Kyotra Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 6 hours ago, [DE]Taylor said: Hey Tenno! In honour of the hard work that our creators have put into their TennoGen creations, we are changing Skins to use the original models for Prime Warframes to prevent any unwanted clipping or concealment of textures. This is an all or nothing process due to technical limitations, so all TennoGen Skins will get this treatment. What? No, nonononono! Now this ruins things for those of us who actually like to use these skins with the prime bits. I understand why some people desire the prime pieces removed but this half-measure is only going to make other people upset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitsu Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 Well, this may cause a huge problem. Especially when compared to what people had to deal with when originally purchasing these cosmetics. Completely changing it might, not go well, since it completely changes what people were originally purchasing for. I expect either a lot of refund requests, or something along the lines of valve possibly getting involved? Hopefully not though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dequire Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 (edited) 8 hours ago, [DE]Taylor said: Hey Tenno! In honour of the hard work that our creators have put into their TennoGen creations, we are changing Skins to use the original models for Prime Warframes to prevent any unwanted clipping or concealment of textures. This is an all or nothing process due to technical limitations, so all TennoGen Skins will get this treatment. Thank you all for your feedback and patience on this matter. Glad you're taking note of problems and taking action against them, but, this isn't an all or nothing problem. You should have a button to toggle whether or not to use the prime model or the base frame's model. Edited January 5, 2017 by Dequire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liminal Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 I'm fine with this. I'd rather have the skin look the way it's meant to. I agree the ability to choose would be best, but if it's not possible (or at least not feasible for the moment) I'll gladly accept this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shut Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, The_Doc said: I'm fine with this. I'd rather have the skin look the way it's meant to. I agree the ability to choose would be best, but if it's not possible (or at least not feasible for the moment) I'll gladly accept this. I agree with this sentiment, but whether there is indeed a technical limitation is something that I'm questioning. I would have happily believed their post a month ago, but after the whole Riven storage fiasco ("We have a 15 Riven cap because of the large item data load which is difficult for our hardware to overcome... but feel free to ignore those 'technical limitations' for the low, low price of 60!"), my trust is limited. Edited January 5, 2017 by SortaRandom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad-Maxine Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 10 hours ago, [DE]Taylor said: Hey Tenno! In honour of the hard work that our creators have put into their TennoGen creations, we are changing Skins to use the original models for Prime Warframes to prevent any unwanted clipping or concealment of textures. This is an all or nothing process due to technical limitations, so all TennoGen Skins will get this treatment. Thank you all for your feedback and patience on this matter. where can i submit for a refund? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentMobius Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 (edited) 11 hours ago, [DE]Taylor said: Hey Tenno! In honour of the hard work that our creators have put into their TennoGen creations, we are changing Skins to use the original models for Prime Warframes to prevent any unwanted clipping or concealment of textures. This is an all or nothing process due to technical limitations, so all TennoGen Skins will get this treatment. Thank you all for your feedback and patience on this matter. I assume you'll be processing refunds for those who purchased tennogen skins in the full understanding that they would have the choice to use the prime mesh or the non-prime mesh simply by using the right Warframe, as has always been the case? Going from a choice to forcing everyone to use it one way is a S#&$ty thing to do IMHO. I'm certainly going to think twice before buying anything Tennogen now. And all you people celebrating this, just wait for the next option being removed that doesn't mesh with your aesthetic choices. Actually if your default choice is going to be obliterating the Primes for paid cosmetics I think it devalues the Primes as well which is not a great thing to do to people who have bought prime access in the past knowing that texture-based skins would apply to their purchases. Does it stop here? How many other features people paid for are going to be removed? Trust is a big part of F2P. Edited January 5, 2017 by SilentMobius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xardis Posted January 5, 2017 Author Share Posted January 5, 2017 (edited) From what I got, its very hard to implement model choice on the individual, frame by frame, level. DE can force non prime model on prime frames, what I dont know is this: can this be done on the client level and only on it? Can I force all models to non prime from my client viewpoint and it wouldnt affect any other player - they would se it as prime mashup. If this can be done - its the next best thing to the individual switch on case by case basis. If this option would be far easier to introduce, I would prefer waiting for that and not force whole many people into the normal model. I waited about 10 months, I can wait more if that means making more Tenno happy. And Im sure other people would be willing to do the same. Edited January 5, 2017 by Xardis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xection9 Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 DE just please give us a TOGGLE for prime parts so everybody wins, in my personal opinion some Tennogen skins are actually looks better with prime parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngrazer Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 3 hours ago, xection9 said: DE just please give us a TOGGLE for prime parts so everybody wins, in my personal opinion some Tennogen skins are actually looks better with prime parts. Now only if all these prime parts were actually well-made in the first place... I do like my Nova's prime parts with Tennogen skins, but here, take a look at this: Spoiler This part kills me every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartianJellyfish Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 (edited) I specifically bought Nova's Visage skin because I liked how it looked on my Nova Prime, and to me Nova Prime's selling points ARE her Prime attachments. Spoiler Ignore the non-optional pink cosmetic, please. The texture clash on the side of her chest doesn't even bother me. I was also looking forward to getting Device and Nyx's Athena, but guess I'll hold it off for a little longer. While I'm all for giving the people who don't like the Prime parts on their skins an option, what about me? Do people like me not deserve options, too? All we asked for was a toggle. If you go through with this change, I have no reasons to use this skin regardless of its quality and I want my money back. (I know I won't get it, but still.) I don't know what everyone else thinks, but where I'm from these skins are too damn expensive for being skins. Also my apologies if I sound aggressive but I'm sick of unfinished content and half-fixes. Edited January 5, 2017 by MartianJellyfish better wording? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amazerath Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 9 hours ago, Seratuhlis said: Hitsu San enjoys seeing creative customizations using his skins on Prime Warframes (please see his threads). Faven_FPS, quite possibly the biggest player in the Tennogen business, browses fashionframe threads in here and on 4chan, he even posts sneak peeks there every now and then. He too, enjoys it when people find creative ways to use his skins, especially on primes. [...] You seem to have missed my point almost entirely. I'm not discussing "creative customization" by adding accessories (like syandanas or armor) on top of the skins. I'm talking about messed up textures as a consequence of applying those textures to a model they were not designed for. I don't know which TennoGen skins you've been looking at, but not all of them are affected by this problem in the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thundervision Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 ...different strokes for different folks. Like many people have said, many Primes, especially Nova, Nyx, Rhino, Saryn Prime, have real issues with using custom skins simply not designed for Prime version: Spoiler Nova Prime: How about Giraffe Prime? The issue with Saryn Prime can be described by a single comparison pic: Some of Rhino fans aren't OK with his Prime bits on his shoulders and hips. Nyx Prime: Though, while her Athena skin can be matched with Prime design, there's still another major issue with her Prime plates -- look at their colour, they are out of place and looks like were simply hot glued on. And the list goes on and on. However, it varies from skin to skin: one can be ruined on Prime and yet another one can shine on the same Prime frame. It's really nice to see how many players can use these issues to their fashion advantage, but the point is missing, Tennogen wasn't designed or tweaked to be used on Primed versions in the first place (in fact, now I'm being a smart-arse, I wonder if it can be interpreted as false advertising). Anyway, while I'm finally happy that I can use Graxx skin on Nyx Prime the way it was meant to be, this situation sends me back to our famous Legacy patch: This one still hits me in the head (it did before we got the latest Tennogen update). Why can't we do the same thing to Tennogen? Call it a «Legacy Prime Armour» in the settings or a Prime Auxiliary option in customization menu allowing to change the model whenever you want. Voila! All sides are happy! 57 minutes ago, MartianJellyfish said: I have no reasons to use this skin regardless of its quality and I want my money back Now I'm not trying to be a smart-arse, sorry, but you agreed to the terms when purchased it: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xardis Posted January 5, 2017 Author Share Posted January 5, 2017 13 minutes ago, Thundervision said: Call it a «Legacy Prime Armour» in the settings or a Prime Auxiliary option in customization menu allowing to change the model whenever you want. Voila! All sides are happy! That was the proposition but as we know now, its hard to implement due to techical limitations. 17 hours ago, [DE]Taylor said: This is an all or nothing process due to technical limitations, so all TennoGen Skins will get this treatment. The solution you proposed, I imagine, would require extensive rework. As it is possible to make it all force normal model for all skins, one thing that can possibly be done (Im not the expert) to give this choice to the client - if I would choose to force normal models on those skins, I would see them as such, not depending on what you chose. Like we have 2 diffrent colour systems in game whitch affect only your client. As such, you could have details on and you would see them, and would also see prime details on my frame, but I would see them gone on both mine and yours. If this solution is possible and easier than case by case as you proposed, I would be quite happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silaeno Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 I only purchased two of the Tennogen skins I own on the strength of how well they worked with the Prime components of their respective Warframes. I wouldn't demand or expect a refund on either of them if this change is pushed through, but I certainly wouldn't be as interested in using them. The technical hurdles that DE has to deal with in order to resolve this issue are things I can't really guess at, but I would much prefer being given a choice to toggle between Prime and stock frame models, for Tennogen purposes, as opposed to being locked out of one or the other - even if it means having to wait a little longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredaven Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 On the flip side maybe now nekros will get a skin. His prime is so bad that making a tennogen skin for him was pointless. From tennogen artists point of view this also make Trinity/Vauban a lot more attractive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amazerath Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 11 hours ago, Geraion said: Hence it should be a toggle for the many of us who -like- the extra icing on the cake that is the prime parts of the model... They can in fact please everyone with this one. Just make it a toggle... In case you didn't fully read the post you quoted: "As for adding an option to show/hide prime parts, before asking DE to do that you should be asking if the artists are ok with it. I think none of us (including DE) want to do something that's going to end up pushing talent away from TennoGen." In other words, it's fine as long as the artists as a whole are ok with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredaven Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 One solution could be to split tennogen in 2 categories. Certain skins are designed with primes in mind. Whilst other s aren't( the latter is more common). But then it becomes an issue of optics and how the user can tell the difference. In my case; volt amp would use prime bits. Volt graxx wouldn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartianJellyfish Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 1 hour ago, Thundervision said: Now I'm not trying to be a smart-arse, sorry, but you agreed to the terms when purchased it: Yes, I did, but I guess that's a mistake I won't repeat :^) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clemza Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 18 hours ago, [DE]Taylor said: Hey Tenno! In honour of the hard work that our creators have put into their TennoGen creations, we are changing Skins to use the original models for Prime Warframes to prevent any unwanted clipping or concealment of textures. This is an all or nothing process due to technical limitations, so all TennoGen Skins will get this treatment. Thank you all for your feedback and patience on this matter. No ? Just give us the simple option to use the non-prime / prime "models" (not skins, but models), so we put the skins we wants on the "models" we likes. Everyone is happy. I was planning on buying tennogen grax skin for ember prime cause it looked cool (for me) with the prime parts, but now i know i won't ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolunde Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 19 hours ago, [DE]Taylor said: Hey Tenno! In honour of the hard work that our creators have put into their TennoGen creations, we are changing Skins to use the original models for Prime Warframes to prevent any unwanted clipping or concealment of textures. This is an all or nothing process due to technical limitations, so all TennoGen Skins will get this treatment. Thank you all for your feedback and patience on this matter. Woot! Thanks for this, now when we finally get our Cure for Space Herpes we get back to True End Game stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thundervision Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 2 hours ago, Xardis said: That was the proposition but as we know now, its hard to implement due to techical limitations. Oh... Ohhh. Okay, good to know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OniDax Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 20 hours ago, [DE]Taylor said: Hey Tenno! In honour of the hard work that our creators have put into their TennoGen creations, we are changing Skins to use the original models for Prime Warframes to prevent any unwanted clipping or concealment of textures. This is an all or nothing process due to technical limitations, so all TennoGen Skins will get this treatment. Thank you all for your feedback and patience on this matter. Nice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightmareT12 Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 19 hours ago, [DE]Taylor said: Um, my name is Taylor. But yw. New savior confirmed. All hail the Queen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PurpleNyxPrime Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 20 hours ago, [DE]Taylor said: Hey Tenno! In honour of the hard work that our creators have put into their TennoGen creations, we are changing Skins to use the original models for Prime Warframes to prevent any unwanted clipping or concealment of textures. This is an all or nothing process due to technical limitations, so all TennoGen Skins will get this treatment. Thank you all for your feedback and patience on this matter. well i want a bloody refund or an option to have it stay because i bought multiple tennogen skins for the primes as they were and this is effectively throwing my money in the dumpster. Thanks mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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