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[Spoiler] Dev Workshop: New Mods Part 1!


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I really like the new Riven mods. I got a +90% Status duration and 50% dmg increase against corpus for Paracyst. (Needed 3 Rerolls). I moded for multishot pure gas and status chance and now it just shreds through corpus. Combine this with a Saryn and you can clear a lvl 40 Corpus room with one salve.

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I like the idea of Riven mods, I really do. Having something to make underappreciated weapons more powerful is great.

I have to agree, though, when people say the implementation is poor. Having to farm a stupidly hard to obtain resource for a reroll is no fun. Having a cap on how many times I get to reroll is even worse. Having to unveil it after every single reroll is just the worst.

I always wanted to use weapons like the Supra for really high level content without gimping myself too much by not bringing a Soma. I was super happy when I got a Riven mod for my Supra. It added 114% crit chance, so it went up from 2.5% to a whopping 5.3%. Yay. Not.

You want me to enjoy my Supra more? Or any other non-meta weapon, for that matter? Maybe just buff these weapons, then? Rebalance then, like others suggested? Or at least make it so that Riven mods don't have such a high chance to be crap?

And if you really want to tweak the stats on existing Riven mods, you may wanna do so right now and not wait another day or a week or god knows how long, because people are paying ridiculous amounts of money for Soma, Boltor and Tonkor Riven mods right now. I'm not personally affected, but you're gonna annoy the hell out of some people when you nerf that. And you may annoy even more people if you don't. The situation is a bit awkward right now.

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@[DE]Rebecca

With all things said in this thread, do we have an ETA of when the fix will hit, and how much impact would they be on the current current mods?

While I know balancing may take time.... this also seems to be an issue that affect the player deeper the longer the solution deployment stalls.

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Man, where are all the stupid ideas from internet trolls?  Usually there are tons of stupid ideas from internet people, but this feedback has been genuinely brilliant across the board.  If only DE had run Rivens past the community before crapping them out as an add-on for TWW, maybe we wouldn't be in this mess.  I can definitely picture Scott crossing his arms over his chest, shutting his eyes tight and just scoffing "No!" over and over as everyone on earth just throws every conceivable solution at him...  Just gonna have to wait and see what they do, I guess.  I'm not gonna invest much effort into Rivens, in the mean time.  After rerolling a paris mod 5 times and getting utterly useless stats for it, I'm throwing in the towel.  Back to grinding utterly broken raids for more arcanes... 

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Few really bad things about these mods 

1 random to get

2 for random weapon

3 random stats

4 random values in said random stats

5 you need another resource to randomly reroll only part of the issue

6 said resource is gained on random basis using the new really buggy, keybind breaking stuff added in the war within 

Edited by thalminion
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Without wanting to sound like a massive jerk...

Are there hundreds of people working on Warframe or how and when are you gonna address all of this? Right now, Riven mods require a lot of tweaking, especially since some people are dumping ridiculous amounts of money into something that's apparently getting fundamentally changed. On top of that you wanted to change damage (3.0) and mandatory mods, focus, limbo, bladestorm... Meanwhile, umbra and a certain infested door are turning into a sad joke right now and I suppose some people would say that Archwing could do with an extra layer of polish. The new player is experience was mildly improved by the new star chart, but there are still no decent tutorials. And a certain new gameplay mechanic introduced by TWW is probably gonna require some love in the near future, as well, unless having 100hp and zero shields or armor is indeed what you had in mind for this. And at Tennocon you already mentioned whole new star systems and even said yes to umbra weapons. And aardvarks, I think? I heard at least one of the raids was kinda broken right now as well, but... yeah, whatever. Oh and, "I think crossbreeding different species of pets is cool and should be a feature", remember that one?

Machetes are crap. Stop making machetes and look at their stance.

There's also the fact that most people would probably love to see the next story update a little sooner than 12 months after TWW.

There is so much stuff right now that you said you're gonna fix, change, overhaul, implement and upgrade and you keep piling feature on top of feature on top of yet another feature, all of which is beta, unfinished, work in progress. I love this game. I've been here for so long, spent thousands of hours. But I'm seriously worried. Can we maybe slow down a bit with the constant promises and the endless amounts of new systems and polish the stuff that's unfinished or just plain broken? Please?

I don't mean for this to sound like a huge flame post and I sincerely apologise if it does. I've spent so much time on the internet, half of the time I can't even tell if I'm sounding like a condescending asshat. But I'm worried. And a bit tired of undercooked beta features. Riven mods need a little more time in the oven. As does a lot of other stuff right now. Maybe we could bake some of that to perfection and take it easy on the new ideas for a little while?

Edited by Berserkerkitten
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On 11/14/2016 at 6:12 PM, NovusNova said:

Fast reader, I saw it in new topics when she posted it and was more interested in the "What happens now" parts than "Why this exists" but all of it is interesting.

No. It's called "Replying to a thread and then reading it so you don't get your post hidden for "FIRST!" content.

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11 hours ago, Virsalus said:

A universal cap would be unwise as it could not address the different values on different weapons. For example some weapons may need a lot more crit % increase to make up for their low base damage and crit chance to make them interesting. A universal cap would only make sense if weapons were balanced better in general but then we would not need this system in the first place...

Before anything else they should buff status stats first like the first 3 seconds will do like 3x damage to atleast be at the same level as critical then the universal cap would make more sense..tbh the cap should be there to limit the op weapons, and if a certain weapon has 2 of the following-

Below 100 base damage

Below 10% critical

Below 10% status

Then the cap on the first buff would be increased to 200%

Edited by titan_sLAyer_
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5 hours ago, Berserkerkitten said:

There is so much stuff right now that you said you're gonna fix, change, overhaul, implement and upgrade and you keep piling feature on top of feature on top of yet another feature, all of which is beta, unfinished, work in progress. I love this game. I've been here for so long, spent thousands of hours. But I'm seriously worried. Can we maybe slow down a bit with the constant promises and the endless amounts of new systems and polish the stuff that's unfinished or just plain broken? Please?

I don't mean for this to sound like a huge flame post and I sincerely apologise if it does. I've spent so much time on the internet, half of the time I can't even tell if I'm sounding like a condescending asshat. But I'm worried. And a bit tired of undercooked beta features. Riven mods need a little more time in the oven. As does a lot of other stuff right now. Maybe we could bake some of that to perfection and take it easy on the new ideas for a little while?

This! So much of this. I basically agree with everything you wrote, but this is the most important thing for DE to do now.

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There isn't any official thread specified regarding the Riven mods, so I'll post here. Mods please move the post if there's a related topic already.

So, Riven mods. The overall idea is actually thrilling, especially when thinking that underrated weapons can become more than just useful now. But there are several obstacles that take the fun away of this new feature:

  • Cycle cost is uncomfortably expensive; currently there is no stable method to obtain Kuva except a semi-bugged Kuva Siphon event, the spawn of which is based on chance. It is okay, and meaningful to have an increasing cost per cycle, but there should be a cap for that. I think a lot of players would agree that around 2500-3000 Kuva would be a reasonable cap, and any cycle attempt from that point onward would cost the same amount of Kuva.
  • Riven mods are relatively HARD to obtain. Also based on chance, and once obtained it's again based on more chance. Once unveiled, the weapon type is locked, and you just have to deal with it, there's nothing you can do about it. Some players have been blessed with riven mods for decent weapons (no I do not mean the currently top-tier weapons like Tonkor, Synoid Simulor, Soma Prime, etc.). But some have been cursed with riven mods for... sentinel weapons (?!). Personally I do not even use a weapon on my sentinel (because I don't like the concept of being unable to control when my sentinel will attack enemies or not). Why would I need to be stuck with a mod I do not want, and will most likely not use at all?
  • I'm aware that the stats of riven mods will be re-balanced depending on the weapon (e.g. no more +% puncture on Zarr for example, because it has no puncture damage at all, making said stat increase obsolete). But what if we got an option to lock a specific stat prior to making a cycle attempt? At the cost of signficantly higher amount of Kuva spent or something. For example: First cycle attempt costs 900 Kuva? Oh you want to keep a stat locked? The cost increases to 2900. You want to keep two stats locked? Cost increases to 6900 (2000+2000 for the two stats, plus 2000 more). Well these numbers I use are just an example, I'm sure DE developers will decide the costs as they see proper.
  • As said above, I believe everyone would be thrilled if we got an option to randomize the weapon type again. Yes, to be fair it should be a randomly selected weapon, EXCLUDING all previously randomized weapons. For example, a riven mod that was set to Synapse, Ignis, and Attica before, re-randomizing the weapon type should NOT include the Synapse, Ignis or Attica in the list.
  • Similar to the above suggestion, we could also get an option to change the polarity of our riven mods. I get that only one riven mod can be equipped on a weapon at a time, but having the option to either using a Forma on the weapon OR change the riven mod polarity would be just great.
  • We need more sources and methods to obtain the Riven Mods. Personally, with the exception of the ultra-annoying -god, seriously please remove this- challenge of lethal headshots when aim-gliding, I love what we are required to do to unveil a riven mod. Why not have some sort of personal quest with a series of similar challenges, which when completed, rewards us with a random veiled Riven mod? Likewise, Baro could start selling us veiled Riven Mods, perhaps one or two only per account, per visit, to avoid exploitation.
Edited by Chalef
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15 hours ago, thalminion said:

Few really bad things about these mods 

1 random to get

2 for random weapon

3 random stats

4 random values in said random stats

5 you need another resource to randomly reroll only part of the issue

6 said resource is gained on random basis using the new really buggy, keybind breaking stuff added in the war within 

 

 

EXACTLY THIS.

i have no need for riven mods. No need for KUVA. No need for another ENERGYDRAINING mechanic ingame. Everything is tide to energy. One Drain Eximus incoming: hole system cracked.

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1 minute ago, Coach-Aprax said:

It´s all fun and games but ¨test¨ mods should NOT be tradeable. But who cares as long as the plat flows. RIP people who wasted tons of plat XD XD

Seriously. A system as new and experimental as this, it's like having an open beta test. Who in their right minds would make these things tradable at such an early stage? That's one reason why people have suspicions regarding the nature of all this. I know, “Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." But DE can't be that goofy now, can they? This has to be intentional, especially since they haven't changed it yet.

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Eh, they're probably just bricking it, trying to find an acceptable fix for this ASAP, without knowing exactly how to do it. I don't believe there's any ill intent there. With that said, I'm surprised they didn't at least remove them from trade for the time being. Or remove them full stop, until fixed.

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On 11/15/2016 at 6:04 AM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Firstly, we should all understand our goal and why this goal existed in the first place:

We want to give players something unique to them that can speak to their wider Arsenal. We want to give new life to the Arsenal in a non-static way.

Riven Mods were added to incentivize end-game players to revisit old weapons and to change up their play style. We’re all familiar with blazing through missions to the Extraction Point, but this system gives players new challenges that require them to test the creative limits of their Arsenal in their quest to Unveil their new Mods. Yes, meta weapons are in the selection pool, but Riven Mods are not needed to make this gear (like the Tonkor or Synoid Simulor) more powerful. What they can do is add an interesting buff to a comparatively underpowered weapon in order to encourage players to think outside of that meta box.

This is why we have prevented players from choosing what weapon the Riven Mod will be for; if we didn’t, we would end up with millions of Soma Mods and none for the Gorgon. The exponential Cycling costs are there to encourage players to try the existing stats before they embark on the journey to the ‘perfect roll’. For those of you who want to find the best Mod possible, that avenue is available to you, but that is not the goal behind this system.

We have started to add quirks to weapons, as shown with the recent Syndicate Melees, and this is supposed to be a continuation of that train of thought: we want players to be able to use their weapons in new ways that typical builds don’t encourage or allow. The current maximum number of 15 Riven Mods is a reflection of this, as limitations encourages creativity and choice.

META play style is the result of your enemy-player interaction design DE. If you want people to change play style, you have to change enemy-player interaction design.

 

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