[Spoilers] This is a perfect time for a traditional progression system & ETC for the

[EmptyDevil]

37 minutes ago, Pckool12 said:

I actually made a video on My thoughts on the whole operator system. I think you capture alot of what I was looking for as well. but I was thinking for of merging the previous focus system with this new operator system.

Aye. I would like for this system i detail and for the previous Focus system to get reworked and applied to the Operator's powers. It would be pretty cool.

[TDefton]

1 minute ago, EmptyDevil said:

Aye. I would like for this system i detail and for the previous Focus system to get reworked and applied to the Operator's powers. It would be pretty cool.

I know right!?! Would be SO GOOD!

[Danjal777]

My thoughts on this...

Why cap it?  It is insane for someone to try and max out their operator to level 1000.  I understand you're trying to keep it balanced, but, if someone upgraded their operator to have 3000 health and an insane power pool, let them go.  In the long run you will just be standing there looking at them like you do with the guys who hundred forma a MK1 Braton...uh...okay bro, that pretty cool.   So you limit this crazy progression by adding a bunch of categories.

Health 

Run Speed

Jump Height

Knockdown resistance

Status Recovery

Energy Pool

Power Strength

Power Range

Power Speed

Power Efficiency

You get the idea, with enough stats, it would take a lifetime to crank any of these stats to levels that are too overpowered.

 

Also your Focus should massively affect your powers.  Where your raw stats are determined by your growth points, they are changed (like through a lens) by your focus school

Madurai- the savage volcano
Beam- Changes to charge and release beam that looks like a kamehameha
Blast- Changes to a fiery blast directly in front of the Tenno
Dash- Dash as normal, but is an enemy is in the crosshairs you erupt from inside of them causing them to explode and litter enemies nearby with shrapnel
Cloak- Because Madurai is about reckless rapid attacks, you are not invulnerable but have your speed doubled and light anything you run into on fire

Vazarin- the fluid wave
Beam- Changes into a cone of pure knock back for enemies, allies in the cone have rapid health regeneration
Blast- Changes to shield that you can hold to activate, collects all incoming projectiles and deflects melee attacks, releasing it sends all collected attacks back on top of the normal function of the blast
Dash- Where you come out of a dash leaves a healing zone that will slowly regenerate health and halves status duration, will dash directly to the nearest ally if held
Cloak- Works as normal but if you walk into an allied Warframe and come out of cloak allows you to 'ride' it giving you the ability to use your their Warframe's powers with your power pool and mods on top of whatever they are doing

Naramon- the wizened tree
Beam- Changes to a rapid fire seeking projectile swarm that stun enemies and opens them to finishers
Blast- Works as normal, but the enemy is fully scanned gives it a weakness highlight (in its weakest area, usually the head) that double whatever that damage usually is
Dash- Dashes, but the operator is cloaked for five seconds afterward
Cloak- while cloaked all enemies within range will have highlighted weak points as blast does above, allies can capitalize on this

Unairu- the immovable mountain
Beam- Changes to high recoil flash that stuns enemies in front of the operator, each continued exposure slowly petrifies them, they will stop bullets and act as cover if this takes place
Blast- Works as normal, but does triple damage to petrified targets and shatters them if they are killed sending them forward as shrapnel
Dash- Works as normal, but erects a stone obelisk in front afterward that can also be shattered by blast or left to be used as cover, allies near your obelisk will gain bonus armor
Cloak- Surrounds the operator in a massive stone armor, walking causes it to roll, enemies will get caught in it as it goes which will slowly petrify them and make the bolder bigger (katamari anyone?)

Zenurik- the eternal gemstone
Beam- Causes electrical bolts to fly from your fingers hitting targets at random (ala emperor palpatine style)
Blast- Works as normal, but slows time around the enemy affected, allies in the blast will absorb some energy
Dash- Works as normal, but enemies affected will have a small magnetic field that caused their hit boxes to be much larger placing preference on weak points
Cloak- Doubles speed for the operator and allies, halves speed for enemies in the affected area
 

 

[EmptyDevil]

2 minutes ago, Danjal777 said:

My thoughts on this...

Why cap it?  It is insane for someone to try and max out their operator to level 1000.  I understand you're trying to keep it balanced, but, if someone upgraded their operator to have 3000 health and an insane power pool, let them go.  In the long run you will just be standing there looking at them like you do with the guys who hundred forma a MK1 Braton...uh...okay bro, that pretty cool.   So you limit this crazy progression by adding a bunch of categories.

Health 

Run Speed

Jump Height

Knockdown resistance

Status Recovery

Energy Pool

Power Strength

Power Range

Power Speed

Power Efficiency

You get the idea, with enough stats, it would take a lifetime to crank any of these stats to levels that are too overpowered.

 

Also your Focus should massively affect your powers.  Where your raw stats are determined by your growth points, they are changed (like through a lens) by your focus school

Madurai- the savage volcano
Beam- Changes to charge and release beam that looks like a kamehameha
Blast- Changes to a fiery blast directly in front of the Tenno
Dash- Dash as normal, but is an enemy is in the crosshairs you erupt from inside of them causing them to explode and litter enemies nearby with shrapnel
Cloak- Because Madurai is about reckless rapid attacks, you are not invulnerable but have your speed doubled and light anything you run into on fire

Vazarin- the fluid wave
Beam- Changes into a cone of pure knock back for enemies, allies in the cone have rapid health regeneration
Blast- Changes to shield that you can hold to activate, collects all incoming projectiles and deflects melee attacks, releasing it sends all collected attacks back on top of the normal function of the blast
Dash- Where you come out of a dash leaves a healing zone that will slowly regenerate health and halves status duration, will dash directly to the nearest ally if held
Cloak- Works as normal but if you walk into an allied Warframe and come out of cloak allows you to 'ride' it giving you the ability to use your their Warframe's powers with your power pool and mods on top of whatever they are doing

Naramon- the wizened tree
Beam- Changes to a rapid fire seeking projectile swarm that stun enemies and opens them to finishers
Blast- Works as normal, but the enemy is fully scanned gives it a weakness highlight (in its weakest area, usually the head) that double whatever that damage usually is
Dash- Dashes, but the operator is cloaked for five seconds afterward
Cloak- while cloaked all enemies within range will have highlighted weak points as blast does above, allies can capitalize on this

Unairu- the immovable mountain
Beam- Changes to high recoil flash that stuns enemies in front of the operator, each continued exposure slowly petrifies them, they will stop bullets and act as cover if this takes place
Blast- Works as normal, but does triple damage to petrified targets and shatters them if they are killed sending them forward as shrapnel
Dash- Works as normal, but erects a stone obelisk in front afterward that can also be shattered by blast or left to be used as cover, allies near your obelisk will gain bonus armor
Cloak- Surrounds the operator in a massive stone armor, walking causes it to roll, enemies will get caught in it as it goes which will slowly petrify them and make the bolder bigger (katamari anyone?)

Zenurik- the eternal gemstone
Beam- Causes electrical bolts to fly from your fingers hitting targets at random (ala emperor palpatine style)
Blast- Works as normal, but slows time around the enemy affected, allies in the blast will absorb some energy
Dash- Works as normal, but enemies affected will have a small magnetic field that caused their hit boxes to be much larger placing preference on weak points
Cloak- Doubles speed for the operator and allies, halves speed for enemies in the affected area
 

 

I don't know about limitless progression, because we don't want them to completely surpass the Warframe. I like the idea of more stats to increase and thought of that at the time of creating this thread.

We seem to be on the same wavelength when it comes to integrating Focus as well. I really like the ideas you listed and might actually be inspired to put my own into the OP. 

[Danjal777]

32 minutes ago, EmptyDevil said:

I don't know about limitless progression, because we don't want them to completely surpass the Warframe. I like the idea of more stats to increase and thought of that at the time of creating this thread.

We seem to be on the same wavelength when it comes to integrating Focus as well. I really like the ideas you listed and might actually be inspired to put my own into the OP. 

Feel free to use them, I had a good time writing it.

[Hobzor]

Mind if I contribute my thoughts?

[EmptyDevil]

1 minute ago, Hobzor said:

Mind if I contribute my thoughts?

Feel free.

[TDefton]

Made this about what I think. Thoughts?

[Hobzor]

Operator Rank And Stats

 

Currently saying the Operator is underwhelming is putting it mildly. It makes sense from a lore standpoint though, I think, they just woke up not long ago (Second Dream) and still don’t really remember their past. They only just regained some of their powers and started acting beyond their frames.

 

Current Operator (Rank 0)

 

Health: 100.

 

Energy: 50 (ish. Near as I can tell, used beam to drain energy to nothing and then picked up an energy orb, energy jumped up to about half).

 

Armor: ?

 

Shields: 0.

 

Sprint Speed: About 0.50. (Would suggest this just be increased to 1.00 base, equal to Excalibur and some other frames)

 

Abilities: Void Beam, Void Blast, Void Dash, Void Mode/Cloak and Transference.

 

Basic Rank Up Idea

 

Operator Rank 1

 

Health: 100 ^ 125

 

Shield: Unlocked: 100

 

Skill Point Gained: 1

 

Operator Rank 2

 

Energy: 50 ^ 75

 

Skill Point Gained: 1

 

Operator Rank 3

 

Health: 125 ^ 150

 

Shield: 100 ^ 125

 

Skill Point Gained: 1

 

Operator Rank 4

 

Energy: 75 ^ 100

 

Double Jump Unlocked. Base Jump Height Increased 50%.

 

Skill Point Gained: 1

 

Operator Rank 5

 

Health: 150 ^ 175

 

Shield: 125 ^ 150

 

Wall Running/Clinging Unlocked.

 

Void Bolt Unlocked.

 

Skill Point Gained: 1

 

Etc.

 

Moving on, as the Operator’s Rank increases they gain points they can use to improve themselves or their powers. Points can be used to increase base stats (health, shields, energy capacity and even sprint speed) or to improve an aspect of an ability, increase range, damage, energy efficiency, etc.

 

Additional abilities will also be unlocked as the Operator ranks up, variations on the main abilities. (Example: Void Bolt: Variation on Void Blast, fires a fast moving, long range energy ball that explodes on impact with the same AoE as Void Blast but higher base damage. As a variation of Void Blast it will be affected by any upgrades applied to the original ability.) Variations are “equipped” through a Operator Skill Tree in the Somatic Link room.

 

Each Focus School has variations of their own on some of the Operator abilities plus upgradable passive buffs.

 

Operator abilities switched up to work like Warframe abilities, used with 1,2,3 and 4 or selected with the scroll wheel and quick cast with Q. 1=Void Blast, 2=Void Cloak/Mode, 3=Void Repulse and 4=...Not 100% sure on that one.

 

Void Beam is still aimed and fired as normal. E has the Operator attack with Void Blades (unique Claw type weapon) formed around their hands. Stealth kills enabled. Using the Void Blades takes energy, same as the rest of the Operator’s powers but not too much per attack.

 

Mastery Rank: Each rank gives an additional point/s that can be used to upgrade the Operator and their abilities. Each tier (Initiate, Disciple, etc) unlocks “slots” on abilities to add modifiers/augments (Diablo 3 runes).

 

Or, instead of having health, shields, etc go up by rank each rank gives stat points the player can use to improve things the way they want. I’m not too attached to either system.

 

Focus Schools and The Operator

 

Madurai: They followed the path of Engage The Enemy. Their swift, uncompromising onslaught, holding nothing back and recklessly attacking their foes, could vanquish an opponent before he had the chance to steel himself. Speed and savagery characterized this school.

 

Buffs: Speed (movement and attack) and Damage. (Affects Operator and Warframes.)

 

    Blitz: Sprint Speed increased by 10/20/25/30%. Melee Attack Speed increased by 10/20/25/30%.

 

    Blazing Fury: Increases Physical damage by 10/20/25/30%. Gives a % chance for attacks to deal 10/20/25/30% heat damage.

 

Abilities: Offensive.

 

    Phoenix Gaze (Void Beam): Beam does heat, slash and puncture damage (and “Void” damage, preventing Sentients from adapting to it). Innate punch through. Can “equip” Meteorite: Phoenix Gaze gains increased AoE on point of impact, dealing blast damage in addition to it’s base damage over a wider area. And Dragon Fire: Phoenix Gaze leaves a trail of fire wherever it hits, dealing heat damage to any enemy that crosses through it.

 

    Chimera Breath (Void Beam): Beam becomes a wide cone with shorter range. Deals heat and impact damage (Void Damage). Innate punch through. Knockback and knockdown chance. Can equip Hades Touch: Increased chance of igniting enemies and increased duration of heat proc. And Dragon Fire: Same as Phoenix Gaze.

 

    Phoenix Flash (Void Blast): Fires a wave of energy that deals heat and impact damage to enemies in a cone ahead of the Operator (Void Damage). Innate punch through. Retains Stun effect. Can equip Rising Ashes: Enemies hit by Phoenix Flash are blasted into the air, dealing additional heat damage and blast damage.

 

    Solar Flare (Void Blast): Creates a stationary energy ball that fires bursts of plasma at nearby enemies for several seconds. Enemies are pulled towards the ball if they enter it’s range. Deals heat damage (Void Damage). Can equip Nova Blast: Solar Flare detonates when it expires, dealing additional heat and blast damage to enemies in range. And Hades Touch: Increased chance of igniting enemies and increased duration of heat proc.

 

    Nova Strike (Void Dash): Dash deals heat and impact damage to enemies the Operator passes through. Can equip Dragon Fire: A trail of fire is left in the Operator’s wake when dashing, burning enemies that pass through it. And Meteorite: A powerful blast affects enemies the Operator passes through, dealing additional heat and blast damage.

 

Unairu: They pushed themselves to Outlast the Enemy, to withstand all aggression without retreat. They believed that if the enemy could not match their endurance, then a battle could be won without having even commenced.

 

Buffs: Armor, shields and health. Resist knockdown and other stun effects. (Affects Operator and Warframes.)

 

Abilities: Defensive, Support and Offensive. (?)

 

    Basilisk Flare (Void Beam): Beam deals reduced damage but slows and eventually petrifies enemies. Can equip Crushing Force: Petrified enemies take damage over time while stone. Weight of Justice: Basilisk Flare deals increased damage. And Stone Armor: Temporarily increases armor of allies hit with Basilisk Flare.

 

….

 

Yeah, I’m not familiar enough with any school other than Madurai. Anyone else?

 

Naramon: This discipline focused on Knowing the Enemy, and the tacticians of Naramon believed that to truly understand a foe would confer the greatest advantage upon a warrior.

 

I actually have a thematically appropriate idea here for passives at least.

 

Buffs: Enemy detection and damage to enemies you have “researched”. (Shadow Step remains because I know some people have built their entire gameplay style around it and it isn’t really against theme.)

 

I have no names for the abilities since they don’t match up with existing focus nodes but, a player using Naramon and with the ability unlocked and equipped can see enemies through walls like a codex scanner without the ping. Based on Knowing the Enemy, a Naramon focus Tenno who has completed a codex entry for an enemy automatically deals increased damage of whatever type that enemy is most vulnerable to and can see weak points on enemies they have completed the codex entry of.

[TheHoodedSkull]

didn't see this mentioned on here, so here is my 2 cents...

Currently aura's and focus-passives DO work in Operator mode (health regen aura def, energy unsure, didnt test the rest yet)

Instead of the focus system, they could use the mystery choices (light, balance, dark)...

And while i adore infinite progression, there will always be a Draco for it, resulting in operator's overshadowing the frames...

Maybe they should just keep 'em squishy but up survivability through better energy regen and higher max energy. relying on void mode and cover instead of stats...

 

Addendum: max frame health is also temporarily reduced when operator dies, what causes it to return/ how much you lose could provide another progression opportunity

[EmptyDevil]

12 hours ago, Pckool12 said:

Made this about what I think. Thoughts?

It doesn't necessarily say anything that hasn't been said on the forums or thread already. It would have been better if you were using Operator mode, especially at the beginning. You were ranting about being unable to fight level 10 enemies with the Operator, but you were using the Warframe the entire time during that.

It would be better to type your thoughts out, as it would be quicker to go through it.

3 hours ago, Hobzor said:

Operator Rank And Stats

 

Currently saying the Operator is underwhelming is putting it mildly. It makes sense from a lore standpoint though, I think, they just woke up not long ago (Second Dream) and still don’t really remember their past. They only just regained some of their powers and started acting beyond their frames.

 

Current Operator (Rank 0)

 

Health: 100.

 

Energy: 50 (ish. Near as I can tell, used beam to drain energy to nothing and then picked up an energy orb, energy jumped up to about half).

 

Armor: ?

 

Shields: 0.

 

Sprint Speed: About 0.50. (Would suggest this just be increased to 1.00 base, equal to Excalibur and some other frames)

 

Abilities: Void Beam, Void Blast, Void Dash, Void Mode/Cloak and Transference.

 

Basic Rank Up Idea

 

Operator Rank 1

 

Health: 100 ^ 125

 

Shield: Unlocked: 100

 

Skill Point Gained: 1

 

Operator Rank 2

 

Energy: 50 ^ 75

 

Skill Point Gained: 1

 

Operator Rank 3

 

Health: 125 ^ 150

 

Shield: 100 ^ 125

 

Skill Point Gained: 1

 

Operator Rank 4

 

Energy: 75 ^ 100

 

Double Jump Unlocked. Base Jump Height Increased 50%.

 

Skill Point Gained: 1

 

Operator Rank 5

 

Health: 150 ^ 175

 

Shield: 125 ^ 150

 

Wall Running/Clinging Unlocked.

 

Void Bolt Unlocked.

 

Skill Point Gained: 1

 

Etc.

 

Moving on, as the Operator’s Rank increases they gain points they can use to improve themselves or their powers. Points can be used to increase base stats (health, shields, energy capacity and even sprint speed) or to improve an aspect of an ability, increase range, damage, energy efficiency, etc.

 

Additional abilities will also be unlocked as the Operator ranks up, variations on the main abilities. (Example: Void Bolt: Variation on Void Blast, fires a fast moving, long range energy ball that explodes on impact with the same AoE as Void Blast but higher base damage. As a variation of Void Blast it will be affected by any upgrades applied to the original ability.) Variations are “equipped” through a Operator Skill Tree in the Somatic Link room.

 

Each Focus School has variations of their own on some of the Operator abilities plus upgradable passive buffs.

 

Operator abilities switched up to work like Warframe abilities, used with 1,2,3 and 4 or selected with the scroll wheel and quick cast with Q. 1=Void Blast, 2=Void Cloak/Mode, 3=Void Repulse and 4=...Not 100% sure on that one.

 

Void Beam is still aimed and fired as normal. E has the Operator attack with Void Blades (unique Claw type weapon) formed around their hands. Stealth kills enabled. Using the Void Blades takes energy, same as the rest of the Operator’s powers but not too much per attack.

 

Mastery Rank: Each rank gives an additional point/s that can be used to upgrade the Operator and their abilities. Each tier (Initiate, Disciple, etc) unlocks “slots” on abilities to add modifiers/augments (Diablo 3 runes).

 

Or, instead of having health, shields, etc go up by rank each rank gives stat points the player can use to improve things the way they want. I’m not too attached to either system.

 

Focus Schools and The Operator

 

Madurai: They followed the path of Engage The Enemy. Their swift, uncompromising onslaught, holding nothing back and recklessly attacking their foes, could vanquish an opponent before he had the chance to steel himself. Speed and savagery characterized this school.

 

Buffs: Speed (movement and attack) and Damage. (Affects Operator and Warframes.)

 

    Blitz: Sprint Speed increased by 10/20/25/30%. Melee Attack Speed increased by 10/20/25/30%.

 

    Blazing Fury: Increases Physical damage by 10/20/25/30%. Gives a % chance for attacks to deal 10/20/25/30% heat damage.

 

Abilities: Offensive.

 

    Phoenix Gaze (Void Beam): Beam does heat, slash and puncture damage (and “Void” damage, preventing Sentients from adapting to it). Innate punch through. Can “equip” Meteorite: Phoenix Gaze gains increased AoE on point of impact, dealing blast damage in addition to it’s base damage over a wider area. And Dragon Fire: Phoenix Gaze leaves a trail of fire wherever it hits, dealing heat damage to any enemy that crosses through it.

 

    Chimera Breath (Void Beam): Beam becomes a wide cone with shorter range. Deals heat and impact damage (Void Damage). Innate punch through. Knockback and knockdown chance. Can equip Hades Touch: Increased chance of igniting enemies and increased duration of heat proc. And Dragon Fire: Same as Phoenix Gaze.

 

    Phoenix Flash (Void Blast): Fires a wave of energy that deals heat and impact damage to enemies in a cone ahead of the Operator (Void Damage). Innate punch through. Retains Stun effect. Can equip Rising Ashes: Enemies hit by Phoenix Flash are blasted into the air, dealing additional heat damage and blast damage.

 

    Solar Flare (Void Blast): Creates a stationary energy ball that fires bursts of plasma at nearby enemies for several seconds. Enemies are pulled towards the ball if they enter it’s range. Deals heat damage (Void Damage). Can equip Nova Blast: Solar Flare detonates when it expires, dealing additional heat and blast damage to enemies in range. And Hades Touch: Increased chance of igniting enemies and increased duration of heat proc.

 

    Nova Strike (Void Dash): Dash deals heat and impact damage to enemies the Operator passes through. Can equip Dragon Fire: A trail of fire is left in the Operator’s wake when dashing, burning enemies that pass through it. And Meteorite: A powerful blast affects enemies the Operator passes through, dealing additional heat and blast damage.

 

Unairu: They pushed themselves to Outlast the Enemy, to withstand all aggression without retreat. They believed that if the enemy could not match their endurance, then a battle could be won without having even commenced.

 

Buffs: Armor, shields and health. Resist knockdown and other stun effects. (Affects Operator and Warframes.)

 

Abilities: Defensive, Support and Offensive. (?)

 

    Basilisk Flare (Void Beam): Beam deals reduced damage but slows and eventually petrifies enemies. Can equip Crushing Force: Petrified enemies take damage over time while stone. Weight of Justice: Basilisk Flare deals increased damage. And Stone Armor: Temporarily increases armor of allies hit with Basilisk Flare.

 

….

 

Yeah, I’m not familiar enough with any school other than Madurai. Anyone else?

 

Naramon: This discipline focused on Knowing the Enemy, and the tacticians of Naramon believed that to truly understand a foe would confer the greatest advantage upon a warrior.

 

I actually have a thematically appropriate idea here for passives at least.

 

Buffs: Enemy detection and damage to enemies you have “researched”. (Shadow Step remains because I know some people have built their entire gameplay style around it and it isn’t really against theme.)

 

I have no names for the abilities since they don’t match up with existing focus nodes but, a player using Naramon and with the ability unlocked and equipped can see enemies through walls like a codex scanner without the ping. Based on Knowing the Enemy, a Naramon focus Tenno who has completed a codex entry for an enemy automatically deals increased damage of whatever type that enemy is most vulnerable to and can see weak points on enemies they have completed the codex entry of.

Very detailed. Personally, i think DE should keep the feeling of Operators and Warframes different. What do i mean by that? The leveling system should take a little longer than the standard Warframe ranking, where Warframes gain a fixed stat amount per level. Operators shouldn't have base shields or base armor, without some kind of gear. They shouldn't be capable of double jumps or wall clings either. The old version of wallruns might be ok, but only for a set duration, like 5 seconds.

Still debating if i want to include my Focus ideas, i still have a lot to type out, but some of them overlap with yours and another poster.

50 minutes ago, TheHoodedSkull said:

didn't see this mentioned on here, so here is my 2 cents...

Currently aura's and focus-passives DO work in Operator mode (health regen aura def, energy unsure, didnt test the rest yet)

Instead of the focus system, they could use the mystery choices (light, balance, dark)...

And while i adore infinite progression, there will always be a Draco for it, resulting in operator's overshadowing the frames...

Maybe they should just keep 'em squishy but up survivability through better energy regen and higher max energy. relying on void mode and cover instead of stats...

 

Addendum: max frame health is also temporarily reduced when operator dies, what causes it to return/ how much you lose could provide another progression opportunity

This thread is not about infinite progression, there are caps that prevent them from being better than Warframes. The incorporation of the mystery choices affecting stats would be a bad idea. We know nothing about it and we don't know how readily we'll be able to change it.

Losing max health on your Warframe when your Operator dies, is not progression, it's a penalty.

[Leemubay]

5 hours ago, Hobzor said:

Operator Rank And Stats

 

[the part that does not interest me goes here]

 

Naramon: This discipline focused on Knowing the Enemy, and the tacticians of Naramon believed that to truly understand a foe would confer the greatest advantage upon a warrior.

 

I actually have a thematically appropriate idea here for passives at least.

 

Buffs: Enemy detection and damage to enemies you have “researched”. (Shadow Step remains because I know some people have built their entire gameplay style around it and it isn’t really against theme.)

 

I have no names for the abilities since they don’t match up with existing focus nodes but, a player using Naramon and with the ability unlocked and equipped can see enemies through walls like a codex scanner without the ping. Based on Knowing the Enemy, a Naramon focus Tenno who has completed a codex entry for an enemy automatically deals increased damage of whatever type that enemy is most vulnerable to and can see weak points on enemies they have completed the codex entry of.

I think I can help with that.

Although those passive buffs seem good and dandy for me, some people don't really enjoy Codex Scanning and don't like using Helios/Heliocor so they might be a little bit unbalanced, but I agree with Shadow Step staying.

(Note that I want to sound original but suck at coining names, so please bear with me.)

Naramon Operator Ability Variants

They have a heavy focus on crowd control.

Mind Spike (Void Beam): The beam has additional Radiation damage along with base Void damage, with 75% status chance. Affected by passive weakness damage bonus. Augments include Reveal Weakness: Enemies hit will be forced into a Blinded animation (and be vulnerable to finishers until they recover), and afterwards receive double damage, or Overwhelm: 5% chance per second to inflict the enemy with a lifetime Mind Control, similarly to how Mind Spike simulates an everlasting Chaos to those hit (Bosses, Minibosses and Field Bosses are invulnerable). [Appearance effect: Beam originates from the eyes instead of the hand.]

Hypnotize (Void Beam): The beam has 1/3 of its range but is spread on a 45-degree radius cone. If enemies are continuously hit for 3 seconds, they will stop attacking and remain in a passive state until damaged or woken up by an ally (Bosses and minibosses are DEFINITELY immune). Can equip Weaken: Upon waking up, enemy has 75% reduced damage; Brainwash: Enemy can only be woken up upon reaching 25% of the health they had when hypnotized, and that includes being shot.

Mind Blast (Void Blast): Gee, such a creative name. Void Blast has its damage quartered but gains a 20-meter range and not only ragdolls enemies hit, but also confuses them (Similarly to Mind Spike, the focus ability, but with a one-minute effect). Augmented by Shatter: All enemies affected have their armor reduced by 50% (Shields too, if applicable) permanently. Does not stack. Sundering Blast: Enemies affected are disarmed and receive 50% more damage from all sources.

Mind Scramble (Void Dash): Enemies hit by the dash are Blinded and Confused for 10 seconds. Can be upgraded with Vulnerability: Until end of effect, enemies affected can receive Finishers. Tactical Redirection: Leaves behind a Radiation Zone similar to the Sortie mission handicap on the area near the dash, but it lasts for 15 seconds, has additional Void damage, and does not affect allies.

Psychic Aura (Void Cloak): Cloaking will trigger a 10-meter-radius aura that has 50% chance to Irradiate enemies. Deadly Intent: Affected enemies deal double damage to other enemies. Mind Drain: Void Cloak will not consume Energy if at least 3 enemies are being affected by the aura.

[Kaotyke]

I like those ideas, but I would prefer if DE made the Focus Actives abilities the Operator can use.

[EmptyDevil]

1 minute ago, Venom-Snake said:

I like those ideas, but I would prefer if DE made the Focus Actives abilities the Operator can use.

I agree about integrating Focus, but DE could and should do both. There isn't really a reason for them to not be able to do a few things listed in the OP.

[TDefton]

 

4 hours ago, EmptyDevil said:

It doesn't necessarily say anything that hasn't been said on the forums or thread already. It would have been better if you were using Operator mode, especially at the beginning. You were ranting about being unable to fight level 10 enemies with the Operator, but you were using the Warframe the entire time during that.

It would be better to type your thoughts out, as it would be quicker to go through it.

Very detailed. Personally, i think DE should keep the feeling of Operators and Warframes different. What do i mean by that? The leveling system should take a little longer than the standard Warframe ranking, where Warframes gain a fixed stat amount per level. Operators shouldn't have base shields or base armor, without some kind of gear. They shouldn't be capable of double jumps or wall clings either. The old version of wallruns might be ok, but only for a set duration, like 5 seconds.

Still debating if i want to include my Focus ideas, i still have a lot to type out, but some of them overlap with yours and another poster.

This thread is not about infinite progression, there are caps that prevent them from being better than Warframes. The incorporation of the mystery choices affecting stats would be a bad idea. We know nothing about it and we don't know how readily we'll be able to change it.

Losing max health on your Warframe when your Operator dies, is not progression, it's a penalty.

 

THats because this is part two. The first video I tried surviving for as long as possible in my tenno. This was after that challenge.

[EmptyDevil]

1 minute ago, Pckool12 said:

 

THats because this is part two. The first video I tried surviving for as long as possible in my tenno. This was after that challenge.

Ah, i see. I was confused as to why there was no Operator play. You should have sent them both to me.

[seanatron]

No.

The Operator should never need to come out of the warframe, the only acceptable time would be in the ship...and oddly enough that isn't available. What is the point of a warframe if your operator can essential become the stalker? As is, the need for the operator in gathering materials is absurd and feels lazy. Kinda like nullifier bubbles...can't figure out how to balance frame abilites? We'll just make all frame abilities useless. The mechanic is not good and this doesn't feel like Warframe, its worse then Archwing.

The operator storylines are great and thoughtful, but using them farther than the confines of the ship is not fun and feels awkward and out of place.

[low1991]

How about Operator and the focus combined? Our #5 becomes our operator' ultimate ability. using while not-operator mode = operator come out to use his/her ulti, when operator mode, he/she use his/her ulti as per normal.

Focus need rework, it need 2 column/ graph, 1 for passive, 1 for active-related, a total of 5 (current) + 1 (new) schools.

• A central school (Tenno?) where all general passives are (energy regen, health regen, etc, and a bit of each below) but to a low extent/ level or maximum lv 1. An active enhancement for Void beam/ dash/ hide?/ blast. Remains in used regardless of schools. Passive works without trigger for #5
• The rest (Madurai/ Vazarin/ Naramon/ Unairu/ Zenurik) will have passive concentrated on each individual school' principles
  •  Madurai-Speed and savagery
    • Def-Passive: movement speed buff, Roll-immune length, Bullet jump-immune length
    • Atk-Passive: Critical damage buff on melee/ primary/ secondary
  • Vazarin-Constant awareness/Counter
    • Def-Passive: Enemy radar, +x immune to each enemy first encounter with tenno, +x% resistance to environment damage/ effect
    • Atk-Passive: +x% damage buff/ critical chance/ critical damage on enemy first encounter with you
  • Naramon-Understand a foe/Advantage
    • Def-Passive: +x% evasion
    • Atk-Passive: +xx% damage buff when damaging weakspot, +x% damage buff when damanging fully scanned targets
  • Unairu-Endurance/Tank
    • Def-Passive: +xx% max shield, +xx% max health, +x% rate of becoming immune to 1 type of damage (like sentinel), +x% resist knockdown
  • Zenurik-Dominate/Brute strength
    • Atk-Passive: +x% ability strength/ duration/ range, +x% weapon damage, +xx% melee weapon damage buff, 
  • *As for active idea, none, they are wet noodles to me.

Operator, progression:

• +x max Health
• +x max Shield
• +x max Energy
• +x% Operator abiltiy range
• +x% Operator ability damage
• +x% Operator ability efficiency

Comments? though of this while reading OP's.

 

 

[EmptyDevil]

5 hours ago, seanatron said:

No.

The Operator should never need to come out of the warframe, the only acceptable time would be in the ship...and oddly enough that isn't available. What is the point of a warframe if your operator can essential become the stalker? As is, the need for the operator in gathering materials is absurd and feels lazy. Kinda like nullifier bubbles...can't figure out how to balance frame abilites? We'll just make all frame abilities useless. The mechanic is not good and this doesn't feel like Warframe, its worse then Archwing.

The operator storylines are great and thoughtful, but using them farther than the confines of the ship is not fun and feels awkward and out of place.

Press 5 on the ship.

25 minutes ago, low1991 said:

How about Operator and the focus combined? Our #5 becomes our operator' ultimate ability. using while not-operator mode = operator come out to use his/her ulti, when operator mode, he/she use his/her ulti as per normal.

Focus need rework, it need 2 column/ graph, 1 for passive, 1 for active-related, a total of 5 (current) + 1 (new) schools.

• A central school (Tenno?) where all general passives are (energy regen, health regen, etc, and a bit of each below) but to a low extent/ level or maximum lv 1. An active enhancement for Void beam/ dash/ hide?/ blast. Remains in used regardless of schools. Passive works without trigger for #5
• The rest (Madurai/ Vazarin/ Naramon/ Unairu/ Zenurik) will have passive concentrated on each individual school' principles
  •  Madurai-Speed and savagery
    • Def-Passive: movement speed buff, Roll-immune length, Bullet jump-immune length
    • Atk-Passive: Critical damage buff on melee/ primary/ secondary
  • Vazarin-Constant awareness/Counter
    • Def-Passive: Enemy radar, +x immune to each enemy first encounter with tenno, +x% resistance to environment damage/ effect
    • Atk-Passive: +x% damage buff/ critical chance/ critical damage on enemy first encounter with you
  • Naramon-Understand a foe/Advantage
    • Def-Passive: +x% evasion
    • Atk-Passive: +xx% damage buff when damaging weakspot, +x% damage buff when damanging fully scanned targets
  • Unairu-Endurance/Tank
    • Def-Passive: +xx% max shield, +xx% max health, +x% rate of becoming immune to 1 type of damage (like sentinel), +x% resist knockdown
  • Zenurik-Dominate/Brute strength
    • Atk-Passive: +x% ability strength/ duration/ range, +x% weapon damage, +xx% melee weapon damage buff, 
  • *As for active idea, none, they are wet noodles to me.

No need to preface with "How about Operator and the focus combined?" since i'm not against Focus being integrated. I mentioned how Focus would relate in the "Why not use the Focus System as a progression system instead/Focus System is the progression system for Operators?" section.

Some of these are pretty good.

32 minutes ago, low1991 said:

Operator, progression:

• +x max Health
• +x max Shield
• +x max Energy
• +x% Operator abiltiy range
• +x% Operator ability damage
• +x% Operator ability efficiency

Comments? though of this while reading OP's.

I disagree with giving them a shield, power range, and power efficiency stat.

[low1991]

53 minutes ago, EmptyDevil said:

Some of these are pretty good.

Use the ideas.

53 minutes ago, EmptyDevil said:

I disagree with giving them a shield, power range, and power efficiency stat.

I'm not sure abt your view, but mine is giving them ability stats to kinda create a Operator-Mission, where using operator alone is possible and making somewhat relevant to the normal game-play (no endless)

Well, it's my opinion.

 

[linxcat]

On 2016-11-14 at 3:49 PM, Reptileo said:

[snip]

a small shields perk would also be a neat thing for an operator ....if the heath would end around 300 ... maybe a 50 or 75 points for energy shields.

Remember that the way damage works it would only take 200 magnetic with your shields up to one-shot the operator. We don't have shield gating, so damage to shields overflows post-multiplier into health, while ignoring armour.

Edited November 18, 2016 by linxcat

[EmptyDevil]

3 hours ago, low1991 said:

I'm not sure abt your view, but mine is giving them ability stats to kinda create a Operator-Mission, where using operator alone is possible and making somewhat relevant to the normal game-play (no endless)

Well, it's my opinion.

 

My view is that they shouldn't share many traits with Warframes at all. They do not need shields(i specifically typed out a perk in the OP to substitute that), power range is extremely redundant because their beam has 20 meters of range, and power efficiency is unnecessary due to energy capacity having a fast regen rate.

[EmptyDevil]

Made a small revision to Melee Restriction ideas.

[Xarteros]

I strongly disagree with most of what I've read here, but I want to be constructive so I'll break down why

It's easy to understand a Warframe, a highly mechanised organism built for combat strength, stabbing a dagger through 15cm thick armour plating. A child should never be capable of such a feat. Tenno are warriors of the mind, not the body, and I don't think their physical forms can even be developed.

All natural biological activity has been halted for our Tenno. They do not age, they seemingly do not require food or have any other biological function. They are like what Vor became, beings transformed by pure Void energy, which is why they can be physically manifested, and they can be harmed/dissipated without actually dying. I just don't see any logical or lore-based reason why they should have a physical progression of stat growth, when nothing else they do is remotely biological.

I think the much more suitable path (logically, mechanically, and lore-wise) is to use the Focus trees, even though you've stated that you don't think it's suitable. Our Focus is like our knowledge and experience, but how you spend your focus is like what you choose to reflect most upon, and the conclusions you draw from that. This is the system that is most fitting for a Tenno, a warrior of the mind. If there was to be any physical growth stat, it should apply solely to Warframes and Companions, not to Tenno Operators. 

I'd accept minor boosts to physical stats for the Operators, but those boosts should come from training in the five Focus schools, available as separate nodes.

• Madurai: Boost to overall damage, and maybe an AoE or Life Steal ability
• Zenurik: Boost to max Void Energy and recharge rate
• Vazarin: Boost to health and a regeneration effect
• Naramon: Stealth drains less power, and the E pulse and dash has a stronger effect
• Unairu: Grants some form of shield or Iron Skin-style ability, to negate a few attacks before it needs to recharge

Again, the Tenno Operators are mostly mental beings, not physical, so any improvement should be a thing of training, not growth.

I do, however, greatly agree that Operators are a great platform for expansion. Not to thread-jack, but I made a thread about changing how Focus powers are deployed, so you manually release each wave or blast of your power in a similar style to the Operator's normal Void attacks. It opens up opportunities for special attacks from each School to give you new Dash attacks or E-pulses when you're using your Focus power. I made that thread with the very same spirit of wanting lots of expansion for the Operator's form

[EmptyDevil]

There seems to be a great disparity in your understanding of some aspects of this thread and the intent of it.

8 minutes ago, Xarteros said:

I strongly disagree with most of what I've read here, but I want to be constructive so I'll break down why

It's easy to understand a Warframe, a highly mechanised organism built for combat strength, stabbing a dagger through 15cm thick armour plating. A child should never be capable of such a feat. Tenno are warriors of the mind, not the body, and I don't think their physical forms can even be developed.

The combat strength you're talking about that allows them to stab through thick armor, comes primarily from the mods. The weapons in Warframe are amplified through mods, a technology that bestows a myriad of affects upon a desired tool. Tenno are warriors in general and children grow + adapt better than adults. You merely think they can't develop their physical forms, that is all. Until stated otherwise, they are subject to the basic rules of any organism such as getting stronger. Keep in mind, the intention of this thread, is not to get them to surpass the Warframe. It's to give them some form of base survivability without imposing a specific Focus school on a player.

15 minutes ago, Xarteros said:

All natural biological activity has been halted for our Tenno. They do not age, they seemingly do not require food or have any other biological function. They are like what Vor became, beings transformed by pure Void energy, which is why they can be physically manifested, and they can be harmed/dissipated without actually dying. I just don't see any logical or lore-based reason why they should have a physical progression of stat growth, when nothing else they do is remotely biological.

Again, more speculation. DE has not confirmed they are stuck as children, don't eat, or don't poop. This essentially has zero to do with them getting stronger. In fact, one could argue that if they are pure energy, then they could grow by channeling more energy from the Void. I could speculate that they have no limits to their strength because they are simply physically manifested energy, meaning they should have no biological limits imposed on them. That logic just simply doesn't hold up.

20 minutes ago, Xarteros said:

I think the much more suitable path (logically, mechanically, and lore-wise) is to use the Focus trees, even though you've stated that you don't think it's suitable. Our Focus is like our knowledge and experience, but how you spend your focus is like what you choose to reflect most upon, and the conclusions you draw from that. This is the system that is most fitting for a Tenno, a warrior of the mind. If there was to be any physical growth stat, it should apply solely to Warframes and Companions, not to Tenno Operators. 

I'd accept minor boosts to physical stats for the Operators, but those boosts should come from training in the five Focus schools, available as separate nodes.

• Madurai: Boost to overall damage, and maybe an AoE or Life Steal ability
• Zenurik: Boost to max Void Energy and recharge rate
• Vazarin: Boost to health and a regeneration effect
• Naramon: Stealth drains less power, and the E pulse and dash has a stronger effect
• Unairu: Grants some form of shield or Iron Skin-style ability, to negate a few attacks before it needs to recharge

Again, the Tenno Operators are mostly mental beings, not physical, so any improvement should be a thing of training, not growth.

I do, however, greatly agree that Operators are a great platform for expansion. Not to thread-jack, but I made a thread about changing how Focus powers are deployed, so you manually release each wave or blast of your power in a similar style to the Operator's normal Void attacks. It opens up opportunities for special attacks from each School to give you new Dash attacks or E-pulses when you're using your Focus power. I made that thread with the very same spirit of wanting lots of expansion for the Operator's form

The logical path would be to leave Focus to dictate their Void powers and how they are utilized. Like you said, Focus is their knowledge and experience, so it shouldn't be used as a way to boost physical stats like health. That would be bad design, as you would just be shoehorning people into Vazarin, Unairu, or Madurai(makes no sense for this to have life steal at all) for survivability.

Tenno are beings, period. They have a physical and non-physical form. Growth is the result of training, both physically and mentally. You're free to want Focus to decide everything regarding the Tenno, but that is not what i'm doing here and i do not intend to either. Again, Focus power are fine for defining their powers, but it would be bad design for it to control baseline stats entirely. With that said, i disagree with your idea and will continue to develop and improve my own.