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[DE]Steve

Anndddd it's already October.

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6 hours ago, [DE]Steve said:

Tenno,

My last big Dev Workshop was in June and that means time for a follow up. What did I tell you last time? Our summer plans. What we were hoping to achieve with splitting out Updates. Where are we now? What's next? What's going on? Where's the last part of the update, 'The War Within'? How much Bourbon has been consumed?
 
You're asking me the same questions I'm asking myself. My team has been stupidly patient as we look back at Second Dream and scream 'we need to repeat that'. The pressure has been on all summer. We've had a summer of content and fixes go out, but the hype for big older brother (which we've hyped a lot) War Within just makes everything we've done feel… just less. Really I'm here to lay out October for you so you can get just excited about what's coming soon on PC.
 
This week on PC we bring you 'The Vacuum Within'. To be fair you've been waiting longer for this than the War Within, so maybe this is the real best of the year deploy. No, we're not having 3 Mods make up Vacuum. We changed it. Vacuum is going to be passively built into every Sentinel, no Mods required. It will have a range of 5 meters which in practice looks something like this WIP (pro-Lotus skills hitting an enemy behind the locked door):


 https://gfycat.com/TepidSlimAmurminnow

Later in October, The Corpus version of Rathuum is hitting PC. This game mode will be called 'The Index'. With it you'll get glimpse of Nef Anyo again! 'The Index' will feel a bit more classic DE in that it'll have an introduction to a new game mode with an Operation (clans rejoice), some Endless emphasis, and an event weapon!

On PC, you can look forward to 'The Vacuum Within' this week.
On PC, you can look forward to  'The Index' in October.
On PC, you can look forward to War Within more than a month away.  
 
And for Console Tenno,
 
The Long Shadow Tactical Alert is hopefully coming in October.
An interim build before The War Within that will include the Corpus style Rathuum.
 
Once The War Within is out our crazy 'break apart Updates' to bring you content faster will be heavily analyzed to see what it achieved. Many of our content creators appreciated us breaking things up for coverage purposes, but even that isn't enough to keep them around if the content itself didn't hit the mark.


So there's a glimpse, an overview, a few paragraphs that explain what's going on here these days. It doesn't do the team's passion justice, but giving you all information is the best way for us to work together. We'll talk more on the Devstream Friday, everyone.

 

Thanks,

Steve 


So Steve just hold up. Hold up 5 seconds.

I just want to know where you went in your logic with the decision to have it as a passive on all sentinels, but not consider user agency and user choice in modding the sentinel.

How did user choice in Sentinels get eliminated from the equation? How did you jump the gun in giving users options on what they want to vacuum up?
 

Quote

 


No, we're not having 3 Mods make up Vacuum. We changed it.



You might just want to slow down a bit.

Now I noticed recently with the Kavatt pet system and Kavatt abilities you've given user's options on top of Charm.

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Loyal_Companion
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Animal_Instinct
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Pounce
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Swipe
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Sharpened_Claws
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Sense_Danger
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Pack_Leader
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Territorial_Aggression
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Shelter

Charm isn't a bad option because the randomization is always positive it might not be something you want, but, something that the user/player might find useful. (See from 1:07)
 


http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Animal_Instinct
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Sanctuary_(Mod)
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Regen
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Coolant_Leak
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Fired_Up
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Guardian
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Medi-Ray
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Self_Destruct

You've got all these mods for the Kavatt but only the above listed sentinel mods, what happens to mods like... What is going to happen to this?
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Looter

Wouldn't it be better to have the 3 mods or individual options for the end-user to configure as an option on what the user wants to pick up?
You could still have the universal vacuum at say 8 or 10 m and people could choose what they want to pick up
-- Pick up Energy Orbs
-- Pick Up Health Orbs
-- Pick Up Resources (Common, Uncommon, Rare or ALL Resources/Oxygen)
-- Pick Up Credits, Stars

You could still have Universal Vacuum on all your sentinels. You can still have your creative moment, Steve, but just stop don't jump the fence. Don't do a Digital Extreme knee-jerk moment, just slow down.
 

This is the most important one: (User Choice -- Which in our case is what would you like to pick up?.)
 

The most important one of all AGENCY and USER CHOICE. You can still give the player base a universal vacuum, crunch your metrics on the distance. I've noticed that 5 meters is the lower area and 15 meters is the up distance in Warframe.
 



Now Mogamu thinks you should "Build any way you want." and he's your number one fan -- At this point he's right.
Give it back. I don't want another repeat of 2013 and Zamboni, mate. The below video might just demonstrate why it was discussed with you in 2013.
 


Because we know where Mog is right now.

Come on, Steve. Think.

 

Edited by Kinjeto
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1 hour ago, Razyda777 said:

put it on frames, then you help Archwing mode too.

"You're making this too eaaasy" - Vor 

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There is a simple reason the update schedule has been constantly delayed and ultimately why we are being told The War Within will not be arriving after this month. 

 

EXR7pQ7.jpg

 

Unfortunately Development happens around this schedule. Hopefully next year will be a little more open. We shouldn't expect anything until about December.  

Edited by F8ted
Spoiler trouble
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I am apathetic regarding the War Within. Will it fix the ridiculousness that is the Bombard/Scorch/Shield Lance? Will it liberate me from mastery fodder? Will it provide new mission types that take advantage of the games combat engine? Will it improve the abilities of Hydroid and Oberon? I do not believe it will and so I remain indifferent to this pending quest. Personally were I the members of Digital Extreme I would be very concerned about the hype surrounding the War Within, as anything short of life changing excellent could result irreparable damage being done to Warframe. I sincerely hope to be proven wrong as I'd love a reason to play Warframe again but I shall not hold my breath. You folks look over-matched presently. 

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There haven't been any "delays". DE has never given us any sort of specific release date, just rough estimations that have turned out to be inaccurate.

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I'm not 100% sure but I am approximately 95% sure that at this point DE is mainly working on bug fixes and tiny features.

DE, I can't speak for everyone, but I sure can speak for some. We don't care if the update is buggy. This is a beta, and letting the community find bugs will be exponentially faster than doing it in house and/or using testers. Just release the update already, it's been months and every time we get closer to the release date it only gets delayed more. This isn't what the community wanted, you decided to drastically overwork yourselves, and i'm sure it will pay off in a spectacular, breathtaking quest, but for the amount of letdowns and setbacks it's caused it's become more of a hindrance ( especially considering we can't replay quests ( yet™? ) ). 

 

At this point it's become a minigame to see when the war within will finally release

 

500 plat to the person who can guess how long and when the next delay will be

( disclaimer : I'm not actually giving out any plat )

Edited by VaykorKek
added "breathtaking" for effect

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1 minute ago, VaykorKek said:

We don't care if the update is buggy...

It would be best not to believe that you speak for all of us.

I care.  I 100% care.

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3 minutes ago, Brachion said:

There haven't been any "delays". DE has never given us any sort of specific release date, just rough estimations that have turned out to be inaccurate.

THIS RIGHT HERE! We should all get a good look at this one over here. 

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1 minute ago, Windspike said:

It would be best not to believe that you speak for all of us.

I care.  I 100% care.

 

 I can't speak for everyone

 

next time read the post, ty

Edited by VaykorKek

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This is like, the 15th thread with this exact title.

I'm pretty sure TWW is shipping with some form of a major new game mode or gameplay overhaul at this point. Just a cinematic quest doesn't take this time.

Maybe damage 3.0, maybe we kill the Twin Queens and the factions and Solar System get a major overhaul.

Idunno, I'm taking a break, active anticipation has burned me out, I'll be back when it releases.

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12 minutes ago, Calwon5 said:

Dear DE,

I don't mind if The War Within is going to be delayed for however long it may need.... possibly like HL3. What I do mind is that, can you please just be honest with us. What I loved more than playing the game, was your dedication to connect with players; through DEV streams, streams, tennocon, etc. Except you're not doing it as of lately, either you(DE) are too busy to notify us of the exact progress of things or are just expecting a soon for an answer would be sufficient. Well frankly, it's not. If you(DE) need more time to work on TWW, then tell us so. Tell us the truth of whats going on with the cinematic. What is holding you guys back from releasing it. Instead of telling us it will come out soon the next month. Players will get hype near that end of the month and if you were too say "oh next month" again.... then it's just painful for both sides.

TL:DR: I don't mind the delays, but I'm frustrated that you are unable to tell us the truth of whats causing the delays, and instead kept of giving us the "soon" for an answer.

this puts it well i love your work, ive loved warframe and connected to so many people through it, but they are all leaving now and its because they feel mistreated and hurt, well i love it and wont leave, but please please be open with us, your cooky extended family we will listen even at 3am when you have had too much bourbon

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5 hours ago, [DE]Steve said:

On PC, you can look forward to War Within more than a month away. 

The update is nice and all, but the game seriously feel... kinda dead right now.

You guys wanna make WW great and stuff, we get it, but "overpolishing" can hurt any work.

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4 minutes ago, VaykorKek said:

next time read the post, ty

Yep, you got me.  I missed that.  My apologies.

I'm glad that we are in agreement that this opinion is not widely merited. 

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Just now, Windspike said:

Yep, you got me.  I missed that.  My apologies.

I'm glad that we are in agreement that this opinion is not widely merited. 

It is definitely widely merited

Whether the majority or minority share my view beats me as there is no feasible way of gaining such data, however.

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So a nerf to Vacuum and only applied to sentinels... less terrible than the 3 part nonsense.

We need an explanation about to why it's not being given as an un-nerfed passive vacuum to all warframes. I believe the innate pickup range is a problem with the game itself, which traditionally Carrier/Vacuum has simply fixed. I've never seen it as a companion usage problem - and I get why that's what it's seen as, but I still believe that's the wrong way to look at it. Is that why 5m vacuum is being proposed? Because players may be more likely to use kuborws/kavats if vacuum is worse? Seems bogus regardless.

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5 hours ago, (PS4)jonnyblaze1976 said:

Vacuum on all sentinels you say? I like it. What will carriers specialty be after that if you dont mind me asking? 

I would also like to say that i have faith in all you guys at DE and if you keep giving me content  I will keep playing. 

Party on Steve.

Watch the last DevStream. Carrier would have the ability to ammo mutate upon pickup and ammo storage (enable larger ammo capacity) for weapons.

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5 hours ago, [DE]Steve said:

Vacuum is going to be passively built into every Sentinel, no Mods required. It will have a range of 5 meters

Why is vacuums range being nerfed to less than half? Is a quality of life improvement that is innately present in most games with mass loot that god damn OP? And why do kubrows and cavats continue to be obsolete? How is this a universal vacuum if you can't have it with your cats and dogs?

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The most important thing is that you guys are communicating with the players, so thank you for that! We do appreciate it. Please try to take any salty replies, well... with a grain of salt lol.

Like a lot of players (who may not be as vocal) I am totally cool with the content taking as long as it takes. DE has a good track record of not releasing content before it's mostly bug-free, and you guys are around to monitor things after release and quick to hotfix bugs. These are all good things and we all want them to continue. No one wants content to be released earlier if it means sacrificing any of this.

Making vacuum available to all sentinels is good. The nerf is incomprehensible. At this point when it comes to the universal vacuum issue I'm just tired, confused, and disappointed. I understand that you (Steve) have to communicate this information to the players, even though it may not be your decision how the vacuum changes were made. I guess these are the vacuum changes we are ALLOWED to have.

Maybe once it's proven that universal vacuum does not cause the entire game to collapse into a gravity vortex of doom the nerf can be rolled back some. We can hope. I guess. Or not. Like I said, I'm just tired of the discussion after several years, so I'd rather accept any solution that let's us move on even if it's sub-optimal (It is.).

I just want to say that, as a player, to you, as a programmer, if there were some kind of "bug" with Vacuum where, say, the range was "mistakenly" 6 meters, or 8 meters, instead of the proposed 5 meter range the players would be VERY understanding *wink wink, nudge nudge*, and we would probably bribe you with chocolate and candy to assuage you in such a crisis.  :)

Thanks for all the things you people do well. Thanks for making a fun game. Thanks for expanding Vacuum to other sentinels. Looking forward to the War Within.

Edited by Protomorph
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I've been keeping up with all things warframe since i started playing, i've always said id play no matter what happens. The 2nd dream came out and it brought tears to my eyes. TWW was announced touting more feels and more animations i jumped for joy.

It was delayed time and time again and i've waited for it for months without a single complaint. The quest must be good so it's worth the wait, right?

 

But now after reading these changes plus TWW being pushed back again, i can't help but feel this

 

ZYakUku.png

 

Ill still be playing ofcourse, crying but playing

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9 hours ago, Supaflytoast said:

How is this a universal vacuum?

It isn't, it's "nerfed to below 50% effectiveness sentinel only vaccum"

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this is why DE needs to put a voting system in place on these upcoming updates and changes, so that the community can voice there opinions on whats good and bad..

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I really dont understand why DE had to do this. Were there that many people crying about it? So we have a piece of equipment that specializes in vacuum, that would be carrier. If you want a vacuum, use it. If you want a fancy cat, use a Kavat. If you want an over sized dog use a kubrow. Both of those still retrieve items. But giving Helix, a companion that specializes in scanning the ability vacuum and scan too, make no sense. Or giving shade, the sentinel that specializes in stealth, vacuum. That is the whole reason people chose to use carrier was because of its vacuum ability. THAT WAS ITS MAIN ABILITY. I dont want an ammo storage box. That is why DE made ammo mutations mods. So if carrier will now be an ammo box, and have auto ammo mutations, i guess that make ammo mutation mods obsolete too?
This comes off as players being lazy and *@##$ing because they have to go and get the items. Be a better gamer and get your drops like you are supposed to. Do we as gamers have to have EVERYTHING handed to us?
i would have rather it been a mod. that way it gives you the ability IF you want it at the cost of something else.
So how about this. I want world on fire on my frost warframe. DE, do that. Give all the warframes World on Fire as a passive skill.
personally i think you ruined a perfectly good sentinel and made the game a little less challenging. i used carrier because of what it could do. When i needed stealth, i went to shade. when i needed scanning, helix was there.
I even noticed in the image you posted on the facebook page ( http://i.giphy.com/l0HlutHBjgD1tSY9y.gif ), carrier is not even in it. You basically made him obsolete

 

PS, i have no clue why the formatting is like this on this post. Deal with it.

Edited by (XB1)pozie
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So many question and so much frustration 

  • Why nurf vacuum at all (12 to 6 meters)?
  • Why isn't it on pets (cat/dog)? 
  • Why isn't it a passive on all Warframes?
    DE why didn't you go this route?
    Form over function? 

I am just so frustrated with this entire process, 1 step forward 2 steps back

 

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