Has Warframe Been Ruined By The Update 18 Reveal? [Spoiler City.]

[Omnimorph]

The only reason that remote-Tenno wasn't more popular is that there was a lot of content that precluded it.

 

Well, it's not "remote Tenno" really, is it?  It's exactly like Avatar, which is not "remote control of Navi avatar" except in the blandest sense - a sense that misses out on the richness of Tenno/Jake Sully feeling like they are the "thing".  And in that sense, I'm not seeing any content that precluded it, except possibly maybe the "we build a frame around them", but that's easy to see as figurative.

[StabbyTentacles]

Fixed your text color in the OP.

Seemed fine to me... sorry everybody, *blushes.

ty Blatantfool

[BBYipho]

I'm just curious what the hell is in a Warframe.  It bleeds and everything.  Probably something like the infested in a more control form for our Tenno RC Puppets?

 

What is in there that is referenced by some of our enemies?  We know it has no eyes, and Alad V says whatever it is "It doesn't make sense."

 

I wonder if it'll bother people if our Warframes are pretty much Hive minds to our "Tenno."

 

I was unconvinced about any theory that concluded with remote Tenno because of the numerous mentions of discreet blood/bones/corpses etc discovered within the Warframes by our enemies, also the dramatic tension from the Intro, Patient Zero and the Inference that when they Warframe "dies" (Limbo Theorem, Hidden Messages) the Operator dies with it.

 

To this I'm just going to point out that some Tenno thought they were the Warframes.  It's pretty much one of the first dialogues they say like "I thought I was..."  Only thing I can say to that.  Perhaps these Tennos didn't really end there on those stories.  Or they only owned that one frame and got nothing else to go back to if it's never recovered.  Putting the Tenno in a bodyless state to project itself.

[Jukantos]

i actually think this has larger potential because it could legitimately introduce "civil" missions / story interactions of us visiting colonists when a grineer attack occurs etcetera.

 

The only problem i have with it is the missing logic of a WARFRAME falling out of a cryopod when a new tenno joins the fight xD i mean what, was our conscience shut down because our sockpuppet was? needs a little bit of polish there.

[SilentMobius]

To this I'm just going to point out that some Tenno thought they were the Warframes.  It's pretty much one of the first dialogues they say like "I thought I was..."  Only thing I can say to that.  Perhaps these Tennos didn't really end there on those stories.  Or they only owned that one frame and got nothing else to go back to if it's never recovered.  Putting the Tenno in a bodyless state to project itself.

 

I'm not referring to the _in character_ issues. I referring to the story integrity issues.

 

Vor's prize has Vor threatening the Warframe physically. It turns out that these were completely empty threats as the Tenno was never under threat. It's still consistent in-world but it makes a mockery of the dramatic tension.

 

Patient Zero, had Alad V, someone who has looked inside a Warframe, threatening us with inclusion into the Mutalist empire, and yet suddenly he's admitting he "didn't understand what he found" if he didn't find what he expected, they why was he threatening us as if we were physically in there and vulnerable to the infestation. Suddenly the drama is gone, motivation are suddenly muddy and vague.

 

Hidden Messages has the previous Mirage pilot _die_ due to Warframe destruction. Was that a lie? all the emotional connection with that quest is now revealed to be nonsense. Ditto with the Limbo Theorem.

 

etc, etc.

 

Each one _might_ be explainable, sure, but together they are damaging the integrity of the story and IMHO DE needs to come up with the truth of the past content sharpish like.

[Latiac]

I'm not referring to the _in character_ issues. I referring to the story integrity issues.

 

Vor's prize has Vor threatening the Warframe physically. It turns out that these were completely empty threats as the Tenno was never under threat. It's still consistent in-world but it makes a mockery of the dramatic tension.

 

Patient Zero, had Alad V, someone who has looked inside a Warframe, threatening us with inclusion into the Mutalist empire, and yet suddenly he's admitting he "didn't understand what he found" if he didn't find what he expected, they why was he threatening us as if we were physically in there and vulnerable to the infestation. Suddenly the drama is gone, motivation are suddenly muddy and vague.

 

Hidden Messages has the previous Mirage pilot _die_ due to Warframe destruction. Was that a lie? all the emotional connection with that quest is now revealed to be nonsense. Ditto with the Limbo Theorem.

 

etc, etc.

 

Each one _might_ be explainable, sure, but together they are damaging the integrity of the story and IMHO DE needs to come up with the truth of the past content sharpish like.

 

I'm hoping DE comes up with something like 'the warframes are alive, and are their own beings'. It'd make everyone happy. it'd certainlty fix alot of those issues you outlined and it'd make everyone happy.

Edited December 7, 2015 by Latiac

[djentlemenBehold]

I'm hoping DE comes up with something like 'the warframes are alive, and are their own beings'. It'd make everyone happy. it'd certainlty fix alot of those issues you outlined and it'd make everyone happy.

 

The Warframes are alive. If you've read the Rhino Prime codex, it's a meatsuit that went berserk and started killing researchers/shoveling entrails in its mouth before ending up in the room with the smol Operators. 

 

So they are alive, just probably mindless beasts.

 

Also I haven't seen this much salt since ME3's ending debacle. Y'all gonna need to drink a lot of water to dilute all that salt. 

Edited December 7, 2015 by djentlemenBehold

[Cpl_Facehugger]

 

 

Vor's prize has Vor threatening the Warframe physically. It turns out that these were completely empty threats as the Tenno was never under threat. It's still consistent in-world but it makes a mockery of the dramatic tension.

 

Let's think about this for a sec.

 

In Vor's Prize, you have one warframe and as far as you know, you are the warframe. Best case scenario if you fail? You're now a bodiless tenno able to do nothing but seethe impotently on the moon while Vor's using your body to promote grineer liberation of the system.

Worst case scenario? Suppose tenno can't disconnect voluntarily from their frames without special equipment in our liset armories (since we can't change frames without that, or call down our spare frames to help out during missions, etc). Now suppose the ascaris doesn't get removed in time. Suddenly, that tenno is a slave in their own body, forever, watching as Vor uses them to do villainous things while they remain utterly impotent to stop it - watching with their eyes as their hands murder and enslave.

 

I think there's plenty of dramatic tension here even after the reveal.

 

Patient Zero, had Alad V, someone who has looked inside a Warframe, threatening us with inclusion into the Mutalist empire, and yet suddenly he's admitting he "didn't understand what he found" if he didn't find what he expected, they why was he threatening us as if we were physically in there and vulnerable to the infestation. Suddenly the drama is gone, motivation are suddenly muddy and vague.

 

It's not much of a stretch to think that Alad's gloating about the capabilities of his new and improved mutalist t-cyte strain and thinking that even if he doesn't quite understand what's under a warframe, he'll be able to infest them just fine. Considering he did the same to Mesa.

 

And I don't know about you, but I'd be mighty salty if my rhino prime got infested. It'd be like losing a friend. :(

 

Hidden Messages has the previous Mirage pilot _die_ due to Warframe destruction. Was that a lie? all the emotional connection with that quest is now revealed to be nonsense. Ditto with the Limbo Theorem.

 

What if warframes are their own independent beings? Certainly there's evidence for this - rhipri codex entry, seeing your frame break War, the way your battleloli talks to you and refers to "we" and gives advice, which would be totally pointless if warframes weren't at least partly independent.

 

In this case, Mirage or Limbo dying would still be tragic, since warframes are their own individuals, it's just not as tragic as it could be because the tenno driving it is still alive?

 

Remember, Hidden Messages had the previous Mirage die. Said nothing about the tenno inside. Lotus at all points refers to Mirage, if I recall.  

[LunarTemplar]

Ruined for you maybe, but the general consensus from the player base seems to be the update was a roaring success.

 

This is how it's gonna be from here on out. I for one am looking forward to see where it's gonna go.

 

We've known for a very long time that we were a single Tenno operating multiple frames.

 

also, this.

[Omnimorph]

I'm not referring to the _in character_ issues. I referring to the story integrity issues.

 

Vor's prize has Vor threatening the Warframe physically. It turns out that these were completely empty threats as the Tenno was never under threat. It's still consistent in-world but it makes a mockery of the dramatic tension.

 

Patient Zero, had Alad V, someone who has looked inside a Warframe, threatening us with inclusion into the Mutalist empire, and yet suddenly he's admitting he "didn't understand what he found" if he didn't find what he expected, they why was he threatening us as if we were physically in there and vulnerable to the infestation. Suddenly the drama is gone, motivation are suddenly muddy and vague.

 

Hidden Messages has the previous Mirage pilot _die_ due to Warframe destruction. Was that a lie? all the emotional connection with that quest is now revealed to be nonsense. Ditto with the Limbo Theorem.

 

etc, etc.

 

Each one _might_ be explainable, sure, but together they are damaging the integrity of the story and IMHO DE needs to come up with the truth of the past content sharpish like.

 

Re. Vor and Alad V, to the outside world, the Tenno is the Warframe. 

 

Also, to the Tenno prior to this reveal, the Tenno is the Warframe. 

 

Nobody in the whole world apart from the Lotus, including the Tenno themselves, has the slightest inkling that the Tenno is not the Warframe.

 

With Hidden Messages, I agree that's a bit more tricky - but given that the Tenno thinks they are the Warframe, and given that the Tenno feels pain through damage to the Warframe (Valkyr), and supposing that at the time of the Sentient war, the relationship between Tenno and frame was 1 to 1 (as opposed to 1 to many that we have now) then the possibility that sufficiently severe shock to the Warframe's systems, with no "revives" possible, might kill the operator via some kind of feedback, makes sense.

Edited December 7, 2015 by Omnimorph

[StabbyTentacles]

[SilentMobius]

Re. Vor and Alad V, to the outside world, the Tenno is the Warframe. 

 

Also, to the Tenno prior to this reveal, the Tenno is the Warframe. 

 

Nobody in the whole world apart from the Lotus, including the Tenno themselves, has the slightest inkling that the Tenno is not the Warframe.

 

With Hidden Messages, I agree that's a bit more tricky - but given that the Tenno thinks they are the Warframe, and given that the Tenno feels pain through damage to the Warframe (Valkyr), and supposing that at the time of the Sentient war, the relationship between Tenno and frame was 1 to 1 (as opposed to 1 to many that we have now) then the possibility that sufficiently severe shock to the Warframe's systems, with no "revives" possible, might kill the operator via some kind of feedback, makes sense.

 

As I said, not "in character" issues, Story issues. And yes, I can think up explanations just the same way Cpl_Facehugger did, there is nothing you or they said that I haven't thought of.

 

Explained or otherwise they are now _bad_ stories, E.G.

 

Before: OMG Vor is after you, he might end up controlling you, Oh no, he's set a self destruct that could kill you.

After: Well maybe that might be psychologically damaging, or maybe you'll be stuck without a body for a bit, but you're not actually going to die it's just, threatening... in a different way.

 

Before: Alad V is infested, he's going to do it to everyone, he has special plans for you!

After: He didn't know what he was doing, despite dismantling Valkyr, we're immune there was no threat. But y'know, losing a Warframe might be annoying, right?

 

Before: Valiant dead Tenno leaves a trail to the design of their Warframe, Lotus get all emotional about losing one of her own.

After: Um, maybe it's like the Warframes are like.... um pets? because anything else would get into mind-control slavery. And the Tenno is fine, um so, sorry to freak you out?

 

Before: Young boy learn about a mystic force and leaves behind his dead surrogate parents to save the Galaxy from an evil empire.

After: Um.. Trade negotiations kinda break down, but the're just a front to get royalty away so the evil mastermind can maybe con the government into using troops that he secretly had made and controls. But a couple of mystics escape with the royalty and find a prophesied boy who ends up saving everyone more through luck than skill. But that all just ends up playing into the hands of the bad guy so it wan't a good ending really.

 

See? Muddy, vague, and difficult to relate to. It ruins the punch of the stories.

 

Don't get me wrong, I like the Second Dream, and I approve of the reveal, but DE need to give some hard answers to what each of those stories now mean, explicitly.

 

Oh and Warframes being alive? Sure, Warframes being sentient and capable of independent action? Highly unlikely IMHO And don't quote the RPC because you an I both know that was pre-Warframes existing and a scientist does _not_ talk about "eviscerating brothers" unless the thing is an animal not a golem-suit. And you don't make speculative Warframes before you've even noticed that the pilots can pilot them. I think that the RPC "beast" is the cow to the Warframe's leather jacket, ultimately raw materials.

 

Also remember that the RPC has a Tenno remote controlling the Beast without transference tech, nixing the notion that the Warframe must be acting on it's own at the end of the Second Dream.

Edited December 8, 2015 by SilentMobius

[Mak_Gohae]

As I said, not "in character" issues, Story issues. And yes, I can think up explanations just the same way Cpl_Facehugger did, there is nothing you or they said that I haven't thought of.

 

Explained or otherwise they are now _bad_ stories, E.G.

 

Before: OMG Vor is after you, he might end up controlling you, Oh no, he's set a self destruct that could kill you.

After: Well maybe that might be psychologically damaging, or maybe you'll be stuck without a body for a bit, but you're not actually going to die it's just, threatening... in a different way.

 

Before: Alad V is infested, he's going to do it to everyone, he has special plans for you!

After: He didn't know what he was doing, despite dismantling Valkyr, we're immune there was no threat. But y'know, losing a Warframe might be annoying, right?

 

Before: Valiant dead Tenno leaves a trail to the design of their Warframe, Lotus get all emotional about losing one of her own.

After: Um, maybe it's like the Warframes are like.... um pets? because anything else would get into mind-control slavery. And the Tenno is fine, um so, sorry to freak you out?

 

Before: Young boy learn about a mystic force and leaves behind his dead surrogate parents to save the Galaxy from an evil empire.

After: Um.. Trade negotiations kinda break down, but the're just a front to get royalty away so the evil mastermind can maybe con the government into using troops that he secretly had made and controls. But a couple of mystics escape with the royalty and find a prophesied boy who ends up saving everyone more through luck than skill. But that all just ends up playing into the hands of the bad guy so it wan't a good ending really.

 

See? Muddy, vague, and difficult to relate to. It ruins the punch of the stories.

 

Don't get me wrong, I like the Second Dream, and I approve of the reveal, but DE need to give some hard answers to what each of those stories now mean, explicitly.

 

Oh and Warframes being alive? Sure, Warframes being sentient and capable of independent action? Highly unlikely IMHO And don't quote the RPC because you an I both know that was pre-Warframes existing and a scientist does _not_ talk about "eviscerating brothers" unless the thing is an animal not a golem-suit. And you don't make speculative Warframes before you've even noticed that the pilots can pilot them. I think that the RPC "beast" is the cow to the Warframe's leather jacket, ultimately raw materials.

 

Also remember that the RPC has a Tenno remote controlling the Beast without transference tech, nixing the notion that the Warframe must be acting on it's own at the end of the Second Dream.

 

Yeah, that's one of the biggest meh this story brought.

No one was ever really in danger.

The game went from you and your buddies being in danger to lets not let them dudes have our toys.

[Cpl_Facehugger]

As I said, not "in character" issues, Story issues. And yes, I can think up explanations just the same way Cpl_Facehugger did, there is nothing you or they said that I haven't thought of.

 

Then why are you complaining? The explanations are there, buried in the lore. 

 

 

 

Explained or otherwise they are now _bad_ stories, E.G.

 

Why are they bad stories? They're different than they seemed at first glance, but I don't see how this reveal makes Vor's prize a bad story, for an example.

 

 

 

: OMG Vor is after you, he might end up controlling you, Oh no, he's set a self destruct that could kill you.Before

After: Well maybe that might be psychologically damaging, or maybe you'll be stuck without a body for a bit, but you're not actually going to die it's just, threatening... in a different way.

 

"Stuck without a body for a bit", dude, in Vor's prize the only warframe you have is the one you start with. Lose that and there's no known way for the tenno to communicate with the outside world. You're stuck on the moon forever with nothing to do. And this is the best case scenario. An equally plausible one is you're stuck as Vor's slave. The stakes are just as high unless you assume stuff that's never hinted at, like how the tenno can just assume control of a warframe that's not keyed to them or somehow escape from the moon unaided.

 

Alad V is infested, he's going to do it to everyone, he has special plans for you!

After: He didn't know what he was doing, despite dismantling Valkyr, we're immune there was no threat. But y'know, losing a Warframe might be annoying, right?

 

"We're immune."

"Infested Mesa."

 

I mean seriously, Alad not being stopped means he infests more warframes and eventually there get to be too many to actually stop him. The stakes are plenty high. And even in that quest a hard distinction was made between infested mesa and a tenno-piloted warframe. :\

 

Valiant dead Tenno leaves a trail to the design of their Warframe, Lotus get all emotional about losing one of her own.

After: Um, maybe it's like the Warframes are like.... um pets? because anything else would get into mind-control slavery. And the Tenno is fine, um so, sorry to freak you out?

 

This is the only one where you even remotely have a point, but even here it's undermined by your unwillingness to think about things with the information we have. We know that warframes are valuable. Very valuable, considering Lotus went to the trouble of shoving them in cryo. (Ignoring how corpus pay millions of plats for warframe parts. :p)

 

We can infer from the way operators talk to and about warframes that they value them. At worst we're talking about pets - anyone who's lost a pet who's been with them through thick and thin isn't gonna feel nothing. More likely, I think we're talking about partners. Certainly the operators expect their warframes to understand their speech.

 

So would you be totes fine with losing a partner? Someone who's been with you through thick and thin?

 

 

 

Oh and Warframes being alive? Sure, Warframes being sentient and capable of independent action? Highly unlikely IMHO And don't quote the RPC because you an I both know that was pre-Warframes existing and a scientist does _not_ talk about "eviscerating brothers" unless the thing is an animal not a golem-suit. And you don't make speculative Warframes before you've even noticed that the pilots can pilot them. I think that the RPC "beast" is the cow to the Warframe's leather jacket, ultimately raw materials.

 

I think you're mistaken, considering how often infested leaders express curiosity at how warframes are like them yet seem to have no trouble murdering them by the shipload. Warframes are pretty clearly alive and there's very strong circumstantial evidence that they're sentient and capable of some degree of limited independent action.

 

They're probably not as smart as a human being, but you don't need to be intelligent to be sentient.

 

 

 

Also remember that the RPC has a Tenno remote controlling the Beast without transference tech, nixing the notion that the Warframe must be acting on it's own at the end of the Second Dream.

 

Does it now? All it does is have the proto-rhino calming down when it reaches the tenno. Says absolutely nothing about the tenno actively controlling the proto-rhino. In Second Dream the tenno had to actively crawl over to the warframe and touch it in order to take control without transference tech.

 

I think you need to actually pay attention to things before you talk about how this or that undermines stories, to be honest.

Edited December 8, 2015 by Cpl_Facehugger

[StabbyTentacles]

Ruined for you maybe, but the general consensus from the player base seems to be the update was a roaring success.

 

This is how it's gonna be from here on out. I for one am looking forward to see where it's gonna go.

 

 

also, this.

So all the guys pushing for this, liked it, hmmmm that's nice.

 

Yeah, that's one of the biggest meh this story brought.

No one was ever really in danger.

The game went from you and your buddies being in danger to lets not let them dudes have our toys.

Yeah, oooh noooes they scratched my rhino that's going to cost me next time I take it to the shop. Cost Dad when he takes it to the shop.Whhaaaa whhhaaaa mooooom!

[Terrornaut]

The warframe pulling a sword out doesn't necessarily means conscious. I've argued before it may just be a security measure kicks in, since look at how the frame are not even moving until stalker literally put his hand on the operator. You can argue it's for dramatic effects but the fact that the warframe lies helplessly on the floor probably just turned alot of players away. Also that quote, never heard that one before. I've only heard the chair one before. It may be that the fatigue caused by uses of warframe can actually be manifested on the operator, who knows.

 

Conscious, security measure, same damn thing. Humans are the same as computers or insects in how we operate, we just have an assload more factors that start affecting our 'I need this for biological goals, get it x way' and 'if this happens, do this'.  The only real difference from us and the computers we make that operate not that differently from our own brains is that, we're biologically/organically created, and that we are just extremely layered in how we pursue our basic biological directives.

 

Unless, that is, you don't consider 'lower functioning' people to be human, then you can throw my argument out :|

 

In other news, loving the update and I felt it was a perfectly natural form of progression with the story.  Also, if you saw my operator you'd know right away who my main frame was.  I haven't lost anything at all with the reveal, but now, kind of feel like I have a warframe protector, my hands.

 

Have you ever been immobilized/bedridden and had to get a -lot- of things done through someone else you trust and have much hope for?  Cause...that's more or less what this all is.

[Omnimorph]

As I said, not "in character" issues, Story issues. And yes, I can think up explanations just the same way Cpl_Facehugger did, there is nothing you or they said that I haven't thought of.

 

Explained or otherwise they are now _bad_ stories, E.G.

 

Before: OMG Vor is after you, he might end up controlling you, Oh no, he's set a self destruct that could kill you.

After: Well maybe that might be psychologically damaging, or maybe you'll be stuck without a body for a bit, but you're not actually going to die it's just, threatening... in a different way.

 

Before: Alad V is infested, he's going to do it to everyone, he has special plans for you!

After: He didn't know what he was doing, despite dismantling Valkyr, we're immune there was no threat. But y'know, losing a Warframe might be annoying, right?

 

Before: Valiant dead Tenno leaves a trail to the design of their Warframe, Lotus get all emotional about losing one of her own.

After: Um, maybe it's like the Warframes are like.... um pets? because anything else would get into mind-control slavery. And the Tenno is fine, um so, sorry to freak you out?

 

Before: Young boy learn about a mystic force and leaves behind his dead surrogate parents to save the Galaxy from an evil empire.

After: Um.. Trade negotiations kinda break down, but the're just a front to get royalty away so the evil mastermind can maybe con the government into using troops that he secretly had made and controls. But a couple of mystics escape with the royalty and find a prophesied boy who ends up saving everyone more through luck than skill. But that all just ends up playing into the hands of the bad guy so it wan't a good ending really.

 

See? Muddy, vague, and difficult to relate to. It ruins the punch of the stories.

 

Don't get me wrong, I like the Second Dream, and I approve of the reveal, but DE need to give some hard answers to what each of those stories now mean, explicitly.

 

Oh and Warframes being alive? Sure, Warframes being sentient and capable of independent action? Highly unlikely IMHO And don't quote the RPC because you an I both know that was pre-Warframes existing and a scientist does _not_ talk about "eviscerating brothers" unless the thing is an animal not a golem-suit. And you don't make speculative Warframes before you've even noticed that the pilots can pilot them. I think that the RPC "beast" is the cow to the Warframe's leather jacket, ultimately raw materials.

 

Also remember that the RPC has a Tenno remote controlling the Beast without transference tech, nixing the notion that the Warframe must be acting on it's own at the end of the Second Dream.

 

Ah, right, I see what you mean.  Actually, while doing the quest I was thinking "Hmm, isn't this really a one-shot deal?".  In effect, only us players who have been playing Warframe for a while are going to "get" this in its full glory as a trippy thing. 

 

From now on (unless, per impossibile, we players manage to pull an Eleusinian Mysteries, and live our whole lives without spoiling the game for anyone :) ) the game is going to be known as "the game where you're a childlike superbeing doing an Avatar thing" (or the anime equivalent, I gather something like this is a popular anime trope, but I don't know anything about anime), so for any new player going in, those stories aren't going to have much punch, as you say.

 

Agreed fully re. the RPC and the question of life v. sentience.  They're alive, they bleed, need oxygen, they have some kind of organic or Infested tech component; but whether they have even a rudimentary sentience isn't clear at all, and in fact as you say the RPC itself (main source of the "it's alive!" theory) actually supports "limited remote control" in the War-destroying scenario.

[SpaceBucket]

crippled kid in the back forced upon me.    -tick

let down  -tick

An npc stands between me and the warframes.   -tick

Lost the direct connection to the warframes and now i must act via proxy.  -tick

Parts of me are sad to see yet another game i liked turn into yet another bland humans good others bad trope.   -tick

Parts of me feel apathy towards the entire coop part of warframe because i know other players will break my immersion in the game the instance they press 5.  -tick-tick

The whole focus lens clusterfuck will only lead to people trying to get all the kills and then the downward spiral into KS will start greater than before in warframe.  -tick

 

:[ -tick

Are you a clock now?

[StabbyTentacles]

Are you a clock now?

We do all see what you are now, my sad little saltboy. 

[Rennagade]

I personally liked the Tenno's introduction into the game.

 

  Imagine walking into a room and seeing a pod open up only to reveal a small body.  You were told that in this pod was the secret of your power- could that be it, a child?

 Then it begins to slide from the pod.  And then you feel it.  That feeling of falling while you're asleep.  You wake up.

Was it all a dream?  In front of you is one of several bodies that you had believed was yours for several centuries.  It stares at you, and shortly after collapses to its knees, the faint glow of energy fading from its form.  If it was a dream then how was it there?

You crawl to it, feeling defenseless.  You want that power back, you need the frame.  Once in direct contact you gain feeling in the warframe's body again.  From the frame's headset you hear a familiar voice, one from the long dream telling you to run and to harness a power long forgotten to drive away your foes.

The place you run through seems all too familiar, but you can't stop to remember it all.  You remember someone trying to help you, but failed.  You remember the people who feared you.  Your people.  

The ship of your dreams arrives and takes you away from that place.  You feel sick.  The voice tells you to get to the back of the orbiter, that there you will be safe.

The menace of your dreams awaits your arrival, wishing to drive you away from safety and back into the darkness.  You are not enough, but your frame, your armor, and your sword does not give up.  It breaks the menace's power and drives back the darkness before falling dormant.  

You are awoken by the voice of your dreams as you are placed on your throne...

 

That's my interpretation of the end of the second dream(in semi-broken english)

Edited December 8, 2015 by Rennagade

[StabbyTentacles]

English is fine. Good post.

[Exodess]

While it does seem more than likely to be the Operator, there is another theory...

 

It seems possible that the Warframes and Tenno, once their connection is severed, can potentially become a split consciousness independent of each other. However, it is very likely the Warframes do not possess the faculties for proper memory and human consciousness, but something from their time merged with the Tenno may yet linger in their primitive variation of a brain. Once the Tenno reconnects with the Warframe, they share experiences and become a gestalt consciousness again.

 

I imagine this scenario happens every time a Warframe is placed in storage and another is chosen, and since the Warframes are fueled by Void Energy (by default, assuming the Zanuka and Hyena proxies use an alternate power source) it seems that this is the first (or at least the first time documented) that a Warframe has acted independently of the Tenno. I believe this happened because the Warframe was within proximity of the Tenno and may have siphoned just enough Void energy from the beleaguered Tenno for one lone act of defiance against Hunhow. 

 

If anyone has played SOMA, that entire game is built on the controversy of divergent consciousness and it could easily explain what happens here.

Edited December 8, 2015 by Exodess

[LunarTemplar]

So all the guys pushing for this, liked it, hmmmm that's nice.

 

Never said it was perfect just that it seems to have been successful, if you really can't stand the direction the game is going though.

 

Leave,

 

No one is holding you here, if you hate the game now then just go play something else. They aren't removing the Operator. The Focus system (while needing to be streamlined a lot) isn't going anywhere ether. So get used to it, or, well, you know how to uninstall the game and avoid a web site I trust.

[SmallRuth]

I personally loved the reveal! I found it really dark and sad and twisted, but just the tiniest bit hopeful as well. The cinematics were great and the dialog was well done.

 

Additionally, I think the update also made it clear that the Warframes themselves have a bit of maybe primitive/animal like autonomy, as hinted at in the Rhino Prime codex entry and the breaking of War, so I don't see how someone can't just push that a bit further and "headcanon" that the Warframes have their own personalities etc if that's what the major upset is.

 

Considering we knew pretty much nothing about what the Tenno/Warframes were before this, I don't see the point in getting upset about what you thought or speculated being wrong. How could you know either way?

[StabbyTentacles]

We went from this... 

To this...

Some liked it, Some don't.

 

"Considering we knew pretty much nothing about what the Tenno/Warframes were before this, I don't see the point in getting upset about what you thought or speculated being wrong. How could you know either way?"

 

If you’d been playing this game since launch you’d know how inaccurate and mistaken preaching that update 18’s reveal was/is the way it is/the way it has always been. Even if you’d started playing @ update 14… Look you can say lol get over it, that’s your right; but you can’t explain resistance to tenno suddenly being made into teen spacewizards from the moon as headcanon. Nor can/should you tell be telling people how to feel about this.

Edited December 8, 2015 by StabbyTentacles