With Ivara Around, Is Loki Still "masterrace" ?

[Enno69]

What is your opinion on that ? Just give a statement about who you think would win the competition, overall, when taking every role, stat and skill into account.

Is Loki still worthy of the adoration he is receiving, or has he been, or is about to be, kicked off his throne ?

And please Loki lovers, don't rage immediately :-P

[izzatuw]

Her Invis arrow with a similar build to perma Loki lasts the same amount of duration for 6 energy and she can potentially bring the literal term of perma invis since they can be spammed so yes, with a coordinated team you can make your friends stay invis for the entirety of the match if she wanted to.

[TheBrightKing]

no guys no, loki master race no, ivara master race no, its VOLT PRIME MASTER RACE

 

1 attack stuns and deal a lot of damage, more if there are a lot of enemies

2 attack increases your movement AND MELEE attack speed

3 attack is a shield that increases a lot your damage and protects you from enemy bullets FROM BOTH SIDES, so it doesnt bother like frosts shield do

4 attack stun and deals a lot of damage to surounding enemies

 

you can use volt to attack, to defend, to speed run, to stun an enemy, to scape...

 

volt is for everything, and the best is the large amount of energy so VOLT MASTER RACE *@##$ES

[ScorpDK]

Loki is the frame for when you need to go fast - Ivara is about tactics.

I love both, but Ivara quickly grew on me with her repertoire of abilities that can greatly benefit not only herself, but her allies.

 

Just her arrows alone give you quite a few ways to deal with pesky enemies - such as the Wiredash literally making you untouchable by melee units, and the cloak arrow working on almost anything AND sticking to objects/allies. Just like Loki before, what they can't see, they can't attack.

 

Navigator puts you in control of ANY projectile you can fire off, be it weapon or ability, which allows for some crazy trickshots and firing a Paris Prime / Dread shot at full strength makes you able to kill 8-10 enemies with a single shot, tho the scaling energy cost is a bit of an issue.

 

Prowl requires some skillful rolling / air-rolling to keep you going at decent speed so you don't need to turn it off, but it's a fair tradeoff for the ability to stay out of sight near-endlessly, plus the increase in melee/headshot damage potential.

 

Her ultimate is the only thing I do not really waste energy on. It's a cool addition, but my weapon generally does better than the bow does even at 150% power Strength.

[Henji]

Well, if you mean in terms of invisibility, I can't realy say but I would still put my bet on him since he is way more reliable in terms of subterfurge...

Now you want a warframe that throne over evry other frame ? He is far from it...

Excalibur live to its description when it comes in terms of versatility, all his stats and abilities now are extremely relevant for any situation even in stealth (you just need the right gear.) 

 

[AsuraKyu]

Dashwire costs energy, is restricted movement, and isn't as quick as loki or bullet jumping around.

 

It's not fair to say "well if you don't take full advantage of this person's mods, then this OTHER person WITH taking full advantage of mods is better. :D". It's like taking two people and telling them to fight in a ring where the floor is hot coals, then giving you insulated shoes and the other bare feet.

 

That being said- they both have their advantages. Ivara is tactical and more of a team player overall, and very versatile. Loki is highly mobile and more of a loner- and a one trick pony. Thing is- he does that one trick very, VERY well.

Thing is- Hard CC > Soft CC. Sleep arrow > Radial Disarm in every way as long as you have the range and efficiency to spam it as much as loki can spam his RD.

I'm guessing you missed the part where Ivara doesn't have Augments which is the only reason I've restricted Loki to the same leveled playing field.

On topic of Prowl vs Invisibility even as an added bonus you're given more reward for prioritizing high risk targets by way of prowls head shot multiplier. not to mention her abnormally high energy pool being a non-prime gives you loads of room to work with.

 

Prowl being 0.34 energy per sec gives you an effective 3 seconds of stealth per 1 energy 3 x 700 = 2100/60 = 35 minutes of stealth. This all while pick pocketing and given damage bonus works out rather nicely.

 

If you're not using Prowl, Cloak arrow provides you the same temporary effectiveness along with synergy of this and her Ult being able to alt fire for instantaneous 1's is something to consider as well

[TangyBlueBerry]

Loki is easier hands down. using Loki takes little skill, press 2 all the time, press 4 when things get hairy for your teammates. I know he's good, I use him for stealth missions as well. My clan warlord uses him all the time. But we can all agree, Loki is an easy frame to use and master, modding him is not hard since he has no need for power strength.

 

Ivara on the other hand has more use and is much harder to play, but can be just as rewarding. At only 7 energy per shot she can, draw enemy attention, pop a team invis bubble that can last 33 seconds in a nearly 6 meter radius. Put enemies in a 15 meter radius to sleep, and a be batman.

 

She can remain invis for over 10 minutes with full channeling efficiency with max energy using primed flow. 

 

She is very effective but much harder to play, her only downside is lower mobility during the use of her prowl. 

 

So Loki is still mater race because master race is secretly noob friendly race. 

[-Ropefish-]

her ult can kill level 100 enemies with the right build, and do it with stealth.

 

so... 

[Etan-gK]

Loki is not now, nor has he ever been the "master race". if he was, nobody would play any other frame.

[Helch0rn]

Saryn is master race because she debuffs the whole map to make it easier for the rest of the team to kill the enemys

[Moghul]

Different strokes for different folks.

 

Loki is the winner in my eyes.

[TangyBlueBerry]

Saryn is master race because she debuffs the whole map to make it easier for the rest of the team to kill the enemys

 

You spelled Nova wrong

 

/s

 

Edit: also enemies* 

[Volinus7]

Stealth Tank VS Stealth Helicopter

[Etan-gK]

You spelled Nova wrong

 

/s

 

Edit: also enemies* 

you spelled banshee wrong

[Cidolfus]

i don't think he ever was a master race, but in the past he became very popular.  However, i doubt that Ivara would supersede Loki, and for one reason alone.  To say what it is would be stating the obvious.

 

Loki became popular because, due to his stats, he was the "tryhard" warframe. He had low hp, low shields, low everything, and could only survive if he stayed invisible almost 100% of the time.

 

He's still like that today, however now people have learned that his low stats mean nothing. His "Tryhard" beginnings have been replaced with "Skip ALL the content" mentality. I don't care who you are - he's not a fun warframe to play. His number 1 thing is speedrunning through entire areas.

 

People calling him the "master race" are saying this because of both of these mentalities. People thought he was the "hard mode" warframe, and now he's become the easiest warframe to "play" the game with. I put "play" in quotation marks because he actually excels in NOT playing the game.

 

 

Ivara however, is a LOT more fun to play as. Her type of stealth actually has balance to it, and her kit is far more versatile and robust. Out of all the warframes in the game- including Ash and Loki- Ivara feels the most "ninja".

 

Long story short: I'll pick Loki if I want to skip content. But I'll pick Ivara if I want to actually enjoy the game.

[TheBrightKing]

Loki became popular because, due to his stats, he was the "tryhard" warframe. He had low hp, low shields, low everything, and could only survive if he stayed invisible almost 100% of the time.

 

He's still like that today, however now people have learned that his low stats mean nothing. His "Tryhard" beginnings have been replaced with "Skip ALL the content" mentality. I don't care who you are - he's not a fun warframe to play. His number 1 thing is speedrunning through entire areas.

 

People calling him the "master race" are saying this because of both of these mentalities. People thought he was the "hard mode" warframe, and now he's become the easiest warframe to "play" the game with. I put "play" in quotation marks because he actually excels in NOT playing the game.

 

 

Ivara however, is a LOT more fun to play as. Her type of stealth actually has balance to it, and her kit is far more versatile and robust. Out of all the warframes in the game- including Ash and Loki- Ivara feels the most "ninja".

 

Long story short: I'll pick Loki if I want to skip content. But I'll pick Ivara if I want to actually enjoy the game.

its almost true thats why i use volt now, because its the funniest warframe to me... loki was like: invisible and its done

Edited December 15, 2015 by mstriker

[3tomatoes]

Saryn is master race because she debuffs the whole map to make it easier for the rest of the team to kill the enemys

Welcome to Warframe, new-friend!

 

you spelled banshee wrong

Have fun hitting those sonar spots located under your enemy's arm, or foot. Nova is far better for damage buffing, as is Mirage.

[fatpig84]

its almost true thats why i use volt now, because its the funniest warframe to me... loki was like: invisible and its done

 

I dunno man, but the 50 meter range disarm Lokis I see in raids can't stay invisible for long.

They spend more time in the open with far less tankage than anyone but still pull their weight.

These people get all the praise they deserve.

 

Loki gets a lot of flak for pressing 2 to win, but nobody gives a disarm Loki user any credit.

Edited December 15, 2015 by fatpig84

[ashrah]

loki is really super fun frame but wen u playing it  over 2k h its become little boring i really like ivara

[3lackrose]

Ivara is good, but i think Loki is still "masterrace" as you define him (permastealth without movement limitations, radial disarm, distraction, mobility) and has a simpler and "faster" skillset when learned how to use.

 

Ivara can possibly do some of that work (yet not as effective as Loki imo) by combining the usage of her arrows, but cycling and usage are binded to her 1st skill which makes the attempt to use multiple type of arrows fairly clunky (at least for me), Loki doesn't have that problem, you always know what to press when you need it.

 

I've heard her navigator drains a lot of energy.

 

Her Prowl is limited to silent weapons, and trying to melee will drain energy faster.

 

Her Artemis Bow is pure damage in a volley spread, but an intensive usage can lead to energy problems. Now keep in mind you also may need to use her other skills, and will find that using all her skillset is quite energy demanding.

[Cidolfus]

Her Artemis Bow is pure damage in a volley spread, but an intensive usage can lead to energy problems. Now keep in mind you also may need to use her other skills, and will find that using all her skillset is quite energy demanding.

 

Which is why her energy pool is gigantic.

[--Sensei--]

Prowl is perma invis yes but with downsides, can't sprint and any non silent weapon will uncloak your prowl, it's ok for a stealth play WF, also many people who will be building for prowl or artemis bow won't have a large range ie small sleep arrows will prob have a range of 2m at that point.

 

Loki is still good in that you can sprint and crouch jump/slide in invis since apparently these things break prowl invis too. Can also use non silent weapons. His irraditating disarm augment is a better version of nyx's chaos but with disarmed enemies on top of it, it's better CC and on top of that you don't need to build for power str on loki like you do on ivara so it's easier to mod on loki to the best of all his abilities. Loki also has the highest sprint speed.

 

TLDR

Both have their pros and cons, ivara can perma invis only with silent weapons and by moving very slowly or rolling.

Loki can cc the whole map freely and use w/e weapons he want and has a nice duration of invis, 

 

Their roles are fitted for different situation despite sharing maybe one similar ability, for example for survivals or spy I'd use loki.

 

For focus point farming in exterminations I go Ivara.

 

They're not the same frame type so trying to argue or compare if one is better than the other is stupid since both of them do different things and have different roles.

 

Hell both their invis works differently, one has limits (Ivara) the other does not (Loki) it's essentially a perma invis with limits vs a 30+ sec invis with no limits (Loki) I think it's far.

 

Hell invis isn't even what made loki master race, because Ash has invis too, it was Loki's 4 with augment, instantly make all enemies your ally within 50m+ range, and disarmed as icing on the cake. That is just.................. delicious.

 

Only common thing about them is they're both fun, and I can see using them both as their roles are fit for different situations.

Edited December 15, 2015 by --Sensei--

[ThorienKELL]

Quote:

Long story short: I'll pick Loki if I want to skip content. But I'll pick Ivara if I want to actually enjoy the game.

Are you aware that this game is 90% mindless grind? Hence ... 

 

I would say that question is stupid in first place (OP) but if you must know - loki is still master race.

 

And that doesn't mean that ivara isn't powerful, fun and well designed frame. 

[h8seekr]

Speed is life.

 

Loki is speed.

[S0ulre4per]

Loki is not a master race anymore.

 

 

Shots fired. Get rekt

Edited December 15, 2015 by S0ulre4per

[spacedkadet]

 

 

Their roles are fitted for different situation despite sharing maybe one similar ability, for example for survivals or spy I'd use loki.

 

For focus point farming in exterminations I go Ivara.

 

 

 

I find the other way around to be much better. I used ivara to farm my daily focus cap and found it to be easy but very slow, Loki with exterminate rush and a tonkor is VERY fast, but the 100% invis with ivara was much better for spy missions so my cloak doesn't run out mid hack.

 

I put 3 forma (no Draco involved) in Ivara and an exilus slot but I'm still not really seeing the point in her - I wanted to love her and at first I did but the novelty wore off when I realised that what she does she doesn't really do that well.

 

invis is too slow movement and breaks to easy - when catching a ledge for example,

stealth arrow? useless, no teammate is gonna wanna stand in your bubble.

sound arrow: just shoot them already.

Zipline arrow? who on earth needs ziplines when bullet jumping is a thing?

Ability to control a projectile? Why not just aim before firing?

Her ult is meh, my weapons out damage it so not a lot of point unfortunately. 

 

I do like her in spy as that perma invis once in the data vaults is very nice :) other than that (and her awesome styling - she looks amazing) she has little use :(

 

 

tldr/  loki master race - undefeated

Edited December 15, 2015 by spacedkadet