Buff Everything

[sLashx189]

so people have been asking for high ttk for a while now, i completly disagreed at the start but now i understand, THE GAME IS FAST PACED, the reason why games like halo have such a slow ttk is because the game doesnt involve people bulletjumping off walls while doing a back flip shooting an arrow at your face, the ttk need to be at standards with cod so i say buff everything. pls no h8 m8s just stating my opinion :/, i would like to kill someone before they shoot a daikyu at my face xD.

[AzazelSama]

This is not Quake,and even tho,i disagree with that.

 

At some point it gets pointless,i mean if its too fast,you won`t understand nothing and you will have less fun.

Even tho,i dont encourage slow paced games,i think the way it is right now,its quite good.

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

so people have been asking for high ttk for a while now, i completly disagreed at the start but now i understand, THE GAME IS FAST PACED, the reason why games like halo have such a slow ttk is because the game doesnt involve people bulletjumping off walls while doing a back flip shooting an arrow at your face, the ttk need to be at standards with cod so i say buff everything. pls no h8 m8s just stating my opinion :/, i would like to kill someone before they shoot a daikyu at my face xD.

Good people are finally catching on. You get my vote

[Phasedragon]

It's not the problem of how fast the weapons kill - that part I think is just about right. The problem lies in how quickly health can be recovered and how easy it is to escape a fight. You can pretty much continually restart a fight until you get the upper hand. It's pretty much the cancer of pvp meta right now.

 

For one, there are TWO shield mods that can be applied at the same time with NO downside. Plus, health is just so readily available everywhere that you can go from being nearly dead, in the middle of a fight, to completely full health just by running away for 20 seconds.

[Lord_Noctus]

I never thought i would wish back the old conclave so badly. the devs seem to listen to unexperienced players and this is why they fail balancing. 

 

Ill be honest. lowering the ttk = solution for most problems of pvp

Edited January 5, 2016 by Lord_Noctus

[sLashx189]

It's not the problem of how fast the weapons kill - that part I think is just about right. The problem lies in how quickly health can be recovered and how easy it is to escape a fight. You can pretty much continually restart a fight until you get the upper hand. It's pretty much the cancer of pvp meta right now.

 

For one, there are TWO shield mods that can be applied at the same time with NO downside. Plus, health is just so readily available everywhere that you can go from being nearly dead, in the middle of a fight, to completely full health just by running away for 20 seconds.

i was gonna make a post abut a new modding system just for conclave, it would be like a skill tree just like the old days of warframe and u would get mod points when u lev ur frame in conclave, yes u have to lev ur frame in conclave to gt these seperatly, and mods would be bought from teshin to install them, forma would add polarities and catalyst work the same, or just remove all defensive mods and health stations from conclave and just let health regen at a faster rate

[sLashx189]

This is not Quake,and even tho,i disagree with that.

 

At some point it gets pointless,i mean if its too fast,you won`t understand nothing and you will have less fun.

Even tho,i dont encourage slow paced games,i think the way it is right now,its quite good.

ok a person with a mk1 braton and a person with a daikyu standing still start fighting, who would win, see this is the problem, THEY WONT STAND STILL, the guy with a braton would loose regardless because iff that guy lands a shot while using the daikyu mod, the other guys is ded, unless it got up to the standards where the other guy fears the guy with the mk1 braton too

[Lord_Noctus]

ok a person with a mk1 braton and a person with a daikyu standing still start fighting, who would win, see this is the problem, THEY WONT STAND STILL, the guy with a braton would loose regardless because iff that guy lands a shot while using the daikyu mod, the other guys is ded, unless it got up to the standards where the other guy fears the guy with the mk1 braton too

u must have had an enlightment. most people dont understand this even nowadays. but u should take for example a opticore "hit and run very fun" right ? but alongside with the buff of those other weapons we rly need then vectis to be back in its shape again alongside with grinlok buff.

Edited January 5, 2016 by Lord_Noctus

[sLashx189]

u must have had an enlightment. most people dont understand this even nowadays. but u should take for example a opticore "hit and run very fun" right ? but alongside with the buff of those other weapons we rly need then vectis to be back in its shape again alongside with grinlok buff.

We need to make all heavya 1 hit but let them have special ammo that drops rarely and only comes with about 3 rounds, but since everything is so fast I don't think this is possible.

I never thought i would wish back the old conclave so badly. the devs seem to listen to unexperienced players and this is why they fail balancing. 

 

Ill be honest. lowering the ttk = solution for most problems of pvp

All we need a little more balance and perfect pvp

[Cyandana]

TTK is fine. Maintaining DPS on a target  for long enough to kill them is the problem. When I dedicate myself entirely to avoiding damage I can survive for a near indefinite amount of time until I either A: Get impatient and try and kill someone. B: get CC'd . 

[sLashx189]

TTK is fine. Maintaining DPS on a target  for long enough to kill them is the problem. When I dedicate myself entirely to avoiding damage I can survive for a near indefinite amount of time until I either A: Get impatient and try and kill someone. B: get CC'd .

U see, if we increase ttk, we can still jump around like crack monkeys but still giving the other guy a chance to kill us.

[-InV-igo95862]

 

Ill be honest. lowering the ttk = solution for most problems of pvp

 

Nope.

 

Every stun or stagger will be overpowered as you will kill in its duration.

 

What next? Remove stuns and abilities?

Edited January 5, 2016 by -CM-igo95862

[Rubbertubtub01]

Nope.

 

Every stun or stagger will be overpowered as you will kill in its duration.

 

What next? Remove stuns and abilities?

 

Removing stuns and abilities would be good... IMO

[Lord_Noctus]

dont make me laugh we can make animations and stun durations shorter

 

my clan is depending on the success of pvp and this seems to be the best solution which will attract most players

Edited January 5, 2016 by Lord_Noctus

[Nighttide77]

If stagger and knockdown recover animations were shorter, there would barely be a point to them.

[Lord_Noctus]

If stagger and knockdown recover animations were shorter, there would barely be a point to them.

how usefull a stagger/knockdown is should depend on how fast ur aim and reactions are and atm a stagger feels actually rly long and gives alot time to aim.

[MechaKnight]

It's not the problem of how fast the weapons kill - that part I think is just about right. The problem lies in how quickly health can be recovered and how easy it is to escape a fight. You can pretty much continually restart a fight until you get the upper hand. It's pretty much the cancer of pvp meta right now.

 

For one, there are TWO shield mods that can be applied at the same time with NO downside. Plus, health is just so readily available everywhere that you can go from being nearly dead, in the middle of a fight, to completely full health just by running away for 20 seconds.

This is truly the problem. Time-to-kill is a fine balance of fun and effectiveness. The issue is our mobility combined with the availability of resources. Players simply avoid battles if they can't sneak up on an opponent to get the upper hand. If the player is losing, they retreat to recover their shields and find some health.

 

This is the reason why mobility is more effective than sturdiness, why players prefer the cold bullet jump mod the most, the reason why players go all-or-nothing with Daikyu versus Latron and similar, and why the jump-slam knockdown meta is a thing.

 

The most effective strategy is surprising your opponent quickly by disabling them to finish them off, or restricting their movement to deal with them better. Players tend to run away to heal and attempt an ambush, so the meta quickly becomes focused around killing your opponent in one hit, disabling them to deliver a payload, or using a dispensable weapon to ensure they never stop getting hit. The best warframes are the ones that can combine mobility and powers to lethal effect, or counter mobile adversaries.

 

As of currently, there's not much of a way to fix our mobility--there will always be ways discovered to effectively free yourself of movement restriction relative to less skill opponents. The real problem is how easy it is to replenish shields and health.

 

Perhaps some balance could be found in making health pickups less effective, or increasing the period of time between respawning the health orbs. Maybe shield recovery could be slowed as well.

 

In my opinion I still like PvP enough as it is. There just needs to be a way to counter more evasive players who employ hit-and-run strategies.

 

I disagree about decreasing time-to-kill. That would only worsen the hit-and-run meta versus focused firefights and duels.

Edited January 5, 2016 by MechaKnight

[JeyciKon]

It's not the problem of how fast the weapons kill - that part I think is just about right. The problem lies in how quickly health can be recovered and how easy it is to escape a fight.

^this

 

But we cant just lower the shield restoration, sure it makes it harder to run away but at the end of every fight you will be forced to hide till you get your shields back up, and i think no-one wants that.

[-InV-igo95862]

 

 

my clan is depending on the success of pvp and this seems to be the best solution which will attract most players

 

Attract 1.0 conclave players or attract players that have not played Conclave before?

 

Conclave 1.0 had way too high skill floor, too high entry level. It was basically an enclosed society that rarely interacted with outside. The whole point of conclave rework was to make it more accessible.

Edited January 5, 2016 by -CM-igo95862

[Nighttide77]

how usefull a stagger/knockdown is should depend on how fast ur aim and reactions are and atm a stagger feels actually rly long and gives alot time to aim.

 

I've had plenty of situations where I've escaped death when staggered, and even when knocked down.  I've also had similar situations where I was doing the staggering/knocking down and my target escaped.  Only times I've been pretty much put in a checkmate is when one person staggered me while the other shot me.

[Lord_Noctus]

Attract 1.0 conclave players or attract players that have not played Conclave before?

 

Conclave 1.0 had way too high skill floor, too high entry level. It was basically an enclosed society that rarely interacted with outside. The whole point of conclave rework was to make it more accessible.

 

now we have the elite stomping people 30 - 0 and make people rage quit. on the one hand u have new people getting even stomped more than they got stomped in conclave 1.0 on the other hand u have the more skilled players having akward fights. 

 

this system didnt help the new players ( it even made it worst ) and also pissed of the skilled and older players. 

 

what im asking is good for casuals. lower ttk is good for them and also puts an end to the suffering of the higher skilled players.

Edited January 5, 2016 by Lord_Noctus

[-InV-igo95862]

 on the one hand u have new people getting even stomped more than they got stomped in conclave 1.0 on the other hand u have the more skilled players having akward fights. 

 

Source on that?

 

I can assure you that being killed slowly is way less frustrating then being one shotted.

[ashrah]

stagger is pretty long in pvp especially wen u playing vs veters who knows bane of game...u will be dead before u recover

[Lord_Noctus]

Source on that?

 

I can assure you that being killed slowly is way less frustrating then being one shotted.

oh u mean getting killed slowly over and over and over again ? without the slightest chance for a newer player ? back then when u could one shot u wouldnt have even dreamed of kds we reach nowadays even against new players.

 

and my point stand the extremly high ttk we have dont help new players and pisses of veterans.

Edited January 5, 2016 by Lord_Noctus

[-InV-igo95862]

oh u mean getting killed slowly over and over and over again ? without the slightest chance for a newer player ? back then when u could one shot u wouldnt have even dreamed of kds we reach nowadays even against new players.

 

You would not get that high scores because there were way less new players in general. Plus don't forget there were bleedouts that slow down game a lot. (in terms of kills per second)