[TWW] New Weapons Feedback

[GrimAtrament]

6 minutes ago, Telogor said:

The Twin Rogga are trash.  They're in direct competition with the Tigris series, and they have less than half the damage after modding, with no supplemental stats to make up that deficit.

The Orivius is also trash.  Its attack speed is absolutely terrible.  Its DPS is lacking.  Nearly any other thrown melee is better, which is saying a lot because thrown melee is pretty terrible.  The Glaive Prime has about 50% faster attack speed making up for its lower damage.  The Kestrel has forced ragdoll on the throw, which is better CC than the Orvius's, while not forcing the wielder to channel and lose attack capability.  The Cerata is much better for melee because of the toxin base damage, faster speed, higher stats, and better crit.

I haven't gotten the Kesheg yet, but a quick perusal of the stats show it's simply too slow to be very effective.  It needs 10% crit and at least .9 attack speed.  Or here's an idea: how about we actually get a polearm that's viable for melee use?  To do that, simply bring its crit chance up to 25% with its current attack speed or 20% with .95 attack speed.

Though I don't have the Zarr yet, It seems pretty comparable to the Kulstar, which is good.  Instead of switching fire modes with secondary fire, just make the shotgun blast the secondary fire.

you must not be using the twin rogga because mine at rank 0 half health a level 56 grineer with the first shot and killed it with the second shot 

[Maki0r]

9 hours ago, N64Gamefreak said:

Orvius: slow attack speed, slow flight speed, low crit chance, low status chance.  Frustrating.

it's a really fun weapon but not really viable medium high levels, i hope they fix just a litle the stats, but i'm loving the weapon right now :D

[SmilingMad]

The Zarr is very fun, and I must say I really like the choice of giving it a shotgun mode. It's not particularly potent compared to true shotties, and it consumes launcher ammo, and of course it has a massive range limitation, but it works very well for situations where the cannon mode is just too dangerous. Also, props to the soundies, this thing sounds really nice.

A quality of life change could be made regarding the mode switching. I've had moments where I was reloading, tried to switch to the shotgun mode and blew myself up because you can only switch after the animation is completed. Beyond that, maybe a smidge of punchthrough for the shotgun, but I'm iffy on that. Would be nice for dealing with groups at close range, but I don't think that's the purpose of the shotgun mode anyway. Not sure.

[Yuni_Hermit]

D'awrr. Kesheg is a halberd. There is one, single alternate combo in Shimmering Blight, and while it's not hard to perform, spear/halberd stances are still very boring right now. Nothing but spinning... no hacks, stabs, or other actual-spear-like moves.

Ironically, there IS stabbing if you do not equip a stance, not that it's very effective with that hitbox. The Kesheg is visually pleasing in terms of paint job and shape (that hanging braid is nice), but it's not fun to wield due to a boring stance with no attack variation.

I even forma'd... one of the quest weapons to give it the other stance, I won't spoiler.

[Telogor]

17 hours ago, hazerddex said:

you must not be using the twin rogga because mine at rank 0 half health a level 56 grineer with the first shot and killed it with the second shot 

I am using the Twin Rogga.  They do quite a bit of damage, but they're way inferior to even the regular Tigris.  After you put damage and multishot on both the Tigris and the Twin Rogga, the Tigris ends up with almost triple the damage, and the Tigris Prime ends up with over quadruple the damage:

Twin Rogga: 300 base damage * (1 + 220%) Hornet Strike * (1 + 180%) multishot = 2688

Tigris: 1050 base damage * (1 + 225%) Primed Point Blank and Blaze * (1 + 120%) multishot = 7507.5

Tigris Prime: 1560 base damage * (1 + 225%) Primed Point Blank and Blaze * (1 + 120%) multishot = 11,154, with the potential of a 100% status build

Edited November 15, 2016 by Telogor

[GrimAtrament]

1 minute ago, Telogor said:

I am using the Twin Rogga.  They do quite a bit of damage, but they're way inferior to even the regular Tigris.  After you put damage and multishot on both the Tigris and the Twin Rogga, the Tigris ends up with almost triple the damage:

Twin Rogga: 300 base damage * (1 + 220%) Hornet Strike * (1 + 180%) multishot = 2688

Tigris: 1050 base damage * (1 + 225%) Primed Point Blank and Blaze * (1 + 120%) multishot = 7507.5

why are you comparing it to a primary and of all the primary the tigris how is that a fair assessment? 

[Telogor]

1 minute ago, hazerddex said:

why are you comparing it to a primary and of all the primary the tigris how is that a fair assessment? 

Because they fill the same role.  Both the Twin Rogga and the Tigris are shotguns with two rounds per mag meant for very high per-shot damage.  They have the same ammo capacity, same ammo pickup, and same playstyle, and the Twin Rogga are strictly worse in all situations.

[GrimAtrament]

2 minutes ago, Telogor said:

Because they fill the same role. 

no no they dont one is a secondary 

one is a primary 

expecting a secondary to out do a primary in the same catagory is a bit much dont you think?

 

theres a reason its called secondary

Edited November 15, 2016 by hazerddex

[Snowbluff]

24 minutes ago, hazerddex said:

no no they dont one is a secondary 

one is a primary 

expecting a secondary to out do a primary in the same catagory is a bit much dont you think?

 

theres a reason its called secondary

They both shoot people. Secondaries should be able to compete with primaries as a rule, and vice versa, or people would ditch one in favor of the other.

[Avidalarm]

I feel as if the twin Rogga need something more in the ammunition department.

The damage on the twin Rogga are massively crippled by it's clip size of two making using the weapon almost pointless.

Slap two more shots into them and they'll be perfect hand canons 

[Gognorok]

I have not had the chance to dive into the new update a ton but I have gone through the quest and have done some kuva/endless fisser farm.

With that being said the one new weapon I was giddy at building was the Orvius.

After some time in the simulator and testing every build I can think of the attack speed of this weapon must change.

With every build that I have tried the attack speed is this glaring sore spot holding this weapon back from being mastery fodder to pure awesome,

even with 3 stacks of berserker and a 225% power strength volt, the weapon still feels very sluggish paired with its average stats I would be forever thankful If you guys were to take a second look at this beautiful glaive.

I just can't think of a reason why it was felt that this weapons performance warranted such a flaw and besides I seriously doubt that a B.A. like Teshin would use something so sluggish.

 

[----Fenrir----]

12 hours ago, hazerddex said:

no no they dont one is a secondary 

one is a primary 

expecting a secondary to out do a primary in the same catagory is a bit much dont you think?

 

theres a reason its called secondary

The Akstiletto Primes can compete with any full auto primary weapon. Infact they out DPS all of them. The fact is it does not matter whenever it's a primary or a secondary. You can only use one ranged weapon at a time and ammo is never really an issue in this game. So there is zero reason do use a secondary when the primary fills the same role but does it much better.

Making secondary's way way inferior is a sure way to ensure that no one will ever use them outside of "pistol only" sorties or when carrying something.

[painterman]

Quick feedbad:

-Zarr: amazing, really, probably my next to-go weapon, maybe swich it to shotgun mods+firestorm so we can ajust the spread of the barrage?( not necesary tho, but would be nice, being that needs a drakgoon)

-Orvius: standar throw, could be usefull, 2 dam slow. Special feature: its nice, but still slow to use in real situations, a explosion-glaive is more usefull IMHO. Really like the desing on this one.

-twin rogga: maybe its intended to be a sidegrade to the brakk? (trade high sustanined/posible high burst for high burst?) A bit 2 slow to my taste, but not bad at all. If it uses shotgun pickups, why it cant use shotgun mods? First true secondary shotgun confirmed????¡¡¡

-Broken scepter: ok, masttery folder, nice desing, ability slow as F and not that usefull in general use. Buff to release instead of 1 health obr to release 4? 1 energy obr is ok.

-Kesheg: Still being researched, but seems really good for maiming strike-spin-to-win build, not that is a bad thing per-se.

[therealfriday13th]

FIRST OFF:  OBLIGATORY SPOILER TAG!   DO NOT READ THIS UNLESS YOU HAVE FINISHED THE WAR WITHIN!

 

Methinks ya dun goofed up.  The Orvius is significantly more powerful than the Glaive Prime in every way aside from attack speed.

[MegatronG1]

Weapon Feedback:

• Zarr - I like the weapon and I feel that this is a weapon that has done the change weapon mode for a weapon right. I also like how this weapon makes me grab this weapon as an alternative to using the tonkor for it's neat cluster bomb mode and it's barrage mode.
• Twin Rogga - It seems like a decent weapon with a small ammo capacity and fast reload speed. This weapon seems to have some potential and I can probably figure out a build for this weapon once I get a catalyst and forma on it.
• Orvius - It's a nice weapon with a pretty neat mechanic with the channeling ability. I haven't had the forma/catalyst/time to upgrade the weapon yet, so I can't really give too much feedback on it's practical usage in missions.

 

• Broken Scepter - I think the stats are decent and the special mechanic is pretty neat. However I think the weapon could have more utility if the essence drain gave a health/energy based on a certain percentage instead of a single energy/health orb. Perhaps like the syndicate weapons giving something close to 15% heal of the base health or 10% of the base energy pool when enemy essence is drained or give a temporary boost to Max Health or Max Energy after draining the enemy essence.

Edited November 16, 2016 by MegatronG1

[lZerul]

Zarr: With the recent changes, the Zarr is perfect. I have never fallen in love with a gun so quickly.

Twin Rogga - A fun weapon, reminds me of the Akbronco and I enjoyed that weapon a great deal.

Spoiler

Broken Scepter - Decent stat-wise, but its gimmick feels very clunky. Maybe make it spawn health orbs/energy orbs on melee kills?

 

Edited November 16, 2016 by lZerul

[Exaedr]

Zarr- It's alright, not too OP or too weak. Pretty mid-viable.

Twin Rogga- Very fun and surprisingly strong for what it is.

Orvius- I had to put both primed fury and berserker to get it to go faster, otherwise it was way to slow for anything, I would've taken 2-3 hits to the body before I could even properly deal real damage to the enemy because of the armor and the shield that they have. Throwing mechanic was very cool but because of slow attack speed, the animation to throw was also slowed down, overall the most disappointing imo since it was the weapon I was looking forward to using since I'm a fan of the glaives.

Broken Scepter- The mechanic is utterly useless, since I have to stand over the body to get the orbs out and not only that but sometimes it won't even let me drain an orb out. Damage-wise I feel like I was looking at another Bo prime. Really wishing that all the true staves weren't mastery fodder, I say true staves because I feel the Tipedo doesn't really count as one, if anything a polearm.

[Guest]

Can we get throw attacks with throwing weapons to count towards the combo counter?  It kinda sucks that their major feature doesn't function like the rest of all the melee weapons in regards to the build up of damage.

 

[VegaTheLich]

I've only used the Zarr and the fifth(!) weapon in the update so I'll comment on those two.

The Zarr, like others have said, should have its self damage capped to its base damage, which is already high. This way, if you were to get careless (or have a butcher appear from nowhere) and fire your four-forma Zarr in canon mode you don't kill yourself, but instead take a good dent out of your shield. (IMO shield gating would also fix the issue of killing yourself with self-damage because a butcher decided to drop in). Other than that I'm loving it. I haven't gotten it to 30 yet (and will likely forget to come give feedback once I have) let alone put any forma on it, but I've got this in mind as far as builds go (pure damage with some reload in there. Cryo rounds might get swapped out for magazine warp, but I doubt I will.)

Spoiler

The Broken Scepter is a visually appealing, decent weapon to use. It suffers from the awkward way you pull energy/health orbs out of a corpse, which is often a waste of time, as you'll get more health/energy by continuing the fight rather than stopping to "absorb" the enemy like it's a capture target. I can think of two solutions, one is to make have the scepter give energy on kills and health on channeling kills. Life strike wouldn't work on this weapon, if this were the case. The second is to massively increase how many health/energy orbs come out of the corpse, perhaps scaling with enemy health. One orb for levels 1-20, two for 20-30, 3 for 30-40, something like that. The damage is decent, nothing special but nothing bad.  Build.

My only other complaint would be that it doesn't show up on the operator's back if our warframe is using it. DE pls.

I hate getting argon so it'll be a while before I get the Twin Rogga, and I have too many melee weapons to level to justify crafting the Kesheg. Dislike all glaives except the original so the orvius won't be built for a while. I also need a lot of Kuva so that's also an issue.

[greymaniac]

The Zarr

Cannon mode is great for defending objectives. I've enjoyed it very much on some excavations combined with vauban. The cluster bomblets that are released are also kind of unique, and spread the base blast damage CC very well. The barrage mode, while not having much range, is good damagewise and the added punch through helps when moving around in missions. Might you allow mode swap when reloading? I've often shot myself in the face with the cannon after a reload, while I though I had swapped to barrage. Overall I like the design very much.

Twin Rogga

Okay damage, small clip size. Almost forced to do aimed shots due to the latter. They're not easy to use in a fast situation, but then again maybe they're not aimed for that.

Broken Scepter

Good reach, good status, slightly low crit (not much of a problem). Makes an okay slide attack weapon. The special for what it gives is too slow to use. I suggest that it should spawn additional orbs instead of just one.

[PrimumMobile]

just came in to say that i love the place the zarr is in right now, but i do agree with everyone else on the not being able to change firing types while reloading. That's often times where the type needs to be changed the most

[AutoPhox]

Omg the Zarr! Oh, its so much fun! Thank you DE

[Gognorok]

16 hours ago, therealfriday13th said:

FIRST OFF:  OBLIGATORY SPOILER TAG!   DO NOT READ THIS UNLESS YOU HAVE FINISHED THE WAR WITHIN!

 

Methinks ya dun goofed up.  The Orvius is significantly more powerful than the Glaive Prime in every way aside from attack speed.

With current mods and abilities you could take a weapon with .750AS [ Orvius ] and a weapon with 1.17AS [ Glaive Prime ] and glaive will out dps the orvius all day long just because of the attack speed that can be achieved with far less making the better base stats of the orvius much less effective not to mention the far superior reaction time you have with the glaive prime

 

correct me If I am wrong but at .750AS, that makes Orvius a one handed melee weapon I presume is also light weight the single slowest melee in game even fragor prime is faster at .800AS

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Gognorok said:

With current mods and abilities you could take a weapon with .750AS [ Orvius ] and a weapon with 1.17AS [ Glaive Prime ] and glaive will out dps the orvius all day long just because of the attack speed that can be achieved with far less making the better base stats of the orvius much less effective not to mention the far superior reaction time you have with the glaive prime

 

correct me If I am wrong but at .750AS, that makes Orvius a one handed melee weapon I presume is also light weight the single slowest melee in game even fragor prime is faster at .800AS

yeah the orvius is painfully slow.  i have to use a speed volt just to make the thing bearable.  i'll get primed fury in a couple days and that may put a small dent in it, but it's still pretty awful.

[therealfriday13th]

7 hours ago, Gognorok said:

With current mods and abilities you could take a weapon with .750AS [ Orvius ] and a weapon with 1.17AS [ Glaive Prime ] and glaive will out dps the orvius all day long just because of the attack speed that can be achieved with far less making the better base stats of the orvius much less effective not to mention the far superior reaction time you have with the glaive prime

 

correct me If I am wrong but at .750AS, that makes Orvius a one handed melee weapon I presume is also light weight the single slowest melee in game even fragor prime is faster at .800AS

I've found that by sticking whirlwind on it I have what amounts to an infinite ammo grenade launcher thanks to its ability.  May be slow at CQC even with Fury, but it's pretty devastating to crowds of Grineer (haven't tried Corpus yet) mooks at range.  I'm guessing that's what was intended here.

 

EDIT:  Just tested this on Pluto Survival.  While it knocks out crewman well enough, it takes a LITTLE longer on MOAs (by which time the crowd disperses), and nullifiers deflect the shot, rendering the Orvius kinda useless against them.  

Edited November 17, 2016 by therealfriday13th
Finished testing on Corpus enemies.