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Kontrollo

Dual Toxocyst gets "excited" buff on Gas, Blast and Electricity procs

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It looks like not only brain matter is what excites these guns, but also causing suffering to enemies through procs.

Posting this as a separate thread because it might be related to something else.

Screenshots:

Spoiler

3SNU1bR.jpg

I'll add more data later once I have time to test this thoroughly.

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because these AoE proc are very likely(If not always) to hit enemy head. Had always been as far as I know. Toxocyst just happen to be the 1st weapon to benefits from it.

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That's what I'm suspecting, but Electricity is surprising.

And no, I don't think it has always been like that. More on that later I guess, maybe I can dig up something.

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So, first I wanted to do an ingame test to see how much the weapon can be abused when knowing about this bug.

For that, I created a loadout specifically built for procs and geared against the Infested, using the dual stat mods for Blast and Electricity together with punch through (loadout on Warframe Builder). I also created an Autohotkey script to make the very most out of the procs. Then I went to Hieracon.

Results: It's certainly very easy now to get that buff going, and the Dual Toxocyst can dish out quite a bit of damage that way. However, it wasn't like I could keep the buff up almost indefinitely, because it only works on enemies that have heads (not on Ospreys for example), and the procs weren't 100% reliable either:

  • Because the weapon is physically-based a lot of procs were Puncture, which doesn't help when trying to excite it.
  • It also seems like the Blast and Electricity procs weren't 100% reliable at triggering this. Need to investigate that further.
  • The buff can't be triggered while it's already up.

In the end, I'd say the weapon is gated by its low crit. stats, even with the ability to easily proc its innate buff. I got outdamaged by a guy with a Tonkor by a good margin, so this bug doesn't really make the guns gamebreaking in any way.

Conclusion: It kinda defeats getting that nice proc reward for good aim, but the drawbacks of the Dual Toxocyst don't make this really exploitable. It's more like it gives us a reason to actually use these elements in a build, because they're generally subpar due to their damage 2.0 multipliers. So next time I'm just going to have a closer look at what does and does not cause this behaviour.

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Someone ordered a truck full of salt?

Spoiler

011510_salt_lead_604x372-thumb-604x372.jSalt_truck_Milwaukee.jpg

At first I didn't like that they removed the buff activation by status effects but got past that. As others said it would be nice if at least they would let us refresh the buff before it ends. As it is right now it doesn't make any sense. If the guns are excited by brain matter as they say, then successive headshots should keep the buff active. Right now it's something like: 
I WANT BRAIN MATTER!!! - Headshot! - Don't want it anymore :( - After 6 seconds. - I WANT BRAIN MATTER!!! - Headshot! - Don't want it anymore :( ...

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6 minutes ago, Kwongk said:

...

and to all other unsatisfied players...

I did not even noticed this bug because i never used these procs. So nothing changed for me and i still like it. If this game mechanics do not fit into your play style than use something else.

The Dual Toxocyst are even end game viable when you understand how to use them properly.

you can't headshot from behind :/

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Darn it. Now dat fancy build from Mogamu is useless.

It was very fun weapon to play BTW just because of this "exploit", and it didn't give super advantage just because you can't renew the buff until previous instance wears off.

OK, back to my arsenal for now.

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I don't remember this gun being ever that good either way to cause this much uproar.

Still. I'm baffled by how selective this gun wants to be on triggering its 'excitement' condition.

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I'm... honestly not seeing the reason for the salt in this thread.

The weapon had a bug/exploit that allowed players to not actually have to get a headshot in order to get rewarded with the buff, and DE fixed it. Now you actually have to TRY to get the buff. Boo Hoo, you have to move your mouse a bit more. 

TL:DR This weapon was not "destroyed", they just took out a bug that allowed you to be lazy. Still, call it mastery fodder if you want.

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4 minutes ago, Achievement-get said:

 

The weapon had a bug/exploit that allowed players to not actually try in order to get rewarded (now where have I seen that before...? coughDRACOcough)

Excuse me but Draco isn't the only thing, there are a lot of other exploit that aren't fixed at all & won't be, like survival camping & such, though Draco annoys me because in the recruit chat is spammed with it.
Also, there's no interest between headshots & high proc %age. If it was compatible with a crit build, it'd be a complete other matter.

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1 minute ago, Feuershark said:

[...]
Also, there's no interest between headshots & high proc %age. If it was compatible with a crit build, it'd be a complete other matter.

Oh actually there is. You may not be interested in but other players might be as well as me.

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What the hell are u even talkin about? using thouse elements on the weapon never made it "End-game worthy" as some1 here obliviously said, if anything, it made them alot less "End game worthy". I enjoy the dual toxy and never once used the """"Buggy"""" element mods and its a S#&$ weapon - its a piece of bloody garbage but its fun to use which is what metters(5 formas on it, R10 Hornet, 99.9% status chance, incase some1's gonna try to tell me i "built it wrong"). Yet, i feel the pain of thouse who were using it that way, as i said be4, it didnt make the gun amazing or op or even, for the sake of argument,not even among the top 20 guns ingame but yet, they enjoyed it, and honestly, i would have been pissed if some1 took somethin i enjoyed ^^ 

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34 minutes ago, ApexPredator-EN- said:

Good job, fellow Tenno. Ignore the haters, for that was NOT how the gun was supposed to work in the first place.
Git gud you others, if you can't score headshots consistently, you're probably playing a shooter game wrong.

Oh man, you know... i'm a hardcore games fan. I like skill-based stuff, and i like difficulty. And it would be a fair comment for most shooters, like Borderlands, for example. But NOT for warframe, or not with this fire rate and recoil. It's not a game about sniping strong enemies, it's a game about slaughtering HUNDREDS of weak foes.

Dual toxocyst's reward for being skillful just worth nothing in this game. Too weak for so hard-to-use thing. It needs either a good buff (like 5x DMG instead of 2x), or a simple mechanic, just to be effective.

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Please stop telling it was wrong for me to enjoy the weapon in the first place.

Relied on a bug... Yeah, a "bug" that was showcased on the wiki and multiple top streams.

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I was going to make this weapon and maybe finally have a secondary weapon that seemed interesting and viable, but I guess not?

On the side note can anyone recommend some good secondaries that are sortie viable and isn't based on primed mods (like Lex and etc) Since i don't have those mods yet.

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All the people saying "git gud" and "stop being lazy" it's more about an underperforming gun interacted with a game mechanic that has existed since implementation in a way that made it fun to use, and now that DE has removed it, the gun still underperforms. If, in the code it can count AOE status effects as a headshot for all purposes up until now, it's not a bug. DE shouldn't have "fixed" this because that's like saying: the Ogris's rockets are an AOE, if you shoot an enemy in the center of mass, you can still hit the head with the explosion, let's remove the ability to get a headshot because it allows the Ogris to be viable.

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7 minutes ago, Ankoku_no_Hime said:

I was going to make this weapon and maybe finally have a secondary weapon that seemed interesting and viable, but I guess not?

On the side note can anyone recommend some good secondaries that are sortie viable and isn't based on primed mods (like Lex and etc) Since i don't have those mods yet.

I have been using the staticor a lot. Great weapon. Good status. Radiation as base so lots of AoE confusion. And it does not require much when modding.

Basically my main secondary weapon pick.

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Cleaning up this thread and locking partly because this bug has been resolved, and partly due to the behavior within.

Hating on other users for their forum contributions is never an acceptable behavior.

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