Void 2.0 sucks

[(XBOX)Cotton Tail]

3 hours ago, -S-I-L-V-E-R- said:

Seriously guys... What gives? Not have time for a few Rotation Cs? Ohh... but you have time to farm 11 new relics, huh? So that means what? Instead of playing 5 hours of Void Survival, you're playing 5 hours of Hieracon... And after those 5 hours, you go and farm tracers for another 30 or so minutes. Right. You don't have the time...

It's the difference between continuous and continual. I can run quick missions to get the odd relic and then run the fissure - spread out over time. 

[KirukaChan]

It would be nice to be able to do something with old garbage Relics. Say, being able to transmute 2 Relics of a single era to get 1 different Relic of that same era.

[-CCC-Secret]

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Right now, to start, you have a problem with constantly getting new relics - thus forcing you to farm them, where in the old Void, you did have more keys because didn't burn them so quickly.

With Vaulting back then, you still burnt through your keys. Advantage here is that old relics are kept meaning you can still farm for stuff that's vaulted. (I know vaulting SHOULD be gone, but it's not so this is one way the new relic system is better).

As for Endless missions. I don't feel the same way. I play the way I want to.

Traces are currently a problem but as @Doxorn stated, we'll have another way to farm them.

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You have the problem that most say that there isn't any real challenge in the game, like, no endgame content. Some will say that the game doesn't have an endgame content in the first place, but the fact remains that you aren't facing anything above level 50. The problem with people here is that it's too easy and once you complete the mission there is no satisfaction in it - the feeling that you accomplished something it's just not there....

FashionFrame is true endgame. Anyways, endgame is still there, just in a different way. It is in farming relics, most people do long excavations/intercepts/defense missions. Not survival because it takes longer but gives the same rewards as excavations.

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You have the problem where people are getting bored already from playing the same mission type. Yes, there are a lot of mission types in the game, but people will play only the ones that you can finish quicker.

This was present before the relic system.

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Speaking of a reward, you get just 1 reward per mission. You say - well, it's the one you need the most, but you really, now you don't have enough prime parts to sell for ducats, you don't have enough forma to max your weapons/cats/frames/etc.

Forma is like in every relic. Some common and some uncommon. Forma building is one a day, no need to really farm that. As for ducats, prices have been altered and since prime parts don't sell for that much plat (this I must admit is a problem), you can sell the rares for ducats. 100 for rare, and 45 for uncommon. I've had no problems with ducats.

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I could probably find more problems, but I'll finish with this last one: PEOPLE ONLY PLAY THE NEW RELICS.

You can always go public fissures. Bring whatever relic you want, no one cares. If you say "what about rewards?" it's still the same chances more or less. 10% out of 7 parts is better than old 5.6092391% (whatever) out of 8-10 parts? And if you want older parts, they're really cheap now.

Spoiler

Pros for the new system.

• You can help out a new player farming vaulted stuff using your stocked up "trash" relics.
• Faster missions (if you want longer endless missions then good for you).
• No need to go to recruiting to find a full squad to farm a part (unless you want everyone to bring the same relic for higher chances).
• Scattered people throughout the starchart. This was one of the problems of the old void they wanted to tackle and I must say they seemed to have done it.
• Able to choose a different reward if you didn't roll what you want (not applicable solo).

 

[-CCC-Secret]

49 minutes ago, -S-I-L-V-E-R- said:

These are just some of the problems here... As I've said, if you look at the forums or reddit, you'll find a lot of angry people. This means the system isn't good enough. There are cool features in it, but it's just not good enough. 

People being angry about a change doesn't mean its not a good one. Some people scream when shown a change. But with most of DE's changes, they still get polished until DE thinks it's in a good spot. Like Mesa's for example, at first everyone was saying it was nerfed. A few balance changes later, Mesa is now the way she was supposed to be released. She's not game breaking like before, but she can still do a lot.

[--Licht--]

@secret9005

Look, I get that everyone has their own way of dealing with the current problems in the game, but the problems are still there.

Anyway, I get it that there are people that like this new system, I really do. For some players, it works... for some tho - it doesn't. You need to understand that there are people that like the old system better - for the reasons that I listed (and more).

I'm really thinking of making a thread about how DE should add the old Void system back into the game, but still keep the fissure system running. It will really solve everything. The things is, we can never be sure if any of this will be read or taken into account when they try to pleases the players. It's just bullS#&$. Still, in hope that it will make this thing better, I might do it. 

[Kai_Shiba]

1 minute ago, -S-I-L-V-E-R- said:

@secret9005

Look, I get that everyone has their own way of dealing with the current problems in the game, but the problems are still there.

Anyway, I get it that there are people that like this new system, I really do. For some players, it works... for some tho - it doesn't. You need to understand that there are people that like the old system better - for the reasons that I listed (and more).

I'm really thinking of making a thread about how DE should add the old Void system back into the game, but still keep the fissure system running. It will really solve everything. The things is, we can never be sure if any of this will be read or taken into account when they try to pleases the players. It's just bullS#&$. Still, in hope that it will make this thing better, I might do it. 

Then you'll have two things doing the same thing except the other one is doing a much better job than the other. Problems happen, ducat system rebalancing again, DE wasting their time to maintain two things doing the same thing. etc

They are going to do something with endless void and yes, they have plans for it, but it's not going to be what you or the other 7 threads want.

[-CCC-Secret]

3 minutes ago, -S-I-L-V-E-R- said:

DE should add the old Void system back into the game, but still keep the fissure system running.

I'm not sure how this would work.

As for Void 2.0, I just hate it when people state "IT SUCKS" as a fact. Some of them talk as if Void 1.0 was perfect. Both of them have problems.

 

[--Licht--]

1 minute ago, KJRenz said:

Then you'll have two things doing the same thing except the other one is doing a much better job than the other. Problems happen, ducat system rebalancing again, DE wasting their time to maintain two things doing the same thing. etc

They are going to do something with endless void and yes, they have plans for it, but it's not going to be what you or the other 7 threads want.

Maintain the two systems? The only thing that needs maintaining is the current system. The Old Void was much simpler and it was working as it should. Where you have this abomination that keeps creating problems and hate among players like it's spamming nullifiers on top of you.

 

"They are going to do something with endless void and yes, they have plans for it, but it's not going to be what you or the other 7 threads want." 

- Right, because listening to your player base is dumb. Why would they want to please people!?

 

 

[Kai_Shiba]

7 minutes ago, -S-I-L-V-E-R- said:

Maintain the two systems? The only thing that needs maintaining is the current system. The Old Void was much simpler and it was working as it should. Where you have this abomination that keeps creating problems and hate among players like it's spamming nullifiers on top of you.

 

"They are going to do something with endless void and yes, they have plans for it, but it's not going to be what you or the other 7 threads want." 

- Right, because listening to your player base is dumb. Why would they want to please people!?

 

 

 

- Getting prime parts that you want is much much more easier than the old void . Period

- Only major complaints are getting new relics and void tileset being useless except for Argon.

DE have spoken about adding more ways to get relics since we're burning through them so quickly than we did with keys.

 

Also, just because the playerbase yells out "HEY DE, THIS IS WHAT WE WANT" even though, it's a fraction of the players who say that, they are not obligated to do what the players say. They do listen, they just don't have to immediately add it just because a fraction of the playerbase wants it.

In the end, DE will never please everyone and not everyone will like their decisions.

Edited August 30, 2016 by KJRenz

[--Licht--]

1 minute ago, KJRenz said:

- Getting prime parts that you want is much much more easier than the old void . Period

Alright. Clearly you haven't read anything that we were discussing here or anything in "the other 7 threads". I'm not going to respond to you.

Period .

 

[Kai_Shiba]

10 minutes ago, -S-I-L-V-E-R- said:

Alright. Clearly you haven't read anything that we were discussing here or anything in "the other 7 threads". I'm not going to respond to you.

Period .

 

Seems you ignored everything else that I said, only for you to say that childish bail out response.

A majority of the players that I have seen have already farmed up Nekros prime with his weapons in 1-2 days, even one of my friends got him in 2 hours. RNG can either be your saint or your suffering.

There are nodes that you can go to that drop relics like candy, Xini being one of them. Spy missions also have a guarantee relics drop for all three data collected. It's all in the codex to show you where to get them in multiple areas. Better than having to stare a the same tileset of gold for 60 minutes.

Statistically, getting prime parts is much easier, especially with a full radiant team. But in the end, RNG can still screw you over.

Again, the parts that you wanted to ignore, DE wants to add more way to get relics and the only major complaints being Void is useless except Argon and getting new relics, since we burn through them so quickly.

Edited August 30, 2016 by KJRenz

[-CCC-Secret]

1 minute ago, KJRenz said:

Seems you ignored everything else that I said, only for you to say that.

A majority of the players that I have seen have already farmed up Nekros prime with his weapons in 1-2 days, even one of my friends got him in 2 hours. RNG can either be your saint or your suffering. Better than having to stare a the same tileset of gold

There are nodes that you can go to that drop relics like candy, Xini being one of them. Spy missions also have a guarantee relics drop for all three data collected. It's all in the codex to show you where to get them in multiple areas. Better than having to stare a the same tileset of gold for 60 minutes.

Statistically, getting prime parts is much easier, especially with a full radiant team. But in the end, RNG can still screw you over.

Again, the parts that you wanted to ignore, DE wants to add more way to get relics.

I support this claim. Relics can be found almost anywhere.

@-S-I-L-V-E-R- I think that you forgot to consider that those satisfied with the new system don't talk about it. They just continue farming. We don't have an accurate number of satisfied people. Most of the people dissatisfied with the new system post a thread about it making it appear that they're a majority. Most of the people in my alliance have no trouble with the new system and most of them aren't active on the forums/reddit.

[--Licht--]

I'm not saying that "we" are the majority. I didn't even use the forums till recently. And really, there are features that I really like about the new systems and there are some that I just dislike.

Like I've said, I know that there are a lot of people that like every aspect about this new system, but you can clearly see that there are people that dislike it. For some this was a good change, for others it was an unwelcome one. That's why I said that it will be better if they could have both systems running. So that people that have valid reasons to complain can choose which one to play. It's very unlikely to happen, but at least they should find a way to fix the problems people have listed. 

[Racter]

To be honest this change seems like it completely screwed everyone and I don't understand how more people aren't up in arms about it. I'm a vet with 1000s of keys, all of which are now essentially inventory bloat. I know exactly how the new system works, I got all the parts in two days, and I still absolutely hate it. It made all previous key accumulations basically worthless, it makes parts far more annoying to grind for new players and veterans, and for what? You replaced grinding t3s rot C with grinding some random, generally more tedious star map mission to get a relic, to go grind very, very boring star map missions to get traces to upgrade that relic, to go grind those same very, very boring star map missions to get a chance at your part. We replaced 60m t3s survivals with 6 10 and out Io's and 4 round Xini's.

 

In the old system, I would often burn through tons of my keys, 10 20 30 a day depending on the mission type, to help others get parts. I got ducats out of the deal, mostly had fun playing on my second favorite tile set, made a little plat here and there if I got a rare part to sell. Now, the process is so mind numbingly boring that I didn't even want to finish grinding the new prime access by the end of the first day, let alone now a week later. There is no chance I'm going to bother getting extra relics for clan/alliance members, or worse go through grinding the traces again to upgrade them all. I know for a fact I'm not alone in this, and this appears to be becoming a big issue for people (at least in my alliance). I've seen multiple people asking for groups for parts as recent as Vauban and no one wants to bother with it anymore. Thankfully Baro has been stingy lately so my ducat hoard should last quite a while, but I really feel bad for the people that have to try and power grind out ducats every weekend for his stuff.

[(PSN)XXPsychosisX187]

Fix the system so old and new players benefit i have relics that give me nothing and farming traces is a pain 

[(XBOX)Cotton Tail]

7 hours ago, KirukaChan said:

It would be nice to be able to do something with old garbage Relics. Say, being able to transmute 2 Relics of a single era to get 1 different Relic of that same era.

Trade them - I'm sure people (like me) would be interested in relics with potential drops for gear that we haven't got

[-CCC-Secret]

4 hours ago, -S-I-L-V-E-R- said:

...but at least they should find a way to fix the problems people have listed. 

They will probably work more on the issues at hand. They make feedback threads for a reason. But again, no expecting changes we want because it's DE's game anyways, they get the final say.

3 hours ago, Racter0325 said:

To be honest this change seems like it completely screwed everyone and I don't understand how more people aren't up in arms about it.

Because not everyone dislikes change. It's not that bad of a change, but it does have issues.

3 hours ago, Racter0325 said:

I'm a vet with 1000s of keys, all of which are now essentially inventory bloat. I know exactly how the new system works, I got all the parts in two days, and I still absolutely hate it. It made all previous key accumulations basically worthless, it makes parts far more annoying to grind for new players and veterans, and for what? You replaced grinding t3s rot C with grinding some random, generally more tedious star map mission to get a relic, to go grind very, very boring star map missions to get traces to upgrade that relic, to go grind those same very, very boring star map missions to get a chance at your part. We replaced 60m t3s survivals with 6 10 and out Io's and 4 round Xini's.

What's so bad about getting the prime stuff you wanted faster? Key Accumulation will be worth more later on since vaulting is still a thing. The point of the change was that you don't have to get stuck at the SAME TILESET every time. They wanted to spread people throughout the starchart with Void 2.0 and they achieved it. There's multiple places for farming relics (Xini, Cerberus, Berehynia, etc), and it's not the same boring tileset every time.

 

[Takkov]

The problem is, that i dont get it faster, i ran far more than 12 radiant relics for the new prime stuff and guess what, not one rare part in there. In addition, most of the relics i get in the farming missions are old relics, i dont need to get nekros parts. also, i have to grind for traces, which makes it also more annoying, so from my standing point, i dont see reduced grind anywhere. Btw, i dont care, if other people get stuff faster, its about everyone for himself in the end.

Also, the fissure missions are utterly boring, its just an extermination until you have your 10 reactant, then finish the mission.

I personally think, that the old system improved the social part of warframe more then now, quite a lot of players on my friend list i got to know in endless tower missions.

[(XBOX)Ahkyoz]

I thought i wouldn't like it....... but it did make it easier and also yea I am not reading all that

Edited August 30, 2016 by (XB1)Itz chibi

[Telogor]

6 hours ago, (XB1)Cotton Tail said:

Trade them - I'm sure people (like me) would be interested in relics with potential drops for gear that we haven't got

Trade chat is still cancer.  Why waste what time I have in Warframe in trade chat when I need to be grinding out Relics to grind out Traces to grind out Primes?

Additionally, I've addressed every single legitimate counterargument in my OP.  Perhaps people could try reading it again?

Edited August 31, 2016 by Telogor

[Jakku]

On 8/16/2016 at 7:43 PM, Jakku said:

Old void bring it back, why? I want it that way!

 

 

On 8/16/2016 at 7:55 PM, Jakku said:

The old way of void after an T3D 100 wave.

 

 

On 8/15/2016 at 4:03 PM, Jakku said:

Ok so here goes nothing, you use one/1 relic and is guaranteed one/1 prize.

So why is it that when four/4 relic(s) are used you still acquire one/1 prize .

This alone is making myself think that the drop table(s) are a sham in terms of item use and effort, let alone the fact that there is no real selection in what you get what so ever.

The selection in a four/4 man party is only due to multiple/ different relic(s) used with prize (s) that are not similar to your own.

And therefor you get to pick a prize (one/1 prize) out of  4 relic(s).

Why is it this way and why are you selecting a single item out of 4 item(s) that should be guaranteed to the player.

*I find myself only doing captures solo due  to the fact of being guaranteed 1 item (one relic/1 item) per void fissure mission.*

It is as if teaming up means nothing anymore due to this fact of less quantity and more effort and time.

The old ways of void was five minute(s) or wave(s) per said reward be it what ever the tier and/or mission it was (Defense, Survival ect).

This new way is one/1 reward per fissure, no matter how many in the party.

This to me is ground breaking in terms of playing to achieve any what so ever ducat(s) and or set(s) of item herein.

If nothing is to be done then I for one will definitely have to solo more mission(s) as stated previously, because if it is a single item each time then why bother.

 

[rynocerator]

19 hours ago, secret9005 said:

Made a thread on my experience with the prime part farming.

You also forgot to mention how much faster we do fissure missions. Most of the good rewards back then was at T3 Survival Rotation C. Now 20 minutes for the part you want, only to be disappointed in not getting it? Not everyone has that much time in a day to grind 3-5 Rotation Cs. Sure burning through relics is faster, but you get a chance at your reward faster too.

This is pretty much me. I recently had a baby and it greatly reduced the amount of time I can play in one sitting. Being able to run 5-10 fissures in the span of an hour is much more enjoyable for me than waiting for 3 C rotations to not get what I want.

I'll take 10 tries over 3, regardless of outcome.

[Racter]

8 hours ago, secret9005 said:

They will probably work more on the issues at hand. They make feedback threads for a reason. But again, no expecting changes we want because it's DE's game anyways, they get the final say.

Because not everyone dislikes change. It's not that bad of a change, but it does have issues.

What's so bad about getting the prime stuff you wanted faster? Key Accumulation will be worth more later on since vaulting is still a thing. The point of the change was that you don't have to get stuck at the SAME TILESET every time. They wanted to spread people throughout the starchart with Void 2.0 and they achieved it. There's multiple places for farming relics (Xini, Cerberus, Berehynia, etc), and it's not the same boring tileset every time.

 

That's the thing, for me it is not faster. That one part with a 2% drop chance (feels like it was Nekros system this time around, nothing else took more than three runs for me) was, sure, but everything else took substantially longer. Tigris Receiver for example, say it had gone into an old T3 capture instead of the new relic system. Instead of doing Xini/Io runs to farm the relic, I could have gone straight to farming the part. Void captures even post coptering took me under 2min to run on average, I could (and would have vastly preferred to) have easily run 20 of them in the time it took me to get 1 relic and refine it. Even then, I didn't even get it from my refined V3 key, I got it on my radiant N3 (Paris String of course) from someone else. As I said before, there are definitely perks to this new system, and I can imagine that anyone that didn't like survival and/or the void is probably burned out on it by now. I get that, I really do, because not even a week into this system's first real trial run I'm already sick of relic and trace farming.

 

Btw, I highly recommend doing radiant runs like old key shares. The fissure missions are a joke to run, might as well not waste 4 new, upgraded keys at once considering the time it takes to get and upgrade them.

[DSpite]

23 hours ago, PickleMonster21 said:

Look above. 6 people (including myself) vs 2 people (including yourself). Sure, these results are only on a simple Forum, but I have no substantial evidence to back me up. It's not like there's a Megathread on why this new system is great... is there?

I hated the old Void and stockpiled my keys. I then ran the new system and finished off 6 old Frames that were missing parts.

I would now want to go back to the old system and be made to run stupid Endless rotations.

 

 

[(XBOX)Cotton Tail]

7 hours ago, Telogor said:

Trade chat is still cancer.  Why waste what time I have in Warframe in trade chat when I need to be grinding out Relics to grind out Traces to grind out Primes?

Additionally, I've addressed every single legitimate counterargument in my OP.  Perhaps people could try reading it again?

I did re-read your post. There was no mention of trading relics just that you had "over 920 useless Relics, just sitting in my inventory gathering dust until I have nothing better to do than farm ducats". I was suggesting a possible use - I would be very interested in trading relics I've farmed that could give the latest PA gear for older relics that could give other stuff that I still want. I'm in no rush to get the latest primes.

Additionally my comment was in regards to the suggestion for a transmute option for relics which strikes me as a great idea - perhaps this could be a rare item that drops from endless void missions with increasing power to transmute 1/3/5 relics?