How Is Exalted Blade Different From A Gun?

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

Alternatively, slap on body count + blood rush on your melee weapon and voila!

Exalted blade without waves.

You even get to choose which type of weapon; hammers, polearms, dual axes, etc.

Just don't blame anyone when you reach the point where damage falls off and you are left with a squishy 100base hp frame 150base armor 100base shield frame trying to slap the enemies with your melee weapon without invulnerability or range.

Well, at least your melee weapon will stay with you when you engage the nullifiers and disruptors in melee range.

Or slap in mentioned mods and activate them with surging dash...the variation that isn't pure wave spamming...seems to work even with eb activated.

[(PSN)UltraKardas]

i was there back in the day when melee normally had charge attacks. we aren't talking about the past we are talking about the present and future. valkyr's niche is invincibility but here is the problem. she has the highest armor of all warframes including with warcry so tell me again why is that much armor needed if she can almost indefinitely stay invincible(not to mention hysteria passively has life strike without the channel cost)? you cannot even compare the 2 frames in terms of survivability because invincibility is the ultimate defense which is why it should not even be a thing someone can turn on and off in this game. Ivara is a true to the word ranged frame being her abilities are focused solely on ranged attacks. the only reason she is even being mentioned here is because her ult is a weapon change one. she isn't a melee frame

 

But you are wrong when you said people don't spam charge attacks. 

 

In the past when charge attacks where more powerful then regular attacks what happened? People spammed charge attacks. With Excalted blade only creating waves on charge attacks what will happen? People will spam charge attacks. Why? Cause Charge attacks are more powerful as excalibur would create a ranged wave.

 

You are delusional if you think otherwise. 

[EinheriarJudith]

But you are wrong when you said people don't spam charge attacks. 

 

In the past when charge attacks where more powerful then regular attacks what happened? People spammed charge attacks. With Excalted blade only creating waves on charge attacks what will happen? People will spam charge attacks. Why? Cause Charge attacks are more powerful as excalibur would create a ranged wave.

 

You are delusional if you think otherwise. 

spamming a power is were you repeatedly press a key(EB+eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee) that is spamming. charge attacks require you to hold the melee key that is not a spammable action. also nit picking to make a jab is in bad taste honestly. the only people who use charge attacks more than anyone is people using throw weapons currently so i dont see where it is even slightly false.

Edited February 18, 2016 by EinheriarJudith

[DSMatticus]

Excalibur is the "melee" frame.

His ultimate has the range, damage, and AoE potential of a top tier gun. It has a melee hitbox of course, but the way people play him he is seldom doing ANY melee combat.

The only non-gun function that his sword seems to have is the auto block.

I've always been very bothered that a frame named after what is probably the most legendary sword of all time has such a dry and unexciting ranged playstyle. Playing him without EB is WAY more fun, though is far far far from optimal.

There's a sword in old celtic mythology that shot out rainbows that could cut through hills and armies.

 

I propose we rename Excalibur to Caladbolg and replace the wave sfx with rainbows.

[(PSN)UltraKardas]

spamming a power is were you repeatedly press a key(EB+eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee) that is spamming. charge attacks require you to hold the melee key that is not a spammable action. also nit picking to make a jab is in bad taste honestly. the only people who use charge attacks more than anyone is people using throw weapons currently so i dont see where it is even slightly false.

 

Riiiiiiiiiight..... Repeatedly using attacks over and over isn't spam... Charge attack is completely separable, and 100% would be spammed if it was the only attack with waves. But feel free to pretend otherwise

[EinheriarJudith]

Riiiiiiiiiight..... Repeatedly using attacks over and over isn't spam... Charge attack is completely separable, and 100% would be spammed if it was the only attack with waves. But feel free to pretend otherwise

by your definition everything in the game is spammable including powers that cannot be recast but do feel free to continue not knowing what spamming means.

[Melos-mevim]

so is it just me or does no one have the self control to play with Excalibur and exalted blade by fighting in melee range and not giving a damn about if the waves exist? I mean after all the blade itself does far more damage than the waves

 

he is still the sword frame his sword is much stronger than the waves he throws out and there is nothing to stop you from running up to enemies and you know hitting them with the blade

Edited February 18, 2016 by Melos-mevim

[Wolfchild07]

Honestly, any ability/weapon that makes you button mash is just bad design. Sorry, DE.

 

I'm not an experienced Excal user, I ranked him to 30 and put him away, so take my suggestions with a grain of salt.

 

Maybe auto-parry damage reduction could be increased to somewhere around 90%.

 

The waves' range could be decreased to around 20m.

 

Excal's armour could get an innate boost.

[OoKeNnEtHoO]

so is it just me or does no one have the self control to play with Excalibur and exalted blade by fighting in melee range and not giving a damn about if the waves exist? I mean after all the blade itself does far more damage than the waves

he is still the sword frame his sword is much stronger than the waves he throws out and there is nothing to stop you from running up to enemies and you know hitting them with the blade

Me.

I'm rather aggressive.

So, while I move in with the waves, I get closer and closer to the target so if something is so tough that it survives my waves, they will be knocked down (because I use the knockdown move of the waves) and stabbed at on the ground or I will slide radial blind and whack them with the blade.

If energy permits (not energy reduction), I will use radial blind and just finish it off.

I only play Sorties with my Excalibur Prime.

Once in a while, I will use my Ash Prime, Rhino Prime or Frost Prime for the sortie.

For void runs and other stuff, I usually run a training frame which currently is Saryn Prime so I pretty much know how to use every frame since I have almost all the frames but my most used and experienced frame will still be Excalibur Prime/Excalibur.

[AKKILLA]

Me.

I'm rather aggressive.

So, while I move in with the waves, I get closer and closer to the target so if something is so tough that it survives my waves, they will be knocked down (because I use the knockdown move of the waves) and stabbed at on the ground or I will slide radial blind and whack them with the blade.

If energy permits (not energy reduction), I will use radial blind and just finish it off.

I only play Sorties with my Excalibur Prime.

Once in a while, I will use my Ash Prime, Rhino Prime or Frost Prime for the sortie.

For void runs and other stuff, I usually run a training frame which currently is Saryn Prime so I pretty much know how to use every frame since I have almost all the frames but my most used and experienced frame will still be Excalibur Prime/Excalibur.

 

This Topic will NEVER end 

 

People are really Hell Bent on these Waves being taken away or toned down. Im gonna start playing and spamming the Life outta EB just to enjoy the last days of this great ability.

 

It be nice if DE could do a feature like League of Legends URF (Ultra Rapid Fire) and give us most of the Old abilities like old Peacemaker Miasma etc.

 

Well time to go Spam EB and piss people off :) Coming to a Draco Near You

[(PSN)UltraKardas]

by your definition everything in the game is spammable including powers that cannot be recast but do feel free to continue not knowing what spamming means.

 

You can spam charge attacks till the cows come home, What are you talking about? I can use a charge attack every 3 seconds--- Enough for it to be spammable

[X-Byte]

Problem with your logic, chroma's ultimate doesn't require him to get in melee range though, and ice chroma is the tankiest of all frames being able to get absurds amount of armor. A 7,000 armor chroma has nothing to fear. And I'm not balancing exalted blade around exalted blade, Im balancing it around what other frames already have to offer. (Valkyr, and Ivara as they are the most similar with their ults)

Excalibur is in a good spot right now, He's fairly balanced with his only flaw being that people don't think he is "melee enough"

Despite your opinion you can just nerf him without throwing him back to ember tier, He doesn't warrant the nerf that you claim he does.

Valkyr and Excalibur do the same amount of damage with their ultimates.

The difference between the two is: Valkyr is immortal, Excalibur has more range and but is vulnerable to damage.

Ivan can effectively stay safe with prowl and do great damage with artemis bow, Valkyr is safely protected by hysteria that not even The Jordas Raid can bypass. Excalibur gets an autoparry and a blind but that gets rather energy draining after awhile. And the blind isn't even all that special considering both ivara and valkyr can cc enemies.

Excalibur's only unique feature is the range on exalted blade, Remove that and Excalibur becomes inferior to valkyr in every way.

So What are some ways we could remove the energy waves on exalted blade without it becoming inferior to hysteria?

Nerfing Hysteria is not an answer as then we enter a never ending spiral of nerf everything till no warfame has a damaging ability.

Option A: Keep excalibur as he is. Reasonably damaging and has good amounts of utility. A strong frame in his own right that lets anyone be useful in any mission.

Option B: Replace the waves for a movement speed buff and a lock on lunge that puts the emphasis on speed and slashes to kill his enemies

Option C: Excalibur gets a power cost reduction on his other abilities while in exalted blade, ( I'd be happy slash dashing everywhere if it cost me 0 energy)

Option D: (insert your own clever idea here)

Sadly, remove or limit energy waves is not an answer as that neither benefits him as a melee frame or changes the current play style you and others complain about

I like your B and C idea.

Allow me to expanded it a bit ;)

Some consensus so far: Exalted Fluctus spam doesn't fit properly a swordman's style, but it could be adapted. I agree.

My thoughts on EB (not just a nerf but a sidegrade)

-Exalted Blade

Bigger (range and hitbox), stronger and 100% slash procs waves at combo finishers (it could offer some wide frontal stagger, CC).

Autoparry dmg reduction of 90%, no channeling and 100% reduction, while channeling (with better efficiency and only frontal attacks ofc) to close distances offering survivality.

Keep the short RB bursts, improve melee attack speed and locks on.

Synergize with rest of skills, augmenting strentgh/range, ensuring SD slash procs and RJ puncture procs on cast.

Also, reduce regular SD to 15 energy cost. (Let us feel the "One cut one death" more often!)

At the end, his ult keeps being accountable at late-game while feeling more themed oriented, whithout feeling like a fluctus on legs.

[Epsik-kun]

When you play Excalibur against enemies his power is actually required, you will be using EBlade in melee range. Crowds that can be cleared by waves can be cleared by pretty much any frame using like half of all weapons in the game.

Edited February 18, 2016 by Epsik-kun

[(PSN)UltraKardas]

I like your B and C idea.

Allow me to expanded it a bit ;)

Some consensus so far: Exalted Fluctus spam doesn't fit properly a swordman's style, but it could be adapted. I agree.

My thoughts on EB (not just a nerf but a sidegrade)

-Exalted Blade

Bigger (range and hitbox), stronger and 100% slash procs waves at combo finishers (it could offer some wide frontal stagger, CC).

Autoparry dmg reduction of 90%, no channeling and 100% reduction, while channeling (with better efficiency and only frontal attacks ofc) to close distances offering survivality.

Keep the short RB bursts, improve melee attack speed and locks on.

Synergize with rest of skills, augmenting strentgh/range, ensuring SD slash procs and RJ puncture procs on cast.

Also, reduce regular SD to 15 energy cost. (Let us feel the "One cut one death" more often!)

At the end, his ult keeps being accountable at late-game while feeling more themed oriented, whithout feeling like a fluctus on legs.

 

I can agree with this as it feels like a fair trade off.

[SomeCrackHead]

On 2/18/2016 at 11:02 AM, Melos-mevim said:

so is it just me or does no one have the self control to play with Excalibur and exalted blade by fighting in melee range and not giving a damn about if the waves exist? I mean after all the blade itself does far more damage than the waves

 

he is still the sword frame his sword is much stronger than the waves he throws out and there is nothing to stop you from running up to enemies and you know hitting them with the blade

actually the sluggish slide attack from EB makes you just wanna throw that wave instead of going close to enemies. the best option would be not to play excalibur, not restricting oneself from using a frame to its best potential. the more challenging acceptable (somewhat survivable) frames are more fun to play.

[Flibbertigibbety]

I think the waves should come from a charge attack... sort of like firing the redeemer.

[Melos-mevim]

5 hours ago, SomeCrackHead said:

actually the sluggish slide attack from EB makes you just wanna throw that wave instead of going close to enemies. the best option would be not to play excalibur, not restricting oneself from using a frame to its best potential. the more challenging acceptable (somewhat survivable) frames are more fun to play.

so your saying a slide attack is the only way to close a gap, not a bullet jump, or a roll, or a slash dash, aim gliding, it has to be a slide attack, gee golly I did not know I was doing it wrong this whole time mister.

 

Excalibur can and is fun if you don't succumb to the same brain dead stupid tactic everyone else uses. 

[EinheriarJudith]

8 hours ago, SomeCrackHead said:

actually the sluggish slide attack from EB makes you just wanna throw that wave instead of going close to enemies. the best option would be not to play excalibur, not restricting oneself from using a frame to its best potential. the more challenging acceptable (somewhat survivable) frames are more fun to play.

Eternal war valkyr + War = never had so much fun playing a Melee warframe in this game. invincibility shouldn't be something a player can control in an online game so i grab any melee i can fit life strike on and go to town. the 1.2k+ armor lets me do such things. excalibur, and wukong are suffering in stats imo to much to be melee frames(not enough armor not enough hp) the waves were DE's way of not having to take responsibility for the broken scaling they keep ignoring. all Melee frames should be as sturdy as valkyr without needing to be invincible at any point.

[SomeCrackHead]

17 hours ago, Melos-mevim said:

so your saying a slide attack is the only way to close a gap, not a bullet jump, or a roll, or a slash dash, aim gliding, it has to be a slide attack, gee golly I did not know I was doing it wrong this whole time mister.

 

Excalibur can and is fun if you don't succumb to the same brain dead stupid tactic everyone else uses. 

wow man, you literally vote for a sluggish slide attack than a regular one. great job, no1 knows why you ask for the worse.

[Melos-mevim]

5 minutes ago, SomeCrackHead said:

wow man, you literally vote for a sluggish slide attack than a regular one. great job, no1 knows why you ask for the worse.

well considering the slide attack of exalted blade actually has some other benefits like a stun and blind which makes any attacks done to enemies count as stealth attacks and therefore a dmg multiplier yes, yes I would prefer exalted blades slide attack over a normal one especially considering there are numerous ways to get close to an enemy besides slide attacks

Edited February 23, 2016 by Melos-mevim

[SomeCrackHead]

4 minutes ago, Melos-mevim said:

well considering the slide attack of exalted blade actually has some other benefits like a stun and blind which makes any attacks done to enemies count as stealth attacks and therefore a dmg multiplier yes yes I would prefer exalted blades slide attack over a normal one especially considering there are numerous ways to get close to an enemy besides slide attacks

that's ignorant. the range is terrible and no1 ever uses it. you don't seem to even play excalibur by saying that. people still press #2 to blind, not slide attack. and any1 knows folding that exalted blade is way more fun than having it up. same with valkyr, but after doing that i thought to myself; why don't i just play another frame instead of restricting myself. after that, it worked out better.

Edited February 23, 2016 by SomeCrackHead

[Melos-mevim]

Just now, SomeCrackHead said:

that's ignorant. the range is terrible and no1 ever uses it. you don't seem to even play excalibur by saying that. people still press #2 to blind, not slide attack. and any1 knows folding that exalted blade is way more fun than having it up. same with valkyr, but after doing that i thought to myself; why don't i just play another frame instead of restricting myself. it worked out better.

actually yes I do use Excalibur infact he is my most used frame, I play a heavy melee playstyle, I like using exalted blade but unlike people who misuse excalibur I don't use it 24/7 if anything I spam radial blind more than any of his other powers because of melee finishers, but even with the blind on radial blind the slide attack on exalted blade is still good to use when you don't want to waste energy on radial blind. If you don't find excalibur or valkyr fun then don't play them there are people like myself who enjoy playing as them and using their entire kit.

[EinheriarJudith]

2 hours ago, Melos-mevim said:

actually yes I do use Excalibur infact he is my most used frame, I play a heavy melee playstyle, I like using exalted blade but unlike people who misuse excalibur I don't use it 24/7 if anything I spam radial blind more than any of his other powers because of melee finishers, but even with the blind on radial blind the slide attack on exalted blade is still good to use when you don't want to waste energy on radial blind. If you don't find excalibur or valkyr fun then don't play them there are people like myself who enjoy playing as them and using their entire kit.

you say people who misuse him. DE gave him the discs and you think people wouldnt create a behavior to spam around that? had it been on charge attack people would play him like wukong and valkyr hell even atlas. i play excal and i use slash dash like alot when closing gaps, radial blind in a groups of enemies, and normal melee because the discs are rather annoying. WTB an augment mod that removes the discs please (if you can do it with tornado removing its CC you can do it with EB removing the discs while adding melee range) thank you.

Edited February 24, 2016 by EinheriarJudith

[Khrushprush]

On 16/02/2016 at 6:07 AM, MIRROR_ell said:

Exalted Blade's waves need to be removed except for selected combos since the waves make Excalibur function less as a melee/swordsman frame and more of a gun-frame. Not to mention Exalted Blade gets all the melee perks without all the downsides.

 

Same as Valkyr's invulnerability.

 

Exalted Blade and Hysteria are for people who want to melee but don't know how to.

Why? You can always use Valkyr if you want true melee. or Wukong. EB is what gives Excal all that utility we love. :P

[ShortCat]

On 23.2.2016 at 0:48 AM, SomeCrackHead said:

that's ignorant. the range is terrible and no1 ever uses it. you don't seem to even play excalibur by saying that. people still press #2 to blind, not slide attack. and any1 knows folding that exalted blade is way more fun than having it up. same with valkyr, but after doing that i thought to myself; why don't i just play another frame instead of restricting myself. after that, it worked out better.

You are the ignorant one, don't speeak on behalf of everyone in the game.

I use the slide attack quite often and it is a good gapcloser and additionally does more damge, because slideattack. One more benefit is that it doesn't open enemies for melee finishers, thus I am not wasting time on those finisher attacks if I am close to them.