The Return of Charge Attacks

[Dracario]

Has anyone else found the charge attacks in the game useful besides just Spaming E RMB E combos? I mean charge attacks and back and such but don't you all think that the charge attacks are sluggish? Why not re-add the mods for charge attacks stacked with channeling efficiency. For example the Reflex Coil mod; give it the 60% channel efficiency and 50% Charge Speed.

[Genitive]

There is no point in adding charge attack mods for as long as the system is broken.

[unknow99]

We can all agree with this: they aren't as "hmpf" as before...

The windup time is too long? People don't fly to the ceiling like they used to? I don't really know but there needs to be a major incentive to use them instead of pressing e-e-e-e-e-e...

[Nurmetya]

They've not proven useful in the least. Most are too slow, clunky and to be honest just not worthwhile in the slightest and DE needs to get rid of the single swing before a charge attack (unless its in a combo and really DE needs to drop the combos entirely and adopt a better melee system) as it tends to get in the way if you do try and use them. 

[unknow99]

1 minute ago, Genitive said:

There is no point in adding charge attack mods for as long as the system is broken.

Broken? How so?

(I know it's far from perfect, mr kavat, but you gotta develop your idea of broken)

[Jellyfish]

1 minute ago, unknow99 said:

Broken? How so?

(I know it's far from perfect, mr kavat, but you gotta develop your idea of broken)

Adding mods for a system that is barely used and not working properly. (broken)

[unknow99]

4 minutes ago, JellyFishhhh said:

Adding mods for a system that is barely used and not working properly. (broken)

Not working properly,such aaas...?

[armedpoop]

Some of them are useful, namely the sparring weapon ones. They force a finisher proc on hit. 

 

I would love to see them remove the quick attack before charge tho. Id also love for attack speed to affect charge speed. I dont want charge attack mods coming back, the builds for melee weapons are already pretty cluttered.

Edited August 26, 2016 by armedpoop

[taiiat]

most of them are just slower, heavier Swings of your Melee Weapon - which means either is a direct upgrade or just not useful.

some are more unique, and actually does things to the Enemy that you can't do normally, Et Cetera. those are useful!

[RenownedWheat42]

20 minutes ago, Nurmetya said:

They've not proven useful in the least. Most are too slow, clunky and to be honest just not worthwhile in the slightest and DE needs to get rid of the single swing before a charge attack (unless its in a combo and really DE needs to drop the combos entirely and adopt a better melee system) as it tends to get in the way if you do try and use them. 

They are actually very useful especially against any enemies you're too weak to go up against normally. Knock em down, finish em. It's something I did a lot in the early-mid game. Melee combos also work pretty well and do highly increased damage from my experience.

[Jellyfish]

1 minute ago, RenownedWheat42 said:

They are actually very useful especially against any enemies you're too weak to go up against normally. Knock em down, finish em. It's something I did a lot in the early-mid game. Melee combos also work pretty well and do highly increased damage from my experience.

Finish them, as in use a finisher? Or charge attack? Cause everything works fine BUT the charge attacks.

[RenownedWheat42]

Charge attack to push em back and knock em down, then use a finisher. They work well for me.

[Dracario]

6 minutes ago, armedpoop said:

Some of them are useful, namely the sparring weapon ones. They force a finisher proc on hit. 

 

I would love to see them remove the quick attack before charge tho. Id also love for attack speed to affect charge speed. I dont want charge attack mods coming back, the builds for melee weapons are already pretty cluttered.

well by charge attacks i mean the strong attacks from holding the melee button. I feel as though each stance mod should have their own version of the charge attack. I want Machetes to be the kings of charge attacks since barely anyone uses them so that more people are using them. Charge attacks, depending on the stance, will buff a stat of a weapon and for Machete's I'd say either more status or crit. For Machete (the weapon not the type) I was thinking extended range and higher status and for its wraith counterpart more crit and crit damage. For prova, increased status chance and AoE shock proc.

[unknow99]

47 minutes ago, Dracario said:

well by charge attacks i mean the strong attacks from holding the melee button. I feel as though each stance mod should have their own version of the charge attack. I want Machetes to be the kings of charge attacks since barely anyone uses them so that more people are using them. Charge attacks, depending on the stance, will buff a stat of a weapon and for Machete's I'd say either more status or crit. For Machete (the weapon not the type) I was thinking extended range and higher status and for its wraith counterpart more crit and crit damage. For prova, increased status chance and AoE shock proc.

Balancing machetes with a better charge attack? Sounds like a plan. :)

[Dracario]

12 minutes ago, unknow99 said:

Balancing machetes with a better charge attack? Sounds like a plan. :)

the logic behind it simple, a stronger hit, a stronger cleave right?

[Onokosha]

4 hours ago, Dracario said:

Has anyone else found the charge attacks in the game useful besides just Spaming E RMB E combos? I mean charge attacks and back and such but don't you all think that the charge attacks are sluggish? Why not re-add the mods for charge attacks stacked with channeling efficiency. For example the Reflex Coil mod; give it the 60% channel efficiency and 50% Charge Speed.

I like your idea. To add on it would be nice if they changed some of the corrupted channeling mods (such Quickening, Enduring Strike, True Punishment) to charged mods.
Example: Upon using a Charge melee attack, gain a 5-10 second Attack Speed/ Status chance/ Critical chance buff.

This would make Charged attacks useful and those current channel mods worth using a mod slot on since it won't need energy.

Personally I don't use any reduced channel efficiency mods except Life Strike and Corrupt Charge because i feel the energy cost of the others are not worth it.
 

[shut]

5 hours ago, Dracario said:

Why not re-add the mods for charge attacks

Hell no. For god's sake, do people not remember that dedicated charge attack mods were one of the most widely-hated features of Melee 1.0?

Having charge attack mods caused players to build for either normal attack spam or charge attack spam. Even back then, there was no room for a hybrid build. This led to the invariant gameplay of "lol spam E" or "lol hold E" on every single weapon. It got stale, and the players got super bored with it, so the removal of charge attack mods was one of the most-anticipated features of Melee 2.0.

Bringing these mods back would be a huge step backwards.

 

The reason that charge attacks suck right now is that they're slow at best, unresponsive at worst, and (aside from gunblades) so pathetically weak that there is no reason to not just spam E or use a slide attack instead. The very mechanics behind charge attacks need to be restored; simple stat boosts just aren't going to cut it.

Edited August 26, 2016 by SortaRandom

[Dracario]

2 hours ago, SortaRandom said:

Hell no. For god's sake, do people not remember that dedicated charge attack mods were one of the most widely-hated features of Melee 1.0?

Having charge attack mods caused players to build for either normal attack spam or charge attack spam. Even back then, there was no room for a hybrid build. This led to the invariant gameplay of "lol spam E" or "lol hold E" on every single weapon. It got stale, and the players got super bored with it, so the removal of charge attack mods was one of the most-anticipated features of Melee 2.0.

Bringing these mods back would be a huge step backwards.

 

The reason that charge attacks suck right now is that they're slow at best, unresponsive at worst, and (aside from gunblades) so pathetically weak that there is no reason to not just spam E or use a slide attack instead. The very mechanics behind charge attacks need to be restored; simple stat boosts just aren't going to cut it.

Charged attacks are the strong attacks in melee system we have currently. They didn't bring back the charged attack back because we were there when it was literally the Jat Kittag Meta of Spin to win.

What I'm saying is that we augment the strong attacks for our weapons so we can use the strong attacks more often. Most of the time players are spaming E combos to kill their enemies. It would be nice to throw in a strong attack.

[armedpoop]

8 hours ago, Dracario said:

well by charge attacks i mean the strong attacks from holding the melee button. I feel as though each stance mod should have their own version of the charge attack. I want Machetes to be the kings of charge attacks since barely anyone uses them so that more people are using them. Charge attacks, depending on the stance, will buff a stat of a weapon and for Machete's I'd say either more status or crit. For Machete (the weapon not the type) I was thinking extended range and higher status and for its wraith counterpart more crit and crit damage. For prova, increased status chance and AoE shock proc.

Thats what I meant, the charge attacks for sparring weapons force a finisher proc. It would be nice if stances determined the charge attack as well tho

[Dracario]

49 minutes ago, armedpoop said:

Thats what I meant, the charge attacks for sparring weapons force a finisher proc. It would be nice if stances determined the charge attack as well tho

speaking of sparring weapons....we need more of them.

[armedpoop]

9 minutes ago, Dracario said:

speaking of sparring weapons....we need more of them.

YES WE DO! I was hoping to see a syndicate variant of either of the 2, but no dice.

[Azamagon]

4 hours ago, SortaRandom said:

Hell no. For god's sake, do people not remember that dedicated charge attack mods were one of the most widely-hated features of Melee 1.0?

Having charge attack mods caused players to build for either normal attack spam or charge attack spam. Even back then, there was no room for a hybrid build. This led to the invariant gameplay of "lol spam E" or "lol hold E" on every single weapon. It got stale, and the players got super bored with it, so the removal of charge attack mods was one of the most-anticipated features of Melee 2.0.

Bringing these mods back would be a huge step backwards.

 

The reason that charge attacks suck right now is that they're slow at best, unresponsive at worst, and (aside from gunblades) so pathetically weak that there is no reason to not just spam E or use a slide attack instead. The very mechanics behind charge attacks need to be restored; simple stat boosts just aren't going to cut it.

^ This.

Also, the ability to chargeattack in gunmode. Some weapons already can, so why not allow ALL of them? Oo

[shut]

On 8/26/2016 at 4:43 PM, Dracario said:

Charged attacks are the strong attacks in melee system we have currently. They didn't bring back the charged attack back because we were there when it was literally the Jat Kittag Meta of Spin to win.

What I'm saying is that we augment the strong attacks for our weapons so we can use the strong attacks more often. Most of the time players are spaming E combos to kill their enemies. It would be nice to throw in a strong attack.

Players don't spam E to kill enemies, players spam the strongest combo to kill their enemies. It just so happens that, for a crapton of weapons, this just means spamming E (and maybe holding RMB while you're at it). Adding in mods to boost the "strong attacks" will not change this; it'll just lead to the same combo being spammed over and over again.

What needs to be done is to tweak the multipliers and added effects (knockdowns, forced staggers/procs, etc) of each combo of each Stance so that all of them are viable depending on situation. That includes everything from the most obscure hold/pause combos to basic E spam.

[VampirePirate]

The original charge attacks were awesome.

I don't know what kind of crap we have now is.   They seem to only be useful with gunblades.

[Dracario]

1 hour ago, SortaRandom said:

Players don't spam E to kill enemies, players spam the strongest combo to kill their enemies. It just so happens that, for a crapton of weapons, this just means spamming E (and maybe holding RMB while you're at it). Adding in mods to boost the "strong attacks" will not change this; it'll just lead to the same combo being spammed over and over again.

What needs to be done is to tweak the multipliers and added effects (knockdowns, forced staggers/procs, etc) of each combo of each Stance so that all of them are viable depending on situation. That includes everything from the most obscure hold/pause combos to basic E spam.

If that is a suggestion then why not remove the strong attacks then? DE added strong attacks back for some reason. The Twin Basolk's mod, RIft Strike, is a useful utility mod that teleports the user when aiming a strong attack at a distant enemy. And pair that with Empowered Blades and Strong attacks would be ultimately useful for the Twin Basolk, given you wouldn't need dual Stat mods, only equipping 90% element mods for damage, rift strike, and empowered blades and you'd guarantee a strong proc of fire damage on an enemy.

My question was not bringing back the OLD charge attack system, but refining the strong attack system we have now in which we could speed the attacks up so they can be more useful and have utility to them.