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Glaxion and the State of Beam Weaponry


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I've decided to dust off my Glaxion and test it out. It...is vastly underpowered. Considering the Glaxion's ammo economy and how Beam weapons work altogether, the entire category of Beam weapons need some fine tuning. Fire rate seems to have its odd affect on Beam WEapons in that fire rate  affects the Status per second. Why do i bring up fire rate? Glaxion chews through its ammo like a really bad Grakata with no carrier or mutation on or even a potato. I believe Beam Weapons should be retweaked to the amount of amount they consume. Phage would be slow but each tick does a large amount of damage, Glaxion would be doing a lot damage ticks but dealing the amount of damage as displayed in the arsenal, that way status actually would make sense on beam weaponry.

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There was a devstream a while back that addressed beam weapon ammo pools.... they talked about making it regen naturally or something. While that and their 100%+ status per sec is really cool, a little bit more oomph would be nice. Not say, a flat buff or anything, but just more weapons, like having the Glaxion be an ingredient for its next beam iteration on up. Just don't cross the streams! XD

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1 minute ago, Zhoyzu said:

Ive got 5 forma in my FLux rifle atm and it does OK. I still miss the days before damage 2.0. Flux was an absolute monster back then.

it does "OK" but what about other beam weaponry? Glaxion, Spectra, Phage, Convectrix, Synapse, and Regular Quanta are sitting in a less than desirable spot due to the low damage and the amount of ticks they do compared to their ammo consumption (besides Phage). I'm more concerned that status beam weapons need a bigger boost because Critcal Chance is still dominant. Status also needs improvement to where the procs "scale" with enemy level, and when beam weaponry have a tick process akin to their ammo consumption.

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Hmmmm.

I have 8 forma Glaxion, it's my second most used primary. I can't say it's weak, it does perform well against all kinds of enemies up to level 100.

It is nothing compared to most meta weapons though.

 

I thought, instead of outright buffing its stats, DE could add some innovative augment mod for Glaxion. Like make killed frozen enemies shatter dealing weapon's % damage, or make it shoot with more than one beam, or make it an 'icethrower' by turning the beam into a Ignis-like spray (so it covers a larger area). Hopefully, such thing happens when the Index is live! :depls:

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6 minutes ago, Dracario said:

it does "OK" but what about other beam weaponry? Glaxion, Spectra, Phage, Convectrix, Synapse, and Regular Quanta are sitting in a less than desirable spot due to the low damage and the amount of ticks they do compared to their ammo consumption (besides Phage). I'm more concerned that status beam weapons need a bigger boost because Critcal Chance is still dominant. Status also needs improvement to where the procs "scale" with enemy level, and when beam weaponry have a tick process akin to their ammo consumption.

My phage still eats everything for breakfast and my Glaxion freezes everything and does worse than phage and FLux. My syn Gammacore is alright too.

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Just now, Zhoyzu said:

My phage still eats everything for breakfast and my Glaxion freezes everything and does worse than phage and FLux. My syn Gammacore is alright too.

I didn't mention the Gammacor because the weapons are pretty well off but limited to Corpus Sorties most of the time.

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2 minutes ago, Dracario said:

I didn't mention the Gammacor because the weapons are pretty well off but limited to Corpus Sorties most of the time.

I mean i completely agree with you these beam weapons need some serious loving.  I recently put primed rifle ammo muta into my flux and i actually dont have ammo issues until infested levels approach 50. the damage also begins to fall off pretty fast at that point too.  This is compared to the tigris family which doesnt begin to fall off until level 100 or so. and even then is incredibly ammo efficient and still does the job.

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25 minutes ago, Zhoyzu said:

I mean i completely agree with you these beam weapons need some serious loving.  I recently put primed rifle ammo muta into my flux and i actually dont have ammo issues until infested levels approach 50. the damage also begins to fall off pretty fast at that point too.  This is compared to the tigris family which doesnt begin to fall off until level 100 or so. and even then is incredibly ammo efficient and still does the job.

indeed, almost all beam weapons fall off due to how the damage is applied in ticks. Their fire rate isn't applied how often it hits, the ticks aren't fast enough to kill lvl 50< enemies because of that mechanic. If anything beam weapons should spew fountains of numbers per second. Post Mag rework and pre beam weapon/magnetize buff, you could take ANY beam weapon into higher levels because the ability factored every frame the beam weapon had shot into account which accumulated into a whopping amount of damage. I rebuilt the convectrix just for that moment of time before the fix. Beam weaponry needs their mechanics fixed before they get a rework. The damage ticks is what causes almost all beam weaponry to fall off late game

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Just gonna throw this out there... when they buff weapons.. if an enemy uses it that enemy gets the buff too.... It was shown with the ignis. 

Now.... just imagine the op flux rifles on those corpus crewmen....I already get my hp shredded by em..

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9 minutes ago, LuckyCharm said:

Just gonna throw this out there... when they buff weapons.. if an enemy uses it that enemy gets the buff too.... It was shown with the ignis. 

Now.... just imagine the op flux rifles on those corpus crewmen....I already get my hp shredded by em..

That's why in this world.... IT'S KILLED OR BE KILLED.

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Embolist and Nukor are in the same boat IMO, not exactly "beam" weapons but they chew through ammo like crazy, or embolist does anyway.  I honestly cannot remember if nukor is just as bad or not, its been quite a while since I used it.

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Just now, Xekrin said:

Embolist and Nukor are in the same boat IMO, not exactly "beam" weapons but they chew through ammo like crazy, or embolist does anyway.  I honestly cannot remember if nukor is just as bad or not, its been quite a while since I used it.

its Ammo is fine, Embolist? same thing indeed. Also i looked further into Glaxion's damage tick...it's 1 tick per 20 ammo used when held down all the way

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4 hours ago, Zhoyzu said:

Ive got 5 forma in my FLux rifle atm and it does OK. I still miss the days before damage 2.0. Flux was an absolute monster back then.

Many weapons were amazing during damage 1.0. Flux rifle, Dual Ether, Acrid, Boltos... Good times, good times.

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yes, the Damage Application model of Continuous Weapons is terrible and the original model worked much better.
making a new Damage Application model which doesn't change the Tick length and always uses 100ms Ticks might be okay though. but still not very Continuous. 50ms Ticks might be a good compromise.

40 minutes ago, Xekrin said:

not exactly "beam" weapons

I honestly cannot remember if nukor is just as bad or not, its been quite a while since I used it.

they are, as the category in Continuous Weapons, and they are that. what shiny effect the 'beam' makes doesn't matter.

Nukor is... okay. it has a unique Utility Effect (which those types of things could be capitalized on to make the Weapon more desirable) in which Enemies that have been inflated take 1.5x Damage until they deflate again.
i can't say with certainty if that affects Nukor itself since Continuous Weapons apply Damage unreliably. but it certainly applies to other Weapons.

4 hours ago, Raniu said:

it does perform well against all kinds of enemies up to level 100.

no it doesn't. you're using exterior Multipliers to compensate for the piece of Equipment. Glaxion applies Damage in about the same volume as a Braton.
exterior Multipliers doesn't justify Equipment which performs poorly.

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4 hours ago, LuckyCharm said:

Just gonna throw this out there... when they buff weapons.. if an enemy uses it that enemy gets the buff too.... It was shown with the ignis.

If you're talking about how Scorches have that ridiculous AoE,
hitting everything within 30+ meters around them at once, that's a bug :P

Enemy weapons don't necessarily use the exact same stats / mechanics as player ones,
e.g. the Bombard's Ogris is a totally different beast from what we have access to.


And yeah, a better freeze ray (& co) for my magic space shooter game?

YYcvH3Z.gif

GIMME GIMME GIMME

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27 minutes ago, NinjaZeku said:

If you're talking about how Scorches have that ridiculous AoE,
hitting everything within 30+ meters around them at once, that's a bug :P

Enemy weapons don't necessarily use the exact same stats / mechanics as player ones,
e.g. the Bombard's Ogris is a totally different beast from what we have access to.


And yeah, a better freeze ray (& co) for my magic space shooter game?

YYcvH3Z.gif

GIMME GIMME GIMME

Was actually more talking about how they buffed the ignis, then immediately had to nerk hyekka trainers since they got an unintended buff with it. It was in the patchnotes at the time. 

If we're talking about stuff we want though... Buff ammo pickups on them if we can't get ammo regenerating on them. I mean... I want to pick up ammo by the clip, not my 20 bullets out of my 1500 ammo pool per pickup.

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11 hours ago, Dracario said:

Fire rate seems to have its odd affect on Beam WEapons in that fire rate  affects the Status per second.

I'm not 100% positive of this as I don't do extensive testing but based on casual observation it seems that the status per second also only applies 1 application .  Meaning continuously shooting something with say, corrosive, will not apply stacks after stacks.  It must be stopped and re-fired.  Same goes for alternating different status procs.  Corrosive/Heat weapon?  Get your trigger fiinger ready if you want to stack each type.

I only mention this because it seems odd that the very nature of the weapon (category) must be contradicted (held trigger, beam) in order to achieve maximum performance.  Although, again, I could be totally wrong about this part.

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14 hours ago, Dracario said:

it does "OK" but what about other beam weaponry? Glaxion, Spectra, Phage, Convectrix, Synapse, and Regular Quanta are sitting in a less than desirable spot due to the low damage and the amount of ticks they do compared to their ammo consumption (besides Phage). I'm more concerned that status beam weapons need a bigger boost because Critcal Chance is still dominant. Status also needs improvement to where the procs "scale" with enemy level, and when beam weaponry have a tick process akin to their ammo consumption.

the regular Quanta is pretty good actually, granted the Quanta Vandal is better.

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4 hours ago, Xekrin said:

I'm not 100% positive of this as I don't do extensive testing but based on casual observation it seems that the status per second also only applies 1 application .  Meaning continuously shooting something with say, corrosive, will not apply stacks after stacks.  It must be stopped and re-fired.  Same goes for alternating different status procs.  Corrosive/Heat weapon?  Get your trigger fiinger ready if you want to stack each type.

I only mention this because it seems odd that the very nature of the weapon (category) must be contradicted (held trigger, beam) in order to achieve maximum performance.  Although, again, I could be totally wrong about this part.

I've tested the Semi-Auto function to get the status on the Glaxion, not Flux Rifle but from what i've experienced even that does not work. Beam weaponry are not exactly useful when tackling lvl 50+ enemies due to how they apply status and damage. If i wanted a suggestion, it should be hitting every 10 milliseconds like a beam should work. That way procs can be constantly stacking so weapons like Flux Rifle and Glaxion can actually remove armor within seconds making them just as competitive as the higher tear weapons.

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4 minutes ago, Insizer said:

the regular Quanta is pretty good actually, granted the Quanta Vandal is better.

I should've guessed really, Quanta Vandal is a straight upgrade and regular Quanta is slightly worse than Vandal i believe. But as for other beam weaponry, we do not have FLux Vandal, Glaxion Vandal, Convectrix Vandal or Spectra Vandal to be called upgrades.

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2 minutes ago, (PS4)lhbuch said:

The changes made to continuous weapons some time ago made them much worse.  Damage and status are applied first at 100ms and then every 300ms. 

Not sure about multishot, but I guess it did affect status as well at some point in time.

damage should apply every 100ms regardless, the 300ms only reduces DPS which then encourages semi-automatic triggers but that works against Beam weapons thematically as they're supposed to be continuous in nature. the 300ms causes beams to drop off at lvl 50<

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13 hours ago, LuckyCharm said:

Just gonna throw this out there... when they buff weapons.. if an enemy uses it that enemy gets the buff too.... It was shown with the ignis. 

Now.... just imagine the op flux rifles on those corpus crewmen....I already get my hp shredded by em..

There's a way around that, make seperate versions for players and NPC's just like DE did with the Ogris, players use the standard ogris whereas bombards use the at-ogris which is the same weapon (only npc exclusive) but with a few tweaks .

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