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[DE]Rebecca

Dev Workshop: Passives, Volt, Mag & More!

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Gonna have to chime in on the Oberon passive. It seems completely worthless against corpus and the infestation on paper. Hyekkas on the derelicts? Sure, but the majority of encounters with infestation are on the solar map.  Nekros should gain a small percentage of health back from killing targets, not a fixed number so it scales with both the enemy and the increasing risk of being in close proximity to the mobs. Nyx's will be good if they get disarmed after the power runs its course because it defeats the purpose of mind controlling a tanky enemy with a powerful weapon otherwise .  

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Hello there, not sure if this was posted already on this topic, but i wanted to say it anyway:

About Volt's speed; isn't it better to leave as it was with players being able to deactivate the buff in some way? (like rolling with limbo's rift) In any case, it sounds as a bad idea on paper, but maybe it'll work. i'm eager to test it with my usual teammates.

Also, i'd like to point that you don't need to take volt to the "alternative to gunplay" description: i think he already works pretty well as a great reinforcer for gunplay, so why not leaving him there? even so: making him even better at this. For example, with Speed it's been suggested many ideas for another buff. How about an increased reload speed for weapons too? Speed already makes the frames move faster, so it can make sense. Even if it's a little like Toxin Chroma elemental ward, but hey, Warcry from Valkyr and Speed are similar too.


Well, i think a lot of things there needs testing. Some sound great, others not so much. And now with Excalibur being a great DPS, and Mag becoming a great CC, I think Volt with this rework may land in the middle with the "tesla turrets", shield & speed, shock with the stuns and etcs. 

Pretty excited to test everything tomorrow and see how it works :)
 

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This is so disappointing... The only good news is loki passive :(
(i play volt the most btw)

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I guess I should actually give some feedback on the Passives other than just only Trinity

  • Ash: Bleed Procs dealt by Ash from any source are 25% deadlier and last 50% longer.

Sounds nice, gotta love those bleed procs

  • Banshee: All weapons are treated as silent.

Interesting but this would make her Silence power very useless now outside of the augment. Might want to tweak Silence if this passive stays.

  • Ember: Receiving a Heat Status effect will regenerate energy for the duration of the Status effect (10 energy per second) and increase Power Strength by 35%.

Interesting but it's a bit too situational at the moment since Fire Hazards are completely unpredictable until Starchart 3.0 and that most fire enemies are either the Grineer or a Fusion Moa.

  • Hydroid: Every Melee Ground-Slam has a 50% chance to lure a Tentacle that will last 15 seconds.

I guess that is neat. Though I wonder if the single tentacle is affected by his augment.

  • Limbo*: Holster Speed and Reload Speed is 50% faster while in the Rift, and movement speed increases by 10% while in the Rift.

I really like the sound of this. My wishful thinking also wishes for this to affect teammates when they're rifted.

  • Loki: 10x Wall-Cling duration!

Wall-Clinging has never been the best because of the wonky camera when you're aiming, especially when your Warframe takes up 80% of the screen when doing so. Unless you'll add a keybind to wall-cling without having to aim this one will probably be not be the best.

  • Mag: Vacuum effect on every Bullet Jump.

Makes you wonder if items/enemies affected by the vacuum would show for teammates like pre-nerfed Greedy Pull. One could hope I guess.

  • Nekros: Enemy death within 10 meters of Nekros regenerates a 5 Health.

Neat I guess. It's kinda melee ranged so it might not be very effective, but I guess any higher would have been too overpowered.

  • Nova: When Nova is down, she will knock down enemies in a 6 meter Radius.

Vague in the sense of whether it's being knocked down or entering bleedout. Maybe both if one would dream, it'll at least stop enemies from stun-locking me as Nova.

  • Nyx: Enemies affected by any of Nyx's powers have a chance to lay down their weapon ( become disarmed ).

Meh. But I guess it's a small trade-off from Loki's Irradiating Disarm.

  • Oberon: All wildlife (neutral or enemy faction) within a 10 meter range of Oberon will become allies and fight for Oberon for 20 seconds.

WAY TOO SITUATIONAL. Since wildlife only appears on Earth, Phobos, and Orokin Derelicts; adding that only Grineer use Hyekkas and Drahks on certain occasions, this passive is by far the least useful for anything outside of Grineer and the 3 locations.

Oberon really deserves much better and it's really shameful he hasn't been getting the love he deserves. Perhaps a status decrease would be paired with this passive since he is essentially the mascot of status on a lot of mod pictures.

  • Trinity: Revive fallen allies faster from further away.

Repeating what I posted earlier. I'll just quote.

2 hours ago, That1Cactus said:

Very vague. Not sure if this will be like Nekros' Soul Survivor or it will be like reviving like normal but somehow doing it from a small distance (Something that can easily be done with the inertia after sliding)

Personally makes me afraid if it's not gonna be good considering the vagueness.

  • Vauban: Other Warframes within 10 meters give you 25% bonus armour.

This one really doesn't sound that great. Mostly because Vauban doesn't have much armor anyways, and if we're going by modding logic 25% bonus armor wouldn't make any difference. If it was stacked by how many teammates are in range, or if it was a specific amount of armor rather than percentage then maybe but really it doesn't seem any useful for groups or solo.

  • Volt: Physical ground-travel distance between attacks causes bonus Electrical damage on next attack.

Pretty good since Volt covers a lot of ground anyways so as long as you're not a power spammer this could be very useful.

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Since Oberon is a support his passive could be a buff for his and his teammates sentinel/kubrow.

Maybe when a sentinel/kubrow dies they come back after a short time. Not only one time, but again and again. And it also applies on sentinels of teammates. Would love the fact that sentinels and kubrow are safe as long as a Oberon is in the team, and it would fit the theme of a support quite well without being op.

Or if this is too much just make the sentinels/kubrows of the team do more damage or something similar.

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Good lord finally a word about Limbo (gratz Limbo fans)

Upset that some Frame's Passives are mini versions of their other abilities (Banshee, Hydroid)

Oberon Passive.... what is Wildlife? (dubious)

No Chroma Passive change!? (Much sads) 

Nyx Passive makes Loki's Disarm Augment eat dirt (Hell, it's about time)

Ember passive (Run through them Fire pits during Invasions for free Damage buff) 

 

Also : Energy drain when picking up Volt shield? Realllly? :C 

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Having a look at the Nekros passive again, it seems they're forcing him to be a melee caster, or be in the thick of it, for 5 health points back. Not 5%, 5 points. Utterly not worth it for such a squishy Warframe.

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It's all good, except the Oberon passive. Really DE? I was so hopeful that it would change from what was said on the devstream. Maybe someday DE will care about him. Maybe some day.

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I'm quite curious on how Volt's Overload scales. It's not exactly stated how long enemies are made into Tesla Coils or if it scales with duration at all.

It was stated in the past Devstreams I believe that once an enemy dies, it'll obviously stop being a Tesla, but what if I Overload a lvl 500 enemy? Will that enemy become more or less a permanent Tesla Coil with an indefinite shock-based stun? Or will Overload do % based finisher damage to prevent that from happening? 

I fear that Volt's reworked Overload will just get nerfed right after it launches, so why not change it before it even gets off the ground?

 

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Passives should be impactful... RIP Hydroid, and Oberon passives. Limbo however, I don't understand why people think this isn't a good passive holy cow! This is great! reload speed and holster rate are solid stats! Not if your dead but still, would like to be able to pick up things in the rift.

Originally, this aspect was meant to be immersive, but it just made it annoying. It also doesn't make any sense, why would an enemy be able to enter the rift but the ammunition that spawns from them isn't able to? Why doesn't ammo move to the rift when the rift is opened either? I understand that it can't be shot out of or into because its a different plane and somehow people can move from one or the other (maybe if its alive) but when its already in it, it should be pick up worth. By this logic weapons wouldn't work in the rift and clothes would fall off, if taken to the extreme but we will leave that to Limbo's mathematics

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As an Oberon main, I was irate that it would only charm wildlife. Including enemy pets is exactly what I wanted added to it for it to be awesome.

 

My concern is, can they still take dmg from allies? I think they should either be damageable but not killed (1hp), or be recharmable a set number of times to avoid getting turned on and killed by an entire pack at once.

 

Alternatively, maybe having pets could confer a buff to allies? Skates could buff crit chance to allies near them. Doggos could add armor, kitties could increase parkour temporarily. Nothing major, just niche fun things. ;x

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2 hours ago, Conestt said:

(If you know how to play him) It really isn't as simple as you have to play him a certain way to be effective. 

I find on a lot of frames people cry Buff on it's because a lot of time they are trying play against spec. Volt is a utility frame, not a DPS frame. CC is his primary strength with a bit of Defense thrown in for survivability.

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Speed is one of the main reasons any one even plays Volt. Also if you were playing Volt "correctly" you wouldn't have emergencies.

My ability to play a frame, other than Trinity, doesn't stop other people from running off into another room and getting incapacitated. It also doesn't stop everyone else from running out of the room and RNGesus deciding to surround me with enough enemies that would be faster and safer to run from than try and Overload or Shield in the short period of time between the rest of the team leaving the room and me noticing.
 

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Now when you suggest that he doesn't need a rework but then you say you don't use one of his abilities...it is hypocritical because the point of reworks

I never said either of those things, thank you very much. I said he didn't need MUCH of a rework, not that he didn't need a rework. I also said I use Speed in emergencies, so I clearly do use it. If you're going to try turn someone's own words on them, you'd better make sure you've quoted them correctly. Because you didn't this time and it backfired on you.
 

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are suppose to fix the problems with people not playing something all the way. So you don't like a speed boost which ruins your playing experience? Well then maybe there's a bigger problem, lets fix it. 

They've already solved the problem. The problem was that it wasn't optional for other team members. I'm not the only one who disliked Speed being foist upon them. There are  reasons they removing the mandatory component.
 

Quote

Also what don't you like about speed? Other than FoV.

It's an Oh Crap button for me when playing Volt. I don't use Volt as a melee frame, there are frames much better suited to melee combat than Volt and I'd rather use them when I'm in a melee mood. And when I'm not playing Volt and I have Speed forced upon me, ignoring the annoying FOV issue, I don't see any real need to be moving that fast in the normal situations. I at more than adequate speed without speed buffs. It's more of a nuisance to some of us to suddenly be moving faster with absolutely zero warning whatsoever. You run into a wall because you weren't expecting to suddenly be moving that fast. It throws your pace and often aim off if you aren't expecting it. And then it wears off quickly, so there's no reason to really adjust to it after the initial disorientation wears off. It's fine if we're all running to the exit or something and we're expecting it. But the rest of the time, no thanks. Which is exactly why it's being made optional. Most people only seem to care about the power when they're trying to exit the mission faster unless they're the one actually playing Volt. Put Volt in the lead, everyone runs through the pick up and you're good to go.

Edited by Ceryk

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4 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

 

Other players in range now get to 'opt-in' to Volt's Speed buff, by activating a pickup that Volt leaves behind on cast. This activation occurs on contact.

 

please reconsider this and make it opt-out if anything. it breaks the flow of gameplay and severely reduces volt's usefulness for the team. i imagine exactly when speed is needed everyone has to stop and fumble to pick up the boost. hope i'm wrong but if the focus pickups are any indication ouch

or maybe remove the team buff from the ability completely and add it to the augment.

everything else is awesome thank you

Edited by ..atom..
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3 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

...

Yes! First, let's talk Mesa:

As you may or may not know, we are making Mesa's personal Peacemaker weapon scale with Secondary Weapon Mods. Peacemaker itself will be tweaked to accommodate for the sudden surge in power that inheriting underlying-Mods introduces.  

We are also making Shooting Gallery be a permanent buff on Mesa when cast, but Allies will still have it rotate.

*And now Limbo:

If we can, we will make more changes to him by tomorrow (cue the coffee machine). His passive is really not something we believe puts him in a place we think is near final. We are considering replacing his 3 (Rift Surge) with something else. Stay tuned!

And everyone else?

With the 18.13 release including all of the above, there are two phases to follow.

The first is practical feedback review. Maybe you're like me and wonder if the quirky fun of Oberon's passive works in practice, or maybe you're sold on that flavour alone. Immersion and style matters just as much as a small stat. Do you believe that everything has to work in all scenarios all the time – if so how far off is the content Warframe offers in being universal? Where do Passives belong – what rules do you think they should follow? Is there room for niche? How deep can a niche go?

Then we move on to bigger Warframe reviews – this includes a detailed look at things that trivializes all content to an extreme.  Please remember that all of the above is subject to change – big or small. Stay tuned for final Update notes.

Take care, Tenno!

 

Awesome. Can't wait for all those changes above.

And so glad that you're acknowledging the issues with Mesa & Limbo.

Since the last change to Mesa, I've stopped using her altogether. It's just no "fun" anymore. And, Limbo... even with the passive change above, I feel something is still missing for that frame (no, not limbo. lol). I feel similarly that Limbo could have a lot of potential. But it feels something is still missing, just don't know what is it. 

Last, I want to say something a little vague here. There is a reason why "evolution" is slow. If someone yells at you stop going to the right, don't immediately run all the way to extreme left. Community feedback is awesome. But just like water, it can flow the ship and can also sink the ship. Respond to it right and use it with care will make Warframe better and last longer and more players will love it. Not every time when someone has written 500 pages of complain mean there is some thing wrong with the game. There could be another million others playing and enjoying it but just not speaking up. A lot of us love the game and want to make changes, but all of us players have some stakes in it.   

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4 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

If we can, we will make more changes to him by tomorrow (cue the coffee machine). His passive is really not something we believe puts him in a place we think is near final. We are considering replacing his 3 (Rift Surge) with something else. Stay tuned!

 

 

 

giphy.gifYeeeeesss....!

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I like most of the passives, just needs a few changes

Edited by Hypernaut1

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Just now, Hypernaut1 said:

does it really matter though? Its their game, they can interpret the theme in any way they see fit. they dont need to follow some arbitrary video game trope of design. I think some of you get too hung up on the specifics of a theme at times.

Don't know if you've noticed, but pretty much every. Single. Warframe. has had a theme. Oberon still is the only one who doesn't have a concrete theme with them yet.

Edited by TheEternalJester
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Just now, That1Cactus said:

 

  • Mag: Vacuum effect on every Bullet Jump.

Makes you wonder if items/enemies affected by the vacuum would show for teammates like pre-nerfed Greedy Pull. One could hope I guess.

I was thinking about Greedy Pull as well, and wondering, if Mag's passive works like this, why she would need Greedy Pull for?
 

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2 minutes ago, ElCorintio said:
 

I was thinking about Greedy Pull as well, and wondering, if Mag's passive works like this, why she would need Greedy Pull for?
 

range?

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4 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Banshee: All weapons are treated as silent.

Silence

  • Enemies entering the aura will experience a sonic disturbance, becoming momentarily stunned. Afterwards affected enemies will become unaware to sounds from gunfire, alarms, and death screams.

Doesn't this passive make her silence ability a little redundant? 

I know the passives should not be as powerful as augments or mods, and really should not affect base stats, but this passive seems rather mundane and easily replaced by simply hitting 3. She is short on armor and has very little shields/hp, what if head shots provided her with 50 shields. If she can kill enough without being hit to cap off her overshields, good for her.  

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It's about time Mesa gets to use Shooting Gallery on herself!

For Loki, if he's going to be able to cling onto a wall for so long, please do something about how difficult it is to aim while on said wall. I never wall cling simply because all I see is my Frame's back instead of where I'm aiming.

And Limbo, assuming the proposed passive stays as it is, will that movement speed buff be on top of the already 20% buff that comes from the Rift mechanic, or will it replace the mechanic? Replacing Rift Surge with something more prominent on the battlefield would be nice, like the teleports people mention. Honestly, Rift Walk and Banish could still be combined: Banish what you're aiming at, or Banish yourself.

For Volt's Speed, make the "opt-in" a full-range prompt rather than a pickup. I've seen builds with some 20 meter Speed ranges. It would be a pain to have to look for and get to the pickup for the buff in some cases, such as being in another room or floor.

Now for Oberon's passive.... Osprey, Lynx, Hyena, Jackal. Those are technically robotic animals, right? Right?

Definitely looking forward to this patch!

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1 hour ago, Machayna said:

This was probably stated along the way but I think there might be some misinterpretation.  " All wildlife (neutral or enemy faction) ".  If I'm understanding that right that means kavats brought out by kavat masters will fight for oberon for 20 seconds when they get in range of him.  Same with Drahk being spawned from Drahk masters.  That's in addition to feral wildlife which they are saying may increase.  Ultimately I'm not sure how it will play out in the longrun but this doesn't sound as bad as I originally thought so long as I'm understanding their meaning.

and let me go ahead and counter those points

 

as things are right now wild life already attack enemy and unless you attack them generally leave players alone. 

 

as for hyeekas and drakks people seem to forget that both oberon's first power and his ult create guaranteed rad procs, a rad proc bascially acts EXACTLY like nyx chaos this means oberon can already turn grineer pets against their masters once again making the existence of this passive utterly pointless

 

a good oberon player already knows to make use of the rad procs from his powers to turn enemies against each other, so they would be already trunning enemy pet units agaisnt their owners

 

THIS PASSIVE IS UTTERLY POINTLESS

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Some suggestions here to the devs, based on what many people is arguing, about some passives. You should check warframes and see if any existing mod fits em as a passive one. Like you did with rhino's heavy landing, Banshee's innate silenced weapons, and such. But there's always place for more creativity if not that.

Chroma: You could extend his passive to something related to his wings, as someone suggested. Like, "Chroma can do an extra bullet jump in mid air with a flap of wings" or "Chroma flaps his elemental wings on bullet jump, afflicting nearby enemies with an elemental proc of its element, and covering extra distance" which would be like those elemental bullet jump mods. Then adding a a bullet jump mod should stack the effects, in case someone wanted to.

Ember: The passive you propose gives nice buffs, but people almost never gets a fire proc. There are just to few sources of it. A better passive would be something like "overheating" from her own casts. Then the effect could be many things, like the actual passive after a spam of powers in a short amount of time, and a continuous casting needed to keep that overheat, but balance it with a self inflicted fire proc, so players can kill themselves if not cautious. Or, an effect harmless to the player "Ember overheats after repeated casts, emitting a heat aura that resets the duration of heat procs and streghtening its damage over time"

Limbo: As someone said, and also in my opinion, Limbo is a frame who would fit with passive evasion, taking advantage of his control over the rift. He's squishy, while switching between planes you often get hit one time or two, which in higher levels translates as "ded". Having a passive let's say, 20% evasion, will make you feel lucky when trying to enter the rift at the moment a sniper shoots, if you get to see a rift effect negating that shot. Plus, it could stack with Agility drift (I think it was?) reaching a chance to evade of almost 1 in 4. Also, Riftwalk should be able to be casted in any moment while giving the buffs you propose, like a "one-handed action", in order to make Limbo more fluid and interesting to play with. That's the main reason I dislike him right now, cast time and animation lock on a thing he should be swift with.

Well, this is my feedback, hope it helps with something.

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2 hours ago, Totorochan said:

This whole "Oberon = Paladin" thing needs to die a fiery death already.

When DE sells the Oberon's accessories even they referred to it as his Paladin pack.

So yes, that's a Paladin in DE's view (Furor approved, unfortunately, as it would be something he would've created for Paladins, as he hates them so much. Hate is an even understatement).

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