Xaero Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 Still think the best idea is to have an innate Vacuum as we do in Archwing. The main problem of Sentinels to me is that they die very fast in high-level missions and I have to run the rest of the mission (or until I die and respawn) picking all the drop manually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demon.King Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 (edited) 6 hours ago, Ksaero said: Still think the best idea is to have an innate Vacuum as we do in Archwing. The main problem of Sentinels to me is that they die very fast in high-level missions and I have to run the rest of the mission (or until I die and respawn) picking all the drop manually. As I said, the devs clearly want Vacuum to still be a mod. So my suggestion caters to everyone. Those that want to collect everything and those that refused to use vacuum just because it wasted Ammo/Health/Energy. Apart from innate vacuum with specific options and customisation in settings menu, which would take time, this is the only compromise with 0 drawbacks compared to now. Edited September 17, 2016 by Demon.King Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EothasianBoar Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Demon.King said: As I said, the devs clearly want Vacuum to still be a mod. So this caters to everyone. Those that want to collect everything and those that refused to use vacuum just because it wasted Ammo/Health/Energy. I'm the later type. If there is an option to opt out of the effect, I'm all for having innate to warframe. Dev want to let people choose whether or not they want to have it, and I think, for them, mod are the easiest way to achieve that Edited September 17, 2016 by AhLiu338 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xaero Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 Just now, Demon.King said: As I said, the devs clearly want Vacuum to still be a mod. So this caters to everyone. Those that want to collect everything and those that refused to use vacuum just because it wasted Ammo/Health/Energy. Well not so long ago they also stated Carrier was perfectly fine and would stay that forever. Innate Vacuum is just a QoL change that doesn't break the game or trivializes anything. If community is persistent enough we may get what we want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hixlysss Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 So long the mod can be put on ANY companion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)HarigeVINCE Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 (edited) Look, instead of balancing the sentinels and making Carrier as useful as the others, they choose to destroy Carrier and its quality of life instead. The idea was to let people use various sentinels, not to destroy the 'best' so everyone has to go for another sentinel... Carrier can't spend 3 mod slots for a vacuum effect, he needs the slots for survivability in higher levels! I'll tell you what the change should have been. Original Vacuum remains untouched. 2 new universal vacuum mods for all compagnions; one for health, energy and ammo, the other one for resources, endo, mods,... This way no quality of life gets nuked, Carrier is still the same, other compagnions can have vacuum too and trading 2 mod slots for it is more than enough. My point is that with this change no usability is destroyed while still having the same desired result: more use of other compagnions! Edited September 17, 2016 by (PS4)HarigeVINCE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demon.King Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 3 minutes ago, Hixlysss said: So long the mod can be put on ANY companion. That would be ideal, but I doubt DE will do it. I have all companion types, of all breeds. I would like to be able to use everything, but kubrow/kavat AI is generally terrible and not worth losing vacuum for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)ghinellil Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 You not even tried it, and already complain... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukinu_u Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 I think innqte Vacuum still the best solution. I dont know why Kubrow/Kavat user have to step on things they want and not sentinels users... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VerinESC Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 To continue on the title, perhaps have Vacuum at current range and power innate on all Warframes but only for Mods, Endo and resources Resources. Energy Vacuum could be a mod for all Companions and Sentinels. But make it 2 separate ones, one for Sentinels that Vacuums around you then another for Companions that has a higher mod cost that sucks up energy that it finds out in the wild and flings it to you, like GPull used to do, but just for energy. Ammo Vacuum could be a Precept for Carrier, the ammo conversion can be innate and scale to the Carrier's level, the ammo pool can still be a precept. There we go, Vacuum split into 3 mods, just like DE wanted but in a way that makes sense. (I understand why the DE staff are scared of Vacuum, energy is a precious resource and you should be looking for it. There should be moments when you look at your ammo pool and think "S#&$ gotta go looting." They don't want to spoon-feed you the game, they want you to be playing rather than just using your numpad and enjoying some TV/YouTube or whatever else you use to numb the grind) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hixlysss Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 39 minutes ago, Demon.King said: That would be ideal, but I doubt DE will do it. I have all companion types, of all breeds. I would like to be able to use everything, but kubrow/kavat AI is generally terrible and not worth losing vacuum for. I guess the Ai is RNG based. I've had great luck with my kubrow/kavat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bl4ckhunter Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 We still need ammo vacuum on everything, a lot of weapons are useless without it and i don't want to be pigeonholed into using carrier becouse of my weapon choiche, agree on th energy orb thing, picking up those isn't that much of an issue, maybe make them a bit bigger but that's it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airwolfen Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 9 hours ago, Troll_Logic said: Right here Really. Ok, wordsmith, explain to me the nuance between "don't care" and "not concerned. Like not even close" *sigh* Its the target that counts here. What I do care about, The vacuum change becoming universal in any way. If one has a view on this why should they not react in a discussion about it. Or did you mean to post your thread in "one-way bashing" instead. What I do NOT care about, Overreactions made by the community BEFORE we even know how good carriers effect will be but nope the automatic response is "Carrier nerfed into the ground, EVERYBODY PANIC/HATE ON THIS CHANGE". The issues people see here with the change simply do not concern me before all info is out and playtesting has been done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VerinESC Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 Just now, bl4ckhunter said: We still need ammo vacuum on everything, a lot of weapons are useless without it and i don't want to be pigeonholed into using carrier becouse of my weapon choiche, agree on th energy orb thing, picking up those isn't that much of an issue, maybe make them a bit bigger but that's it Yeah I was spitballing on the ammo thing. But have you played with Carrier recently? The pick up range looks to be between 1m and 2m now instead of at your feet so Maybe just boost that a little so when jumping above it you still grab the ammo then I can live without it. Primed Ammo Mutaion is under-rated too, really helps when you don't have Carrier on and there are only a few random ammo pods near you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kubbi Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 3 different types of vaccuum? No thanks. I don't feel like cluttering all slots just for comfortable gameplay. Either make vaccuum just for all sentinels or I prever carrier the way it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bl4ckhunter Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 Just now, VerinESC said: Yeah I was spitballing on the ammo thing. But have you played with Carrier recently? The pick up range looks to be between 1m and 2m now instead of at your feet so Maybe just boost that a little so when jumping above it you still grab the ammo then I can live without it. Primed Ammo Mutaion is under-rated too, really helps when you don't have Carrier on and there are only a few random ammo pods near you. I'm not sure you've understood the extent of the problem, on some weapon (glaxion, kohm, s.gammacor) need a primed ammo mutation AND carrier to be usable past ten minutes, the kohm takes 24 (!!!) clips for a reload, and you've got 4 reloads in magazine, if you have any intention of using that thing past that you need to pick up all the ammo pickups in the universe, the glaxion? it basically directly fires ammo pizzas, even with primed mutation AND carrier it still runs out of ammo fast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bl4ckhunter Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 8 minutes ago, Airwolfen said: What I do NOT care about, Overreactions made by the community BEFORE we even know how good carriers effect will be but nope the automatic response is "Carrier nerfed into the ground, EVERYBODY PANIC/HATE ON THIS CHANGE". The issues people see here with the change simply do not concern me before all info is out and playtesting has been done. Basically when it's too late to do anything about it this year and we have to wait in the hope that a rework comes around in a year or so? i prefer being concerned now than having to deal with the fallout for ages before they get around to fixing it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misgenesis Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 (edited) Unbelievable. You essentially get universal Vacuum, you still complain. Personally this turned out to be better than i expected, no forced universal vacuum and choices. Edited September 17, 2016 by Misgenesis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sold0ut Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Misgenesis said: Unbelievable. You essentially get universal Vacuum, you still complain. Personally this turned out to be better than i expected, no forced universal vacuum and choices. You clearly don't read. We don't get universal vacuum. We get three nerfed to hell mods that randomly do different things each. It's horrible. If we had gotten universal vacuum we'd be celebrating. It's still forced. Not forcing it would be to make it an optional setting that you can turn off or on, you dingus. Just now they force 3 mods instead of 1. Edited September 17, 2016 by Sold0ut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airwolfen Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 1 minute ago, bl4ckhunter said: Basically when it's too late to do anything about it this year and we have to wait in the hope that a rework comes around in a year or so? i prefer being concerned now than having to deal with the fallout for ages before they get around to fixing it Oh that is open to discussion in my book. But to combine it with that carrier gets nerfed into the ground and will become THE useless sentinel... Leave that part out please... That is basically the context of the original thread that got merged with this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misgenesis Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Sold0ut said: You clearly don't read. We don't get universal vacuum. We get three nerfed to hell mods that randomly do different things each. It's horrible. If we had gotten universal vacuum we'd be celebrating. It's still forced. Not forcing it would be to make it an optional setting that you can turn off or on, you dingus. Just now they force 3 mods instead of 1. Essentially. I dont have to use it, its not forced. Edited September 17, 2016 by Misgenesis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bl4ckhunter Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 2 minutes ago, Airwolfen said: Oh that is open to discussion in my book. But to combine it with that carrier gets nerfed into the ground and will become THE useless sentinel... Leave that part out please... That is basically the context of the original thread that got merged with this one. They merged so much stuff in this thread that there's not really any point besides using it as dashboard, personally i think that carrier gets the best deal out there with the ammo mutation precept, but i'd like the ammo pickup issue to be solved rather than splitting a bandaid in 3 mini bandainds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilChaosKnight Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 3 mods instead of 1 is indeed a pretty massive slap to the face IMO. Granted I don't NEED it per see. Just like I don't NEED to play Warframe. I need air, shelter, food and water. But just like playing Warframe is fun (mostly) and helps with the stress (mostly), using Vacuum helps to keep the fun up and frustrations down. Or rather, how to put it better. It's like a drummer in a musical band. You don't really notice his work until he screws up. And now I'll have to make room for 3 drummers to have the effectiveness of just 1? In an action game like Warframe, spending time to carefully collect every little box you need is just a pace and game rhythm killer. Which is a pretty darn bad game design practice which should never be encouraged IMO. Now if we look at other fast paced games of the past you'd have: - A lot less but more valuable pick ups in general. (Not gonna work in WF as there's a lot of drops to be picked up.) - In UT, Doom and Quake series small items which you need a lot of are generally lined up on the ground. (Obviously not gonna work with small random drops.) - Innate "vacuum" in some titles, mostly sandboxes like Terraria, Minecraft, Starbound, NMS, etc. which like Warframe have a lot of loot to collect. Why we don't have innate vacuum to this day (can be like a half range of what Carrier gives atm) is something I can't understand at all tbh. It's a matter of convinience and general player comfort which has nothing to do with actual difficulty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonteaomd Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 (edited) Are we changing warframe abilities also? I like playing mesa but dont want to miss op world on fire....please make world on fire a mod. It's not fair that i have to play ember just to get world on fire. Please DE Edited September 17, 2016 by Bonteaomd Leave carrier the way it is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonicSonedit Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 I already know who I am going to use now: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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