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The Stalker is Teshin and here's why - A theory with many a possible spoiler. Read at your own risk.


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Ok folks. this is going to be a LOT to take in, as it's gonna be long, and a lot of things looping back to one another. I will do my absolute best to explain what I've found by reading through the lore, watching the second dream repeatedly, and cross checking the codex, with pure canonical view. no personal thoughts or opinions, just what the game itself has presented as a whole.

First, Why is the stalker Teshin? Conclave guy? Not possible. 

But it is. And the evidence is glaring if you are looking at everything DE has presented as intended, and that includes behaviour of characters, in and out of battle. So, let us look in depth at the stalker, what he does functionally, and in regards to who he attacks.

The stalker attacks tenno for their crimes against the Orokin, and killing of Grineer and Corpus figureheads, the Corpus being Orokin themselves. Again, the Stalker attacks warframes visciously, as in where he has a massive situational advantage against his singular target due to blitz tactics and shutting down their ability to defend themsleves.. He has been a relatively low threat to heavily armed and powerful warframes, if ever, until he was empowered by Hunhow. Then, he became a major league threat to all warframes, as his defenses were heavily augmented with Sentient tech as well as Hunhow's presence itself(remember, his consciousness is linked to all of his fragments. Source: Lotus lines from the second dream). Now, Why did he usually attack Tenno? Why was he a threat  Tenno, and also, why so many abilities unlike the Tenno's few per warframe? The answer lies in his codex entry:  

"Some have walked these desolate worlds while you slept. Some like me. I remember what you did. I remember the day.

The Tenno appeared at the Terminus, gleaming and victorious. Our cold and gold Emperors, breathless, bathed you in savior's silk. Then came the sound. Across all our worlds, all at once, the ceremonial Naga drums. A royal salute to the honored Tenno. Ten solemn beats to declare the suffering was over. I watched from a distance, with the rest of the low Guardians. With each beat terror began to crush my throat. The Tenno were not stoic and silent, They were waiting. They were poised. I tried to call out but only a strangled whisper escaped.

When the ninth beat rang a torrent of blood filled the stadium, loosed by Tenno blades. The drums, the Empire, fell silent forever.

Now I hunt, dividing your numbers. Watching from that dark place, cataloging your sins, I am the ghost of retribution. You may forget but you are not innocent."

Notice how the L in low, is not capitalized yet, the G in guardians is. If the class of the Guardian were low, then it would be Low Guardian. As it stands, it's most likely a point of view, and I shall explain it.

If we look at a Tenno's warframe, we know that it has four abilities max, and works on a "input void energy, produce desired result consistantly" type of system similar to say fueling your car. You know putting gas in it and then turning on the engine, popping it in to gear and then pressing the gas pedal is going to have a specific, often reliable result. The same principle applies here. Now, If you look at the Stalkers ability pool, it's much large ( See:http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Stalker for details) but again as he only targets weak prey, his ability strength is much, much weaker (level scaling does not apply to lore). So right here, we see a massive difference between the Stalker, and the Tenno. Tenno have warframes with immense power, but few abilities. Stalker has more abilities, and yet is weaker in his powers. What this means, is those weaker abilities are compensated by more adaptability and versatility. Now, lets look at the head that Stalker presented to Hunhow. It was that of a Loki. Literally the easiest prey to corner as the Stalker, due to it relying on it's abilities entirely for defense, which the stalker can simply dispel. None of this, is accidental. DE has an established habit of putting the facts out there and making them so obscure you only really see them in hindsight. The way the stalker behaves, his particular targets of choice, which is always when he has the advantage(again, lore wise, not scaling) and all his abilities are less powerful than the Tenno versions, however he has access to more than we do, as do the Acolytes.

Now in the Stalker codex entry above, I've mentioned the importance of the capitalization. Here is where it becomes important.

In The Second Dream, a few interesting pieces of information come up. You get these shadow conversations that give you crucial hints into the past events that led us to where we are now. In sequence:

 1:Ballas "What they need Margulis, is to be destroyed. They're devils, from that hell. Not Human anymore." Margulis "No Ballas, no more destruction. We could heal them. Maybe they're meant to save us." Ballas "How can you defend these devils Margulis, after what they've done to you?" Margulis "Love looks not with the eyes, but with the mind. They won't hurt anyone, I just need more time." Ballas "Hush, my wilted love. I cannot protect you. Tomorrow, you mus renounce before the Seven."

1-1 This conversation is between Ballas and Margulis during the sentient war, after the return if the Zeriman ship from the Void.

2: Margulis says "This will stop the voices from taking hold, you will have to dream, my angel."

2-2 Margulis is speaking to a child from the Zeriman, who is being plagued by voices in their head from void exposure.

3: "So shame on you! You Orokin, so perfect on the outside, but you're rotted! Through and through!" 

3-3 Margulis berating the Seven Executors.

4: "Seven hands raised. For your apostasy,the sentence is...death. Margulis...Why?"

4-4 Ballas speaking directly to Margulis after handing down the judment.

5: Presently unknown person "....it's about the rejects we consigned to Lua a few years ago. They're calling it....Transference."  Ballas " ....I know we're desperate, Executor, but these aren't Dax soldiers. These are golems, possessed by devil minds."

5-5 Conversation between an unknown person and Ballas regarding the WarFrame project that had been carried on after Margulis had been executed.

By now, you're wondering how this ties Teshin to being the Stalker. I'm getting to that, I promise, but all of the details that link Teshin to being the Stalker need to be completely fleshed out.

Now, The Stalker has been hunting us for a while, with absolutely no remorse. Never once does he ever hesitate, save for the moment you are in the Reservoir. He gave pause when he could have struck the operator dead, then and there. Hunhow told him his hatred was too weak, but Hunhows was strong. Stalker then vanishes, and you and your allegedly dying(6) operator head back to the Orbiter. Lotus tells you that she doesn't know mhow much time you have, giving a strong hint that if you don't do as she says, you will die. The Stalker shows up again, trying to impede you. Eventually, he has you on the ground, and rams his sword through your Frame.

As he's about to grab you by the throat, Hunhow says "i know what you're thinking. you're wondering, was i ever one of these wretched things? you know the answer.....You hate them. You hate yourself." 

This line, along with the Lotus informing the Operator prior to them rescuing their main body, that the secret of the Reservoir had driven the stalker mad. This Secret, which was so important that the Lotus hid an entire celestial body in the void and then implanted false information that it had been destroyed. This is, simply put, massive in scope of power and ability and is more than willing to use it to protect the Tenno. Meaning, that if she's willing to hide a moon, there really isn't much she's not going to do to protect them as best she can.(which is important for later)

Now, we look finally before the real meat and potatoes, at the act of the betrayal, and it's results. While the Guardians watched, Stalker referes to him and others as low Guardians. the low isn't a rank, as so much as it is a reflection of self in comparison to the Tenno. Guardians again, display less power and abilities compared to the Tenno. They don't bullet jump, they don't wall run, they aren't entirely physically terrifying, unless using their abundant powers. So, entire stadium filled with Tenno and Guardians watching, The Tenno are bathed in saviors silk. This detail is important, as it demonstrates the immense weight of the act. The Orokin are extraordinarily vain. They were ready to have the children destroyed just because their power wasn't able to be immediately subdued, but were stopped by Margulis. So, The Guardians, outnumbered vastly by the Tenno are far away because what do they need to protect the Orokin for presently, when the saviors are here. Saviors that have abilities that greatly surpass the Guardians, that saved the Orokin that the Guardians love so mu....oh....oh wait....oh darn....yup...yup they're killing them. We, the Tenno of the Zeriman ship, the first, slaughtered those who had tormented, used, and abused us. We killed every last one, including those handful that knew of the Warframe program in detail. It's not difficult to surmise that the Lotus along with the Tenno destroyed the majority of the Warframe programs information, as she's the most powerful hacker in the system asiide from Hunhow.

So, let's assemble the current facts presented by the game. We have an entity, that is a Guardian with limited damage powe, but greater power variety in comparison to the Tenno, who is effectively cut from the same cloth as the Tenno. The musings of Hunhow, and the Stalkers reaction to discovering the secret behind the Reservoir, his ability to even use a warframe which is requires one to be exposed to the void's energies. Now, that does not mean that the Stalker is a Tenno. The fact that he refers to himself, and others, as Guardians in which he, and presumably the Acolytes who follow him, have unique less powerful versions of mass-produced battle tuned warframes with greater range of powers. The stalker met up with Hunh.....

Oh wait. How did the stalker know where to find Hunhow, or that he'd even be in the mood to talk?

This, is where evidence begins to point to Teshin.

Who all was "present" for the cracking of Hunhow's tomb? There was the Operator, there was the Lotus, and there was Teshin. Only ones who knew about it. Period. 

What does this mean? It means that the only way the Stalker could know Hunhow's location, were if he'd been made privy to it's location. In that last survival mission, that drill fo Tyl's is just, hammering away at that tomb like it's making bank, while Teshin is pleading with Tyl to not open the tomb, as he knows not what he's meddling with. In response, Tyl pretty much sticks his tongue out and goes oh, you don't want me to do this? That means i really need to do this! 

So, the end result in this mission is Hunhow being awakened, as he'd been sleeping in his tomb until it was opened. Tyl runs off like any sane person would, and for a while thats the last we hear about Hunhow, until the second dream.

Now, lets look at Teshin diirectly. He's the master of the conclave, he teaches and observes tenno combat, helping them hone their skills to fight the returning Sentients that he forsaw in his arrival, which was when we first got the pvp rework. Read his quotes very carefully, with the information That is present within this post.

"We were led astray. We forgot the Conclave, so when that new evil came, we were not prepared. This is how we failed the Orokin. You went into stasis, but not me. I searched the long path for redemption, for the kind of balance only The Conclave can create. Now I return, only to find the Tenno still herded like livestock. Horrors from beyond the Outer Terminus are coming. You must prepare. You must accept The Conclave. Let it be your teacher and I its humble guide. For true balance can only be found in the face of the ultimate enemy. Yourself."
Remember that stalker codex way up there? where he says "Some have walked these desolate worlds while you slept. Some like me". Teshin predicted the return of an evil he was well aware of, but the Tenno had become ignorant to due to being in the second dream. 

"The Lotus seduced the Tenno. Led them on a complacent path like oxen. I failed the Orokin but I will preserve their legacy. The Tenno. Now is the time for action. Cast off your harness and become a pupil of The Conclave. Through trial combat, I will prepare you for the evils beyond the Outer Terminus. A warrior only grows if they face the ultimate enemy. Themselves."
 In this entry, we see him mocking the Lotus, by comparing the path the Lotus sent them on against the Orokin. He also shows immense reverence to the Orokin in these entries, making it a poorly hidden fact that he held them in the highest esteem, despite what they did to the Tenno.

Now, we look to the newest trailer for The War Within. In it, we see a Nyx approaching a chamber that has the following, exceptionally important details.
1: It's Orokin tech. If you pause it and look carefully, the texture and design of that room, is identical to both your Liset/Orbiter, and any Clan Dojo. 
2: Glowing crimson sigils on the back wall. These sigils are the same color the Stalker has on his WarFrame armor.
3. The entire room is bathed in crimson and hues of black and grey, colors of the Stalker.
4: there is a Void pool identical to the one seen in the Reservoir.
5. Teshin, shaking his head in disappointment, says "You should not have come here. You've ruined us both!" and draws his Nikana.

For a short while, I've been wondering why Teshin would do that.Why would the master of the Conclave, a place where he observes and trains tenno in armed combat, sitting in a room that is very much Orokin tech and practically has "Stalker's vacation home" spraypainted on it, attack a nyx, saying they're both boned?
The answer, is so very, very simple. 
Teshin is the stalker. 
Why? How? Again, very simple. What better place to choose targets, than a place where they gather. What better secret identity, than a well known, well loved public figure who assists the masses? What better way to learn your targets weaknesses, than to train them yourself?
What Teshin stands to lose upon that scene - He disables the Warframe, but knows the Operator can still leak the secret to the Lotus. So, he makes an effort to silence you via cutting off your connection to your WarFrame, as shown later with the Operator walking on her own.

This means, the Operator doesn't need to be in their chair all the time. Teshin was located next to a void pool, which most likely will house an operator chair in it which sustains the operators. That being the case, that means that the Stalkers Operator, would be able to walk around for a period of time as well.
Now, Here's something else to take into account. Teshin is not always at the relay, as evidence of his presence in the Orokin tech room in the trailer. Since he's not a God and omnipresent, this means if he's not at the relay, he's physically somewhere else. 

If you add everything up, here is what you get: The Stalker used Tyl to crack open the tomb of Hunhow, so that he could meet with Hunhow and help him kill his most hated enemy, the Tenno.

"But Lee! all the children from the Zeriman are still children!" Yes, You would be too if you were kept in stasis for millenia and also aged at an excessively slow rate.
"But Lee! Teshin is old, all the void kids are still kids!" Teshin wasn't in stasis for millenia. Void kids were.
"But Lee! Teshin is a good guy trying to help us out!" Teshin is a very very intelligent, revenge driven psychopath. Comparison? Dexter Morgan.

Edit: To those saying the stalker was driven mad by the secret of the reservoir, yes, he was. a very long time ago. Did he know the location of the reservoir for tenno, well the answer is ObviousLee not. However, as we've discerned a functional difference between Guardians and Tenno, although they are created essentially the same way, served differing roles in where they may have been deployed, as well as housed. Remember, when the conversation between Ballas and the unknown person is going on, they're talking about the transference system and the kids from the Zeriman, who were consigned to Lua. A logical thinking empire, after discovering that children placed into the dream are easier to control and handle than the up an at'em children of the Zeriman were, would have sent in any further subjects(which they did as evidence by the Lotus stating as the Tenno numbers grew, they founded great schools) in a subdued dreaming state for essentially greater control and thus have an easier time of assigning roles and purpose. This means any future Guardian would not be aware of the fact that they were ever anything other than a Guardian, similar to how Tenno believe they are the WarFrame until they discover their physical body.

Now, about the Tomb. Tyl does indeed refer to Teshin as a Psuedo Tenno which I did indeed neglect to mention due to feeling like it would honestly distract from and therefore reduce the weight of the rest of the presented information. Howver, the reason i refer back to the Tomb is it kind of explains things about the stalker being driven mad. See, when we read driven mad, most probably imagine something akin to him falling to his knees screaming in intelligible rage or something along those lines. From personal life experience, I've seen madness, and although it takes on quite a few forms, they're all relatively similar along one core commonality, which is doing things that make absolutely no logical sense to the masses. Something like say, taking a moment to realize that even if the you found the betrayers, you'd not have the ability to do much against them save for the weaklings. You'd hunt them down regardless, but you're under-powered in comparison. So, how can I tip the odds in my favor? The Sentients.... I can bring back the greatest enemy the Tenno ever faced. And while they're caught amidst the strife, I will strike. But.....how can I do this.....How can I bring about their resurrection... So, I set a plan in motion. I walked, and learned, while you slept. I sharpened my skills, I sharpened my mind. The Grineer have grown competent,pliable enough if given the proper motivation to the proper person. Like the location of an ancient artifact I found about six hundred Tuesdays ago.that leads to a tomb. Since I can't get inside to see what is in there, and all signs point to it being sentient, and I need to get in there but don't have the means, but hey! Tyl does." This is essentially a plan set in motion to make contact with the one species that gave us a genuine run for our money for the sake of revenge.

These, are not actions i would deem a sane man or woman would make. At. All. So, if you consider this in tandem: The Count of Monte Cristo was driven absolutely insane with his thirst for vengeance over being falsely imprisoned and his life being destroyed. He forged an elaborate plan that was based on entirely obliterating everything that his enemies had, from their wealth to their social status to eventually their lives. He wanted them left with nothing, hollow husks of what they once were before he killed them. Again, not the actions, of a sane man.

Dexter Morgan, a sociopath with a psychotic homicidal urge that threatens to lead to him losing complete control of himself and going on a murder spree that can only be quelled by picking stalking hunting and killing his prey (typically other serial killers) and claiming a trophy to remember them by. The reason i mention Dexter here is because if the Stalker and Teshin are indeed one and the same, as i fully believe they are, then they have personality traits that are eerily similar. Both Dexter and Teshin are public figures who serve an important role within the story of which they exist as characters. Both are for the most part well liked, with minor differences of opinions based on who you talk to. some love Teshin/Dexter, some merely tolerate him, and some want to kill him if given the chance. Now i'm not saying TeshinxDexter or anything like that, but I am saying that iif you look at the Stalker and Teshin as one and the same, and you stand Dexter Morgan with his Dark Passenger next to Teshin and Stalker, well, seems like a mirror to me, psychologically speaking.

What about the Twin queens? couldn't they have made more Tenno and Guardians? No, they could not, and here is the short and simple of it: The Twins were considered abominations by the Orokin. There is no reason at all they would have been privy to anything as classified as Tenno and Guardian OPS or files. They were left to themselves, neglected and abandoned.
As to why nobody else could make new stalker type of frames, again everyone who had anything to do with Warframe tech is, and was, dead. we killed everyone that had to do with the project, as well as the royalty. On top of which Lotus, who again hid an entire celestial body(I literally cannot emphasize that enough, just consider the amount of mass just *pop* gone, and the power needed to make that happen. freaking mindboggling) as well as most likely did information control and destroyed any records available pertaining to the Warframe program. Remember, Lotus OPHACKSPLSNRF, which is game lore, with her only peer being fellow Sentients, or Hunhow himself.

Also from DiosGX
Stalker drops a Nikana stance, Blind Justice. Stalker, however, does not use a Nikana.

  Hide contents
Teshin does

Edit 2:  The connection between the Twin Queens in the upcoming update is Both Teshin and the Stalker revered the Orokin, specifically the Royalty. as such, it's logical to assume that a Guardian would do everything in it's power to defend the last of the royal family, including making a deal with the devil, Hunhow.(see SPAWN for plot similarity). The operator in the video is in what she clearly expects to be Grineer structure, but it's painfully Orokin. It even has a void pool in the center, and if you watch the opening bit carefully a few times, you realize that you're able to see the entirety of that chamber. And i feel it makes logical sense that a Guardian's pod would be somewhat close to the royalty. We also know that dojo's float in space, and that that was dojo tech, inside a grineer asteroid. so is it not possible that the asteroid is merely a shell covering a dojo that houses the last of the Orokin royalty as well as the Stalker/Teshin' as a last line of defense?

Edit 3, a copy of my last post in response to why i'm using lore to verify upcoming lore. 
are you inquiring as to why he stopped going wayne brady on your operator and dropped you like a sack of potatoes?

I'm willing to bet it had something to do with the warframe, a living, semi-sentient being, moving of it's own accord and surprising not only the stalker, but also hunhow who thought them only lifeless mechanical dolls

remember the hacked transmission that was decoded? about the carrier signal being hacked and a possible tracer detected? so it rebooted the somatic link, which is most likely nearly instant, but causes your perception to flicker. so it's not the lights that are flickering, but most likely it's the somatic link recycling. either way, it was a very very small tightknit clue that lead myself as well as a few others to the conclusion that the operator and the warframe were indeed seperate, and communicated control via a control wave of some sort, which turned out to be the somatic link.(I was a UAV operator in the army and worked with albeit extraordinarily primitive in comparison, but very similar tech to the actual transference theory of input command, thing goes and does the thing where you want it to and how you want it to do it with equipment that acts as a signal relay and processor. Essentially all the equipment I used in the army is inside the orbiter chair. so, that piece of information eas extremely important in it's reveal that once decoded it confirmed what the tenno were, almost a month before TSD was released. Steve said that the original idea for U19 as a bulk release back when he mentioned the second quest they were working on, he said that their goal was to do what TSD did for warframe, but they wanted it to have a bigger impact. All the information i presented, isi relevant  in that it is not my theory so much as it's my observation of everything the game has to offer. you said it yourself, the idea is to make the stalker scary in his moveset, and yet the acolytes who have the same helmet, varying warframes but with a similar power structure to the stalker are out being hooligans. 

I strongly suggest you re-watch both trailers. the reason being is that the center architecture in the first trailer, has 4 massive ribbed pylon'esque cables atop a rounded pedestal in a large cavernous room with a deep sloping floor. the room the operator discovers in the second trailer, is a flat floored surface with no massive ribbed pylons and no domed tower with royalty standing on it, but instead is a pool identical to the one the tenno discovers on lua in TSD, which is a longstanding quest chain with increasingly levels of wat as you progress in the quest chain ending with the inaros quest which adds another viewpoint outside the orokin civilization. 

Again, the nyx is expecting the interior she stumbles into to be grineer tech, and yet what she finds looks identical to a dojo. it's likely  that the twin queens are housed in a Dojo, along with Teshin and the Stalker warframe.

As for why he didn't just hop into the stalker frame from the get? because that kind of reveals that he's the stalker in the trailer at point blank, which ruins the surprise(if i'm even remotely correct) for the update. so of course they aren't going to show him doing that. He may very well wind up doing so. alternately, time. It takes about 20 seconds for the void chair to make it's way from it's hidden position under the pool and be ready to receive or deliver it's operator. 20 seconds, lorewise within the warframe universe, is an eternity to be fighting a Tenno, as demonstrated by the in game lore, and our ability to destroy entire ships of enemies by ourselves. the only other faction in the game lore wise that can contend with warframes for speed and agility are the infestation, the hyena pack, and zanuka. this is discounting the nonsensical buggy elevated jump that occurs in say void towers, as thats not a story element as it's horrid pathing.

Edit 4 - Lancer synthesis lore entry that i believe relates to the stalkers initial discovery of the secret of the warframes  


Edit 5: How does the stalker track you? The stalker jacks into your somatic link and uses it as a tracker for your location as demonstrated here for the stalker loading screen;

in the below text, pulled from the stalker loading page translation you see some interesting things in the first line. a tracking signal? how would something be able to invade the somatic relay's signal and get a fix on it?

Void Link Severed

Reason: foreign carrier detected. Origin: unknown. Suspection: tracking signal.
Reinitiating dipolar connection on novel carrier. 
Bio in standby for check and sync. 
Motion compensation complete. 
Selenic lensing locked. 
Somatic control established. 
(Margulis) implantation intact. 
EVM status nominal. 
War platform awaiting sync.

Initilizing synaptic overlay... Good night, sweet angel.

The answer is relatively simple. He gets it as teshin while manning the conclave. Lets look at what the conclave arena's are/

The arena's in the conclave are three-dimensional spaces created within the relay that a Tenno's WarFrame is transported into. Which means that your command signals need to pass through to that space meaning they need to be relayed through. This moment gives Teshin the easy opportunity to snatch his targets that he wishes to hunt at his convenience as he can track your location.

Now, lets look at what Teshin stands to gain from his actions as the Stalker. The Stalker/Teshin set a chain of events in motion that would allow Stalker to interact with hunhow and form a mutually beneficial agreement to hunt down the Tenno as a whole. What winds up happening is during the story, the stalker has your Operator dead to rights and is in the process of killing you. You're saved by your WarFrames autonomous actions as it breaks War in its chest, causing Stalker to vanish. But, What if that isn't the Stalkers end-game ?

If i were in service to the Orokin royalty, the very last of their kind and was assigned the task of protecting them while simultaneously wanting to exact the ultimate revenge, here is how I would do it.

If my enemies numbers are not only high, but able to be easily replaced, as evidence by my killing only the actual WarFrames, while knowing that somewhere, out there, is their source. But I can't get to it, nor do I even know where it is to get to. But I know of someone who may be able to help. So, I launch a plan to resurrect the one enemy that was the sole reason for the Tenno's existence. I then will form a partnership with it, to gain it's trust. I will then play both Tenno and Sentient against one another until both are so weary that I and our forces(possibly Acolytes/Grineer/Corpus mass blitz on the remaining Tenno and Sentient forces. Whipe out the Tenno, the Lotus, and the Sentients in one fell swoop. My Queens will be safe, My enemies will be dead, and my vengeance will be satisfied.


Also the Stalker has the ability to make void keys, which only high ranking orokin would have access to the tech to do so on a genetic level(remember at the time of the fall everything stopped working) and teshin is in a room that is related to the Queens.

Edited by ObviousLee
added spoiler tag
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I'll re-read all this in the morning like I said I would, but, I wanted to add on the point I mentioned on messenger being:


Stalker drops a Nikana stance, Blind Justice. Stalker, however, does not use a Nikana.


Teshin does


Edited by DiosGX
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3 minutes ago, DiosGX said:

I'll re-read all this in the morning like I said I would, but, I wanted to add on the point I mentioned on messenger being:


Stalker drops a Nikana stance, Blind Justice. Stalker, however, does not use a Nikana.

  Hide contents

Teshin does


Well that explains a lot :P

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2 minutes ago, SeaUrchins said:

Oh, there's a tinfoil hat party going on here.

The poor old mushroom-head dude promoting anti-violence lunaro is the ultimate enemy of Tenno? Leave the pensioner alone.

but he doesnt only promote lunaro...


he also promotes warframes killing each other.

Edited by DeFragMe
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Just now, DeFragMe said:

but he doesnt only promote lunaro...


he also promotes warframes killing each other.

Well, I kick Stalker's arse on a regular basis even with weak equipment simply because I use the high mobility stunts I learned by playing Conclave, so if Teshin is the Stalker he's doing something wrong.

Also, a little thing I want to add to this:

What if the Tenno aren't children, but:

A) The actual crew of the Zariman, reversed to child-like state by the same process that gave them their powers

B) The whole crew was devoured/destroyed by the Void, but some enegy materialized in a shape similar to that of the anihilated crew. So the Tenno are actually physical manifestation of Void energy in the guise of humans, that would explain why they don't age.

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14 minutes ago, DiosGX said:

I'll re-read all this in the morning like I said I would, but, I wanted to add on the point I mentioned on messenger being:


Stalker drops a Nikana stance, Blind Justice. Stalker, however, does not use a Nikana.

  Reveal hidden contents

Teshin does


Makes even more sense considering how he covers his eyes with his helmet.

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You see, I love lore in games that have interesting lore, but I'm not smart enough to put everything together when it's presented in such a way, similarly to Dark Souls which is notorious for that. I don't read enough into little things that connect each other and such. I'm ok with that since I can read, watch and listen to other people that are good at that.

This was an awesome read and all of that makes a lot of sense actually. And you see, I never thought of it, because I just look at all the cool dialogue and other little bits of lore and go "that's cool!", haha! So thanks for this and if it's actually going to be like this, mind blown?! Heh.

Also, I'm one of the few people who absolutely love Teshin. I think he's a really cool character. I feel the same way about Stalker, but to a slightly lesser extent. If they end up being the same character that would add so much to this character and make it a really well designed and written character.

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12 minutes ago, Nazrethim said:

Well, I kick Stalker's arse on a regular basis even with weak equipment simply because I use the high mobility stunts I learned by playing Conclave, so if Teshin is the Stalker he's doing something wrong.


well,might be that he sometimes picks the wrong target.

moreover  , him promoting warframes killing each other is easily shown, truh the fact that he gives xou reward for each "contestant" you defeat.

never forget that the tenno on the other end still feels the pain ofthe warframe beeing stapped.

if he was the stalker, iam sure he would love to let the tennos feel pain.

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Good job on connecting the dots. I have the same thoughts as you, but couldn't connect the dots. Still, there are still a few things that bug my mind:

1. Why does he offer to train us? If he hates us, surely he'll plan to do something instead of pulling an amazingly intricate stunt like that. On the contrary, if he wants to train us, why does he need to "catalog our sins"? Why does he hunt us only after we assassinate an important figure?

2. If he'd wanted to train us, why did he join forces with the Sentients? That's a bold move that will surely endanger the Tenno.

3. If he's using the same transference tech as ours, why did the Lotus mention that the secret of the reservoar drove the Stalker mad? I don't think the reaction of discovering the secret of the Tenno would shock him if he had been using similar techs.

Edited by Jangkrik
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But Lee! The tenno were supposed to take a 1000year nap, and Teshin didn't. So how exactly has he not just crumbled to dust, unless he is the equivalent of an orokin T1000. I mean, we only ever see his nose-mouth area, his arms and legs definitely aren't normal ones, not sure what is going on under the rest of him and he has a giant hat (but given the fashion choices of people like alad v, it isn't that odd).

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2 minutes ago, Jangkrik said:

G1. Why does he offer to train us? 

I'd imagine it's his cover and having them fight each other makes it easier for new and unknown forces to kill them as the Tenno are more skilled in killing each other than this new force they should obviously train to fight against.

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1 hour ago, ObviousLee said:

Again, the Stalker attacks weak warframes only, as in where he has a massive situational advantage against his singular target.

It's a myth, his probability of appearing is not affected by your loadout. In fact, the opposite is true - he won't visit you if your frame is too weak, i.e. lower than lvl 10. This point and it's derivatives can be disregarded. In fact, everything that you said about Stalker's and guardian's abilities and gameplay can be disregarded, since you're giving too much meaning to what is a gameplay convention.

1 hour ago, ObviousLee said:

How did the stalker know where to find Hunhow, or that he'd even be in the mood to talk?

Can be easily explained by Hunhow extending an invitation and letting him knoiw that they both have an enemy in Tenno to Stalker instead of Stalker finding Hunow.

1 hour ago, ObviousLee said:

For a short while, I've been wondering why Teshin would do that.Why would the master of the Conclave, a place where he observes and trains tenno in armed combat, sitting in a room that is very much Orokin tech and practically has "Stalker's vacation home" spraypainted on it, attack a nyx, saying they're both boned?

You know, I can see three possible scenarios why he would draw the sword there, and only one of those involves him turning against that Nyx. In fact, I'll go ahead and point out that while we see him drawing the sword we don't see him attacking.


1 hour ago, ObviousLee said:

a room that is very much Orokin tech and practically has "Stalker's vacation home" spraypainted on it

It's not Stalker's vacation room, it's Grineer Queens residence. Queens, as we know, are surviving Orokin, and the room was teased before with Queens in it.


1 hour ago, ObviousLee said:

He disables the Warframe, but knows the Operator can still leak the secret to the Lotus. So, he makes an effort to silence you via cutting off your connection to your WarFrame, as shown later with the Operator walking on her own

There's "jumping to conlusions" and there's this. There's such a huge gap between the scene in the throne room (which is located somewhere in the asteroid belt) and the scene with an operator walking in a blizzard that literally anything can be fit in it. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised that it's actually someone's mindscape instead of a location in a real world.


Overall, I'd say that this theory does not hold water, even if you would use more fitting arguments. I'm actually surprised that you did ot bring up Tyl Regor calling Teshin a "pseudo Tenno", which would contribute to your theory more. But as is, all you have is circumstational evidence at best and irrelevant at worst.


And you get penalty points for bloating the poast as you did (slap yourself at the back of your head for each instance of "wait for it, it'll all make sense later" you put into your text), instead of stating your points in a condensed and an easy-to-read way and having them in one place instead of having us browse through all of that wall of text to find them. Edit your post and add a "Conslusion"  of a sorts, it'll help things.

Edited by VisionAndVoice
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hmmmm   hmmmmm

To those who are age confused Darvo is 105 and is still considered young

Anyway how about thicken the plot?

teshin doesn't necessarily need to BE the stalker could be merely overseeing him and his "condition" (madness) still its clear that they can both be guardians

Also that head ring thing is huge could be a mini transference machine (microsofts augmented reality headset) maybe 2 personalities running amuck while he is teshin his subconscious is stalker or maybe he takes naps or power naps and starts dreaming of killing the same tenno he is teaching (teachers that hate their jobs)

also the guardians and tenno are separated so sure they might have destroyed or removed anyone who knew about the warframe program but what about destroying the guardian program? As the grineer were builders its very much possible they they had some people (the twin queens) who knew how to make the guardian versions of the transference pods and that the guardian program might have been to replace the tenno program later on thus it being more of a secret then the warframe/tenno program.

The stalker i'm pretty sure used to be in the grineer section of the codex as well

this kinda gives us speculation to why the twin queens or grineer might be in on this (also the twin queens did not want Vor to open the tenno pods/awaken them)

Edited by LOTSL
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