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[DE]Rebecca

Dev Workshop Part 4: Hotfix 18.13.2 information & more!

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1 hour ago, Fifield said:

Trinity

Even after the nerf, Trinity was the most powerful frame in the game.  Now you've buffed her.  How are the other healer frames supposed to compete?

They're not. Honestly, Trinity is the only "Healer Frame". The others either just have a small bonus in healing, or they're a jack of all trades frame that need to be buffed anyway. Trinity's abilities directly kill maybe 1 enemy every couple of seconds when you use two in conjunction. Every other frame capable of healing have main focuses that aren't in healing or even Support. If you scale how powerful her heal is off of frames that aren't even supposed to be specialized in healing, there will be no specialized healer.

Warframe is a game of roles, not "I have this frame, so I can literally do anything". The other frames aren't supposed to compete with Trin's heal. They're supposed to play their own role.

It's silly to say Trin is the most powerful. It's like saying the brain is the most powerful organ in the body. It doesn't matter. If your heart stops working, you're dead. Every organ has its' own role to perform. Some do similar things, but they all have a different task at the end of the day. If one stops, the entire system can't properly function. Essentially: You can't say one specific frame is the most powerful because just about every frame is different. You can't walk in to a T4 survival with just Trinities and expect to go as far as a party with a Trin, an Ash, a Nekros, and a Frost.

Her being viable in anything other than a Raid has nothing to do with her Blessing, anyway, which is what they "buffed". They haven't even touched the ability that many people argue makes things "easy mode".

In the end, it's silly anyway, because anyone who was asking for Blessing to be changed again was either complaining about the mitigation (which wouldn't be an issue after proper enemy balancing), and the fixed range. They changed the thing that would have been made right by enemy balance, and kept the thing that honestly has nothing to balance against.

Edited by CoRRh
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1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Enemy Plasma Grenades:

If you're like me and you have been playing a lot of Void Defense lately, it's more than likely you've had a mission failed due to one stray grenade from the enemy. These seemingly infinite-damage-scaling grenades of doom can be a death sentence, so here's what's coming:

Before enemy Plasma Grenades explode, they will live for 3 seconds after coming to a rest on the ground. Plasma Grenades can now be shot in air or when they are on the ground. When an enemy Plasma Grenade is shot and killed, it will explode and damage any enemies in range with no damage to you. A Tenno with a keen ear will be able to identify these threats and counter them with an accurate shot before it's too late.

Will there be any changes to killing the enemy before the grenade is thrown?

I've killed the hostile before they throw the grenade, only to have the grenade still be hurled at me/the objective.

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Also, while we are talking about enemy cheese, there is also the issue with manics being able to tackle you, and claw you to death with next to zero recourse on this. I won't bring up nullies, since there are a lot of posts on that topic alone. There is also issues with ancients of all kinds (toxic, healer, disruptors, corrupted) being able to throw out their hook lines and spamming knockdowns on frames. It's happened several times where a healer will hook line me, drag me into a toxic ancient, who will then kill me just by breathing on me.

Those should get looked at as well.

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1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Long term:

The bigger picture is the way enemy damage and EHP scales in the higher level content. We are discussing a few options at this time on the way scaling works, but ultimately we will preserve increased difficulty over time that demands a 'be careful and get out or get killed' set of stakes the longer you spend in a mission. The long term of this will demand a greater Dev Workshop as we make decisions on the topic - more to come here.

I look forward to seeing what happens here.

Hope we get a shield gate for high-damage enemy attacks.

On a side note, Equinox's Mend should really get an aura effect, so it can compete with Trinity's heal. Perhaps Mend can cut the time of status procs on allies by 50%.

Edited by EmptyDevil
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I believe the biggest issue with grenades is that they would penetrate snow globes resulting in a bad time. Never paid attention to whether or not that has been fixed though. 

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In regards to the grenade changes, it would be nice to have a HUD indicator for nearby grenades kind of like in CoD:

400px-CoDGrenadeIndicator.jpg

Here's a pic as an example where it shows the general direction of any nearby grenades that are about to explode

Edited by Dragazer
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1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Ballistas:

Ballistas will have telegraphing when they are winding up to fire off a round from their deadly Vulkars. An observant Tenno will be better able to identify and prioritize these threats.

Why not just give them them lasersights (with colorblind laser option)? There are some people who are deaf that plays warframe and won't be able to hear them at all.

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1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

The bigger picture is the way enemy damage and EHP scales in the higher level content. We are discussing a few options at this time on the way scaling works, but ultimately we will preserve increased difficulty over time that demands a 'be careful and get out or get killed' set of stakes the longer you spend in a mission. The long term of this will demand a greater Dev Workshop as we make decisions on the topic - more to come here.

I'd again like to sound a call for armor to not scale, but instead be a flat value.  I totally understand and agree with the design basis of being forced out in endless missions, however, with the exponential curves that are currently in use (and the exponential on exponential in the case of armor), there's essentially only a knife's edge of fun.  On either side is boredom and silliness.  If the curves were flattened out a bit, the period of time where the mission is challenging and interesting would be increased, instead of being only a ten minute window inside a mission that takes 40 minutes just to get to the good stuff.  Alternately, as it's just AABCAABCAABC anyway, allow us to enter a mission at x number of rotations in, so we can get right to the fun part.

Trinity changes sound nice.  A bit sad that Link solo immortal build is going to go away, but if I'm reading this right, this should allow a vigilant Trin to maintain 100% uptime on Blessing, along with using it for healing.  That sounds like a pretty decent place for balance, as that 4x EHP should make it a lot easier to actually act as a healer.

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Don't forget to nerf the Scorches, and give the Napalm's AoE explosion range a look. Those things have a huge range which isn't telegraphed at all.

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26 minutes ago, CoRRh said:

They're not.

For starters, all frames are supposed to be as viable as all other frames.

Now you can try buffing Oberon, Equinox, Inaros and Nezha in other ways, but here's your problem...

26 minutes ago, CoRRh said:

Warframe is a game of roles

Quite right, and there are only 3 main roles* in the game:

Energy supply.
Protection.
Crowd control.

Now Trinity has a virtual monopoly on energy supply.  And she has one of the best protection abilities in the game, though Frost's is better.

So Oberon, Equinox, Inaros and Nezha need to be buffed in a major way in one or more of these three roles, as well as having their healing buffed in order to compete with Trinity.

26 minutes ago, CoRRh said:

It's silly to say Trin is the most powerful.

This is obviously nonsense.  It's like saying that Zephyr's just as powerful as Trinity and Frost.

26 minutes ago, CoRRh said:

You can't walk in to a T4 survival with just Trinities and expect to go as far as a party with a Trin, an Ash, a Nekros, and a Frost.

Actually, unless you're camping you can.  I'm not sure what the record Trinity solo is but it's probably around the 2 hour mark.

26 minutes ago, CoRRh said:

Her being viable in anything other than a Raid has nothing to do with her Blessing, anyway,

Rubbish.  People take her to Sortie Defence, Sortie boss fights and endless T4 missions, purely for her Blessing.

But I like how you tried to avoid acknowledging she has a virtual monopoly on energy supply, which is the main reason she's the most OP frame of all.

*Every frame can self-heal.  Every frame can do insane damage so these aren't major roles.

Edited by Fifield

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1 hour ago, residente said:

Any words about the useless passives? Since you ignored pretty much any feedback we gave prior the launch, have you bothered to reconsider our suggestions now that you've seen the outcome of your decisions?

 

and wut about chroma not having real passive at all?

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Just now, taiiat said:

Bombard Missiles following you to the end of the universe.

I think this is probably a PC bug, because here on PS4 the missiles are easy to dodge.I usually just dodge or slide in their direction as they fly to my position or I use a double jump to jump above them obviously. In both cases the missiles can't turn back to attack me from behind. 

Edited by (PS4)BrutalReaper32

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Sigh... just like I said before:

NERF HARD

Buff ever so slightly. Ever so slightly. More hotfixes. More hotfixes.

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PLEASE! Fix the Phased Vauban Skin on Vauban Prime and the Rubedo Plated Skin on Rhino Prime!

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So instead of rewarding Trinity with a risk and reward playstyle we now get turned into the same as all other frames scaling with power. And if it does not matter if your teammates are wounded will once again turn into a boring ability. Or am i misunderstanding the second Trinity change?

 

If this is indeed correct then it is even worse than the last change, at least it rewarded risk a little. If it becomes a static value all it will promote is Trinity to keep it up all the time with no reward for timing a skill.

 

Oh well, i guess this will promote Frost + EV even more then, since 100% Damage reduction is better than 75%.

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1 hour ago, Major_Phantom said:

Not only that my friend. Armor too.

I'd very much love to have Polarize back to a % even if lower than it was originally just for the same of better scaling... I mean 10 casts to strip a high level gunner with 200 power str is kinda (pardon my language) $&*&*#(%&.

Polarize is no longer about wasting enemies. Polarize is now about restoring shields and creating shrapnel.

1 hour ago, Joel_The_Jackle said:

Good compromise changes so far...too bad there is no mention of mag...poor girl is stuck in the suck right now...

Mag is anything but "stuck in the suck" she is significantly more capable now than before. Your inability to adapt is what is stuck in the suck.

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You can keep the increased difficulty but just don't make it insane like it is now with the scaling. Shield gates have been suggested many times now, think it may be time to implement that to stop the annoying OHK's.

Also...

Whaaat about Bombard's and Napalm's with their insane levels of AoE knockdowns and burns AND the crazy homing abilities of their rockets?

I've had times where I've been followed by a rocket across the map and then around a corner.

Edited by Naith
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1 hour ago, residente said:

PS: When I read "The Forma'ing" I genuinely thought that you would add the MR Forma suggestion: When you forma something it starts at the level of your MR. How cute of me to think something like that.

Uhhhhh, HECK YEAH, finally a reward for hard work!

great idea

Edited by momobeach

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Please revisit the range cap on Trinity. It's way too small for missions that highly encourage splitting up (Interception, Sabotage, Spy, RAIDS), and it completely destroys her ability to help the Archwing players in The Jordas Verdict. There's no archwing healer, the archwing portion of that stage is unforgiving as hell, and they play a critical role in the whole thing.

Edited by DeltaPhantom
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the change to the plasma grenades, will it effect hyekka's napalm grenades? Very deadly against excavators and mobile defenses.. especially on sortie

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ah, just saw a good note - the way Blessing has been working mechanically rewards risk and making you consider a balance between waiting or casting it constantly.

if Blessing will always provide Damage Reduction based on Power Strength, we indeed will be back to Trinity v1 - where you run a Macro on Blessing throughout your Mission because there's literally no reason to not constantly cast it.

 

41 minutes ago, Darkwave1098 said:

Now we just need a "Bombard and Corrupted Bombard rockets can now be shot down in the air, causing them to explode" patch note and done!

you can do that..... but only with Explosions. heh.

41 minutes ago, Prinny13 said:

Not even 1 button? like X?

no. because it will interfere with other parts of the game.

2 minutes ago, (PS4)BrutalReaper32 said:

I thin  this is probably a PC bug, because here on PS4 the missiles are easy to dodge.I usually just dodge or slide in their direction as they fly to my position or I use a double jump to jump above them obviously. In both cases the missiles can't turn back to attack me from behind. 

it's identical across all platforms, and has been the same way for Years.
unless you are literally behind the Missile, it will follow you forever.

i never said anything about dodging them, but you glazed over that. being directly behind the Missile is the only location that successfully dodges them. because they have an infinite lifetime

1 minute ago, Johldemort said:

PLEASE! Fix the Phased Vauban Skin on Vauban Prime and the Rubedo Plated Skin on Rhino Prime!

maybe you should try... the Art and Animation Bug Reports Section?
instead of wasting your time here.

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@GameDesigners: How about you stop tweaking stats and scripted behavior and implement some AI that can scale in skill instead...

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