how rescue missions automatically trigger the countdown). In short, it would be helpful if it was made clear what mechanics in a mission are being changed, so I know what I'm supposed to do/not do and if something happened because it's supposed to happen or if it's because someone on the squad screwed up.

Other mission types are fine, thus far.

Edit: fixed some typos.

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Well, you can't use ciphers, that is an unmentioned limitation applied in sorties so you can't bypass hacking minigames. That is fine I think. Had one where I felt legitimately pressured and completed the hack with 1 second remaining. That was fun, in a non-sarcastic way.

 

And why shouldn't the rewards be awesome? I mean, it is a hurdle, and though there are strategies and frames to use to get around the difficulty, it is thinking and using things many of us normally don't. For example, the defense one with the whole load of eximus enemies. Frost's snow globe was going down as fast as the invincibility wore off. It made me dust off Nyx and it made me appreciate her again like that escort Tactical Alert did. I really like that. I think that the only real problem is the rewards. And as many have said, why are credit costing market items in the table?

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Well, you can't use ciphers, that is an unmentioned limitation applied in sorties so you can't bypass hacking minigames. That is fine I think.

(Assuming this was directed at me)

I also have no problem w/ this. I don't even bother to build ciphers most of the time so it doesn't really effect me anyways.

 

Finally, Why do I have to do a 20 wave defense, when there are zero incentives between waves? It makes sense for tower. Each wave gets harder, each wave gets better stuff, like a gamble. In these defenses, if you're kitted out correctly, the first 15 waves are a yawn fest, and the last 5 are a blast. Why can't we just play the last 5 waves, and skip the rest? Same with 20 minute survivals (though those have the decency to be interesting throughout the entire duration) and with extractions... Why do I have to complete 17 extractors? Seems a bit... much.

To be fair, this is also how endless missions are implemented in regular alerts, already. Mind you, 20 waves and 15 excavators does seem like to be a bit tedious, especially when the mission content remains relatively the same from beginning to end.

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To be fair, this is also how endless missions are implemented in regular alerts, already. Mind you, 20 waves and 15 excavators does seem like to be a bit tedious, especially when the mission content remains relatively the same from beginning to end.

 

This is where I get my thought. Considering the time invested, the types of missions, and so forth for what you get out of it. Not sure how it sounds unreasonable to just buff the turnout just a little. Maybe just 2 per sortie, we are playing missions under conditions and investing time where we'd get multiple rewards. At least you have 2 chances at something good, so can only yell at RNG (not DE) that you get 2 you didn't want. I would never suggest more than three, though, I don't want it to be overly rewarding, just enough to really feel motivated by this system.

 

This is based entirely on the length of invested time, number of missions, toughness of enemies, etc.

 

Me and a friend were debating it, and he's kind of neutral towards WF. I'm biased in favor of WF so I was all "well this looks cool". But his first impression was "Only one reward? And this is the only way to get those lense things? That is kind of lame". And you know, ultimate truth is... he's right, it is. I mean, when the season is over and we just got a bunch of Karak Wraith receivers and two lenses... what then? Feels more like wasted time than a job well done. I feel like this should be a major movement to save sorties instead of turning out to be another hyped system that ultimately flops.

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Something I would love to see from Corpus sorties is allowing Bursas, Hyenas, and maybe even a Lynx to spawn there, and make Combas spawn more often. Then we'd have something reminiscent of those alert missions in the days leading up to 17.5 that were truly challenging and entertaining, since we actually had to work together and prioritize bringing down the Bursas before they isolated and brutally murdered us. I think the Corpus could really use something like that.

 

Liar... you just want stances

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All three vaults got the countdown triggered though so I'm a bit suspicious that the cause is a sortie-specific mechanic

Grineer hack panels seem to work like in nightmare LoR - if you activate a certain spot more than three times, it zaps you and kicks you from the panel. There is no insta-countdown, though. I did the Corpus spy all by myself last night and didn't trigger the alarms. You have to watch out, though, there have been new cameras added to some spots that you might only see after they've seen you. Ivara's Prowl and sleep arrows were really helpful in that one.

 

Liar... you just want stances

Sorties can't drop rare mods, so that reduces the number of obtainable stances quite a lot. Alas.

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Call me quitter. But today i uninstalled warframe until spy/stealth has pulled out of sorties. It just does not work well.

 

1. The game is already newbie hostile enough, i myself started month ago and had EXTREMELY rocky start with this game. And while i know sorties arent exactly low lvl missions. Quiranteed someone who's not ready for them is gonna go there and get destroyed and leave the game.

 

2. Lvl 90-100+ spy missions? where you have to succeed in every way? Didin't you learn anything from feedback on Stolen dreams Quest DE? Like where do i even get started here.. Do you want us to do it in group or solo? Because we all know how well spy multiplayer turns out, (NEWSFLASH: NOT FUN) Or solo, where even your huras just deems that OK its time to constantly turn off the stealth and get himself killed. And not even considering that what happens IF you manage to hack all 3 terminals.

 

Lotus- Ok tenno kill all the witnesses now. 0/178

 

Myself i tried to then go ahead and get them with tonkor. that keep in mind.. had earlier killed same lvl eximuses in last defense with 1-3 shots. >100 dmg. Mission failed. Tried again, same thing.. 0/178.. this time with dread. Nope.

 

3. Stealth just does not work in this game. And there's alot of replies on how to make it better. Myself i experience the enemies camera placement to be the worst thing. Sometimes you open a door to a hallway and alerts go off instantly. Story of our lives ain't it?. Not to mention that it seems that enemies in this particular sortie have some sort of extreme hate boner towards the player and seem to stalk you to the ends of the earth even if alerts are not even on.

 

4. DE, i can see, maybe even bit understand it if you said that hey this S#&$ is for the loki/ivara club and whatnot. But tell me honestly: when you were making this sortie, did you guys sit down and have a good 5 minutes to reflect on how someone like Oberon would run through this? like would he have good time doing this?. Cause someone out there is the @(*()$ hero that does that. There's always going to be that guy. And this is coming from volt lover (Offtopic: Why do you hate us volts DE?) Bottomline: I can understand it if your gonna say  something like: Tough S#&$, its stealth so better get that new ivara or join the loki masterrace scrub. Cause.. well yeah thats logical. But not everyone has loki or ivara.

Heck, even if i HAD them id still try volt first.

 

TLDR: Pull the spy sorties out until you really have the stealth down. Cause they are just not FUN. Start asking yourself that how would the weakest frame run through this at the moment.

 

This all is coming from someone who has been enjoying, and loving everything after that rocky start of a game up to this very last point (beside stolen dreams quest, F*** that quest.) And this 1 sortie singlehandedly made me quit the game atleast until you get some patches in on stealth or sorties. All you need is tweaks honestly. Cause at the end of the day i had to ask myself >"is this what it it's like? THIS? This is warframe endgame? THIS is the kind of S#&$ we have to grind through every day?

 

No thanks.

 

Cause congratulations DE, you have created the perfect storm of bullS#&$.

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Call me quitter. But today i uninstalled warframe until spy/stealth has pulled out of sorties. It just does not work well.

 

1. The game is already newbie hostile enough, i myself started month ago and had EXTREMELY rocky start with this game. And while i know sorties arent exactly low lvl missions. Quiranteed someone who's not ready for them is gonna go there and get destroyed and leave the game.

 

2. Lvl 90-100+ spy missions? where you have to succeed in every way? Didin't you learn anything from feedback on Stolen dreams Quest DE? Like where do i even get started here.. Do you want us to do it in group or solo? Because we all know how well spy multiplayer turns out, (NEWSFLASH: NOT FUN) Or solo, where even your huras just deems that OK its time to constantly turn off the stealth and get himself killed. And not even considering that what happens IF you manage to hack all 3 terminals.

 

Lotus- Ok tenno kill all the witnesses now. 0/178

 

Myself i tried to then go ahead and get them with tonkor. that keep in mind.. had earlier killed same lvl eximuses in last defense with 1-3 shots. >100 dmg. Mission failed. Tried again, same thing.. 0/178.. this time with dread. Nope.

 

3. Stealth just does not work in this game. And there's alot of replies on how to make it better. Myself i experience the enemies camera placement to be the worst thing. Sometimes you open a door to a hallway and alerts go off instantly. Story of our lives ain't it?. Not to mention that it seems that enemies in this particular sortie have some sort of extreme hate boner towards the player and seem to stalk you to the ends of the earth even if alerts are not even on.

 

4. DE, i can see, maybe even bit understand it if you said that hey this S#&$ is for the loki/ivara club and whatnot. But tell me honestly: when you were making this sortie, did you guys sit down and have a good 5 minutes to reflect on how someone like Oberon would run through this? like would he have good time doing this?. Cause someone out there is the @(*()$ hero that does that. There's always going to be that guy. And this is coming from volt lover (Offtopic: Why do you hate us volts DE?) Bottomline: I can understand it if your gonna say  something like: Tough S#&$, its stealth so better get that new ivara or join the loki masterrace scrub. Cause.. well yeah thats logical. But not everyone has loki or ivara.

Heck, even if i HAD them id still try volt first.

 

TLDR: Pull the spy sorties out until you really have the stealth down. Cause they are just not FUN. Start asking yourself that how would the weakest frame run through this at the moment.

 

This all is coming from someone who has been enjoying, and loving everything after that rocky start of a game up to this very last point (beside stolen dreams quest, F*** that quest.) And this 1 sortie singlehandedly made me quit the game atleast until you get some patches in on stealth or sorties. All you need is tweaks honestly. Cause at the end of the day i had to ask myself >"is this what it it's like? THIS? This is warframe endgame? THIS is the kind of S#&$ we have to grind through every day?

 

No thanks.

 

Cause congratulations DE, you have created the perfect storm of bullS#&$.

Or just go with Loki on spy missions? Well, I do it since I have no gear to kill a regulator drone reliably on those levels.

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Or just go with Loki on spy missions? Well, I do it since I have no gear to kill a regulator drone reliably on those levels.

Like i said, i dont have loki, or any other stealth frame. And even if i had, id still prefer playing it with volt, he can do it. The only problem is the kill everyone objective that happens to me. Which is kinda odd btw considering that your after the info. It's just a massive slap on the face from DE, and i bet im not the only one here who's feeling #*($%%@.

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Flak vest ready, flame repellent on.

 

I think Sorties are junk. Not only enemy scaling is just not fixed for such levels, but also whole content is "Let's throw our hardcore dogs a difficulty bone". It's not a new high-level multistage mission type that gives both challenge and fun, it's 3 old dumb nightmare missions with pumped up enemies and trial wannabe hazards (namely consoles with no ciphers and 3 mistakes before failure and electrocution). Loot pool - have fun with your 25 Cores or greater lens blueprint - you just saved yourself 200k credits!

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Like i said, i dont have loki, or any other stealth frame. And even if i had, id still prefer playing it with volt, he can do it.

so, let me get this straight - you are doing missions that were created specifically to be difficult endgame content, and you are getting angry that you are failing because you are dedicated to using the wrong tool for the job? no, DE should not remove spy from the rotation just because one of their players wants to play volt for everything. just get a stealth frame. loki, ivara, ash, or limbo all work well. probably others too. limbo can pass through the lasers without setting off alarms, the others have invis powers. most of the gameplay in warframe is about choosing the right tool for the right job. if you stubbornly refuse to do that, then you should probably stick to lower level content (where you can totally get away using any gear for any mission types) rather than attempting things outside your comfort zone and then complaining about how they are outside your comfort zone.

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so, let me get this straight - you are doing missions that were created specifically to be difficult endgame content, and you are getting angry that you are failing because you are dedicated to using the wrong tool for the job? no, DE should not remove spy from the rotation just because one of their players wants to play volt for everything. just get a stealth frame. loki, ivara, ash, or limbo all work well. probably others too. limbo can pass through the lasers without setting off alarms, the others have invis powers. most of the gameplay in warframe is about choosing the right tool for the right job. if you stubbornly refuse to do that, then you should probably stick to lower level content (where you can totally get away using any gear for any mission types) rather than attempting things outside your comfort zone and then complaining about how they are outside your comfort zone.

Like it how you paste volt players as noobs or something? @(*()$ typical. I prefer to play him cause i enjoy to play him, i like his balance, and the challenge that he gives compared to some frames like loki or nova, frost and whatnot. lets face it, he's more interesting. So yeah i play him for FUN like that's what games are all about you know? Also, i know he has alot of things that need fixing, but that does not mean that you should just abandon ship when DE makes your frame S#&$tier. You gotta show that there's people who care about it. Besides, if you really just switch frames for rewards do you even enjoy playing the frames or are you all about rewards? 

 

And trying things outside comfort zone? What am i even supposed to try outside huras and already doing the mission technically, did you even read it that i simply don't even have stealth frame. Besides i like it how your being all condescending and expecting me to be some complete noob. You should think bit more. Like how did i even get there then?

 

I'm only giving critique here. Even if DE was hellbent on insisting to use loki. It would not only be a slap to players but also bad business practice. It's just all around really stupid. Like it would just be screaming to either buy slots for loki, or get more farming for a frame that you are forced to use. like man do you even know what logic is? Cause that's just not good game design. They simply should just remove that idiotic kill everyone objective from the spy missions. Problem solved.

 

And what would it change for you? Yeah you might say people may rush more, but aren't they already?. Anyone reasonable tackles spies with caution anyway. It would only open more challenges for wider audiences.

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