Let's talk about the monster under the bed

[Cloud]

Many believe that the game is perfect as it is. Well this post is not addressed to you, I do not recommend, indeed I invite you to ignore it and get back to do what you most please. But for those of you who feel that something is wrong, that the game needs to change, to improve and provide a more enjoyable , challenging and complete experience  .. please continue to read these lines.
For many, this game is considered a "kill hordes". A peculiar characteristic of this type of video game is to kill a lot more stupid enemies, instead of focusing on a few stronger. Being an Hord game, instead of the difficulty of killing a strong opponent , what makes it fun and competitive are the tactics and systems to contain and destroy a large number of troops suffering the least damage possible.
This is exactly what happens in Warframe, we use our weapons and our skill to contain a large number of enemies and get rid of them regardless of their level of strength and endurance.
But within Warframe there are some serious problems that undermine the foundations of this game model: 1) Scaling of the enemies 2) Skills Abuse.

Now I would agree with those who say that our skills are incredibly effective precisely because they adapt to this type of game, except that in my opinion, our skills have long since exceeded that limit, and instead of being interesting and fun mechanical which change the game in our favor, they totally trivialize it making the game itself completely boring.

Now it has been said hundreds of times scaling is broken, the enemies get to be too tough and their damage too high, and this pushes players to use techniques which inevitably trivialize the game itself. But that it's like watching a cat chasing its tail: some say that scaling is broken because the skills are broken, others claim the opposite.

In this post I will not discuss particularly about the enemy scaling (which in itself deserves wide discussion) because it would just be redundant and unnecessary. Instead  I will just point what in my opinion might be remedies which, although simplistic could sort excellent effects for then proceed with the core of the argument I want to discuss about.

I personally would solve the enemy scaling:

-establishing a level scale (1-90) and calibrating properly the damage and resistance for each level  

-eliminating the elements of endless growth 

-and ultimately replacing the "artificial difficulty" simply obtained by an increase of enemies stat  With different varieties and types of enemies based on level and eventually increasing the number of "minions" units as well.

I apologize in advance for the brevity with which I treated the enemy scaling speech, but that is not the core of what I want to deal with this topic.

What I want to bring to your attention are the skills that we use. Many people think that one of the major problems for the game balance are abilties, (and perhaps in some cases they are right) but in most cases those are not the real problem which instead was and is always our energy system.
Unfortunately I see many posts talking about how one skill or another is broken and need nerf or fix but instead I see rare post addressing the real problem at the root: Many skills are not broken as such, but rather in their ability to be spammed.

The ability to be spammed does not depend on anything other than energy system.
Being more precise, there are skills that should inherently have the ability to be used frequently (ex: Volt, Frost, Ember 1st), while others should have a more parsimonious use (Nova, Rhino, Mirage, 4th). 

But in the current state, between a 1st or a 4th there is absolutely no difference from the energy point of view. Why? Because we have elements that allow us to trivialize the entire energy system!

And these elements, my friends, are the things we care about most and that are present in 90% of our game: Vampire Energy and Energy Restores.

These two mechanisms allow us to have virtually inlimitate resources of energy, letting us not care about the skill costs and creating various inconsistencies within the same Warframe skillsets (trin 1st and 4th)

I know that for many might seem a simplistic solution or even a blasphemy. But in my opinion following  few steps we could solve this "energy crisis"
1) giving the energy restore a 10 minute cooldown
2) completely eliminating EV
3) By halving the effectiveness of zenurik passive
4) Eliminating the ES Aura and giving a passive to all the frames that regenerate energy by time. Each frame according to its skillset and average energy needs could have a more or less fast energy regen .
5) Capping the efficiency to 50%

6)Abandoning the strict division in 25/50/75/100 energy cost, and establishing an appropriate energy cost for each skill of every frame depending on the nature and its possible use.

6) Adjusting the energy costs of channeling skills and all other elements as Paracist Units  to the new changes

The use of the abilities would thus become very tactical , as well as bringing back  to be part of normal gameplay the  real time energy management after years of absence. People could no longer use their skills to lazily trivialize the game, but will have to play actively trying to achieve the best use from them. Moreover with the passive energy regen would be solved the total dependence from the ev and the inability of spamming certain skill will prevent a fierce nerf , revaluating the skill. This method hit mostly "advanced skills" (3th and 4th), which requires high quantity of energy and in most cases would merit a more parsimonial use, while leaving almost unaltered the use of primary skill (1st and 2nd).

 

[TheGuyver]

I thought the monster under the bed was how DE keeps adding new systems and features in and then leaving them to rot for months afterwards.

[SpeedOfLightPuncher]

Ok let me respond.

EV should not be tick based but duration based because duration hurts EV and that is something that DE did wrong. Capping efficiency at 150% is not a good idea. Just no. It is good now.

Giving a passive of energy regen is smart, no worry there. It is never fun to be energy leeched (those should be changed to a nullifier aura).

Also I would like to say that you are completely out of your mind. I never see people use energy restores. Like what??? The zenurik passive should be nerfed (just nerfed, throw the hammer DE).

I would rather work on the enemies, make them "smart". Give them more weak spots so that we can actually use tactics. Decrease the amount of enemies spawned and don't use scaling but rather enemy types (perfect example DOOM).

And about ability spamming. They are a essential part of the game and it should not be made so that they cost more but that really strong abilities should have a cooldown.

[Multicom-EN-]

6 minutes ago, TheGuyverOne said:

I thought the monster under the bed was how DE keeps adding new systems and features in and then leaving them to rot for months afterwards.

Focus is a prime example...Hope we get some more changes soon though.

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

I agree with a vast majority of what you have here. I'm not sure changing energy gain/drain and management mechanics would be enough to be perfectly honest though. Perhaps more situations where enemies or mission parameters can manipulate your energy. As well as more enemies that are unaffected by most abilities (E.I. Nulifiers).  I don't agree with the current magnetize effect completely removing energy but its on the right track. The current scaling, skills and difficulty manipulation is flawed, very flawed.

[Wandering_Cyberdragoness]

What...what in the nine hells and outer spheres is wrong with you?

[Cloud]

2 minutes ago, TheGuyverOne said:

I thought the monster under the bed was how DE keeps adding new systems and features in and then leaving them to rot for months afterwards.

You can see many of the actual major problems as a direct consequence of that attitude. We can say that energy system is an extremely outdated feature.

2 minutes ago, SpeedOfLightPuncher said:

Ok let me respond.

EV should not be tick based but duration based because duration hurts EV and that is something that DE did wrong. Capping efficiency at 150% is not a good idea. Just no. It is good now.

Giving a passive of energy regen is smart, no worry there. It is never fun to be energy leeched (those should be changed to a nullifier aura).

Also I would like to say that you are completely out of your mind. I never see people use energy restores. Like what??? The zenurik passive should be nerfed (just nerfed, throw the hammer DE).

I would rather work on the enemies, make them "smart". Give them more weak spots so that we can actually use tactics. Decrease the amount of enemies spawned and don't use scaling but rather enemy types (perfect example DOOM).

And about ability spamming. They are a essential part of the game and it should not be made so that they cost more but that really strong abilities should have a cooldown.

Even if EV was duration based, it would still provide an unlimited amount of energy.

With the actual cap of 175% efficiency you can just run a 4th skill with 25 energy points. That is probably good for you, but not for the " economy" of the gameplay.

Energy restores are greatly abused, probably you must still reach that point in your gameplay experience.

More enemies, with different tattics , attacks and weak points is exactly what I said I would like.

Cooldown are not part in this game and will never be. I prefer to give a pool of limited energy and leave the player the decision on how to use it. The problems happen when you have no limits at the energy you are using.

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

1 minute ago, Wandering_Cyberdragoness said:

What...what in the nine hells and outer spheres is wrong with you?

The simple fact that certain people want to see more challenge within a game does not make them crazy, in fact, it makes them exactly what more games should be keyed towards... people who want something to keep them coming back. Currently, the game is cheese... Spam 4 to win, He is 100% correct in wanting something that rebalances skills and difficulty within warframe.

[Tizodd]

Sounds to me like you should challenge yourself by playing w/o energy pizzas/zenuric/energy siphon/ev.

[SpeedOfLightPuncher]

1 minute ago, LordCloud00 said:

You can see many of the actual major problems as a direct consequence of that attitude. We can say that energy system is an extremely outdated feature.

Even if EV was duration based, it would still provide an unlimited amount of energy.

With the actual cap of 175% efficiency you can just run a 4th skill with 25 energy points. That is probably good for you, but not for the " economy" of the gameplay.

Energy restores are greatly abused, probably you must still reach that point in your gameplay experience.

More enemies, with different tattics , attacks and weak points is exactly what I said I would like.

Cooldown are not part in this game and will never be. I prefer to give a pool of limited energy and leave the player the decision on how to use it. The problems happen when you have no limits at the energy you are using.

Ok so you just want to kill a normal support frame. I don't like that. Spamming abilities is a thing because it is mostly effective against lol level enemies. To get 170% energy efficiency you have to sacrifice 2 mod slots and at least 40% duration. For some duration based frames that is really bad. I do not wan't to get in a war with you but our abilities are not what is wrong is the game. They are a essential part of the game and should be use lot. The style of play is what is wrong. The game gives you too much enemies and when you pair them up with some decent armor and nullifiers you become quite useless. Abilities are supposed to be nerfed but not change the whole system.

Also how would fleeting expertese work with 150% energy efficiency, you didn't think about that.

[Redthirst]

50 minutes ago, LordCloud00 said:

Many believe that the game is perfect as it is.

Wait, are there actually people who think that Warframe is perfect? That would be hilarious.

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

Just now, Redthirst said:

Wait, are there actually people who think that Warframe is perfect? That would be hilarious.

You would be surprised how many people who will defend DE and warframe until their dieing breath. The forums are not for those people... the forums are for this Waframes Pressure Points.

[Mutt2679]

In a game with this many frames and different abilities it is going to be very difficult to get everything in balance. I don't agree that energy vampire (I hardly see trin anywhere, unless you are looking at recruiting chat, where people think "meta" frames are required for some 20 minute mission) and energy restores (If you are counting on these to offset energy costs, something is wrong with your build) are the problem. I also don't agree with a cooldown timer, or lowering the energy cap.

Energy is not what is wrong with this game.

They have a lot more to look at than just energy to get this game balanced right.There has to be some middle ground between reworking the frames and enemy scaling. What that middle ground is, I don't know.

Right now, the low leveled game is way to easy for high ranked players, and the high level game gets too hard in general without much strategy involved.. DE has a really tough job to do to get it right.

Edited July 7, 2016 by Mutt2679

[FoxyKabam]

31 minutes ago, TheGuyverOne said:

I thought the monster under the bed was how DE keeps adding new systems and features in and then leaving them to rot for months afterwards.

• Focus
• Clans
• Dojos
• Alliances
• Arch Wing
• Shark Wing
• Raids
• Sorties
• Invasions
• Relays
• Quests
• Maroo's bazaar
• Extractors
• Syndicates
• Codex
• Synthisis
• PVP
• Limbo
• TBD: the new Void Projections and Lunaro

to name a few

On 7/5/2016 at 5:37 PM, [DE]Drew said:

we’ll continue to polish this system, as we always do

 they just need some of that sweet sweet polish

[Nesodos]

sooo... you want to force people to find other cheese just because you dont like how they use it right now?

 

i dont like a ability spam type of gameplay, so i dont go out there and spam until my keyboard passes out

just because you can doesnt mean you have to, just sayin...

 

oh, and point 6 is built on false infomation

[at35z]

14 minutes ago, PureIcarus said:

The simple fact that certain people want to see more challenge within a game does not make them crazy, in fact, it makes them exactly what more games should be keyed towards... people who want something to keep them coming back. Currently, the game is cheese... Spam 4 to win, He is 100% correct in wanting something that rebalances skills and difficulty within warframe.

Yeah but if the majority of players love EZ winning, the devs would be fools to change that, since they would be losing more players than what they lose currently with the game being "not challenging enough".

Personally, I like to be both challenged and relaxed, depending on my mood. If I feel like it, I play and easy mode where I just spam abilities and win. The usual grind that makes me feel somewhat better after a horrible day. Then, if I want some challenge, I do nightmare missions, high-level missions with intentionally low (or suboptimal) gear, spy, search for resource caches, or sometimes even PvP. You can get creative and make it challenging for yourself as well.

And people sometimes misunderstand the concept of the game design itself. It doesn't want to be a serious, story-based, horribly challenging tactical shooter, the game is basically a World of Warcraft in space. You kill a lot of enemies to get xp and stuff, grind, farm, level up, collect things, etc. Also there are quests which are separate from the actual casual gameplay. And this is fine. Not all games are the same, it's fine if you don't like it, it's fine if you're used to different kinds of shooter games, but Warframe has always been an MMORPG and it will always be one.

Of course everything could use tweaks, updates here or there, but I just don't see why some people want to change the very core concept and design of the game. There is a reason why so many people play this game and continues to grow, still one of the most played Free-to-play games on Steam and ever, and this is in the game's current form. People love the game as it is.

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

3 minutes ago, at35z said:

Yeah but if the majority of players love EZ winning, the devs would be fools to change that, since they would be losing more players than what they lose currently with the game being "not challenging enough".

Personally, I like to be both challenged and relaxed, depending on my mood. If I feel like it, I play and easy mode where I just spam abilities and win. The usual grind that makes me feel somewhat better after a horrible day. Then, if I want some challenge, I do nightmare missions, high-level missions with intentionally low (or suboptimal) gear, spy, search for resource caches, or sometimes even PvP. You can get creative and make it challenging for yourself as well.

And people sometimes misunderstand the concept of the game design itself. It doesn't want to be a serious, story-based, horribly challenging tactical shooter, the game is basically a World of Warcraft in space. You kill a lot of enemies to get xp and stuff, grind, farm, level up, collect things, etc. Also there are quests which are separate from the actual casual gameplay. And this is fine. Not all games are the same, it's fine if you don't like it, it's fine if you're used to different kinds of shooter games, but Warframe has always been an MMORPG and it will always be one.

Of course everything could use tweaks, updates here or there, but I just don't see why some people want to change the very core concept and design of the game. There is a reason why so many people play this game and continues to grow, still one of the most played Free-to-play games on Steam and ever, and this is in the game's current form. People love the game as it is.

Point is, there are 2 sides to every coin... Having easy casual content is fine, as long as there is content for the veteran players who want more difficult challenge... and some reward to go along with said challenge. as of right now, there is no challenge, and no reward for challenge... If you want to stick to relaxed and easy wins through cheese, go right a head, but people like him and i, we should be able to have content tailored to us as well and still be rewarded for them.

[SonicSonedit]

10 minutes ago, LordCloud00 said:

Many believe that the game is perfect as it is. Well this post is not addressed to you, I do not recommend, indeed I invite you to ignore it and get back to do what you most please. But for those of you who feel that something is wrong, that the game needs to change, to improve and provide a more enjoyable , challenging and complete experience  .. please continue to read these lines.
For many, this game is considered a "kill hordes". A peculiar characteristic of this type of video game is to kill a lot more stupid enemies, instead of focusing on a few stronger. Being an Hord game, instead of the difficulty of killing a strong opponent , what makes it fun and competitive are the tactics and systems to contain and destroy a large number of troops suffering the least damage possible.
This is exactly what happens in Warframe, we use our weapons and our skill to contain a large number of enemies and get rid of them regardless of their level of strength and endurance.
But within Warframe there are some serious problems that undermine the foundations of this game model: 1) Scaling of the enemies 2) Skills Abuse.

Now I would agree with those who say that our skills are incredibly effective precisely because they adapt to this type of game, except that in my opinion, our skills have long since exceeded that limit, and instead of being interesting and fun mechanical which change the game in our favor, they totally trivialize it making the game itself completely boring.

Now it has been said hundreds of times scaling is broken, the enemies get to be too tough and their damage too high, and this pushes players to use techniques which inevitably trivialize the game itself. But that it's like watching a cat chasing its tail: some say that scaling is broken because the skills are broken, others claim the opposite.

In this post I will not discuss particularly about the enemy scaling (which in itself deserves wide discussion) because it would just be redundant and unnecessary. Instead  I will just point what in my opinion might be remedies which, although simplistic could sort excellent effects for then proceed with the core of the argument I want to discuss about.

I personally would solve the enemy scaling:

-establishing a level scale (1-90) and calibrating properly the damage and resistance for each level  

-eliminating the elements of endless growth 

-and ultimately replacing the "artificial difficulty" simply obtained by an increase of enemies stat  With different varieties and types of enemies based on level and eventually increasing the number of "minions" units as well.

I apologize in advance for the brevity with which I treated the enemy scaling speech, but that is not the core of what I want to deal with this topic.

What I want to bring to your attention are the skills that we use. Many people think that one of the major problems for the game balance are abilties, (and perhaps in some cases they are right) but in most cases those are not the real problem which instead was and is always our energy system.
Unfortunately I see many posts talking about how one skill or another is broken and need nerf or fix but instead I see rare post addressing the real problem at the root: Many skills are not broken as such, but rather in their ability to be spammed.

The ability to be spammed does not depend on anything other than energy system.
Being more precise, there are skills that should inherently have the ability to be used frequently (ex: Volt, Frost, Ember 1st), while others should have a more parsimonious use (Nova, Rhino, Mirage, 4th). 

But in the current state, between a 1st or a 4th there is absolutely no difference from the energy point of view. Why? Because we have elements that allow us to trivialize the entire energy system!

And these elements, my friends, are the things we care about most and that are present in 90% of our game: Vampire Energy and Energy Restores.

These two mechanisms allow us to have virtually inlimitate resources of energy, letting us not care about the skill costs and creating various inconsistencies within the same Warframe skillsets (trin 1st and 4th)

I know that for many might seem a simplistic solution or even a blasphemy. But in my opinion following  few steps we could solve this "energy crisis"
1) giving the energy restore a 10 minute cooldown
2) completely eliminating EV
3) By halving the effectiveness of zenurik passive
4) Eliminating the ES Aura and giving a passive to all the frames that regenerate energy by time. Each frame according to its skillset and average energy needs could have a more or less fast energy regen .
5) Capping the efficiency to 50%

6)Abandoning the strict division in 25/50/75/100 energy cost, and establishing an appropriate energy cost for each skill of every frame depending on the nature and its possible use.

6) Adjusting the energy costs of channeling skills and all other elements as Paracist Units  to the new changes

The use of the abilities would thus become very tactical , as well as bringing back  to be part of normal gameplay the  real time energy management after years of absence. People could no longer use their skills to lazily trivialize the game, but will have to play actively trying to achieve the best use from them. Moreover with the passive energy regen would be solved the total dependence from the ev and the inability of spamming certain skill will prevent a fierce nerf , revaluating the skill. This method hit mostly "advanced skills" (3th and 4th), which requires high quantity of energy and in most cases would merit a more parsimonial use, while leaving almost unaltered the use of primary skill (1st and 2nd).

 

I think energy is not the core issue.

The core issues are half-baked game mechanics, features and excessive grind. New void will be even more grindy than what we have now.

I hontestly ok that we fight cheesy enemies with cheesy tactics right now. The reason why almost don't play Warframe and why I don't recommend it to any friends is because DE make something, unfinished, broken (feature, enemy, ability - anything) and it stays like that for ages. And yeah, they keep on adding grind. So energy issue is quite minor to me.

[TheScytale]

I personally think capped enemy levels or at least capped armor and shields, coupled with this, can hugely reduce the needed cheese in the game.

[Nopy117]

If they change energy so we cannot spam abilities, or limits how we use them, the game will become dull, the powers are what makes game play refreshing and new warframes worth fighting for, if i wanted to run around with my gun, i wouldn't play warframe.

Some abilities need balancing, but the common "Fix" for it that keeps coming up is for DE to uproot the entire energy system, waste a lot of time fixing something that isn't broken, or can be fixed in a different manner with a lot less disruption to the current game. 

[NightElve]

1 hour ago, LordCloud00 said:

Many believe that the game is perfect as it is. Well this post is not addressed to you, I do not recommend, indeed I invite you to ignore it and get back to do what you most please. But for those of you who feel that something is wrong, that the game needs to change, to improve and provide a more enjoyable , challenging and complete experience  .. please continue to read these lines.
For many, this game is considered a "kill hordes". A peculiar characteristic of this type of video game is to kill a lot more stupid enemies, instead of focusing on a few stronger. Being an Hord game, instead of the difficulty of killing a strong opponent , what makes it fun and competitive are the tactics and systems to contain and destroy a large number of troops suffering the least damage possible.
This is exactly what happens in Warframe, we use our weapons and our skill to contain a large number of enemies and get rid of them regardless of their level of strength and endurance.
But within Warframe there are some serious problems that undermine the foundations of this game model: 1) Scaling of the enemies 2) Skills Abuse.

Now I would agree with those who say that our skills are incredibly effective precisely because they adapt to this type of game, except that in my opinion, our skills have long since exceeded that limit, and instead of being interesting and fun mechanical which change the game in our favor, they totally trivialize it making the game itself completely boring.

Now it has been said hundreds of times scaling is broken, the enemies get to be too tough and their damage too high, and this pushes players to use techniques which inevitably trivialize the game itself. But that it's like watching a cat chasing its tail: some say that scaling is broken because the skills are broken, others claim the opposite.

In this post I will not discuss particularly about the enemy scaling (which in itself deserves wide discussion) because it would just be redundant and unnecessary. Instead  I will just point what in my opinion might be remedies which, although simplistic could sort excellent effects for then proceed with the core of the argument I want to discuss about.

I personally would solve the enemy scaling:

-establishing a level scale (1-90) and calibrating properly the damage and resistance for each level  

-eliminating the elements of endless growth 

-and ultimately replacing the "artificial difficulty" simply obtained by an increase of enemies stat  With different varieties and types of enemies based on level and eventually increasing the number of "minions" units as well.

I apologize in advance for the brevity with which I treated the enemy scaling speech, but that is not the core of what I want to deal with this topic.

What I want to bring to your attention are the skills that we use. Many people think that one of the major problems for the game balance are abilties, (and perhaps in some cases they are right) but in most cases those are not the real problem which instead was and is always our energy system.
Unfortunately I see many posts talking about how one skill or another is broken and need nerf or fix but instead I see rare post addressing the real problem at the root: Many skills are not broken as such, but rather in their ability to be spammed.

The ability to be spammed does not depend on anything other than energy system.
Being more precise, there are skills that should inherently have the ability to be used frequently (ex: Volt, Frost, Ember 1st), while others should have a more parsimonious use (Nova, Rhino, Mirage, 4th). 

But in the current state, between a 1st or a 4th there is absolutely no difference from the energy point of view. Why? Because we have elements that allow us to trivialize the entire energy system!

And these elements, my friends, are the things we care about most and that are present in 90% of our game: Vampire Energy and Energy Restores.

These two mechanisms allow us to have virtually inlimitate resources of energy, letting us not care about the skill costs and creating various inconsistencies within the same Warframe skillsets (trin 1st and 4th)

I know that for many might seem a simplistic solution or even a blasphemy. But in my opinion following  few steps we could solve this "energy crisis"
1) giving the energy restore a 10 minute cooldown
2) completely eliminating EV
3) By halving the effectiveness of zenurik passive
4) Eliminating the ES Aura and giving a passive to all the frames that regenerate energy by time. Each frame according to its skillset and average energy needs could have a more or less fast energy regen .
5) Capping the efficiency to 50%

6)Abandoning the strict division in 25/50/75/100 energy cost, and establishing an appropriate energy cost for each skill of every frame depending on the nature and its possible use.

6) Adjusting the energy costs of channeling skills and all other elements as Paracist Units  to the new changes

The use of the abilities would thus become very tactical , as well as bringing back  to be part of normal gameplay the  real time energy management after years of absence. People could no longer use their skills to lazily trivialize the game, but will have to play actively trying to achieve the best use from them. Moreover with the passive energy regen would be solved the total dependence from the ev and the inability of spamming certain skill will prevent a fierce nerf , revaluating the skill. This method hit mostly "advanced skills" (3th and 4th), which requires high quantity of energy and in most cases would merit a more parsimonial use, while leaving almost unaltered the use of primary skill (1st and 2nd).

 

all what i read was 7 reasons not to play Warframe, thank god we have DE! i rather not have any of your proposals, i thought you were mainly talking about enemy scaling/the left out focus schools, the trash cans of weapons in our arsenals, MR systems,  the useless frames and so much morefor now DE is doing a better job, all that are 7 tips for me to quit Warframe/ruin the game

Edited July 7, 2016 by NightElve

[Nopy117]

Just now, NightElve said:

all what i read was 7 reasons not to play Warframe, thank god we have DE! i rather not have any of your proposals, i thought you were mainly talking about enemy scaling/the left out focus schools and the useless frames, for now DE is doing a better job, all that are 7 tips for me to quit Warframe/ruin the game

Exactly, NightElve 

[_-Malicious-Melodi-_]

Just now, NightElve said:

all what i read was 7 reasons not to play Warframe, thank god we have DE! i rather not have any of your proposals, i thought you were mainly talking about enemy scaling/the left out focus schools and the useless frames, for now DE is doing a better job, all that are 7 tips for me to quit Warframe/ruin the game

Number one problem with Warframe currently... Players who want everything to be super easy and want 0 challenge so they go out of their way to shut down those people or try to get them to quit.... Quite pathetic to be honest. His idea is wrong, but his intention is perfectly right, Warframe needs more challenge and less cheese.

[Chromatrescu]

Triggered !!!!!

Why we have parasite eximus and energy drain eximus spawning like 40% of the match if you nerf completly the energy restore ? , ER is emergency pads which helping us on very difficult time.

My idea : Nerf a bit about Zenurik , reduce the Energy Vampire's OP'ness , make her given less energy as it should be only . if energy pads nerf then lots of players will very angry about the game itself , since energy pads is the source for survival situations . Try law of retribution and you will know how much needed it should've be .

[Nopy117]

1 minute ago, PureIcarus said:

Number one problem with Warframe currently... Players who want everything to be super easy and want 0 challenge so they go out of their way to shut down those people or try to get them to quit.... Quite pathetic to be honest. His idea is wrong, but his intention is perfectly right, Warframe needs more challenge and less cheese.

So because we don't want the game to be boring and we like the way it currently is, you attribute that to us wanting to get everything easily?......

The balance and challenge issues do not lie within the energy system, they lie within the enemy design and scaling. Do not assume what players want or how "Pathetic" they are.