Bursa Are Ruining Corpus Missions For Me

[Lysserd]

Lemme get this out of the way, it's not because they're too hard. It's because they're annoying, and they're disproportionate to the enemies around them.

Bursa spawn too much. Also once they start spawning there's no way to get them to stop. (Though I'm hoping that's just a bug.) Turning off alarms doesn't seem to have an affect on their spawning. Having them spawn from alarms in the first place is an absolutely terrible idea anyway. It's effectively "punishing" people for taking part in the dominant play style for Warframe. I don't want to play every Corpus mission as stealth, and I don't think I should be spanked with a Bursa for it.

Bursa are also only proportionately powerful in high level missions, like Pluto. In lower level areas Bursa spawn enormously out of proportion to everything else. If you go into a low level Corpus mission with low level gear, the Bursa don't care. They're also capable of spawning in unfortunate combinations that can lead to death from being 100% stun locked. I'm not always in my optimal loadout because sometimes I like to mess around and have fun, which I guess is against the Corpus religion or something.

Maybe have them only spawn once per level, or only from lockdowns instead of alarms.

Or maybe actually scale their health and damage more appropriately.

 

Edit: Wasn't expecting this topic to still be here, but since it is I'll add some things from continuing to hate Bursa and reading the current comments.

• I agree that Bursa are balanced for high-level games, but they are not balanced at all for lower levels. They also aren't balanced for solo play, particularly when they spawn in groups. 100% stunlock combinations of Bursa are fairly common, and being locked in a corner until I'm dead isn't difficult it's just annoying.
• I was incorrect about turning off alarms, it does immediately stop their spawning. The problem is that an enemy can also immediately turn the alarms back on, within seconds. Also,
• Bursa can spawn in missions where alarms are always "on" like Interception, Survival, and Defense. There is no way to stop the Bursa floods in these missions (that I know of), where it seems there will always be ~2 active at a time. Because of this I am now adamant that having Bursa spawn from alarms is a terrible idea.
• While I agree that Bursa add some dynamic to the otherwise bland alarm element, they don't do it in a good way. Most people play this game to fight hordes of enemies, the game is even built around rewarding the player for doing this. Stealth has always been an optional play style, and never the dominant one. Having Bursa spawn from alarms punishes the dominant, and seemingly intended, style of play.

 

Edit 2:

Quote

Bursa Changes and Fixes

• Reduced the turn rate of Bursas so that they are slightly easier to flank.
• Fixed an error that caused Bursas to constantly spawn regardless of alarm status in a Mission.
• Bursa weapon damage has been reduced.
• Bursa overall health and armor has been reduced.
• Bursa front-facing damage reduction has been reduced.

It's nice that some fixes are being approached to this issue, and that it's being recognized. But of course we had to go with some of the worst possible solutions. First two bullet points are good. That makes solo play better, and fixes a bug. Great. However, a blanket reduction on Bursa is stupid. These things were well balanced for high-level play, they didn't need a nerf they needed to scale and btw they still do. Even with the nerf they still aren't proportional to other enemies at low levels, but now they also aren't proportional at high levels. There's also still some spawning issues, and it still feels like a punishment for having the gall to not stealth a Corpus mission.

I really wish these things were just handled similarly to Prosecutors: only in high level worlds, spawn more randomly, drop something interesting. Gate them off to a point where the player should be skilled enough to handle them, make their spawning a challenge and not a punishment, and give people a reason to care.

Edited March 24, 2016 by Lysserd

[Scytze]

While i agree that they spawn like infested and it can get annoying, but i think fact that they spawn after alarms is more or less cool. Its not hard to keep eye on panels where they launch alarm first place. Sure stealth should get few changes before stuff like this becomes normal.
But hey at least Mirage fans will be happy, *@##$es wont be making any alarms when consoles blow they're faces off.

[Dr.Speize]

Yesterday I was in a Sortie Mission solo. Finally I was surrounded by 5 Bursas --- so..no chance for me. The whole bursas-topic is not well balanced in my mind. They are generally to hard to kill.

[Rixalabur]

I did have to quit a mission once as I ran out of energy playing Loki. And had three Bursas making my life difficult.

Before this was put in, alarms really never did much. They would go off and it was easily ignored. Now you are being forced to turn them off, or deal with the consequences. Maybe a limit of bursas would be a good thing. Turning of alarms did stop spawning for me. 

[ScienceFerret]

I just played a level 15-20 syndicate Jupiter exterminate mission today, solo.

I can't really even express in words the pure frustration I've experiences during that mission alone.

Both the syndicate agents I had with me died seconds apart from eachother from the constant stunlocks of the second bursa I've encountered. I couldn't do anything to save them because I, too, was being knocked down repeatedly. If only I knew just how bad the situation would become.

I fought three other bursas later on, which weren't that bad because they all spawned seperately from each other. A few rooms and a few more bursas later, I took an elevator up to another room: a tight-spaced, cramped one with two denial bursas in it. While double the shockwave spam was very annoying, I eventually killed one, only to see that it was replaced with another one. As I was attacking it's replacement, another bursa spawned in, then another, then another, then another. As more and more spawned in, filling the cramped room with obnoxious debuffing AoEs, it was more difficult to kill them quickly and as such they had time to spawn more. And not only that, but they were completely immune to damage from the front, and damage that hit them from the sides did very little. It took around 4 magazines from the Seer (32 shots, each one dealing roughly 1132 of total damage) to take just the level 20 bursa's shields down and chip away at their health, and even then they regenerated quickly. I soon found myself out of ammo with the AoE knockdown spam making it too risky and futile to use my nikana. The only reason I survived enough to that point was because of consistent bullet jumping keeping my off the ground, with a single timing error resulting in me being stunlocked repeatedly and killed. I thought that maybe I could run from the bursas and just kill all the other enemies to complete the mission. It was then I realized that the enemy counter, which was roughly 170, was now 209. As Lotus notified me of another bursa spawn, the counter went to 210. Each bursa counts towards the exterminate goal. I couldn't finish the mission unless I kill every last bursa, which have excessive knockdown abilities, complete immunity to attacks from the front, extremely high amounts of health and shields, all topped off by the fact they continue spawning forever unless you kill them to the last one.

I nearly had an aneurysm and pressed the "Abort" button. At that time there was around 45 bursas on the map, judging by the exterminate goal at the start and end of the mission, around 30 minutes. I'm cooling down as I type this but I'm still sufficiently enraged.

TL;DR: Thanks, community design. Because enemies that are constantly shielded from the front are always to fun to fight.

[Necrius]

Manic spawns during alarms should be increased a bit. Bursa spawns during alarms should be decreased Drastically.

[Hellmaker2004]

Bursa's are fine they way they are. Done plenty of normal missions and Sortiers and barely spawned anyone since i turned off the alarm before they showed up.

Bursa's adds pressure by forcing one frame to dedicate to hacking once the alarm is triggered, or the group will get mildly punished by it making Bursa's spawn. And turning it off always works for me, in both scenarios be it either that they never spawned, or that a few of them did. It push pressure on the player to react upon on something we never really had to react to, unless it was stage two alarms that locked you down of course.

What Bursa need is to be toned down for low levels, so new players don't associate Bursa's with instant failures other than that, they are fine.

And as Necrius said. Maniac need to spawn need to be increased as well. Having the alarm to go off should be punishing no matter what faction.

[Kainosh]

I think that there should be special Cameras in some areas that r capable of summoning bursa.  There should be 4-5 of these in a mission.

Like...if you are not carefull enough and got detected by that "super camera" you get bursa. Or even few of them.

 

Btw turning off alarms do stop bursa spawning...Just once you have few of these its hard to keep alarms off....coz they r noisy af.

[Caelward]

On 2/18/2016 at 0:04 AM, ScienceFerret said:

I nearly had an aneurysm and pressed the "Abort" button. At that time there was around 45 bursas on the map, judging by the exterminate goal at the start and end of the mission, around 30 minutes. I'm cooling down as I type this but I'm still sufficiently enraged.

TL;DR: Thanks, community design. Because enemies that are constantly shielded from the front are always to fun to fight.

Before you blame 'community design', read this.

 

[VanLyrr]

Mate get Landing craft segment for your foundry, start building those air support charges, and let Ordis control Corpus alarms like they're his b!tch.

Edited February 23, 2016 by VanLyrr

[Volkovyi]

I agree with you mate, they ruined the Riot Moa design into a Corpus nightmare. The Riot Moa was designed more or less two years ago back when the Corpus had no defensive or support-like units, that means no Nullifiers, no Scrambus, no Shield-Sapping Osprey, no Eximus either. But now, the Riot Moa is just one of many offenders in the entire Corpus faction making them a nightmarish frustration to fight, definitely not "fun" for a marketed video game. The Riot Moa were supposed to be a carefully, elegantly design enemy with one good strength, and one fair weakness, to add variety and fair challenge to the Corpus faction. I should know what it was supposed to do, I was the one who designed it.

[Lost_Cartographer]

I don't think telling people to shut off the alarms is a really a healthy and viable way to play Warframe.  I mean, for starters... enemy presence is incredibly light before the alarms, and they're often blind and deaf (I've literally "stealthed" entire missions with my guns blazing while marching along the ground like a grunt.)  I enjoy when the alarms or when there are fires in maps because it means I can run a sabotage or deception or capture and find hordes of enemies coming at me.  I like the defense/survival quantities of targets, minus the whole "sit and wait" mentality coupled with those mission modes.  I imagine a lot of people that enjoy running non-endless without regards to stealth do too.  This is a horde shooter after all.  Fighting through hordes of enemy units while carving a bloody path to their reactor core is one way to play that shouldn't be heavily punished.

Enter the Bursa.  The problem with the Bursa isn't entirely that it's too powerful, it's that its durability scales too hard relative to the rest of the Corpus around it and they're a little too quick on their feet for something that can only really be harmed from behind.  Couple this with the fact that they're actually breaking exterminates by increasing the counter, and we're dealing with a powerful, probably bugged enemy spawn.  It feels like something that's more properly encountered as the Corpus' answer to the Grineer Manic or Infested Juggernaut, not something that's meant to be streamed at the player with abandon like standard issue Shock Moas.

Limit the Bursa to maybe one per mission when the alarms go off, and maybe tone back its durability or increase the damage multipliers when its hack panel is struck, as well as tone down its turn speed and it should be fine.  The big honking plates of metal should be enough to suggest hitting it from behind is the best plan of action, but Tenno should have the time to jump past it and hit it a few times.  Right now, unless it's a Drover mid mortar volley, it will instantly turn around.

Edited February 23, 2016 by Littleman88

[Hellmaker2004]

One Bursa per mission is a terrible idea unless they remove all there drops and relocate there unique drops to other foes. All this would cause is people either being frustrated when they show up and in extreme cases people may even quit the current mission if they have yet to learn how to fight them, or they will turn into the same issue Maniac have when it come to unique drops.

 

Bursa's may need some looking into for lower levels, but they are perfectly fine for high level (maxed level i've encountered is around 105) and there health and damage was fine, if anything they may need some toning down on lower levels, especially so new players can learn how to play against them. They may need some sort of introduction level. Either from a quest so the player can get some narrative hints towards defeating it or at the very least a good codex description on how to defeating them, what summons them and so on.

 

Stage one Alarms were until Bursa's introduction(added as a normal foe) pointless and at best it was a annoyance since the alarm rang and that was about it. Stage two locks down the doors so that has a impact. So i believe that adding Bursa's to the alarm was a great idea, it adds a counter play towards a foe that otherwise is easy Twp farm if you want, or easy to avoid if you counter it. I for one, wish they did the same to both Grinner Maniac and Juggernaut. To add them as a sort of Pressure people can respond to either by leaving the alarm on, making it easier to gather there drops. Or turning it off to avoid them. Clearly Juggernaut is not tied to an alarm so his "phase one shriek" has to have some sort of timer before it occurs, but i do wish they remove the two time limited spawn on him.

[DeMeritus]

I agree that the spawnrate for bursas is ridiculous.

A single alarm spawning 5 or more bursas in rapid succession is more than a little excessive.  Then they just sort of... stack from there.  I've seen quite a few scenarios play out where players have been staggerlocked and walled  by them, helpless to do anything.  You can't even deactivate alarms, though doing so doesn't seem to stop bursa spawns.

Why isn't the bursa more like the juggernaut and manic?  1 per mission works plenty well.

[Sepharoth]

They are just to much for lower levels. To fast and to powerful for low level characters. I encountered one a few days ago in a mission, never before seen it, and it nearly killed me off. I was on my rhino warframe and even using iron skin made no difference as it disappeared as quickly as I applied it. Not to mention the unrelenting grenades ( I guess they were grenades ) that it shot at me. It was to fast and way overpowered for the mission I was in. But I did finally defeat it. I would rather fight 2 juggernauts at a time than any mission with a bursa in it. But I am a low level player and they are just to much for lower levels.

[fatmonk77]

Perpetual spawning Bursas have finished my playing this game.I am done with Warframe .It was a great game while it lasted but with the addition of the Bursas, there are NO real levels as a spawning Bursa in an exterminate mission can and does go on and on and on.If the mission calls for a set number of foes to be killed, then it should be as stated AND at the level of difficulty stated. This way the player knows ahead of time what warframe and weapons to take and for the noobs, if they should go into the mission or not. I am a level 12 and was in an exterminate mission with a level 5 player. We had 11 foes left to exterminate when the Bursas started spawning and after some 30+ had popped up in the game I was killed my final time with no bring backs. I watched the level 5 until he was killed for his final time at which time the remaining foes was 132.Remember we only had 11 when the Bursas started spawning.

As the Warframe people want this crap to occur, I have had it with the game as it has no real levels anymore and with the Bursas is unbeatable!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You people at Warframe sure screwed up a great game!!!!!!!!!!

Edited February 29, 2016 by fatmonk77

[Lysserd]

1 hour ago, fatmonk77 said:

Perpetual spawning Bursas have finished my playing this game.I am done with Warframe .It was a great game while it lasted but with the addition of the Bursas, there are NO real levels as a spawning Bursa in an exterminate mission can and does go on and on and on.If the mission calls for a set number of foes to be killed, then it should be as stated AND at the level of difficulty stated. This way the player knows ahead of time what warframe and weapons to take and for the noobs, if they should go into the mission or not. I am a level 12 and was in an exterminate mission with a level 5 player. We had 11 foes left to exterminate when the Bursas started spawning and after some 30+ had popped up in the game I was killed my final time with no bring backs. I watched the level 5 until he was killed for his final time at which time the remaining foes was 132.Remember we only had 11 when the Bursas started spawning.

As the Warframe people want this crap to occur, I have had it with the game as it has no real levels anymore and with the Bursas is unbeatable!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You people at Warframe sure screwed up a great game!!!!!!!!!!

I'd never even heard of something like this before. That's beyond Bursa being annoying, that's straight-up broken.

If you still enjoy the game then I'd say just do what I've been doing and only do Corpus missions with your best gear, no matter the level, and try to avoid them as much as you can in general. 

[JohnnyQuantum]

Admittedly I'm only a casual player, but I have yet to finish any solo mission with a bursa. (I haven't come across one in a group yet.) I'm basically giving up on Corpus missions for now. Have plenty of other games vying for my attention! I used to have fun playing Warframe, but due to bursas, I cannot complete any more of the maps.

[KeenBean4]

The amount of anxiety I just went through hoping that no one got away to trigger the alarms and spawn a Bursa was unnecessary. 

[IceColdHawk]

Can anyone tell me where bursas seem to spawn so ridiculous high? I was trying to fill the vessel with 5 red bursas (done already) and i have done corpus exterminate and sabotage. I was trying HARD to actually get an alarm. I got 2 bursas at most in 1 mission.

Edited March 6, 2016 by IceColdHawk

[Shockwave-]

Bursa are great. Finally you might actually FAIL a mission if you don't play well. Kill each bursa as it comes out, don't let them gang up. They don't spawn 5 at a time, the spawn over time, when the Lotus says a bursa is coming, find it and kill it, then move on. If you ignore it, a new one will spawn and then you are 2, 3, 4, etc.

If you can't kill it fast enough then you need better gear. Getting behind it is pretty easy for most frames. Frost, nova, ember, Equinox, Ash, Ivara, Loki, Vauban, Excalibur, all have no trouble and probably some others, anything with a stun/blind, slow, makes it easy to get behind them and kill them quick. Then a stun and a quick reprogram and they help against the next bursa while you shut off the alarms or use an air support charge.

I really hope DE doesn't' cave and get rid of the bursas, My friends and I finally have the occasional scary moment when a couple bursa get going.

Edited March 7, 2016 by Shockwave-

[Vinylz]

I had a few times where I couldn't kill them fast enough and about 5 or 6 killed me in like less than 1 second. Then After a while I went like screw it, modded for radiation. And omg it was hilarious, I had about 6 or 7 Bursa all fighting each other, while i sit some where and throw money at which one is gonna win! LOL!!

[Cronotekk]

I LOVE it when a bursa spawns (no sarcasm) it mixes up the normal grind and adds a bit a tension.

[SoanoS]

23 hours ago, Cronotekk said:

I LOVE it when a bursa spawns (no sarcasm) it mixes up the normal grind and adds a bit a tension.

Then you must feel absolutely ecstatic it when it spawns 4 or 5 more before you manage to kill one and you spend the rest of your mission ragdolling all over the map and pressing revive button repeatedly.

[nVidiaContractor]

Isolator Bursa, my old enemy. I love him, he is the only one who could stand against my tests.

 

Isolator Bursa Level 100 versus Mesas Peacemaker on 5K FPS, it was long time ago when attack speed scaled with FPS and it was 360°, at this rate, Isolator Bursa survived for ~15min or ~20.7 hours based on real time and frames.

 

No one else can stand like him, so respect him, we dont need another zombie a like enemy.

Infesteds got Juggernauts with lots of HP and DMG, Corpus got Bursas with lots of DEF and AoE, now its Grineers turn to bring some annoying unit on table with massive old school Grineer DMG.

 

Edit: In missions, its all about team play, CC and other things, if whole team die from Bursas, then its terrible party, its not Bursa fault.

Long time ago, i dont remember event or alert name, if 4 players could stand against level 400 Grineers for 4 Rounds on Interception with Heavy Melee only, with 2-4 mods overall due to crazy conclave limitation, then you can stand against several bursas for sure as a sensei. Same for 2 hours of Interception and level 700 enemies.

For example, Bursa never killed me (except one with rockets), and i can solo win level 100 (its 400 in game i noticed) Juggernaut with Frost, didnt have ever problems in party with them. I know there is some newbies who cant, but in late game we must have some good fight.

Edited March 10, 2016 by nVidiaContractor