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18.13 Valkyr Hysteria change


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Hysteria is a rage so it should be supported by more anger.

Not attacking enemies means that your anger get lower, while attacking killing etc, will raise your rage.

So in my opinion it should not work as it is now.

 

How should it work:

After using Hysteria you gain 100% damage reduction and it is lowering every second by 3%. So after 10 seconds you will have 70% damage reduction.

To hold your damage reduction you must attack enemies, One hit gives 5% damage reduction back.

When Damage reduction will go down to 0% Hysteria automaticly is turned OFF

 

So you can't just run with Hysteria around and do nothing, to hold rage you need to attack enemies. So it won't look stupid, like standing in one place and be immortal all the time.

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And then what would be the point of using hysteria at that point with that sort of mechanic in place where as you're busy running to enemies you're chipped away (and depending on how many enemies you'll be killed before reaching them).  There are plenty of situations where the enemies will even take out a full Vex Armor Chroma which can quickly hit 99% DR through armor.

Literally the only thing going for Hysteria is its invulnerability.  Without that its a trash ability.

I can, and have, outdone hysteria Valkyrs before even in other frames:
-Melee weapon with Blood Rush and Body Count
-Naramon Shadow Step

After a very short time you'll be permanently invisible and dealing massive damage without having to worry about constant energy drain, and having better reach, group attacks and combos.

Here are the downsides to hysteria:
-Limited to sub 2 meter reach with claw weapons
-Can only hit one enemy at a time
-Can't attack flying enemies at all.
-Constant energy drain

Here are the upsides:
-Invulnerability
-High base damage modified by weapon mods

You remove the full invulnerability and it becomes actively harmful to use because I can just take any other melee weapon, especially ones with a long reach like the Orthos Prime or many of the heavy blades, put on a Primed Reach to maximize range, put on Blood Rush and Body Count and use Shadow step and I'll be outdamaging the Valkyr because I'll be hitting more enemies per swing at greater ranges.  Further I'll be invisible permanently due to critting non-stop, and I'll even get 100% red crits fairly quickly, and that invisibility can't be dispelled by Nullifiers or Comba/Scrambus  units meaning that I won't have to worry about being rendered vulnerable.

Simple fact of the matter is that without 100% invulnerability hysteria just sucks and can be outdone by any frame that uses Naramon Shadow Step and a weapon with a 15% or higher crit chance.  So if you want to remove invulnerability from hysteria you had best provide a full rework that actually makes it useful because a change like you are presenting would make it mostly trash.

Edited by Tsukinoki
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They are going to nerf her, along with many other frames.

Hysteria was already a pain to use with energy drain enemies around now it will eat more energy the longer I stay in it and the damage absorbing (the one that can backfire on you) gets less over time as well. All this while not getting anything in exchange, no dmg buff, nothing. Still can't even steer her during combos and the range is S#&$.  Not even touching her other abilities which still need tweaks. Only Hysteria nerf.

 

Happy now whiners? Thanks for ruining the game for me.

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10 minutes ago, Momo93 said:

They are going to nerf her, along with many other frames.

Hysteria was already a pain to use with energy drain enemies around now it will eat more energy the longer I stay in it and the damage absorbing (the one that can backfire on you) gets less over time as well. All this while not getting anything in exchange, no dmg buff, nothing. Still can't even steer her during combos and the range is S#&$.  Not even touching her other abilities which still need tweaks. Only Hysteria nerf.

 

Happy now whiners? Thanks for ruining the game for me.

I was always pushing back forma'ing my Valk some more to fit all the mods I originally intended to install a month or two ago when I first got her, since there are always more pressing use of forma with weapons and meta frames. I even got close to actually doing it yesterday when I finally maxed Vitality and Steel Fiber (for my Inaros), which pushed my Valk past its mod capacity to hold the mods that I've used for months

Guess she won't need any of these forma now.

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10 minutes ago, Mattoropael said:

I was always pushing back forma'ing my Valk some more to fit all the mods I originally intended to install a month or two ago when I first got her, since there are always more pressing use of forma with weapons and meta frames. I even got close to actually doing it yesterday when I finally maxed Vitality and Steel Fiber (for my Inaros), which pushed my Valk past its mod capacity to hold the mods that I've used for months

Guess she won't need any of these forma now.

I only have 4 forma in her. I do run and gun a lot while also using all of her abilities but saving teammates will be pretty risky during lvl 100 eximus sorties lol. I will try adapting to the changes. I don't really have any other frame I enjoy as much as her yet. Maybe Inaros comes close a bit but I barely have any experience with him because I built him last week whereas I put hundreds of hours into Valkyr already.

Edited by Momo93
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2 hours ago, Tsukinoki said:

And then what would be the point of using hysteria at that point with that sort of mechanic in place where as you're busy running to enemies you're chipped away (and depending on how many enemies you'll be killed before reaching them).  There are plenty of situations where the enemies will even take out a full Vex Armor Chroma which can quickly hit 99% DR through armor.

Literally the only thing going for Hysteria is its invulnerability.  Without that its a trash ability.

I can, and have, outdone hysteria Valkyrs before even in other frames:
-Melee weapon with Blood Rush and Body Count
-Naramon Shadow Step

After a very short time you'll be permanently invisible and dealing massive damage without having to worry about constant energy drain, and having better reach, group attacks and combos.

Here are the downsides to hysteria:
-Limited to sub 2 meter reach with claw weapons
-Can only hit one enemy at a time
-Can't attack flying enemies at all.
-Constant energy drain

Here are the upsides:
-Invulnerability
-High base damage modified by weapon mods

You remove the full invulnerability and it becomes actively harmful to use because I can just take any other melee weapon, especially ones with a long reach like the Orthos Prime or many of the heavy blades, put on a Primed Reach to maximize range, put on Blood Rush and Body Count and use Shadow step and I'll be outdamaging the Valkyr because I'll be hitting more enemies per swing at greater ranges.  Further I'll be invisible permanently due to critting non-stop, and I'll even get 100% red crits fairly quickly, and that invisibility can't be dispelled by Nullifiers or Comba/Scrambus  units meaning that I won't have to worry about being rendered vulnerable.

Simple fact of the matter is that without 100% invulnerability hysteria just sucks and can be outdone by any frame that uses Naramon Shadow Step and a weapon with a 15% or higher crit chance.  So if you want to remove invulnerability from hysteria you had best provide a full rework that actually makes it useful because a change like you are presenting would make it mostly trash.

 

Hysteria still will be very usefull. You don't have masive damage reduction in melee mode, Hysteria have.

Remember that Naramon Shadow Step is OP and will be nerfed. The most of the peopel uses Shadow Step. It will gone in future. So stop comparing Hysteria to Shadow Step.

Nothing and no one should be Immortal for longer than several seconds.

 

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1 minute ago, IfritKajiTora said:

 

Hysteria still will be very usefull. You don't have masive damage reduction in melee mode, Hysteria have.

Remember that Naramon Shadow Step is OP and will be nerfed. The most of the peopel uses Shadow Step. It will gone in future. So stop comparing Hysteria to Shadow Step.

Nothing and no one should be Immortal for longer than several seconds.

 

So lets ignore Shadow Step for now.

With your idea why would I ever take Valkyr over say Chroma?
Chroma can hit 99% DR fairly quickly and unlike your idea it won't decay over time (and all thats required to max out the DR safely is to drop a few cheap shield restores and you'll hit that 99% DR through armor safely and easily).
Further he has a massive damage boost to all of your weapons, not just melee, meaning that he can outdo Valkyr in pretty much every single area currently except for the fact that Valkyr is 100% invincible while using Hysteria.

Currently I use Hysteria for 2 things:
-Hacking in areas I can't clear of enemies
-Reviving allies

With your change those two actions won't happen because it takes longer than 5 seconds to revive allies, meaning that I would be under 85% DR and dropping steadily and being ripped apart so I can't even take advantage of hysteria to revive people or hack or do any of the few things that Valkyr is actually good at while under fire.

Fact is that without invulnerability Hysteria would be useless because there are simply better options for it.

Quite literally the only thing that Hysteria has going for it is its invulnerability.  And you simply aren't giving anything to it to keep it viable with your idea.

IF DE made the change that your proposing why would anyone take Valkyr over other frames?
They want a powerful melee ultimate?  Use Wukong (who can go immortal and with teh right mods can keep it up forever) with better reach and a more useful kit for group gampley.  Or use Excalibur who can lock down entire rooms and again has a better kit than Valkyr and has a 40 meter range.
They want to be able to face-tank anything?  Either use Chroma and keep your DR at 99% (which is beyond easy) or a 99% blessing trinity and you're covered, without any of the downsides that Hysteria has.

So if you wan't to remove the invulnerability from Hysteria you need to provide something to balance it out.  Otherwise it becomes useless and actively harmful to use with absolutely no upsides.

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2 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

So lets ignore Shadow Step for now.

With your idea why would I ever take Valkyr over say Chroma?
Chroma can hit 99% DR fairly quickly and unlike your idea it won't decay over time (and all thats required to max out the DR safely is to drop a few cheap shield restores and you'll hit that 99% DR through armor safely and easily).
Further he has a massive damage boost to all of your weapons, not just melee, meaning that he can outdo Valkyr in pretty much every single area currently except for the fact that Valkyr is 100% invincible while using Hysteria.

Currently I use Hysteria for 2 things:
-Hacking in areas I can't clear of enemies
-Reviving allies

With your change those two actions won't happen because it takes longer than 5 seconds to revive allies, meaning that I would be under 85% DR and dropping steadily and being ripped apart so I can't even take advantage of hysteria to revive people or hack or do any of the few things that Valkyr is actually good at while under fire.

Fact is that without invulnerability Hysteria would be useless because there are simply better options for it.

Quite literally the only thing that Hysteria has going for it is its invulnerability.  And you simply aren't giving anything to it to keep it viable with your idea.

IF DE made the change that your proposing why would anyone take Valkyr over other frames?
They want a powerful melee ultimate?  Use Wukong (who can go immortal and with teh right mods can keep it up forever) with better reach and a more useful kit for group gampley.  Or use Excalibur who can lock down entire rooms and again has a better kit than Valkyr and has a 40 meter range.
They want to be able to face-tank anything?  Either use Chroma and keep your DR at 99% (which is beyond easy) or a 99% blessing trinity and you're covered, without any of the downsides that Hysteria has.

So if you wan't to remove the invulnerability from Hysteria you need to provide something to balance it out.  Otherwise it becomes useless and actively harmful to use with absolutely no upsides.

One mention though. Chroma doesn't get to 99% damage reduction. It gets to at most 97-98% damage reduction with only that much armor, which means it takes 2-3x times more damage than at 99%. To see the difference, 8000 armor is about 97% damage reduction. In comparison, Mesa has an ability with 95% damage reduction and is much easier to mod for and use.

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10 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

So lets ignore Shadow Step for now.

With your idea why would I ever take Valkyr over say Chroma?
Chroma can hit 99% DR fairly quickly and unlike your idea it won't decay over time (and all thats required to max out the DR safely is to drop a few cheap shield restores and you'll hit that 99% DR through armor safely and easily).
Further he has a massive damage boost to all of your weapons, not just melee, meaning that he can outdo Valkyr in pretty much every single area currently except for the fact that Valkyr is 100% invincible while using Hysteria.

Currently I use Hysteria for 2 things:
-Hacking in areas I can't clear of enemies
-Reviving allies

With your change those two actions won't happen because it takes longer than 5 seconds to revive allies, meaning that I would be under 85% DR and dropping steadily and being ripped apart so I can't even take advantage of hysteria to revive people or hack or do any of the few things that Valkyr is actually good at while under fire.

Fact is that without invulnerability Hysteria would be useless because there are simply better options for it.

Quite literally the only thing that Hysteria has going for it is its invulnerability.  And you simply aren't giving anything to it to keep it viable with your idea.

IF DE made the change that your proposing why would anyone take Valkyr over other frames?
They want a powerful melee ultimate?  Use Wukong (who can go immortal and with teh right mods can keep it up forever) with better reach and a more useful kit for group gampley.  Or use Excalibur who can lock down entire rooms and again has a better kit than Valkyr and has a 40 meter range.
They want to be able to face-tank anything?  Either use Chroma and keep your DR at 99% (which is beyond easy) or a 99% blessing trinity and you're covered, without any of the downsides that Hysteria has.

So if you wan't to remove the invulnerability from Hysteria you need to provide something to balance it out.  Otherwise it becomes useless and actively harmful to use with absolutely no upsides.

 

Trinity blessing will be nerfed. But Using Chroma or Trinity you need to control something at least, with chroma you need a lot of Power Strength, while Hysteria dont need any mods except Efficiency but that needs all abilitis so that doesnt count.

Valkyr have 50% critical hit chance with her Hysteria its a massive buff to melee. With Blood Rush you need to first make some combo and you can lose it. While Hysteria from start have huge Damage.

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3 hours ago, IfritKajiTora said:

Hysteria is a rage so it should be supported by more anger.

Not attacking enemies means that your anger get lower, while attacking killing etc, will raise your rage.

So in my opinion it should not work as it is now.

 

How should it work:

After using Hysteria you gain 100% damage reduction and it is lowering every second by 3%. So after 10 seconds you will have 70% damage reduction.

To hold your damage reduction you must attack enemies, One hit gives 5% damage reduction back.

When Damage reduction will go down to 0% Hysteria automaticly is turned OFF

 

So you can't just run with Hysteria around and do nothing, to hold rage you need to attack enemies. So it won't look stupid, like standing in one place and be immortal all the time.

It sounds good yes...for PvP.

What you sugest will give the players a chalenge and sure thats nice, but there is a time and place for chalenges. Hysteria is neither.

Now look I am not trying to say that this is a bad idea like everyone else, but it is a wrong one. What I mean by that is if Warframe was a completly diffrent game like a beat them up, then it would be a very nice idea which brings balance to the ability and makes it more fair.

Also by your logic it will apparently not drain energy per second and only on cast. So maybe as some sort of augment for people who want Hysteria to be that way, but don't force it on everyone.

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1 hour ago, Momo93 said:

I only have 4 forma in her. I do run and gun a lot while also using all of her abilities but saving teammates will be pretty risky during lvl 100 eximus sorties lol. I will try adapting to the changes. I don't really have any other frame I enjoy as much as her yet. Maybe Inaros comes close a bit but I barely have any experience with him because I built him last week whereas I put hundreds of hours into Valkyr already.

The fact that enemies scale to level 100 is a PROBLEM born of OP frames. I would expect and hope DE would fix this next, and very, very soon. This is the reason I dont run Sorties. I dont find them challenging. I find them extremely tedious. 

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1 minute ago, BlackCoMerc said:

The fact that enemies scale to level 100 is a PROBLEM born of OP frames. I would expect and hope DE would fix this next, and very, very soon. This is the reason I dont run Sorties. I dont find them challenging. I find them extremely tedious. 

I am only doing them for the cores and the extremely small chance for a legendary one. It is true that most of the time they are not fun at all and feel like a chore. Like yesterday's level 100 eximus excavation, man that gave me cancer.

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14 minutes ago, (XB1)Stage DRGR said:

Lol yea in a casual game.. 

I would not say that Warframe is realy casual game. It is if you play as Excalibur, Valkyr, Trinity, Wukong, Loki, Ash, Mirage, Ivara.

Because those Warframes have OP ability that makes game too easy.

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10 hours ago, IfritKajiTora said:

I would not say that Warframe is realy casual game. It is if you play as Excalibur, Valkyr, Trinity, Wukong, Loki, Ash, Mirage, Ivara.

Because those Warframes have OP ability that makes game too easy.

I play as Excalibur an don't spam Exalted Blade.

I play as Loki and don't spam Radial Disarm.

Will soon play as Ash and wont't spam Bladestorm.

Thank you!

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1 hour ago, IfritKajiTora said:

Invisibility is OP not Radial Disarm.

 

If you use Exalted Blade you will see that playing is much easier.

I haven't Radial Blinded mysefl enough to not see how easy missions can be with Exalted Blade and that is exactly why I only use it in these scenarios.

In a squad:

Spoiler

 

My team needs help clearing out an area.

Boss takes too long or is anoying.

Somebody asks me to and I agree. (I don't always agree)

 

Solo:

Spoiler

 

I am farming and want to get things over with faster, because either I am bored or short on time.

Because I feel like it. <--- only when solo!

 

Both:

Spoiler

 

I am low on health and need an escape, but Radial Blind and Slash Dash won't be good enough.

None of my weapons do enough damage.

 

I understand that not everyone plays Excalibur like me, but then again not every Ash player uses only Bladestorm.

It's your choice if you want to follow the meta or not and its like that in litrally every game. Nobody is forcing you to do Draco when you need exp.

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