Dojo Needs To Be A Place People Want To Hang Out.

[Viziroth]

See that's the problem. That doesn't need to happen at all. It's a step that shouldn't be required. There are many reasons a standalone dedicated server would do good things for this game. Persistent Dojo instances are just one.

Also done your way here is still the graphical overhead of the game itself. A dedicate server doesn't need PhysX or even a dedicated GPU.

Why would the host? Pretty sure most of the higher end graphics are rendered client side, including the PhysX. The host just needs a computer good enough to be able to tell where everyone in the dojo has equipped, is located and their vectors.

[Brasten]

Why would the host? Pretty sure most of the higher end graphics are rendered client side, including the PhysX. The host just needs a computer good enough to be able to tell where everyone in the dojo has equipped, is located and their vectors.

Because any major effects in the "host's" line of sight or that it is forced to process will negatively impact the "server's" performance. In a dedicate server you want it doing one thing, being host. Having it run the actual game overhead is counter productive.

Dojo instances are capped at max population. Part of this is DE picking a value that current "host" arangments like you suggest can handle, both bandwidth and hardware wise. A dedicate server at an actual hosting location could likely be tweek to hold many more. At the very least it could likely run several instances (yet another reason to NOT make players create secondary mule accounts just to host)

You are also not going to find a hosting service that will let you do the rather shoddy workaround you're talking about. Which is the real nail in the coffin of your idea. Most dedicated gaming servers for things like Battle Field, or even Minecraft, are run off people's home Internet. Most ISPs actually have terms that expressly prohibit customers from running servers and will be within their legal right to either terminate your serive or more likely throttle the hell out of it if they catch you. In the US, Comcast is a notable example of being quite agressive in that way.

And you serisously going to argue that DE should not make a Dedicated Server option?

[holdenagincourt]

I agree that the dojo should feel more like the hub it's supposed to be than it is now. There are a lot of good ideas in this thread, like having dedicated servers to keep it smooth, moving the mission selection/start screen to the dojo, adding region chat and alert notifications to the dojo or having an armory, firing range or melee dummy room.

 

Couple of concerns though...obviously, there are people who are not in clans and don't want to be in clans. Should they just retain the current galaxy map setup if this change were to go forward? And would this create problems for DE supporting the UI for both versions? Also, people often want to play missions with a set group without having the entire clan entering the lobby and inviting themselves to the mission. If there were a single galaxy map room for the clan, this could pose an issue. There would have to be a way to play missions with some other people without having to visually notify every member of your clan that you're in a lobby by standing around in the room. Maybe the galaxy map room would be interactable but un-enterable, so that as soon as you and some friends wanted to start a mission you could interact with the galaxy map node, then transition to a new galaxy map interface that looks like a room but is in fact not "in" the dojo at all, so other people you haven't invited won't see what you're doing unless they join or you invite them.

[Nicocat]

The dojo isn't just a research hub for new toys? Huh.

[CatScratch]

Maybe if they move foundry to the dojo? people will definitely come then.

[Nicocat]

Maybe if they move foundry to the dojo? people will definitely come then.

But that would be horrifically annoying. Especially for people without a clan key. Which needs the foundry to build.

[Hafilgar]

I hope they change it into your starting location if in a clan, and make it so that all of the armory, foundry, market and what not can be accessed from there.

You should perhaps still be able to access all of the stuff but if there were "physical" shops and loadout places that would be cool. You could team up with players in a "mission room" where the solar system would be visible (holographic). Like a lobby.

If your clan based weapons or other stuff were built in the dojo there would be a reason to go there too. Entering Dojo takes to many steps as is right now as well.

^this

 

...and a jungle gym please.

 

Oh and a training center. Like if you ever get bored of doing missions you can just go to the dojo and shoot running holographic enemies (no mod/material drops so as not to exploit in-clan farming) and quit any time you like instead of actually going through a whole mission just because you don't want to lose any items from quitting. Sort of like a more complicated shooting range.

 

...AND Dojo puzzles/secret rooms! Like in the void! (also no mod/mat drops to avoid exploit) Maybe the reward could be a bunch of affinity orbs(not too many to avoid leveling exploits)

[Magister_Zel]

It may be strange but i would also like to have a dojo library with a log of tenno, grineer,corpus and infested history and the enemy weakness's.View clan member stats from there and maybe watch video files of some sort.

Edited June 25, 2013 by 911nsidejob

[Viziroth]

Because any major effects in the "host's" line of sight or that it is forced to process will negatively impact the "server's" performance. In a dedicate server you want it doing one thing, being host. Having it run the actual game overhead is counter productive.

Dojo instances are capped at max population. Part of this is DE picking a value that current "host" arangments like you suggest can handle, both bandwidth and hardware wise. A dedicate server at an actual hosting location could likely be tweek to hold many more. At the very least it could likely run several instances (yet another reason to NOT make players create secondary mule accounts just to host)

You are also not going to find a hosting service that will let you do the rather shoddy workaround you're talking about. Which is the real nail in the coffin of your idea. Most dedicated gaming servers for things like Battle Field, or even Minecraft, are run off people's home Internet. Most ISPs actually have terms that expressly prohibit customers from running servers and will be within their legal right to either terminate your serive or more likely throttle the hell out of it if they catch you. In the US, Comcast is a notable example of being quite agressive in that way.

And you serisously going to argue that DE should not make a Dedicated Server option?

First part, you can have all the graphics settings turned down to minimum. There aren't really a lot of effects to process in the dojo anyway, and the account could afk in a room nothing really happens in like a reactor room.

Second I have no argument against.

Third point, my friend's and I have  hosted servers multiple times on home networks with no problems, some running for months on end, they use Comcast and I use Verizon, and have experienced no ill effects.

Finally, although I'd support dedicated servers, DE has much more they need to focus on first. Since this game supports generally only 4 people at a time, it really shouldn't need dedicated servers and if it gets popular, would be weird. Also, how would servers work for missions? Would the server just cycle through missions, would each mission have a certain number of servers and then you'd be put in a que to wait and join a server? It's not like an MMO where you just get a couple large servers everyone joins and holds every quest, or a FPS game that cycles through a few mission types. Opening up hosting on client machines also greatly opens up the game to changes, as the data will be processed through the machine hosting the servers. Also, how would the server host a mission, would it take a player slot? They'd have to create a separate slot for it or introduce a spectator option and allow spectators to host missions. If servers are only for dojos then I just don't see the point. It's such a small part of the game. Dedicated server support should be at most a back burner project random staff could work on when they don't have anything better to do. Lore, mods, warframes, bosses, enemy types, and weapons need to be worked on far more than this.

Edited June 25, 2013 by Viziroth

[Windbow]

Moved to Dojo Feedback section.

[JustDont]

Since this game supports generally only 4 people at a time, it really shouldn't need dedicated servers and if it gets popular, would be weird.

4 people (+mobs) is a mission-specific limitation, there's no reason to have the same limit for dojo. I'm pretty sure it can accommodate much more players in one instance.

 

Also, how would servers work for missions?

Why would you need dojo-hosting servers for missions? Missions can (and should) be just like they are now.

[Ced23Ric]

Hey there, please take a look here, where DESteve may address some of your concerns.

[Nickeltoe]

You can add all you want to the dojo but who would ever go there past checking out a new room or running a challenge unless you could load missions from within the dojo or change your loadout in the dojo (by hitting escape or another key to go to the loadout menu or mission menu.)  If it is easy like that than yes, why not hang and compete on these upcomming leaderboards?

 

Really they can add tons to the dojo but it won't be fun if I have to wait through several load screens to get to missions or my gear.

[-Krux-]

would be nice if, as many of us expected, that the dojo would replace our current main menu. Our frame and weapon selection all being done IN the dojo.

[Ariarch]

Everything about the dojo is a waist except dueling and the clan weapons.

 

"WHOA THAT CROSS CONNECTOR, MAN THIS GAME ROCKS."

This^

Also, ridiculous ideas for the dojo over at my thread labeled Fragor Golfing.

[Fiskero94]

I think a casino part would be rad, with different machines, and the money you could win or lose would be from a clan bank. But of course, the clan always wins..

[X3Evanescence]

Clan Dojos lack homely feel, slap on some adorable pets to roam the Dojo and BAM profit =D

[-Synapse-]

Wait, can you see other player in the dojo as is? I've only ever been in a dead clan, so I'm not exactly sure. If not that'd be awesome, though very troubling for my hardware. 

[Windbow]

Yes, you'll see everyone who's in the dojo at the time. It's pretty cool. I just wish there was more to do there. (yes, yes, I know, dojo is still alpha). You can't use weapons and powers except within a duel which avoids quite a bit of lag potential.

[Kaidinah]

I wish I could laze around in the Dojo while waiting for a group to show up on the mission I wanna play.

[EnzoVulkoor]

And you serisously going to argue that DE should not make a Dedicated Server option?

 

Yes, because it has killed TF2.

 

There are tons of afk servers that grind to get free items or upgrades.

There's servers that have "Premium benefits" which are pretty much: infinite ammo, metal, health, engie builds etc. (Makes MvM pointless might as well not even play.)

 

 

We don't need that here.

 

TF2 has become a "Why bother doing things the legit way by playing, when I can afk and come back to tons of items, boxes, and strange levels."

[F43AK]

Yes, because it has killed TF2.

 

There are tons of afk servers that grind to get free items or upgrades.

There's servers that have "Premium benefits" which are pretty much: infinite ammo, metal, health, engie builds etc. (Makes MvM pointless might as well not even play.)

 

 

We don't need that here.

 

TF2 has become a "Why bother doing things the legit way by playing, when I can afk and come back to tons of items, boxes, and strange levels."

Eh I don't agree, you can't apply that WarFrame in the slightest. Seeing as how we don't have a map editor, or a way to get free stuff while afk without having some sort of map editor. I'd love a dedicated server of my own where I can turn melee only on for awhile, or pistols only to see who's the best at pistol whipping fool Grineers.

Edit: On a side note, I want Clan Customizable Parkour maps, where you can make your own parkour maps for the clan to test and have fun with, like the lvl 8 training.(IIRC)

Edited July 6, 2013 by F43AK

[-Krux-]

Eh I don't agree, you can't apply that WarFrame in the slightest. Seeing as how we don't have a map editor, or a way to get free stuff while afk without having some sort of map editor. I'd love a dedicated server of my own where I can turn melee only on for awhile, or pistols only to see who's the best at pistol whipping fool Grineers.

Edit: On a side note, I want Clan Customizable Parkour maps, where you can make your own parkour maps for the clan to test and have fun with, like the lvl 8 training.(IIRC)

I hope you guys are only talking about the dojo for dedicated server.

I think it's alright the way it is for mission.

[Pinkie_Pie_Cyborg]

Was mentioned in a previous live stream.

Scott said something about a firing range.

Oooh I would love a firing range!

[Pinkie_Pie_Cyborg]

It may be strange but i would also like to have a dojo library with a log of tenno, grineer,corpus and infested history and the enemy weakness's.View clan member stats from there and maybe watch video files of some sort.

I would so love a library in my Dojo! I want to learn more lore about Warframe :D