Jump to content
Temporary sub-forum for Update 30: Call of the Tempestarii ×

Excalibur is overnerfed. Badly.


Recommended Posts

9 hours ago, (PS4)DesecratedFlame said:

To be honest, I think DE wants Excal to be subpar at this point. He is the poster boy for the game, so he will always be a starter. As such, I don't think they want him being too viable because they want to give people a reason to farm (or buy) a replacement. 

 

I thought of this a while back:

The starters should be broken, lesser versions just like the Mk1 weapons and shattered mods. They'd work just fine for lower level content, but at some point looking for a different frame or even just the direct upgrade of your starter would have a sense of progression. This way they wouldn't have to do too much to Excalibur. As the starting Excalibur would be "worse" than the one you can farm.

Link to post
Share on other sites

For me some problems with the idea of starting off with mk1-frames is the loss of nostalgia, connection to your first frame some of us have. 

I first started playing in closed beta and selected Excal because he was indicated as a "balanced frame" at the time. Played it for a while and it just didn't grab me (the game, not Excal). One of my best friends got in and we played together for a while and it still didn't grab me.

After a while he talked me into giving it yet another go (a bit before the 1st year anniversary, only reason I know this for sure was because towards the end of that "trial" I logged in just to get the Dex Furis because "free weapon!") and it still didn't really do it for me.

Much later due to the game getting some good buzz on Youtube I decided to come back yet again and check it out. It had been long enough since I first started that I had to re-do the New Player Tutorial and picked Volt this time, since I hadn't liked Excal.

Volt was good fun but when the tutorial was over the game dug up my old info and there was Excal waiting for me again.

But this was after his major rework (Summer-ish 2015) and he was actually pretty cool now, yay!

And since I had really enjoyed my time with Volt I had to get him too.

This time trying out the game again, it hooked me pretty hard. And I always see Excal as my original starter Frame, he's my "hero frame". And Volt was my "coming back to the game, re-starting Frame". SO they both have a special place in my heart/mind now.

But my mk1 weapons? The only feelings I ever had towards those was what complete garbage they were/are and how they totally fail to do what they need to even at a lot level.

Now in part that can be blamed on the low stats of the mk1 weapons, and also on the huge lack of mods a new player starts with combined with needing to know and be able to level up those mods and apply them.

The mk1 Paris was such a hunk of junk, it couldn't even manage to one shot (even on head shots!) mobs on Mercury where we tried to be all sneaky sneaky Ninja's and get Stealth kills as much as possible. Replacing it with the actual Paris was a massive upgrade because it could actually one-shot head-shot kill stuff. 

I don't ever look back at my Lato or mk1 Paris and think "man I should re-build that, they really take me back to some good times" but I do look at Excal and he's always my "og-frame" and Volt will always be my "tried to pick him as my re-starting frame".

New players lack mods and the ones they do get are Damaged, so they already start off in a much worse position than "vets". 

Giving them gimped frames, I don't think that would make things better.

All IMO of course!

Cheers!

~R~

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 9/27/2016 at 10:32 PM, Epsik-kun said:

I believe you are missing the difference between a concept and the final product.

And the concept isn't required to touch on everything that needs to change immediately. That's why it's a concept. 

On 9/27/2016 at 10:32 PM, Epsik-kun said:

I can guarantee that "a generic shooter with an occasional ability thrown in once in a hour" is not something close to whatever vision DE has - now or in the future.

Nobody said limitations had to be extreme. They just have to be effective to have a purpose.

On 9/27/2016 at 10:32 PM, Epsik-kun said:

Which means it is Life Strike working. Not channeling.

Next time on "see how many hairs you can split!"

On 9/27/2016 at 10:32 PM, Epsik-kun said:

Do you even use melee in this game? Because you are giving me an impression that you don't.

I certainly do. More frequently than most, I assure you.

On 9/27/2016 at 10:32 PM, Epsik-kun said:

If you think, that breaking a skill by tearing about half of its strength and slapping it on a faulty mechanics will fix anything - you are wrong. And if you are trying to send a message along the lines of "of course they will make appropriate adjustments" - you should really start reading what you are replying to.

What I said was that Excal won't stop being a turret until the waves aren't just handed out for free... which is true. As long as the range potential remains, and remains free... it will be relied on more heavily.

On 9/27/2016 at 10:32 PM, Epsik-kun said:

Stop talking to yourself.

If you get to make baseless generalizations about my comments when I don't bother writing out all the tiny little details, so do I.

On 9/27/2016 at 10:32 PM, Epsik-kun said:

Are you aware, that average DPS of Excalibur gets over x16 increase when he moves up close to an enemy? Waves never were a problem - you don't use waves on high levels, unless you like dealing no damage. And "turret" Excalibur is so weak, that I don't see a reason to even try to work around him.

The problem is the lack of motivation to actually move close. Excal's melee range is short, his movement speed is low, his survivability is not on a level you would assume a melee frame should have and he is highly susceptible to knockdowns. And what the latest nerf did wasn't addressing a "turret Excalibur problem". It was removing one more reason for him to actually go melee.

This isn't something you solve by removing one of the options. Were you to remove the range option (not to mention it will also immensely weaken his melee potential) - you'll be stuck with a melee frame that punishes you for going melee. Such an approach can't fix anything.

By the time enemy levels are high enough that EB waves aren't overwhelmingly powerful, the game is no longer supposed to be balanced. Stop trying to account for high levels. At levels where the game is supposed to be balanced, EB waves kill things so quickly that it is legitimately difficult to keep a melee combo going without Body Count because the waves kill your targets before EB connects.

I'm not commenting on the subjective value of dealing with turret Excal.

I'm not trying to balance out Excal and make him flawless.

I'm saying that as long as free, uncontrollable blade waves are a thing, EB will be used as a ranged ult instead of a melee ult. Preserving the waves at an extra cost and tying them to channeling to improve player control is preferable to removing them outright, IMO.

Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

And the concept isn't required to touch on everything that needs to change immediately. That's why it's a concept. 

Concept isn't the actual thing we are dealing with. No matter how good it is, it has absolutely zero effect on the current situation. That's why it's a concept.

9 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Next time on "see how many hairs you can split!"

Next time on "arguing for the sake of arguing!"

10 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Stop trying to account for high levels.

Why should I? If I don't account for high levels - there is no objective reason to use Excalibur. He is outperformed by weapons. Also, Sorties are a part of the game that's supposed to be "balanced", yet provides you with targets that are able to take few blows from Exalted Blade.

13 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

EB will be used as a ranged ult instead of a melee ult.

This is a moot statement. The fact is, on a level when Excalibur stops being garbage, using Exalted Blade in melee is much more efficient than using Exalted Blade in range. I don't know who "will use Exalted Blade as a ranged ult", because I personally use it in melee, as does pretty much every serious Excal player.

 

I will try one last time explaining it to you - what you have started arguing against and are arguing now was a reply to the question "why doesn't DE just moves waves to channeling". The point was:

1) Channeling a wave with the current channeling mechanics normally results in absurd usage of energy, up to all of it in a split second.

2) Removing waves from normal attacks will result in Exalted Blade having minuscule reach normally and the damage being far from great, while still remaining a channeling ability with severe modding limitations. It will effectively make Exalted Blade inferior to, let's say, Galatine Prime in absolutely everything.

Due to these reasons, DE can't "just" (notice this word, it is important) move waves to the channeling. No one was saying it can't work as a concept - it easily can, were the channeling mechanics to be reworked to not be such a garbage, as well as the actual Exalted Blade were to stop being a piece of trash as far as pure melee weapons go. You are arguing against a point that was never made. No one made the point you are arguing against. Think about it and stop talking to yourself.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Epsik-kun said:

Why should I?

Because you don't get to define what part of the game should be a frame of reference for balance.

1 hour ago, Epsik-kun said:

If I don't account for high levels - there is no objective reason to use Excalibur. He is outperformed by weapons. Also, Sorties are a part of the game that's supposed to be "balanced", yet provides you with targets that are able to take few blows from Exalted Blade.

Actually, Sorties are a bit of an odd creature... they've been set at levels ranging outside of the "standard" balance range... because they're supposed to be challenging. Currently, the only way to challenge us is to pit us against imbalanced enemies. While Sorties can be considered "balanced" in the sense that they are presented as-is... Warframes are still not supposed to be balanced around being normally effective at those levels. (After Sortie 1, anyway.)

1 hour ago, Epsik-kun said:

This is a moot statement. The fact is, on a level when Excalibur stops being garbage, using Exalted Blade in melee is much more efficient than using Exalted Blade in range. I don't know who "will use Exalted Blade as a ranged ult", because I personally use it in melee, as does pretty much every serious Excal player.

It's kind of hard to take you seriously when you refer to anything that is perfectly viable as "garbage."

1 hour ago, Epsik-kun said:

I will try one last time explaining it to you - what you have started arguing against and are arguing now was a reply to the question "why doesn't DE just moves waves to channeling". The point was:

1) Channeling a wave with the current channeling mechanics normally results in absurd usage of energy, up to all of it in a split second.

2) Removing waves from normal attacks will result in Exalted Blade having minuscule reach normally and the damage being far from great, while still remaining a channeling ability with severe modding limitations. It will effectively make Exalted Blade inferior to, let's say, Galatine Prime in absolutely everything.

Due to these reasons, DE can't "just" (notice this word, it is important) move waves to the channeling. No one was saying it can't work as a concept - it easily can, were the channeling mechanics to be reworked to not be such a garbage, as well as the actual Exalted Blade were to stop being a piece of trash as far as pure melee weapons go. You are arguing against a point that was never made. No one made the point you are arguing against. Think about it and stop talking to yourself.

... Are you serious? Go back and read the post I originally made on the subject. I never said "just" move the waves to channeling. The post you quoted responding to mine was "Why isn't this a thing?" I'd quote the posts directly for your convenience, but the forums are weird about quoting across separate pages.

The "just" is a qualifier that you and only you imposed on the concept. So tell me again... who was talking to himself? Me? Hmmm...

Moving the forced ranged attack that is the blade wave onto a player-controlled input would go a long way toward making Exalted Blade more of a melee skill, rather than the ranged skill it currently is within the scope of normal play. This is a goal that DE defined, not me, when they added damage-falloff to the waves. 

Believe it or not, I happen to agree that simply moving waves to channeling and calling it a day would be insufficient... but you're the one who shoved those words into my mouth to begin with. Do you maybe see how that sort of hypocrisy is irksome?

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Are you serious?

On 9/27/2016 at 2:44 AM, EinheriarJudith said:

why isnt this a thing?

On 9/27/2016 at 3:01 AM, Epsik-kun said:

Because:

1) Channeling is a terrible mechanics;
2) Channeling is an unsustainable mechanics;
3) EBlade without waves is a glorified Skana.

To put it straight - linking waves to channeling will require the whole mechanics overhaul, as well as a somplete ability rework. Alternatively, implementing it without making such changes will simply murder Excalibur right away.

On 9/27/2016 at 3:09 PM, Epsik-kun said:

What you are quoting is an answer to "why didn't DE just put waves on channeling" and it says essentially "because they can't *just* put waves on channeling without making the skill worthless". What you are trying to argue about now is completely irrelevant to the original post.

On 9/28/2016 at 2:32 PM, Epsik-kun said:

And if you are trying to send a message along the lines of "of course they will make appropriate adjustments" - you should really start reading what you are replying to.

1 hour ago, Epsik-kun said:

I will try one last time explaining it to you - what you have started arguing against and are arguing now was a reply to the question "why doesn't DE just moves waves to channeling". The point was:

1) Channeling a wave with the current channeling mechanics normally results in absurd usage of energy, up to all of it in a split second.

2) Removing waves from normal attacks will result in Exalted Blade having minuscule reach normally and the damage being far from great, while still remaining a channeling ability with severe modding limitations. It will effectively make Exalted Blade inferior to, let's say, Galatine Prime in absolutely everything.

Due to these reasons, DE can't "just" (notice this word, it is important) move waves to the channeling. No one was saying it can't work as a concept - it easily can, were the channeling mechanics to be reworked to not be such a garbage, as well as the actual Exalted Blade were to stop being a piece of trash as far as pure melee weapons go. You are arguing against a point that was never made. No one made the point you are arguing against. Think about it and stop talking to yourself.

Yes, I am pretty damn serious.

Have fun talking to yourself.

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Epsik-kun said:

Yes, I am pretty damn serious.

Have fun talking to yourself.

Re-read my first post on page 1 about the channeling blade waves.

Then find the first mention of "just" moving the waves to channeling and calling it a day.

Remind me of who is talking to themselves.

Re-read my previous reply to your self-perpetuating commentary.

Re-evaluate your line of thinking.

We're through here. You're pretty demanding of other people when you can't be bothered to take your own advice and actually pay attention to what you're responding to. I didn't even realize you were the OP at first... but it sort of all makes sense now.

Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Epsik-kun said:

 

Yes, I am pretty damn serious.

Have fun talking to your self

 

As much as it pains me to respond to this, what is your argument here? you seem to be saying excalibur is to weak because up against enemies over lvl 100 his damage with skills are less effective, is that accurate? 

i can safely state that he is very effective in all standard missions. below level 100. Are wanting him stronger or saying he should be less?

Edited by Babellon
Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, DiabolusUrsus said:

Then find the first mention of "just" moving the waves to channeling and calling it a day.

It bothers me when people can't use their brain.

If I rephrase it like that:

"Why isn't this a thing?"

"Because at the current state of things this can't be a thing"

Will it be easier for you to comprehend? Is it still too hard? I can't make it even plainer, sorry.

I was not talking to you. I did not argue with you. You were told three times in a row, that you are wasting your time by arguing with me, because the only thing you are arguing with is your imagination. I was not a part of that argument. I am pretty sure you are not in a position to tell anybody anything about "the way of thinking", because you've demonstrated a pretty obnoxious one yourself.

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Babellon said:

what is your argument here?

There is no argument. My interlocutor have decided I had made an outrageous attack on his majestic suggestion and decided to strike an intellectual conversation with me about the most interesting topic of discussing the said outrageous attack on the ground of it being biased and flawed, thus not doing the justice to the majestic suggestion. Despite being specifically told three times in a row to stop that due to having his assumption to miss the point by a landslide.

In short - I get what he meant, but he refuses to get that I get what he meant. And that's something I don't get.

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Epsik-kun said:

"Why isn't this a thing?"

"Because at the current state of things this can't be a thing"

Re-visit previously-made point about concepts not being required to account for every-little detail when they have yet to be implemented.

8 minutes ago, Epsik-kun said:

I was not talking to you. I did not argue with you. You were told three times in a row, that you are wasting your time by arguing with me, because the only thing you are arguing with is your imagination. I was not a part of that argument. I am pretty sure you are not in a position to tell anybody anything about "the way of thinking", because you've demonstrated a pretty obnoxious one yourself.

But you were using a public forum where people are allowed to join conversations they aren't initially a part of.

I don't think it's too unreasonable to ask you to re-evaluate the line of thinking where you are infallible and anyone who dares to question your faulty logic is obnoxious.

Notice that I adhere to the expectations I set for others... especially the ones about utilizing brains.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Re-visit previously-made point about concepts not being required to account for every-little detail when they have yet to be implemented.

Do me a favor - quote me talking about the concept you were proposing.

2 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Notice that I adhere to the expectations I set for others... especially the ones about utilizing brains.

You know, I'm failing to notice that. Like, I am trying really hard right now - but I just can't. Maybe it's something wrong with my eyesight, who knows.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Epsik-kun said:

snip

That was a beautiful paragraph, how ever it didnt offer me any clarity. what are you wanting done to excalibur? you seem to be saying hes not effective how ever in every map ive put him on excalibur performs very well. so i am trying to understand. mind you i disagree about his lack of power entirely. In point I notice alot of the complaints about frames involve levels far outside the norm and as such to me invalidates said complaints on basic principle, that being the higher the mob lvl the less effective our weapons and powers are going to be. this is a standard in all video games. but im seeking clarification on the subject.

Link to post
Share on other sites

um... what?

ok ill give you that the spin-blind energy cost is dumb, the cost needs to be way less especially considering the reduced range/duration on it [or just take it back to zero cost and reduce the range/duration some more, either way]

but basically nothing else that you said makes any sense at all, aside from the nrg cost on the spin-blind, he's fine 

Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Epsik-kun said:

Do me a favor - quote me talking about the concept you were proposing.

Sure!

"Because:

1) Channeling is a terrible mechanics;
2) Channeling is an unsustainable mechanics;
3) EBlade without waves is a glorified Skana.

To put it straight - linking waves to channeling will require the whole mechanics overhaul, as well as a somplete ability rework. Alternatively, implementing it without making such changes will simply murder Excalibur right away."

Copy-pasted, no edits.

Point one is subjective.

Point two is not a problem.

Point three is overly-simplistic and not actually a problem.

Requiring extensive changes is also not a problem, nobody said that was off the table, and no... loss of EB waves would not "murder Excal right away" because his most important skill is his blind... not EB.

 

13 minutes ago, Epsik-kun said:

You know, I'm failing to notice that. Like, I am trying really hard right now - but I just can't. Maybe it's something wrong with my eyesight, who knows.

I understand. Wouldn't be the first thing you've failed to notice. Points for effort though.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 9/27/2016 at 2:54 AM, WARLOCKE said:

Exalted blades damage is not up to par. Never has been. I can easily hit 400k + PER SWING with chroma and maxed vex, His waves need to go. His EB needs to scale with his weapon, shadow debt mods and all Energy on spin needs to go and EB needs a good built in combo. I never liked EB because it was a band-aid. Now its a terrible band-aid.

1+

Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Babellon said:

what are you wanting done to excalibur? you seem to be saying hes not effective how ever in every map ive put him on excalibur performs very well. so i am trying to understand.

That's a separate topic for the discussion.

I want Excalibur to not be outperformed by a weapon. I want Excalibur to have his niche he is viable at. I did not suggest any solution myself, because there could be a wide variety of them.

For instance - they can address the overstayed late-game Excalibur - it was his niche for some time, but few most recent updates had severely diminished his value in that content;

Or it might be his "prior-prior" niche - high level content - think Sorties;

Or it might be something that fixes his most obvious flaws - poor stats for the close melee combat DE seems to be proposing lately - so while he won't be an "efficient" frame, at least he can be a "consistent" frame.

Or even to go as humble as to give the game some content Excalibur can be effectively used for.

 

I believe my vision of what is "viable" differs from such vision of many players here. I don't consider "can run a successful mission" to be "viable". I consider it to be a norm. Every single frame in the game is "viable" in that sense. What I consider "viable" is when I can think up at least one objective reason to use a frame in some kind of a content over other frames. And I am not talking about "the best", I am talking about not being "average".

Because I can guarantee that all "viable" Excaliburs can be outperformed by a non specific unranked frame with a melee weapon. Currently, the only Excalibur that actually excels at something would be an RJ Excal running low-level Exterminations.

3 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Sure!

I believe you've a little bit failed at basic reading comprehension. I've asked you to quote me talking about your concept - what you are quoting are points about the current channeling system. Now, please - do me a favor and quote me talking about the concept you were proposing.

Thank you.

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Epsik-kun said:

I believe you've a little bit failed at basic reading comprehension. I've asked you to quote me talking about your concept - what you are quoting are points about the current channeling system. Now, please - do me a favor and quote me talking about the concept you were proposing.

Thank you.

Actually, the bit about EB without waves would suggest otherwise. The fact that you were responding to a quote about my concept without bothering to specify that you were allegedly changing the subject further reinforces my suspicion that you have just typed your first outright lie in this conversation. 

Also the bit where you were talking about "linking waves to channeling" being a bad idea.

Sounds a lot like my concept... and I don't think my reading comprehension is at fault here.

Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Actually, the bit about EB without waves would suggest otherwise.

That's a point about the actual blade of Exalted Blade. I suppose I'm the one at fault here - I've forgotten you are can't process information.

16 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Also the bit where you were talking about "linking waves to channeling" being a bad idea.

That's a conclusion of the points.

18 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

allegedly changing the subject

When and where? I am pretty sure the subject was "Why isn't this a thing?"

17 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

further reinforces my suspicion

*delusion

17 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Sounds a lot like my concept

What again?

Link to post
Share on other sites

so, you have no specifics persae you want him to be different is primarily what this is all about. Its not that hes weak just that hes not doing what you want. 

Personally I would like for DE to rebalance all damage both mobs and players to treat level 30 as maximum standard. meaning Those level 30s hit and take damage the way lvl 60 does now. and do that all the way up

. we keep basing viability of our weapons and powers on how they perform against lvl far above any rational expectation. LvL 100 is not where we should 'start' noticing difficulty. Our max level is 30.,,,so if we honestly want challenging game play against enemies we need to get down out of the rafters and start looking at things logically.

make levels 1-10 damage/ Resistance where 10-20 are now. 10-20 should feel like 20-30 does right now. 20-30 should feel like our current 30-40. this along with the mod changes would give the entire combat system a more logical feel to it. then we can have a rational conversation about viability.

we keep bouncing around arguing these rediculous claims all of which include the statement "after lvel 100" and act like that means frames weapons and such need fixing. I know big numbers for little cost make us feel good but truthfully it sucks for honest game play.

who cares if it costs alot to slide when nothing on the map can kill you untill you get into the triple digits. so what armor becomes a problem after level 100 when its utterly irrelevent before that. its pointless to worry about running out of ammo or energy against those level 150 mobs when until then you barely have to fire a shot.

I have personally solo'd every thing in this game with every weapon and every frame. so if all you experts are having trouble in 4 man teams especially in 4 man teams, regardless of level, im inclined to think its not the number of mobs, powers or weapons that are the problem. How ever it is these arguments, these insistent persistent types of cinversations that completely misrepresent the actual gameplay and why we cannot have reasonable discourse.

Edited by Babellon
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Babellon said:

rediculous claims all of which include the statement "after lvel 100" and act like that means frames weapons and such need fixing

You've missed a huge point there. I've specifically addressed, why am I talking about "after level 100" to begin with.

Otherwise - yeah, I want him to be different in a sense of him getting a purpose - his own "forte" - back. How is that achieved - changing him or changing the game - doesn't really matters to me.

Link to post
Share on other sites

no i think i see your point. The problem here is the number of counter threads i see all the time of people complaining that 1 frame/weapon or load out becomes the only go to in certain situations and people insist they want more universal viability across all frames and weapons. so this then is the resistance you are seeing, and justifiably so. excalibur is a good frame equally as viable as others in doing the job hes built to do. what that job is is completing the missions not being the best after waiting to lvl100+. no frame or weapon is or should be the "best" go to at those levels. that has been an ongoing conversation for mOst of 3 yrs now.

Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, Epsik-kun said:

When and where? I am pretty sure the subject was "Why isn't this a thing?"

"This" being the concept I put forth.

"I reject your reality and substitute my own" is not a viable strategy for actual conversations, sorry.

That post was, in fact, an attempted explanation of why my concept was incompatible with the current state of the game. No amount of retrospective logical contortions on your part will change that... 

Maybe what you meant was something different, but that's not what you wrote.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, DiabolusUrsus said:

"This" being the concept I put forth.

But I don't talk about "this". I talk about why "this" is not in the game. Your problem is that you can't see the difference here. You are rejecting reality and trying to substitute it with your own. Regretfully, that's not how discussions work. To give you a more clear example:

"Why isn't Hitler in the game?"

"Because that might be offensive"

And then you burst in with claims my interpretation of World War II being wrong. Because, c'mon - everyone knows Hitler is directly linked to World War II - hence whenever I address him in any way, I am surely making a point about World War II.

3 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

That post was, in fact

explaining why "this isn't a thing". I do not address, critique or evaluate Your Concept™ at any point of it.

4 minutes ago, DiabolusUrsus said:

Maybe what you meant was something different, but that's not what you wrote.

Or maybe, just maybe - think about it for a moment - you can't bring yourself to stop the argument you have started yourself by admitting you are trying to address the point that isn't being made. Because you, as an adequate human being, could not miss such a miscommunication after being directly pointed at its presence three times in a row, could you?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...