Stop Punishing Us For Other People's Bad Connections

[Clowee]

Scenario:

 

Join T3S.  Go 40 minutes.  Carry group.  Get disconnected at 39:50 cause the host sucks and the game lags.  Get nothing for my effort and time.  This happens way too often.

 

Stop punishing the other 3 group members because this game relies on P2P connections and some people inside on playing using two cans connected by a string for a modem.  If you disconnect 75%+ to the next objective, you should be allowed to keep the rewards you have earned up till that point.  Plain and simple.

 

I'm soo tired of putting in effort only to be rewarded with wasting my time.  #1 thing that sucks about this game.

[VampirePirate]

Scenario:

 

Join T3S.  Go 40 minutes.  Carry group.  Get disconnected at 39:50 cause the host sucks and the game lags.  Get nothing for my effort and time.  This happens way too often.

 

If the scenario was that bad, why in the world would you stay for 40 minutes?  You set yourself up for that failure, if you knew that "the host sucks" and "the game lags".  If you could carry the entire team like that, you could have saved yourself trouble by running the mission in solo mode.

Edited January 17, 2016 by VampirePirate

[Clowee]

If the scenario was that bad, why in the world would you stay for 40 minutes?  You set yourself up for that failure, if you knew that "the host sucks" and "the game lags".  If you could carry the entire team like that, you could have saved yourself trouble by running the mission in solo mode.

 

I stayed so as not to be a jerk and abandon the team on a 3/4 vote to stay.  Regardless of whatever reason you can possibly think of, there's no good reason not to give people their just due for being disconnected 10 seconds before the end of the mission. 

 

Quit trying to make up weak reasons to justify why DE should waste our time and focus on the real issue.  I'm sure you would be thrilled if you picked up an ash prime bp only to be disconnected from the mission while voting to extract on wave 20 and get nothing for your effort.

[CS0310]

If the scenario was that bad, why in the world would you stay for 40 minutes?  You set yourself up for that failure, if you knew that "the host sucks" and "the game lags".  If you could carry the entire team like that, you could have saved yourself trouble by running the mission in solo mode.

 

That doesn't make the problem better though.

I often get hosts with terrible connection which, for some reason, results not only in lag but framerate issues as well (vsync not enabled)

 

 

Connectivity issues have to be resolved.

[carnaga]

They have done in Digital Extremes a wonderful job with the P2P network optimization. They implemented the Rad Game Tools netcode into Warframe and it can handle masses of connections without frame drops. If you experience frame drops, it's time to upgrade your computer. The problem is not with the netcode but with the people who run these ancient computers with horrible internet connections and who you occasionally bump in-to.

 

When you go with random people, you never know do their connection or computer suck. You always hope for the best. And mostly you end up with a good host. But when you get a bad host it might be ok for the beginning of an endless mission but when the challenge rises you start to use your warframe abilities more diversely. This means lots of skill spams and effects and you start to notice the difference if it's a bad host (connection and computer performance wise) and usually at this point it's already too late.

 

Of course it's not enough that people run ancient computers and bad ISP with bad modems -- we have these trolls and rage quitters. Yesterday I did a spy mission with random people. At some point the screen started to flicker and then we got a Host Migration. The guy either rage quit, crashed, trolled, lost the connection - who knows. And every time we get host migration you see these weird things happening.

http://i.imgur.com/cLKLFyN.gifv

Edited January 18, 2016 by carnaga

[Clowee]

For P2P it's really good network wise.

 

The problem though starts to manifest on nights where you end up with a few bad hosts in a row.  One night I disconnected from 3 random missions in a row (it's not me as I have great reliable Internet) late into the mission which basically wasted my entire evening of play time.  Disconnecting from the mission at wave 19-20 sucks, but it sucks worse that you get nothing for your time/effort.  I'm not asking for the 20 reward for disconnecting on wave 20 before it's over, but we should at least be able to keep what we've acquired up to that point (wave 15) if we didnt alt F4 or abort the mission.  Otherwise it just becomes a waste of time / effort and more incentive to bail on a group at the slightest hint there may be some lag.

[carnaga]

For P2P it's really good network wise.

 

The problem though starts to manifest on nights where you end up with a few bad hosts in a row.  One night I disconnected from 3 random missions in a row (it's not me as I have great reliable Internet) late into the mission which basically wasted my entire evening of play time.  Disconnecting from the mission at wave 19-20 sucks, but it sucks worse that you get nothing for your time/effort.  I'm not asking for the 20 reward for disconnecting on wave 20 before it's over, but we should at least be able to keep what we've acquired up to that point (wave 15) if we didnt alt F4 or abort the mission.  Otherwise it just becomes a waste of time / effort and more incentive to bail on a group at the slightest hint there may be some lag.

I'm sooo happy when this happens (instead of going wave 20 and losing everything) :

http://i.imgur.com/0pKtwOi.gifv

[Gigaus]

If the scenario was that bad, why in the world would you stay for 40 minutes?  You set yourself up for that failure, if you knew that "the host sucks" and "the game lags".  If you could carry the entire team like that, you could have saved yourself trouble by running the mission in solo mode.

 

Solution to crappy connections in multiplayer co-op focused game: Run it alone and don't play with others. You run a lot of missions solo don't you?

 

Either way, while DE has done a good job at smoothing out P2P connections, there's still some major bugs-- and features-- that need to be worked out. Like Host Migration going nuts for no clear reason, or Host Migration crashing a 40~60 minute run, all because there was a hiccup in the network. Lets be honest here, the major problem is who is set to be the host, and there's times where the system really, really, REALLY messes up in picking who should be host. 

 

I'd also like to make a point of saying, this is why Def/Survival/Intercept rewards being locked in once you got them was good. The old system where if you  got to wave 17 in defense and the game couldn't resolve a network issue, you got all the rewards upto 15 was a good idea. Especially if it bumps the key host too. There's been times where I host T4 Defense, and the game decides it wants to switch Host mid game, can't resolve the transfer for anyone, and no one get's rewards AND I lose the key. As much as I poke fun at the guy above for saying doing stuff solo, right now that's the only real solution, because people don't want to risk going several waves or minutes just to have the server crap out, and no one gets anything. 

 

Until the problem is resolved, put a bandage on the symptom of the problem-- losing rewards due to network problems-- and figure out some way to make connections more stable. And for that matter, we need the Host selection process to be refined. Heavily. 

[lSwRl]

Solution to crappy connections in multiplayer co-op focused game: Run it alone and don't play with others. You run a lot of missions solo don't you?

I wouldn't call being forced to play solo in a co-op game because of other people internet connection problems a solution.

 

A real solution would be for example Dedicated servers

[carnaga]

Today I got trolled by one guy. He invited me to T4I and whined that we should do a long run and stay till wave 10. At wave 7 he disbanded the party. No idea did he DC but I doubt it.

Edited January 22, 2016 by carnaga

[VampirePirate]

I stayed so as not to be a jerk and abandon the team on a 3/4 vote to stay.  Regardless of whatever reason you can possibly think of, there's no good reason not to give people their just due for being disconnected 10 seconds before the end of the mission. 

 

Quit trying to make up weak reasons to justify why DE should waste our time and focus on the real issue.  I'm sure you would be thrilled if you picked up an ash prime bp only to be disconnected from the mission while voting to extract on wave 20 and get nothing for your effort.

No, but you are being a jerk with your comments.  I am not justifying anything.  Of course there are things DE needs to fix.  That's just stating the obvious.  No I would not be thrilled to lose items I worked for during missions that suffered from disconnections.  My point was that if you could solo the mission, why not?  I see no point in bragging on the forums about how you carried an entire team.  If playing solo grants me better results, I will do that.  It's logical.  If I don't need an entire team to achieve my goals, I won't be on a team.  The problem with such disconnections and losing items has something to do with not having dedicated servers.  If the host is too laggy, I quit.   If I stay and tolerate the lagginess, I don't get on the forum and complain about that, because that was my decision to tolerate such lagginess.  I don't blame anyone for it, not even DE.   However, yes of course, if they could fix this problem, that would be great, but they have not.  I find it safe enough to say that they won't fix it.

 

That doesn't make the problem better though.

I often get hosts with terrible connection which, for some reason, results not only in lag but framerate issues as well (vsync not enabled)

 

 

Connectivity issues have to be resolved.

You are right.  It does not make the problem better.  Never said it would.  Playing solo, when you are a tough enough player to do so, would help you get the results you need for completing the mission.  I'm not saying that it is the win-all solution, but it is one I use when frustrated like the Op is about the problem.  Again.  I wouldn't come on the the forums and complain about it in such a manner as the OP, which is why i made my comment in the first place.

 

<<snip>>

You: Solution to crappy connections in multiplayer co-op focused game: Run it alone and don't play with others. You run a lot of missions solo don't you?

 

Me: No, I don't run a lot of missions solo.  The fact that you concluded that about my comment shows me how bigoted you are.  There was nothing so absolute about my comment to the Op.

 

You: Either way, while DE has done a good job at smoothing out P2P connections, there's still some major bugs-- and features-- that need to be worked out. Like Host Migration going nuts for no clear reason, or Host Migration crashing a 40~60 minute run, all because there was a hiccup in the network. Lets be honest here, the major problem is who is set to be the host, and there's times where the system really, really, REALLY messes up in picking who should be host.

 

Me:  I totally agree.  That is a far better critique than the bad-attitude complaint comment the Op provided.  Your take on the problem is why I suggested running solo to succeed.  Sometime I can tolerate teaming up with one person only to get the job done.  It just depends on the situation or how badly I want to get a certain reward.

 

You:  I'd also like to make a point of saying, this is why Def/Survival/Intercept rewards being locked in once you got them was good. The old system where if you  got to wave 17 in defense and the game couldn't resolve a network issue, you got all the rewards upto 15 was a good idea. Especially if it bumps the key host too. There's been times where I host T4 Defense, and the game decides it wants to switch Host mid game, can't resolve the transfer for anyone, and no one get's rewards AND I lose the key. As much as I poke fun at the guy above for saying doing stuff solo, right now that's the only real solution, because people don't want to risk going several waves or minutes just to have the server crap out, and no one gets anything. 

 

Until the problem is resolved, put a bandage on the symptom of the problem-- losing rewards due to network problems-- and figure out some way to make connections more stable. And for that matter, we need the Host selection process to be refined. Heavily.

 

 

Me: Exactly.  How about when I am on a team of four players during the missions mentioned, and then sudden about 10 to 20 mins into the game, the host migration removes everyone except me form the game?  Then I'm faced with fighting alone anyhow.  It gets frustrating.  I'm not going to put angry comments about it on the forums though.  I rather give constructive feedback.  This was my point, which everyone clearly missed.   If i can do a mission alone to avoid bed experiences, I will do just that.  Last time I checked, there is nothing wrong with that.  If a game lags far too much for me to tolerate, I will leave and try again with a new group or do it solo if possible.  Last time I checked, there is nothing wrong with that either.

 

Sometimes people have bad internet connections and sometimes it's the game screwing up.  Either way, if I feel it is a waste of my time, I will leave the mission to avoid lag and other complications in order to help get better experiences playing warframe.  If you three that responded to my comment want to hate on me for that, then so be it.  To me, it's nothing personal.