Is The Grind In Warframe Killing The Game?

[traybong111]

Grind is Warframe's oxygen. It's carcinogenic, sure, but we all know Warframe will never survive without it. 

 

I rotate between Disgaea, Pokemon, and Warframe on a regular basis to worship RNG and his grinding glory in all platforms. 

 

Grind is good for you. Breathe in...

[Chaosdreamer]

DE is just doing bad 

 

Wu Kong (some monkey which is terrible for me) : Behind wall time and rng  -> Labs + Nitain alert

 

Ivara : look like just some enhanced version (or maybe failed) of Loki  -> Spy mission RNG reward + Nitain alert

 

Ne Zha : Well Do I really need to say it? Sortie only , one chance each days can beat that once you got Ne Zha you will get plenty of her as trash

 

Everything is done so you buys them in market instead of grinding ,so people , I've just an advice to all of you Tenno , If you want to support that 

 

kind of release any time soon , just don't buy and farm ,if you buys ,you're just saying that good way to sell and we will get more of these bad 

 

release .

 

Even if 2015 is nearly ending soon , just remember 2015 YoA (Year of quality) , Well actually the more they try , the more is worst...Hope you guys try hard for a real year of quality

[HyokaChan]

Here's the problem: We say "this grind sucks", and they say "Okay, we want to make content, but we don't want you guys having it instantly (unless plat but that's irrelevant right now)"

 

So their method of "reducing grind" was instead of literally raising a droprate, they would go and make new varying ways you grind to obtain the content. This is done in hopes of achieving "reduced burnout".

 

However, grind is still grind. You're still repetitively doing missions at the end of the day, just at varying difficulties still made trivial depending on how geared/prepared you are. 

 

I've found that nearly each new warframe has been coming from some cycle of the following steps:

 

1. Release new warframe with new method to get

2. Community: "Nonono this is a horrible method of obtainment please change it."

3. DE: "Okay, we're not changing that but here's a new warframe with a different method."

4. Community: "This is equally if not more grindy than the last one please change it."

5. Go back to step 3.

 

Booben's alert-only parts... 

...evolved into Limbo's horribly high-leveled quest using new content... (Archwing was new at the time and the high level archwing intercept was really bad since you had to wait to go grab yourself all the gear you need to do it)

...evolved into Mesa's invasion-only keys...

...evolved into Chroma's multiple warframe part component (re-used for Equinox, though the entire warframe takes 6 of it's own part components instead of other warframes)

...evolved into Wukong's alert-only resource wall... Hold on, did we just go back to Booben's problem?

Then, finally, it evolved into Nezha's sortie only part reward.

 

I skipped Atlas and Ivara because running single missions for parts isn't new at all. Ivara is like running the void, except all missions are spy. Atlas is just a longer assassination since pherliac pods aren't really a problem.

 

But yeah, each subsequent warframe is generally just as (if not more) grindy than the last, done in different ways and still burning out the community. All because DE doesn't wanna give in and raise the droprate.

[Robm]

Its a Free to Play game, if you want something, you have to grind for it. They gotta make money somehow. 

[Judgebanks]

I'd be okay with grind if I could actually make progress towards the goals I'm grinding for.

 

That would involve removing rng, and Sheldon would never let that happen.

[shoryukensama]

what mmo doesnt have grind? 

[Kaisty]

what mmo doesnt have grind? 

Like others have said, it is not the grind itself that is the major problem but the amount along with other issues. Unlike other games that either have it where you just grind to get enough of an item to trade for what you want (Tokens for gear) or a flat rate of chance to get something (5% chance of an item dropping if farmed), Warfrane has grinding for a chance to get a void key, which in turn has chance to be either the key you need, which then leads to a mission where you have a chance to get the item you seek if the rotations match up just right (another chance).

 

On the low end of the setup (bosses and basic missions) it is RNG with grinding. When dealing with higher tier stuff (Void missions) it is RNG (farming for the key you need) on RNG(hoping it is the right rotation) on RNG(hoping you get the part you need the first time) on RNG(if the first rotation fails, then maybe the second one?).

 

Had Warframe just been nothing but a straight grind with little to no RNG, more people would complain about running out of items instead of the amount of grinding they have to get them.

[JOJ650s]

I think you're right. It's not so much the grind but the REAL problem is RNG. I wouldn't mind grinding if I knew what I was working towards. The uncertainty coupled with the let down that RNG so often dishes out is unbearable.

 

What if it was a token system instead? Void gives tokens to purchase the part you want?

 

Not that exactly, but that concept. That is an acceptable grind.

 

I like this idea, I strongly dislike the RNG as I don't feel like I have made any progress after several attempts to get the item I desire.

Edited December 18, 2015 by JOJ650s

[Vercinaigh]

I love warframe and DE. But the grind in Warframe is becoming a little much. For me personally I am accustomed to a little bit of grind, but everyone who I have recommended this game to has left because of the grind and almost unobtainable objects.

DE once said they would reduce the grind, but with the release of NE Zha, I don't see that happening. Equinox and Ivara are both warframes I grinded hours for. People get turned off by that. The new single handed stance mod is practically a myth!

 

Focus is a giant grind that many wouldn't even care to try. 

What do you guys think? Is the grind becoming too much to the point of running players away? Or is the grind fine where it is?

Yep pretty well Nhe Zha made me quit again, guess another year of inactivity for me, I've voiced my opinion already but it did little good back then the last time, i suspect it will do nothing this time, too. That's okay, I have not spent a dime for years over it, prior I spent way too much, lost one whale, and possibly a player.

Edited December 18, 2015 by Vercinaigh

[Cosmic_Elf]

The best thing is to play a bit of each everyday, and not set goals , it would drive one insane. Though getting Nezha i went the plat route, because i like Nezha's design and appearance like my Nova Prime, but the irony is I have been collecting his parts. Though I am struggling a bit with getting the warframe with the spy missions, but I made it that I do one  to two or even three specific spy a day, randomising with alerts, the daily sortie , some voids, alerts and resource farming, random nightmares, random invasions(not all , because focusing on invasions in one go gets boring), random syndicates and the odd occasion of a solo boss battle, or a team , which would help those who ash to unlock planets and farming box specific warframe parts, or do Cephlon Samaris scans or a survival with Clem, random voids, and derelicts, or dual it up in the conclave. 

The best thing is to variate missions instead of focusing on one thing all the time.

[ROXXXY]

My gf and I were just discussing that and we both agreed that it's becoming to much. We cant count how many spy missions we've farmed and only have two parts since the release. Same for the frost prime chassis, just endless farming. Now we can only try once a day for nezha or trade who knows what for it.

I wouldn't be surprised if the sortie system is there to prepare us for the new star chart. From what I remember, they made it sound something like the mission system in Skyforge.

Skyforge is horrible. Getting a new class takes years.

[(PSN)Ana_Nuann]

Not only is it killing the game, its dictating entirely how the game is played.

Rushframe. Someone spams 4 as the group runs to exit.

Not fun. Not fun at all. It minimalized the vast arsenal of weapons available to the point where you could feasibly run with none.

I hate rushframe. I do not play the spam 4 and everything dies immediately frames, and I should never need to.

But as long as the game rewards mindless play, those are the sort of people who 9 out of 10 times you get paired up with.

Playing any other way is detrimental. The game is literally built in a way where to have fun by doing something different just can't be done consistently.

It has trained those who can be into people who play to grind, rather than to have fun with what is at its base, a badass game.

I can get no one to stay with this game. Everyone is always immediately impressed and excited to continue playing as a first impression.

But then too soon after the grind appears, moreso in the community attitude than from the game itself.

And it kills that initial joy and excitement as they see the game for what it has become.

You guys are truly kidding when you talk about things like stealth 2.0.

None of you actually give a crap about stealth. You just want a multiplier.

[(PSN)Draconis1981]

look at this https://youtu.be/tWtvrPTbQ_c

[TheBrsrkr]

The grind has been "killing the game" for 2 years now. I'm not saying we can't do with a little less (Nitain being a weird choice) but most of the calls to increased grind can be attributed to gimme gimme mentality.

You mostly hear about the new frames when someone says the grind has increased, but most of them really aren't that bad. Limbo had AW parts you can do once and get all you need, an you just needed to wait for the other part to finish before you build the next. That's not grind, it's waiting. A background task. Same with Mirage. Besides for the weird drop rates of Saryn Systems, Chroma was pretty much okay in terms of the grind, and was really more about the quest than the frame. Equinox is a bit grind heavy, but that's because it's basically 2 frames in one. Nitain is a step back in my opinion, but the alerts seem to come along very often. Ivara seems grindy because you can't ROFLstomp Spy missions. Wukong is clan tech. 99.100% of the non clan tech weapons are instantly available to most players, and even the clan tech ones aren't that bad (if you have an active clan). Sorties are not endgame, and not meant to be. Putting Nezha (hope I spelled that right) there is perfectly acceptable, especially since all the parts are tradeable. Just because I don't like them doesn't mean they're not a valid way of distributing content.

[Hawk197]

The grind isnt killing the game, RNG is. I personally despise grind, but I know that its needed for many games, what I despise more is RNG. When I grind on games, be it free to play, pay to play, freemium or whatever, I want my grind to be worthwhile. While there are many, MANY problems, Ill use an obvious one for an example, Nezha. He is locked behind a HUGE RNG wall called Sorties, which only gives you one chance per day, and then theres so many junk rewards clogging the pool that the chance of getting a single part that day is low, which would mean doing a Sortie for a normal Lens would be unrewarding to many people considering a Greater version costs 40p. Instead of getting a Dera Vandal part or Nezha part, I might get 25 cores or something that has no worth.

 

Another example would be Vengeful Revenant. The Sentients are hard to kill, which is good, but when theres a 99% chance for it to drop junk like a Neurode, it becomes discouraging to many players to visit the Moon tileset because theres little to no reason to continue those quests once youve gotten all the Moon Vault mods.

 

I simply dont have a reason to continue fighting the same enemy, continue farming Focus, continue farming Sorties, continue farming *Insert something to farm* because I know the chance of my effort being wasted is too great.

[HoakinBlackforge]

The only way to reduce grind is to remove many things dependant on rng.

[(PSN)Draconis1981]

Yes it is.

 

 

I don't even need to think about it.

 

It's too damn much. DE outright lied to us and it's killing my enthusiasm to play.

another waaaaaaaaaaa im going to quit unless DE makes it easier for me post folks

[GnosticCat]

The only way to reduce grind is to remove many things dependant on rng.

So how do you replace grind so that players don't blast through game? Consider that this game doesn't have same sword+1, same sword +2 that other games use to pad out content.

Do you really want to so that you have to farm for skana with +5% damage to replace your skana with only +2% damage bonus?

[-Blaze-]

An improvement would already be when they remove duplicates in one mission.

So when you stay longer your chance to get the item you want increases! Would also give a reason not to stop the mission at the first C drop.

[Hypernaut1]

An improvement would already be when they remove duplicates in one mission.

So when you stay longer your chance to get the item you want increases! Would also give a reason not to stop the mission at the first C drop.

But also practically force players to to play 40-60 minutes at a time.

Whatever the highest drop rate is will become the "real" drop rate and people will rage that DE makes them play missions for 1 hr.

Truth is many of you have no idea what you're talking about. The fact that some of you are in here raging like babies is PROOF that DE has you by the balls and you love the grind.

Edited December 18, 2015 by Hypernaut1

[-Blaze-]

But also practically force players to to play 40-60 minutes at a time.

How so? Its still the same as it is now when you go till C Drop.

Only difference is, when you had a Loki Helmet drop in the Rotation before it won't appear in the next Rotation when you keep playing.

And when you don't want to play longer you can go and start a new mission just like you do it now.

But i prefer to play a single 1 hour mission with increased chances on the 'correct' drop then muliple 30min missions for lesser chances.

Edited December 18, 2015 by -Blaze-

[Hypernaut1]

How so? Its still the same as it is now when you go till C Drop.

Only difference is, when you had a Loki Helmet drop in the Rotation before it won't appear in the next Rotation when you keep playing.

And when you don't want to play longer you can go and start a new mission just like you do it now.

But i prefer to play a single 1 hour mission then muliple 30min missions for lesser chances.

is an item has a 5% chance at 20, then a 7% chance at 40, then a 9% chance at 60- players will consider 9% to be the "real" drop rate and complain that they NEED to play 60 min to get an item. If they go 60 and dont get it, even more raging at DE for making them grind for nothing. If its guaranteed to drop at 60, then players rage that it takes 4hrs of mandatory grind to get a new prime.

Its a horrible idea

[-Blaze-]

is an item has a 5% chance at 20, then a 7% chance at 40, then a 9% chance at 60- players will consider 9% to be the "real" drop rate and complain that they NEED to play 60 min to get an item. If they go 60 and dont get it, even more raging at DE for making them grind for nothing. If its guaranteed to drop at 60, then players rage that it takes 4hrs of mandatory grind to get a new prime.

Its a horrible idea

 

Not worse than paying 15 voidkeys back to back and only gathering Loki helmets (true story). Its horrible

[Zemosu]

Not worse than paying 15 voidkeys back to back and only gathering Loki helmets (true story). Its horrible

sell them and buy what you need, either for low ammount of platinum or for ducats and buy items from trader that you can then sell for platinum and buy what you need.

[ThorienKELL]

Grind does not kill warframe. Warframe IS grind. 

"almost unobtainable objects"? I have everything you can have in this game and I'm playing 2 or 3 months.