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Volt Rework Feedback [Post Update 18.13]

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8 minutes ago, giovanniluca said:

Amesha?

No, that's an Archwing. I'm talking about Warframes.

If you wanna take a different Warframe and Amesha and get your biz done that way, go do it, that's cool. But having multiple successful options doesn't discount Volt's efficacy. You could just as easily do it with a Frost for cover and an Itzal to get around quick. Also good.

Edited by SenorClipClop
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2 minutes ago, SenorClipClop said:

No, that's an Archwing. I'm talking about Warframes.

If you wanna take a different Warframe and Amesha and get your biz done that way, go do it, that's cool. But having multiple successful options doesn't discount Volt's efficacy. you could just as easily do it with a Frost for cover and an Itzal to get around quick. Also good.

yeah only with volt you get around fast AND can protect defense points (and yourself) without having to use consumables.

he's great for the plains :)

Edited by Kotsender_Quasimir
typo
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3 minutes ago, SenorClipClop said:

No, that's an Archwing. I'm talking about Warframes.

If you wanna take a different Warframe and Amesha and get your biz done that way, go do it, that's cool. But having multiple successful options doesn't discount Volt's efficacy. you could just as easily do it with a Frost for cover and an Itzal to get around quick. Also good.

But since this is a game of variety of tools if something is inferior that's pretty much the end of it, in the long run you'll be worse and not wanted.

Also I could've said Octavia.

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3 minutes ago, Kotsender_Quasimir said:

yeah only with volt you get around fast AND can protect defense points (and yourself) without having to use consumables.

he's great for the plains :)

Nova?

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1 minute ago, giovanniluca said:

Nova?

is probably great, too? dunno didn't try her out yet. not that much of a nova fan.

Edited by Kotsender_Quasimir

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1 minute ago, Kotsender_Quasimir said:

is probably great, too? dunno didn't try her out yet. not that much of a nova fan.

g5QY6tZYRsC5VYMsrazBjA.png

Enjoy the true speedgirl of PoE, I lack a forma in there. Enough power strenght to slow enemies to they do no damage state.

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11 hours ago, giovanniluca said:

Get Nova or whatever can tp, oh and remember that his sprint speed is so low that everything outspeeds you.

Also dashes work good, naramon's dash, not really Zephyr's.

everything? you're exaggerating things

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On 19/10/2017 at 2:41 PM, SenorClipClop said:

I dunno there, Tenno. Wide open space with little cover and you take a frame who has a speed boost and can make cover for himself (that absorbs infinite damage)? Sounds pretty good to me. 

First thing I thought when PoE came out was to re-test Volt, as in theory, he'd be merciless with Speed and all. Truth be told, I either forgot how to play him or it's just theory, because of all the open space we have there you can and will get shot even from above, and let's be honest, his shield might be really good if you can lock an entire region, such as between pillars on normal missions, but in PoE I feel like a sitting duck, dying several times. It might be my fault, as I've been playing other Frames (never playing Octavia, Rhino and Loki, that are top tier, imho, but still...) but even though speed gives a melee buff, it doesn't work since you're gonna get shot from everywhere, and sitting still and sniping things behind the shield is EXTREMELY boring for me.

Have you actually tested him on high lvl bounties? Is it viable? As in, would you be able to solo things as Volt?

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7 hours ago, Toramaru said:

Have you actually tested him on high lvl bounties? Is it viable? As in, would you be able to solo things as Volt?

There are just much better or fast alternatives that have more ways to survive.

And if you want a chance to survive you must run quick thinking but it dramatically cuts your energy.

Edited by giovanniluca

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Are people still trying to make arguments about how volt is relevant or useful in anyway? Really?

Oh, and apparently electric chroma got some sort of buff. Lots of damage. No cap. What pc guys are saying.

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4 hours ago, ZDoppelganger said:

Just remove damage cap. on 4th and remove drain when shield is picked up.

And the slow on the speedframe which is one of the slowest frames already.

Edited by giovanniluca

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Current Shield seems like not useful at all in Plains, there's no reason to use it, or you running fast to next bounty phase, or standing still when defence in progress, so yes, there's no reason to fix it, it's useless in my opinion.

So POE out, Volt became a bit more useful (for me), more viable for bounties, and especcialy for soloing Eidolons (pure loneliness). Still remains a fact, that Volt needs some more tweeks to be not perfect, but still good frame. Firstly, it would be great to see some changes about range/duration affects abilities:
 

1. Discharge - be affected by rangeduration and power strenght. In this case duration is not that usefull at all because of damage cap, so there's no utility from it, why not remove it at all, :thinking: or why we can't have something like Nova/Mag spreading mechanics working pretty good. 
Possible fix: borrow wave spreading mechanics from Molecular Prime/Shield Polarize. In this case we can achieve some kind of versatility in builds.

2. Speed - couple of months ago i had an idea to add some Nezha Treatment to some of Volt's abilities, one of them was the Speed as toggable ability with energy drain and the trail of electricity with proc. (could possibly be an Augment).
Advantages:
- No more buff recasts (no sens to do it everytime)


- Remove dependence on fixed duration.

 

- Adds more versatility to build Volt.

3. Shock and Shield (yeah, not Current Shield as described upper) are good as they are. (Need more ideas)

Something like that.

 

Edited by Cryone
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Has it always been a thing that if volts speed is slower than yours, the ability will make you run at volts speed, thus actually slowing you down?

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Volt's problems are being highlighted by the PoE update, and I'm quite happy about that.  That said, I rather like Shock-sniping and electro-spear fishing.

Volt's Electric Shield had many, MANY mitigating factors added to it to counter the fact that it has no damage cap before breaking.  Personally, I'm okay with the Shield, but not some of the drawbacks attached to it negatively affect Volt.  Mind you, I'm thinking about the carried ES, the Riot Shield, more than the base ability.

The basic Electric Shield is okay.  It has drawbacks on the Hills of Eidolon, to be sure, but it always had these drawbacks in open spaces before.  We never had the same issues because enemies weren't shooting at us from hundreds of meters away through thick brush and behind rocks where nothing should be able to see ANYTHING (different issue, and shades of Crysis gunboat AI), but casting 2-3 Shields can give you total coverage against low-angle bullets coming in, so meh.

I've often said that Electric Shield was one of Volt's best abilities, but that it's still of limited utility.  I don't feel it's BAD out on the Hills.  Volt is just a gen 1 'Frame in desperate need of a PROPER rework instead of the overhaul he got.

Also, I'm finally onboard with being able to hold 1 to cast a continuous-beam Shock.  Watched that old Alad V trailer for the then-new Jupiter tileset, and Shock lasted a solid 3 seconds at LEAST.  For that matter, Volt was (and still DOES) air-cast his 4 by firing blasts of electricity downward and projecting an electric field from himself and that point.

Volt's sprint speed is REALLY slow, especially given how squishy a 'Frame that HAS TO USE ABILITIES TO SURVIVE winds up being.  I would LOVE to see his sprint speed bumped up to 1.2 for both Base and Prime Volt.  Base Volt needs 65 armor and 225 energy as well.  Still.  After more than a YEAR of recommending these improvements.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Recap or TL;DR:  Shock should have a continuous-beam mode.  I've said before and will continue to say Speed needs AT LEAST 15 seconds duration base.  Riot Shield limitations make it impractical to use basically ever, ESPECIALLY without good energy regen, and Discharge should be air-castable.  Oh, and we FINALLY have a use for his passive, so lets not have this fekked up.

Edited by Cytobel
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16 hours ago, Cytobel said:

Volt's problems are being highlighted by the PoE update, and I'm quite happy about that.  That said, I rather like Shock-sniping and electro-spear fishing.

Volt's Electric Shield had many, MANY mitigating factors added to it to counter the fact that it has no damage cap before breaking.  Personally, I'm okay with the Shield, but not some of the drawbacks attached to it negatively affect Volt.  Mind you, I'm thinking about the carried ES, the Riot Shield, more than the base ability.

The basic Electric Shield is okay.  It has drawbacks on the Hills of Eidolon, to be sure, but it always had these drawbacks in open spaces before.  We never had the same issues because enemies weren't shooting at us from hundreds of meters away through thick brush and behind rocks where nothing should be able to see ANYTHING (different issue, and shades of Crysis gunboat AI), but casting 2-3 Shields can give you total coverage against low-angle bullets coming in, so meh.

I've often said that Electric Shield was one of Volt's best abilities, but that it's still of limited utility.  I don't feel it's BAD out on the Hills.  Volt is just a gen 1 'Frame in desperate need of a PROPER rework instead of the overhaul he got.

Also, I'm finally onboard with being able to hold 1 to cast a continuous-beam Shock.  Watched that old Alad V trailer for the then-new Jupiter tileset, and Shock lasted a solid 3 seconds at LEAST.  For that matter, Volt was (and still DOES) air-cast his 4 by firing blasts of electricity downward and projecting an electric field from himself and that point.

Volt's sprint speed is REALLY slow, especially given how squishy a 'Frame that HAS TO USE ABILITIES TO SURVIVE winds up being.  I would LOVE to see his sprint speed bumped up to 1.2 for both Base and Prime Volt.  Base Volt needs 65 armor and 225 energy as well.  Still.  After more than a YEAR of recommending these improvements.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Recap or TL;DR:  Shock should have a continuous-beam mode.  I've said before and will continue to say Speed needs AT LEAST 15 seconds duration base.  Riot Shield limitations make it impractical to use basically ever, ESPECIALLY without good energy regen, and Discharge should be air-castable.  Oh, and we FINALLY have a use for his passive, so lets not have this fekked up.

Kinda disagree about constant shock cast, it's more like Chroma feature, movement speed reduction includes into rework mechanics (if so), you couldn't cast it continuously w/o it.
Because of passive, we couldn't have neither old-fashioned aircast 4, so it pressumes to rework totaly passive (which is good to fish (yeah, yeah, FISHING = ENDGAME)). And Speed, yes, Speed needs to have or fixed base duration, or toggable ability with energy drain. The second option can be or nerf or improvement, that can help to fix (in case) some of Riot Shield restriction for example: Riot shield equipped with activated Speed draining energy per meters as it is now, but Volt has no movement speed restriction.)

Edited by Cryone
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The toggle Speed would be great, given that they don't mess with the energy drain (just as they did with Riot Shield...). The switching Discharge to a mechanic similar to molecular prime would be ideal considering his build, as you have 3 choices atm, since Speed/Shield/Discharge all benefit from different stats.

The only problem I see here is again, that they recently "reworked" Volt, which would put him directly as last in line.

I also believe it is worth mentioning as others Frames are way better... W A Y better. Rhino/Chroma/Octavia/Loki do so much more, each with their survavilbility mechanic, and a huge buff to their damage.... I'm a huge fan of the idea to revert the power creep and nerf these guys that excel at both at the same time, with simple builds... Might not be the best post to say this though...

Edited by Toramaru
Grammar
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On 11/5/2017 at 6:32 PM, Toramaru said:

The toggle Speed would be great, given that they don't mess with the energy drain (just as they did with Riot Shield...). The switching Discharge to a mechanic similar to molecular prime would be ideal considering his build, as you have 3 choices atm, since Speed/Shield/Discharge all benefit from different stats.

The only problem I see here is again, that they recently "reworked" Volt, which would put him directly as last in line.

I also believe it is worth mentioning as others Frames are way better... W A Y better. Rhino/Chroma/Octavia/Loki do so much more, each with their survavilbility mechanic, and a huge buff to their damage.... I'm a huge fan of the idea to revert the power creep and nerf these guys that excel at both at the same time, with simple builds... Might not be the best post to say this though...

In reverse order:  I'm not a fan of breaking 'Frames that WORK so that a broken 'Frame seems less bad. I get that they touched Volt already, but that shouldn't mean they can just ignore him and his problems (some new, some old) and go work on other things.  That's a good way to build good content on bad, which leads to MORE problems at a later date when things MUST be fixed.

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Just now, Cytobel said:

That's a good way to build good content on bad, which leads to MORE problems at a later date when things MUST be fixed.

I mean, it is DE we're talking about.

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On 13/11/2017 at 3:51 PM, Cytobel said:

In reverse order:  I'm not a fan of breaking 'Frames that WORK so that a broken 'Frame seems less bad. I get that they touched Volt already, but that shouldn't mean they can just ignore him and his problems (some new, some old) and go work on other things.  That's a good way to build good content on bad, which leads to MORE problems at a later date when things MUST be fixed.

I do understand what you're saying, but looking at how things work in a general manner, those 4 Frames are broken... They do so much with so little effort that toning them down is more of a fix then a nerf...

Since we already crossed the power creep ladder by leaps and bounds, I'd rather have them fixed first, then proceed to re-reworking Frames such as Volt.

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12 hours ago, Toramaru said:

I do understand what you're saying, but looking at how things work in a general manner, those 4 Frames are broken... They do so much with so little effort that toning them down is more of a fix then a nerf...

Since we already crossed the power creep ladder by leaps and bounds, I'd rather have them fixed first, then proceed to re-reworking Frames such as Volt.

So, when those 4 are "fixed", what happens to the frames that become more powerful than them as a result? Are they then "fixed"? At what point does power-creep reversal stop? When is it safe to say that a frame is balanced? And if the frame is balanced, what is it balanced in reference too? Is it balanced in reference to Zephyr? Is it balanced in reference to Loki? Reversing power-creep is just as slippery a slope as power-creep itself, let's just focus on making Volt better.

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Power creep reversal could result in an endless nerfing of content, that would be massively counterproductive...

Still Volt's rework was underwhelming due to massive expectations after how good was Excalibur's, with a completely new ultimate and in general better usability across the board (then they had to nerf it because too many used it).

What stings more is that all feedback was ignored and a lot of time wasted around speed opt in /opt out mechanics and the medioccre and overrestricted riot shield mode for voltaic shied (all considered it should have been a an augment)

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5 hours ago, Ikusias said:

Volt's rework

They did less changes than Hydro's revisit, it's not even a rework.

DE:"We'll make Volt as good as Excalibur"

No unique mechanics, some changes, bugs, nerfs, unusable mechanics, bad mechanics, minor reload buff, passive that somewhat works with an augment, troll ult, VFX degradation from the removal of particles.

And I remember when they hurried to release the shield carrying mechanic, which only 1 random person suggested, after the community felt how massively underwhelm felt by the community.

Unpopular frame, low grade treatment, and I hope they trashed that deluxe coming cause it looked like trash glued together.

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It's been over a year and a half and I don't see much in terms of DE paying attention to volt. Maybe they are and just don't want to say anything to prevent the Wait Within syndrome, but this thread is reaching 100 pages long. I've literally been following this thread only to see how long it will last. I was confident in it reaching 50 pages, then it reached 75, and then 80, and 90, and now it's at 95, closing in on a hundred. I doubt this thread has slipped past DE's mind, but they're just simply busy with so much other stuff to do. They're reworking Mirage's second ability, most likely to come out in conjunction with her Prime (my guess), and then they  have to work on Zephyr, who's in a much needed state of rework. Maybe after that, can we get a good look at Volt.

Moral of this, keep going guys. Keep up your posts, and eventually DE will get around to you. Just keep in mind that they're focusing on Mirage first, because she's a tricky subject (no pun intended). She's going to be the first Warframe to be primed, that comes from a quest. This is a huge dilemma that I say they're gonna have to work around.

Now keep in mind, Mirage Prime is my assumption. The only other option that was to come out was Zephyr Prime, who also is in deep need of a rework.

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Other than Discharge Volt isn't bad, overall he seems quite good actually. I don't really see a rework as necessary at this point. Some tweaks to make his abilities all around better would be good. I may happen to have a lot of mods that really benefit Volt so it may be his low level performance that needs to be tweaked for the most part. I don't mind the idea of a held cast of his 1st ability since I tend to spam 2-3 shots every use anyway, he's a bit energy hungry. His speed could have better duration tweaks or be continuous (although how that works into allies would be interesting). Picking up his shield does seem to drain too quick, also maybe could have some duration tweaks overall. His 4th I don't tend to use, I'm curious as to what others use it for since I can't really find a use for it at all. I use his 1st in succession over the 4th for crowd control, 1st and 3rd together to save me from sudden deaths (this isn't the best, though), and a combination of other things for damage. Does it do much damage? It doesn't seem like it. I think I'd mostly like for it so be a better panic ability which will naturally make it a better ability in non-panic situations. Mostly it seems to carry it's functions too slowly, and results in Volt dying rather than being saved by using it. It probably needs something to make it more functional, without augment.

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