The Vacuum Within: Hotfix #2

[DarkOvion]

25 minutes ago, Babellon said:

I liked the 6m passive personally. The objective was to encourage more use out of the other sentinels, which they accomplished. 

The second phase of that experiment was/is aimed at the companions. The question on the table at this point is, how do we implement the radial pickup to apply to a 'pet' creature that moves with its own AI rather than blindly following the player per sentinel behavior.

Do they adjust the behavior of companions? I think some adjustments are needed since far to often companions wander off, get stuck, or don't respond at all.

Do they make all companions have a precept similar to what they did with 'vacuum' but call it something different and make a universal precept mod out of it?

Would it be game breaking to make a universal Pickup as standard, but then what range, people went nuts over losing those 6m from vacuum. Do we keep it 12 meter universal pickup radius and forgo the entire mod tendency both on pets and on sentinels?

I think if we want to seriously have a conversation with the developers we need to firstly address ourselves and how we present feedback, secondly use appropriate language and communication skills, thirdly develop a concrete idea that we can express to them.

10M would be acceptable for a universal warframe passive.

That's a roughly 40% loss of effectiveness, as opposed to the 88% loss that the 6M bubble brings.

[m1a3s3k7]

Here is my constructive 2 cents:

First off, I will openly state I enjoyed the 6m universal, no mod required change giving all sentinels the passive ability to collect loot.  While it wasn't as nice as the Carrier precept, I enjoyed the complete freedom of having to chose to Vacuum or not to Vacuum.  As many have stated, I do like the option of adding a mod to increase this range but feel vacuum as a passive should be a given to open up choices in both modding and sentinel choice.  I personally see the current state of Vacuum as a step back to just using Carrier for 2 unsurprising reasons:

1. We all had a build to fit this.  Spending more resources (forma, etc) is maybe a lazy excuse but it is still part of the issue.  Part of the build issue is the raw stats of the sentinels being pretty one sided, much like our actual preference in sentinel use.  Many have talked about this, but few have mentioned (like with Warframes) their abilities give them survivability.  Taking away that precept mod to fit Vacuum mod will have one or some of the following; spoil the unique ability that sentinel had, take away another choice mod (Medi-Ray, Animal Instinct, Sanctuary, etc) decreasing effectiveness of the sentinel, or making the sentinel about as tough as a wet paper bag due to its already lackluster stats.  All of this when compared to just...using Vacuum as originally intended on Carrier.

2.  IF/WHEN added to our space dogs and cats it will also be a mod.  There were not a lot of comments on this repercussion.  While, up to this point in time, we have used Kubrow/Kavats in situations where we obiviously didn't care about Vacuum or could live without it the time has come to bring this up.  Much like with sentinels, we would be giving away the uniqueness of a breed or decreasing effectiveness to squeeze in the ability to vacuum.  There is, however, both a pun and a whole new animal to tackle here.  Vacuum turns off pickups for your Warframe.  This means your pooch, while running around derping out on some cliff will be sucking up nothing while you stand in a treasure trove of pickups.  So changes in either Vacuum or the AI for the furry ones will be needed.  I personally wouldn't think "as intended" would work in this situation.  If you thought the wait for TWW has been too long...

So with my opinions on why this is not ideal over with, what improvements or changes do I suggest?  I will list them in a nice, orderly fashion below:

1.  Many have stated this, and I happen to agree, the best change to Vacuum would be to make it a universal passive for Warframes.  DE will have to change coding for pickups when dealing with Vacuum being spread to all companions, this would be the most cost effective, and in the long run, efficient way to bring vacuum to all aspects of Warframe (ArchWing included).  

2.  Let's think outside of the box here.  As I stated in the first issue with Vacuum as a mod, sentinel choice has traditionally been centered around it.  But why?  We all know the true endgame of Warframe is Fashion Frame.  Does Carrier or Carrier Prime look the best?  No (IMHO).  What if, and this is a big What IF, Djinn, Dethcube, Wyrm, Shade, Carrier, Diriga, what IF they were all just SKINS?  Aren't they already just a different AI due to precepts?  My radical, out of the box suggestion to fix the "lack of diverse use" in sentinels is to melt them all down to 1.  Think of it like a buffet.  I want to have the chicken, melon chunks, peas, and saltine crackers.  Translate that to "I want to use Wyrm Prime's Skin, Djinn's Fatal Attraction, Diriga's Electro Pulse, Health, Armor, Sheilds, Animal Instinct, Coolant Leak and Sanctuary."  I could go on, but I personally feel if DE would like us to choice different "sentinels," do either of the following to give us this buffet choice:  current sentinel names are just skins (1 sentinel built MechWarrior Style) or make all precepts universal among sentinels.  Either of these would require substantial work and wouldn't be anything to be expected anytime Soon^TM.   With hope, this could be applied to Kubrow and Kavats as well.

 

I would prefer the second option, personally.  

 

 

[Urska]

On 10/6/2016 at 1:50 PM, Andrew7811 said:

When is the next sortie season? It's been 6 weeks and I want more goodies.

ever.... :>

[DarkOvion]

On 06/10/2016 at 9:50 PM, Andrew7811 said:

When is the next sortie season? It's been 6 weeks and I want more goodies.

It could be any time, but more likely will switch with this Nef Anyo event.

There's really no set schedule to Sorties, as fantastic as it would be to have it in a known quantity, it's basically 'when DE feels like it' so far.

[SharpWit]

And again: 

 

[XIceBladeX]

1 hour ago, LoganTheBadWolf said:

And again: 

 

Yeah.. every 5 waves in defense missions, my map keeps resetting to the tiny one in the top left.

I have to press M to make it big again.

Also, the teammate HP overlay keeps resetting randomly. 

[fatpig84]

I applaud DE for making Vacuum completely optional and useable for all sentinels.
Now we get true choice™ :)

[Sonicoblivion]

Well I thought I was about to go on an exodus from this game, but no.

I love how the developers are trying new and interesting ideas with this game and factoring in community feedback into decisions. It's really amazing how much this game has evolved over the years.

Please continue your R&D with this game. If I had the choice to take back the many hours I've already invested in it, I wouldn't.

Thank you DE!

[SP3CT3R7]

I can't wait to see the new Foliage and the new lighting and stuff - nearly wet my pants when I saw it in a Tact Pot video :D

Makes everything look like a cinematic, and I love it! :D

[DreamsmithJane]

Great! Now can we do the same for Chesa's "Retrieve" precept for kubrows and kavats?

Either way, I'm glad it's opt-in, because I honestly don't always want it. It's especially a pain when a single bleed proc wastes all the health orbs generated by Nekros, restoring only one health each. Or whole ammo packs for one bullet/arrow. Would be nice to only auto-loot things you really need.

A step in the right direction, anyhow. Thanks!

[ThePostman4149]

Since they added vacuum back in as a mod I guess the update is alright, Only thing I wish DE would do is allow the use of the Deconstructor (or maybe add a another sentinal throwing weapon) on other sentinals because I hate the throwing melees plus the fact I don't want to have to have 2 sets of the same weapon mods ranked all the way up just to use a weapon optimally on a sentinal and having mod conflicts when I swap mods and pick the wrong one.

[Furyoushounen]

On 2016-10-07 at 0:32 PM, marelooke said:

"Don't use it" doesn't particularly solve the issue of the playstyle Vacuum promotes (I have enough of most resources so tend to use my Kavat more nowadays). Getting rid of it would have ended up forcing people to play more as a team, or miss out on drops (you know, the way it was before everyone had a Carrier), since just running around Vacuuming all the loot the hallway heroes generated wouldn't have been an option anymore. While it certainly wouldn't solve all the related issues it'd at least have been a step in the right direction. But whatever I guess...

 

Nah man, it works exactly the opposite. The speedrunners dont need resources so they dont even bother with carrier and dont afford the other players enough time to even get loot so, with carrier, atleast new players or those that want resources and play as a team, have time to get some stuff before the timer runs to 0.

 

[TheJagji]

Phase 3 of the experiment should be to pull it from the game completely, then give people back the 6M range passive, and see if they like it or not. :P

[-AM-Akimuro]

Most of the comments are too much POSITIVE FEEDBACK. 

You guys turn your backs on what you said:
All Sentinels now have a passive 6 meter Loot Vacuum, no Mods required! - [DE]Megan
After Hotfix #2, This is what we get.  Vacuum is now an equippable Mod (Precept) for all Sentinels. We have also increased the range from 6m to 12m at max rank.
The only good thing is they increase the range of Vacuum Mod. Bad thing is removing them as passive.

I hope you guys are getting my point of view.
 

[defcultist]

so, increase the range at which 'warframes', the tennos, pickup drops.  Say, what is within 'reach' of melee weapon?  or what?  perhaps if you shoot a drop it will get picked up?

anyway, having to tiptoe on a drop seems a bit much, but what are you going to do?  How bout put an x on each drop like the ayatan stars?

[Rolunde]

Although I do feel that Vacuum being "universal" to all Sentinels (with a 12m range) is an improvement even as a Mod, I'd still prefer to see it act as a universal passive for all Warframes.

Playing just this weekend with a couple of friends/guildies and I've been using Helios lately for the scans. Pretty early in our run Helios got blown up and I then had no more Sentinel, no Vacuum and not even a loot (and enemy) radar (because Animal Instinct).

Next run I brought faithful Carrier Prime and it being "tougher enough" managed to survive to extraction on that one.

Now if I really want the Radar I can mod for that on my Frame but for the Vacuum I'm still back where we were before. No Sentinel for whatever reason, no Vacuum.

And as before sure I can walk over the loot and pick it up and that's fine when you have the time, but then what was the point of all this attention to Vacuum, eh?

And I do tend to have crappy Internet and if it's a laggy day it can take a while to pick stuff up, even if I stop and stand on it. And I know I am not the only person with this problem and that there are people that have that happen even more than I do.

Vacuum actually tends to help out with that quite a bit as before carrier was pretty good about dragging around a pile of loot until it was cleared by the loot gods that it was OK for me to actual get it.

If for some reason DE doesn't actually want to have a 12m universal passive Vacuum on Warframes for some reason, maybe what we could have is a compromising middle ground mix of what we've seen so far.  

As we see with stuff like Loot Radar, Loot Detector & Animal Instinct, how about Vacuum being a combination of innate Warframe passive that can be boosted by mods in the same way.

So lets say that all Warframes have an innate passive Vacuum of 6 meters and then there's a Vacuum Mod counterpart of the Loot Radar mods that boost that out by up to another 6 meters. They stack, take up a slot and capacity.

Opting out is as easy as just not using those mods. Opting in means running the 6m mod on your Companion so that you're now back to the 12m in total. If the Companion gets wrecked you still have 6m vacuum. 

If Vacuum is super important to the player than they could stack all 3 and have 18 meters of vacuum using up some of their mod slots and capacity. 

Cheers
~R~

Edited October 11, 2016 by Rolunde
typos =p

[PH03N1XUS]

Not the worst update, I'll give you that.

[ixacalibur]

Vacuum is universal mod now? Just in time I got back into the game. Thank you DE!

[MBaldelli]

Ceres, Extermination Mission, Grineer Shipyard.  

I've been informed that there are changes that will be coming up with the tilesets for the shipyard, though I'm not quite sure when they will be rolling out.  I'm keeping this in mind as I report these issues.  

These seem to be strange artifacts and what not that I didn't encounter prior to these two updates.  The first three happen around the automated/conveyor belt for the Grineer shuttle's movements...  

And apparently the Nothing (q.v., The Neverending Story reference) that I talked about on the Earth Tile-set last week has made its way to the outer planets.  Fortunately this time, it's not creating a "no man's zone" as it had on the Earth Tile-set.  

I have also noticed an intermittent issue with zoom aiming with primary and secondary weapons.  When changing weapons, and zooming (RMB) to ensure hitting the target, the thrown weapons and arrows are way off from the center of the reticle, especially in close quarters (and trying to hit lockers and material stores).  Swapping weapons and then back to the weapon original seems to fix it -- but it would appear this issue is becoming more and more frequent.  

It's sort of like the times when quick swapping bows in primary to melee weapon strikes, the arrow isn't cocked onto the bow properly and is pointing in god only knows what direction.  I'll try to screen cap it the next time it happens.  

Edited October 10, 2016 by MBaldelli
Added other issue

[McBalth]

Having played for a while with the vacuum change as it was initially, this is exactly what i was looking for a place to ask if it was possible to simply revert to mod and make it "sentinel" instead of "carrier".... I love it when y'all get freaky psychic on me  8~)

[saif_da_king]

On ‎10‎/‎6‎/‎2016 at 5:17 PM, _sheepy_ said:

On ‎10‎/‎6‎/‎2016 at 5:17 PM, TranceReality said:

I'm trying to selling my prime parts and haven't had luck selling them please help

 

 

[aerosoul1337]

Still no fix for:

1.Heavy blade front finisher deals extremely low damage: (even Galatine P deals a lot less melee finisher damage than other weapons)
https://forums.warframe.com/topic/693194-why-does-galatine-p-deal-poor-finisher-damage/

2.Hysterical Assault falls off the map:
https://forums.warframe.com/topic/695422-hysterical-assault-falls-off-the-map/

3.Blade Storm losing melee combo on all robotic and machinery type enemies
https://forums.warframe.com/topic/664725-blade-storm-losing-melee-combo-on-all-robotic-and-machinery-type-enemies/

4.Fatal teleport bug:
 -If the targeted enemy is moving fast enough (such as a running Charger), the finisher will fail.
 -Some melee classes may fail to trigger Finishers on the target. This is currently present with the Nikana series.
 -Teleporting while sliding will fail to trigger a finisher on the target.

5.When using overlay map, the player indicator is no longer at the top layer, it's on the bottom. It can be covered by enemies, allies, loots and interception towers... simply everything.
https://forums.warframe.com/topic/691744-overlay-map-bug

6.Most primary guns and polearm weapons are still misplaced while holstered.
https://forums.warframe.com/topic/699889-why-does-ash-primes-weapon-holstering-never-get-fixed/
(The worst case is Ash Prime: most primary, secondary and melee weapons are still misplaced. They still use normal Ash's holstering positions, so most of them are stuck in Ash Prime's armor.)

7.Sobek's Acid Shells effect bug:
https://forums.warframe.com/topic/687402-arid-shell-sobek-missing-physx-effect/

8.Aura stops working after access the arsenal in the Simulacrum:
https://forums.warframe.com/topic/700315-aura-stops-working-after-access-the-arsenal-in-the-simulacrum/
 

9.Consuming energy orbs even at full energy:
https://forums.warframe.com/topic/700300-consuming-energy-orbs-even-at-full-energy/

10.Enemy proc through our status immunity abilities:
https://forums.warframe.com/topic/700485-enemy-proc-through-our-status-immunity-abilities/

 

[Hesyol]

Ammo case made me really sad. And it's not only because it makes carrier overpowered again, but also I was hoping that whole ammo system will go away some day. It's really stupid for some weapons. Hoped that we'll have unlimited ammo like in Overwatch or something else. And now it looks like we've got another band aid mod...

[Babellon]

2 minutes ago, Hesyol said:

Ammo case made me really sad. And it's not only because it makes carrier overpowered again, but also I was hoping that whole ammo system will go away some day. It's really stupid for some weapons. Hoped that we'll have unlimited ammo like in Overwatch or something else. And now it looks like we've got another band aid mod...

unlimited ammo is not, has never, and should never be a thing in Warframe.

[Hesyol]

1 minute ago, Babellon said:

unlimited ammo is not, has never, and should never be a thing in Warframe.

Why? All these ammo mutation mods appeared because ammo drops are very unbalanced. Some weapons don't need extra ammo at all, others run out of it super fast even if you pick up everything on the ground. Does it add anything interesting to the gameplay? No, because it all can be solved by dropping few ammo pads. So we have almost unlimited ammo already, just need to drop ammo pizzas for that.