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Sortie Reward Changes Cause More Problems Than They Solve


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- The Previous Problem
Players were getting repeats of rewards that they personally did not need.  Due to the skewed drop tables, trade values for things like weapon parts declined to the point that it wasn't even worth it to get an extra one of those to trade.  Complaints were all over the place that players were getting things they personally deemed worthless or a waste of time to obtain.

- The Attempted Fix
Segregating rewards into repeatable and non-repeatable per season along with changing the reward pool slightly.

- Problems Solved
None of the reward systems issues were concretely solved because different players will or will not like getting repeats of specific parts.  This may potentially fix some things in some situations but will cause annoyances and the same sort of issues to other players in other situations.

- Problems In The New System

  • The Pyra Syandana is not checked off for players that already have it.
  • Syandanas cannot be traded, adding a literally worthless "reward" for players that have it.
  • It will take two months at a minimum to craft a Greater Lens yourself from scratch.
  • People who want extra weapon parts to help friends complete a set are gimped.
  • Getting one "non-repeatable" reward does not actually increase the chances of getting the others.
  • Players that have these event weapons already will still get duplicates.
  • Duplicate rewards will start happening again every 15 days despite the changes.

The complaints vary depending on the person.  Some people will want the ability to get the Pyra, some will not.  Some people would like getting the same lens repeatedly, others would not.  Some players would like getting specific weapon parts they don't already have (to help friends), some would not like getting the same parts again after 15 days.

- A Common Theme
Why are these still problems?  They're still problems because different players already have different things and wish to obtain different things individually, well beyond the scope of what an automated system can determine.

- An Actual Solution
A token system.  Let players earn rewards and pick what they themselves desire, they can do it far better than any automated system can.

Edited by Rydian
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Why the Token System hasn't been added yet is beyond me. I've been suggesting it since Day 1 of Sorties (and Day 1 of Void, but that's a whole different battle).

Edited by Lanieu
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  • It will take two months at a minimum to craft a Greater Lens yourself from scratch

 

 Tin_foil_hat_2.png 

 

So to get one in a reasonable time, you either suffer trade chat (in which the majority will want plat in exchange) or you purchase it from the market (again for plat).

 

Either way it seems we'll need to spend plat if we want the greater lenses, it's almost like Vulpine Mask all over again.

Edited by DeMonkey
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Its great isn't it, DE mention token system, they get nothing but positive feedback from their customers.

DE then implements something worse, continuing to look like someone thinks their customer base is to be mocked.

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Nope

 

cHNSiKU.png

Would have been cool...if there only wouldn't be:

 

 

  • When a non-repeatable reward is removed from the list, it's reward spot is substituted by a 25 x Rare 5 or 50 x Rare 5 Core bundle.

I mean yeah, sure, people would like to get cores instead of lenses they don't need. But it's still RNG. And probably not the best RNG.

Edited by IceColdHawk
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This is so confusing, they were even talking about utilizing a token system last devstream. Even were leaning on Maru to be the vender for it.

 

EDIT: For the record I'd much prefer the token system they were playing with.

Edited by KittyDarkling
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Yeah, a Token system would be much better

I already have Pyra Syandana, with no need of a second one. useless reward to me, yet not already checked off

I already farmed and built and Maxed and Forma'd, and re-maxed Nezha, his parts would literally only be of use to sell, and he doesn't really sell anyway. pretty much useless, and not checked off

I received Strun Wraith from the event, and it would only be good to sell for me. ALSO: that means the ONLY people offering it on Trade chat would be people like me who already have the weapon from the event. this will likely hyper-inflate the price similar to the lenses before they got added to the market

 

MY SUGGESTED FIX:

Well, Token system obviously, but assuming that needs too much code to implement ATM, let's go with something else purely for argument's sake, and how merely thinking about this for a few seconds I can already come up with a better idea

repeatable TOGGLE

Let us CHOOSE which rewards we want repeatable in our drops, Obviously the perma-repeatables won't be able to be toggled off (so no stacking the odds in favour of Legendary Cores) but let's say a new player gets a full strun set, and wants to sell a duplicate or help out another newer player who can't run Sorties yet. letting them toggle which rewards they can get will let them turn back on the Strun parts and keep them flowing

Not as good as a Token system probably, but for damn sure better than what got implemented >.<

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They just need to stop beating around the bush and just give us the fricken token system. No random loot crap, just the system. Problem solved. Cycle a shop full of items more often and people will actually be happy for a few seconds longer.

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I also think a token system with reasonable prices would be the end solution.

 

The non and repeatable system only reduces the problem of unwanted rewards and does not resolve it. I personly think lenses should be repeatable rewards or this would improve the system:


-snip-

 

MY SUGGESTED FIX:

Well, Token system obviously, but assuming that needs too much code to implement ATM, let's go with something else purely for argument's sake, and how merely thinking about this for a few seconds I can already come up with a better idea

repeatable TOGGLE

Let us CHOOSE which rewards we want repeatable in our drops, Obviously the perma-repeatables won't be able to be toggled off (so no stacking the odds in favour of Legendary Cores) but let's say a new player gets a full strun set, and wants to sell a duplicate or help out another newer player who can't run Sorties yet. letting them toggle which rewards they can get will let them turn back on the Strun parts and keep them flowing

Not as good as a Token system probably, but for damn sure better than what got implemented >.<

 

Edited by (PS4)Prisma144
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  • 1 month later...

Token system would solve some problems but not all. And also can be abused. I doubt it will ever be implemented.

What about some of item's blueprint have much rarer drop rate? If nezha's sys cost х10 tokens more then other parts it will look weird. And actually there will be no sense in separating one item's parts... But If cost will be too high it will discourage players.

How to deal with Legendary core droprate chance varies from zero to none for frequent players and much higher for casual or newbie players? (just like ultra-rare void parts!  yeah, I do not think that there is a fair RNG). How to evaluate legendary core in tokens, a thousand or a million? Who will ever farm em? Same about exilus and potatoes. As a result, gold cores will be typical pick. As well as 'meta' lenses.

Edited by K4r4k4s4
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3 hours ago, (PS4)Lord_Gremlin said:

Your issue is that they didn't make any rewards non-repeatable. They just rob you of duplicates and give cores instead. Which is even worse. 

This, or they just shove the regular 25 cores your way and tell you to go home, even though you still don't have all the Sheev parts yet. How it's still possible for you to not get a reward for completing the sortie is beyond me, especially since I find the cores almost useless when I've got a Varazin and Zenurik tree to complete for my Tenno. The 25 cores and zip thing has been happening to me and my friend that I do sortie with for this entire, maybe even since Inaros' release. While I'd like to blame it on a hiccup caused by the new update, I have a feeling that DE's really out to screw us with RNG so we'll buy more things from the store.

Sorry that we're dedicated ninja farmers, Digital Extremes.

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I don't see an issue really, sure you get only one lens but why the hell would you want to craft them when they require Forma, Argon Crystals, Orokin Cells, AND 4 lens to craft??
You'd be better off just to buy a greater lens from the market. 

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On 3/12/2016 at 11:35 PM, K4r4k4s4 said:

What about some of item's blueprint have much rarer drop rate? If nezha's sys cost х10 tokens more then other parts it will look weird.

Because it's not like people don't already know things have different drop rates.  Don't want people figuring that out, nope.

On 3/12/2016 at 11:35 PM, K4r4k4s4 said:

How to deal with Legendary core droprate chance varies from zero to none for frequent players and much higher for casual or newbie players?

- If DE doesn't want people obtaining things, they should not be in the drop table.
- If they should be obtained but rarely, they should cost more than common things.

On 3/12/2016 at 11:35 PM, K4r4k4s4 said:

But If cost will be too high it will discourage players.

If drop rates are too low it'll discourage players too.

On 3/12/2016 at 11:35 PM, K4r4k4s4 said:

How to evaluate legendary core in tokens, a thousand or a million?

Well, one thing to do would be to look at it objectively instead of subjectively.  I mean it's a core that ranks mods, it's not some god mode item or something that powers up mods in a way nothing else ever can.  DE could just scale the cost to the effort they feel it replaces in ranking things through normal cores and credits (say, dark sector core farming).

On 3/12/2016 at 11:35 PM, K4r4k4s4 said:

Who will ever farm em? Same about exilus and potatoes. As a result, gold cores will be typical pick. As well as 'meta' lenses.

This is where I feel you lose the point of this thread.  You may make those choices.  Not all players will.

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