Formas and Polarities

[(PSN)Lor-Enzo_1996_]

So,Ive been thinking this for a while...What if formas would work differently? Basically my idea was:

-Applying a forma to any slot will make that slot polarized (nothing new till here) BUT you should be allowed to switch that polarity in the future.

For example,say I have a 5 forma warframe: that means I could choose between V - and D etc. in all those 5 polarized slots and change them according to the mods I wanna use on it in that moment.

This method would:

- Still requires effort as you'll still have to level up your gear multiple times

- Allows you to create multiple builds on your frames and weapons which may need different load outs...Think about Mirage-> you can't do both blind build and clones build at the same time ( the first requires D's.the latter requires V's)

- Avoids problems when new mods are released... remember when the exilus slot first came out? Many people definitely added a - polarity there for Rush,but later the drift mods were introduced,and of course some of them are a better choice than rush. Though they are V or double - and that requires extra formas for nothing basically.

 

So,thats an idea I've had for quite a long time,hopefully some of you will agree or perhaps disagree,who knows ;)

Feel free to add your thoughts and thanks for reading!

 

[TheLexiConArtist]

Toot toot, special delivery courtesy of past discussions

Still trying to get it addressed.

[(PSN)Lor-Enzo_1996_]

Welp,you got me there dude haha,I didnt even scroll down before posting this >.<

Looks like some people had my exact same thoughts.hopefully they'll look into these

[TheLexiConArtist]

25 minutes ago, (PS4)Lor-Enzo_1996_ said:

Welp,you got me there dude haha,I didnt even scroll down before posting this >.<

Looks like some people had my exact same thoughts.hopefully they'll look into these

Well, those threads have long since trundled their way down the pages. Especially since all the 18.5 stuff gave us a fresh influx of new threads.

I'm certainly not suggesting you abandon this one, just keeping references to previous discussions available.

[(PSN)Cwellann]

2 hours ago, (PS4)Lor-Enzo_1996_ said:

- Allows you to create multiple builds on your frames and weapons which may need different load outs...Think about Mirage-> you can't do both blind build and clones build at the same time ( the first requires D's.the latter requires V's)

- Avoids problems when new mods are released... remember when the exilus slot first came out? Many people definitely added a - polarity there for Rush,but later the drift mods were introduced,and of course some of them are a better choice than rush. Though they are V or double - and that requires extra formas for nothing basically.

First one would be nice - I have to drop a bunch of forma into my regular Frost because with the introduction of Zenurik, higher strength/lower efficiency builds are more viable, however, I refuse to give up my Frost Prime's reliable all rounder build and exclusively rely on Zenurik.  However, you can actually do blind and clones at the same time.  Still, I think it's a great point.

Second is, I think, a really solid point, with the potential removal of base damage and multishot mods.  It does seem however, that they've got that in mind.  A lot of the Shadow Debt mods, rumored to be a step in the direction of Damage 3.0, are Madurai polarity.

[(PSN)Lor-Enzo_1996_]

On 14/3/2016 at 3:03 AM, (PS4)Cwellann said:

First one would be nice - I have to drop a bunch of forma into my regular Frost because with the introduction of Zenurik, higher strength/lower efficiency builds are more viable, however, I refuse to give up my Frost Prime's reliable all rounder build and exclusively rely on Zenurik.  However, you can actually do blind and clones at the same time.  Still, I think it's a great point.

Second is, I think, a really solid point, with the potential removal of base damage and multishot mods.  It does seem however, that they've got that in mind.  A lot of the Shadow Debt mods, rumored to be a step in the direction of Damage 3.0, are Madurai polarity.

We'll see dude,definitely looking forward to this!

Though Im sure I cant really do both mirage builds in the best way possible xD

[(PSN)Cwellann]

My blind build looks like that, and my damage build like this.  Polarities work to slot a Total Eclipse build too, if you want to grab a Mesa and pretend like it's six months ago XD

Spoiler

I don't use HoM because I like the consistency from the high strength instead (and I'm still positive on dE/dt with Zenurik up), and I read somewhere that when using a Simulor, the clones don't really count anyway - and that's really the only weapon I use on my Mirage when I'm running her for damage.

 

[(PSN)Lor-Enzo_1996_]

On 14/3/2016 at 0:53 AM, (PS4)Cwellann said:

My blind build looks like that, and my damage build like this.  Polarities work to slot a Total Eclipse build too, if you want to grab a Mesa and pretend like it's six months ago XD

  Hide contents

I don't use HoM because I like the consistency from the high strength instead (and I'm still positive on dE/dt with Zenurik up), and I read somewhere that when using a Simulor, the clones don't really count anyway - and that's really the only weapon I use on my Mirage when I'm running her for damage.

 

yea,same build,though I use Hall of Malevolence on my strength build instead of streamline,but thats about it.

 

[(PSN)Cwellann]

Yeah, would have to drop something then, so fair enough that both can't be done with the same Mirage then I guess.  Dropping Power Drift wouldn't be too bad though to get the extra capacity to squeeze in HoM.

[-N7-Leonhart]

On 3/14/2016 at 1:05 AM, (PS4)Lor-Enzo_1996_ said:

Applying a forma to any slot will make that slot polarized (nothing new till here) BUT you should be allowed to switch that polarity in the future.

For example,say I have a 5 forma warframe: that means I could choose between V - and D etc. in all those 5 polarized slots and change them according to the mods I wanna use on it in that moment.

Then what the hell would be the point to the polarities themselves? In this way, a forma would halve the cost of each mod, no matter which, so they may as well remove the concept of polarities.

[(PSN)Lor-Enzo_1996_]

Well yeah,you would be able to halve the cost of the mods u want,you 'd just need to select the polarity you need...

Though you'd still need to re-level your gear and forma things as we've done so far.

[TheLexiConArtist]

34 minutes ago, -BM-Leonhart said:

Then what the hell would be the point to the polarities themselves? In this way, a forma would halve the cost of each mod, no matter which, so they may as well remove the concept of polarities.

Your concern is valid (increasing the value of a given Forma). That's why the method I proposed in the past (see my links earlier) is based around keeping the effect of each individual forma the same, while improving the flexibility and removing the concept of "wasted" forma by moving the polarities from slot-based to a bank of usable polarities attributed to the item itself.

Every single Forma star on an item is a permanent upgrade, and applying more Forma with a polarity already available for every slot just adds flexibility instead of power.

Having to potentially spend a Forma to undo or alter a previous Forma's polarity switch just feels bad, it demeans the resources and time that were put into polarising and relevelling the weapon that first time.

[(XBOX)SickWicked]

How about if you double forma a single slot and you get a universal out of it.

The first time its just as it is. You pick a polarity for that slot and done.  But, if you forma the same slot again it becomes a universal polarity slot halving any mod you put in said slot.

If you want to up the cost just make that slot forever locked in place not movable like the normal polarity slots. This would only affect slots that have had a forma put in in it already and not any of the polarized slots that come with a warframe or weapon. This way the cost would be pretty substantial to have a multiple universal slots.

[Educated_Beast]

I've always felt a better solution is to allow slots to be forma multiple times.  It would still require 2 forma and still level weapon up twice.

 

For example, you could forma the same slot with a V or D and get bonus for those polarities only.  

 

Still requires planning but less penalty for bad choices and encourages build diversity.  

 

Not to mention, fixes the whole issue with pvp and pve mod polarity.  This is a major problem a D reason many people are just turned off by pvp.  Why should I be forced to build two versions of same weapon?  I'm not, I just ignore this entire game mode.  

 

It also future proofs weapons since you can just add extra forma and fix entire build (versus adding forma over a slot you already forma, and it may not be better choice so just avoid trying).

 

It fits inside existing system, not over powered, encourages build diversity, and fixes pvp.  Even with all those advantages, when I proposed this, still had people complaining it would be OP (even though it adds no extra power potential since can't fit two mods in same slot anyway).

 

 

[(XBOX)SickWicked]

1 hour ago, Educated_Beast said:

I've always felt a better solution is to allow slots to be forma multiple times.  It would still require 2 forma and still level weapon up twice.

 

For example, you could forma the same slot with a V or D and get bonus for those polarities only.  

 

Still requires planning but less penalty for bad choices and encourages build diversity.  

 

Not to mention, fixes the whole issue with pvp and pve mod polarity.  This is a major problem a D reason many people are just turned off by pvp.  Why should I be forced to build two versions of same weapon?  I'm not, I just ignore this entire game mode.  

 

It also future proofs weapons since you can just add extra forma and fix entire build (versus adding forma over a slot you already forma, and it may not be better choice so just avoid trying).

 

It fits inside existing system, not over powered, encourages build diversity, and fixes pvp.  Even with all those advantages, when I proposed this, still had people complaining it would be OP (even though it adds no extra power potential since can't fit two mods in same slot anyway).

 

 

This would be perfect.

I don't see how this would be considered OP.  All it would allow you to do is change out a single mod and try something different. 

 

[TheLexiConArtist]

3 hours ago, Educated_Beast said:

I've always felt a better solution is to allow slots to be forma multiple times.  It would still require 2 forma and still level weapon up twice.

For example, you could forma the same slot with a V or D and get bonus for those polarities only.  

Still requires planning but less penalty for bad choices and encourages build diversity.  

Not to mention, fixes the whole issue with pvp and pve mod polarity.  This is a major problem a D reason many people are just turned off by pvp.  Why should I be forced to build two versions of same weapon?  I'm not, I just ignore this entire game mode.  

It also future proofs weapons since you can just add extra forma and fix entire build (versus adding forma over a slot you already forma, and it may not be better choice so just avoid trying).

It fits inside existing system, not over powered, encourages build diversity, and fixes pvp.  Even with all those advantages, when I proposed this, still had people complaining it would be OP (even though it adds no extra power potential since can't fit two mods in same slot anyway).

Another valid approach not wholly unlike my own. Although I feel like the ability to opt out of something we've added is deserved quality of life. Until you throw in that second forma (then third, then fourth?) you still have the problem of being penalised for the effort you've put forth in the previous polarisations.

 

There's also the issue of storage load. Without landscaping out the actual possible storage in my mind since it's late right now and I'd probably only fail, my immediate impression is that it'd add greater load this way than in the even more flexible method of simply adding to a bank of polarities of which any combination could be applied.

Not much, mind you - it would be unlikely to more than double the theoretical (aggressively optimised) storage I had envisaged for my own, and even so would probably barely break double digits of bytes added, if it did so at all. When you think about how many players there are, each with many, many polarisable objects.. it does add up, though.

[weezedog]

I hate that you have to use a forma to remove a polarity, especially for Aura and Exilus slots since you can't swap them around to reuse them.

Frankly I hate that Auras have polarities at all. Auras were supposed to be for team play synergy, you could look at the makeup of your team and bring the auras that work best for that group, but thats impossible when you are locked into a few matching mods and to change it you have to level your frame to 30 again.

[TheLexiConArtist]

Linked this thread (and predecessors I'm aware of) in Devstream 71 thread.

Fingers crossed we get picked out!

7 hours ago, weezedog said:

I hate that you have to use a forma to remove a polarity, especially for Aura and Exilus slots since you can't swap them around to reuse them.

Frankly I hate that Auras have polarities at all. Auras were supposed to be for team play synergy, you could look at the makeup of your team and bring the auras that work best for that group, but thats impossible when you are locked into a few matching mods and to change it you have to level your frame to 30 again.

Honestly, better option there is for the viability of different auras to be improved, and new ones added so it isn't incredibly weighted to Naramon auras. But that's a whole different thread.

[(PSN)Lor-Enzo_1996_]

Glad to see you guys are proposing such interesting ideas!