Ash Changes

[PoisonHD]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)DesecratedFlame said:

Except, it is. This isn't a difficult concept. It doesn't matter how many steps that tact on in front of it if the end step is the same as always.

You're not getting what I'm saying at all... people didn't like automarking entire rooms instantly  Is that hard to understand? The end result is fine if there is some interaction in the initial marking process 

Edited November 23, 2016 by PoisonHD

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

Either way Ash is still one hitting everything. This change is just alittle annoying is all. Experienced ash players will toggle it, sweep the room, toggle it off and BS. Its not changing anything. Just wont be able to nuke a room like Ash players used too.

Edited November 23, 2016 by (XB1)FCastle74

[RavenCorella]

As a player who had a tendency of using Ash on different occasions, from spy missions to sorties, I'm really displeased with the way they've reworked it (from what I've seen on their streams). Like the people above  said, if you rework something, do it properly. 

He's a samurai, just think of a new cool ability all together.

"Ash spins around in a 360 degree and releases deadly 3/5/8/10 Shurikens that remove enemy armor by 70% percent (affected by power strength) for 4 seconds (power duration) while pushing enemies back. Should the enemy hit a wall due to the knockback, they get impaled and suffer a stun for 5 more seconds (unaffected by duration)"

et voila

Edited November 23, 2016 by RavenCorella

[Awazx]

4 minutes ago, (XB1)FCastle74 said:

Either way Ash is still one hitting everything. This change is just alittle annoying is all. Experienced ash players will toggle it, sweep the room, toggle it off and BS. Its not changing anything. Just wont be able to nuke a room like Ash players used too.

You admit that change is annoying, but you have not really changed anything. So why not leave it as it was?

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

11 minutes ago, PoisonHD said:

You're not getting what I'm saying at all... people didn't like automarking entire rooms instantly  Is that hard to understand? The end result is fine if there is some interaction in the initial marking process 

And I am saying you are wrong. You could simply shoot every enemy in the room then tap 4 under the old system, and it would be exactly the same level of interaction as this new version.

2 minutes ago, Awazx said:

You admit that change is annoying, but you have not really changed anything. So why not leave it as it was?

Exactly.

[PoisonHD]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)DesecratedFlame said:

And I am saying you are wrong. You could simply shoot every enemy in the room then tap 4 under the old system, and it would be exactly the same level of interaction as this new version

That's still not the argument... People complain about there being no interaction in the marking of the ability, so they add it with this "reticle sweeping" even if it's not good, even if it can be replicated. It still is interaction which limits Ash's ability to insta-nuke entire rooms. Which is the main complaint of the current bladestorm. 

Edited November 23, 2016 by PoisonHD

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

2 minutes ago, PoisonHD said:

That's still not the argument... People complain about there being no interaction in the ability, so they add it with this "reticle sweeping" even if it's not good, even if it can be replicated. It still is interaction which limits Ash's ability to insta-nuke entire rooms. Which is the main complaint of the current bladestorm. 

There is no interactivity when you are watching Ash teleport around and slash enemies. Just because you sweep a reticle before hand, doesn't mean there will be interactivity when you are watching Ash teleport around and slash enemies. In both cases once the teleporting starts you can put the controller down and go make a sandwich.

[PoisonHD]

Just now, (PS4)DesecratedFlame said:

There is no interactivity when you are watching Ash teleport around and slash enemies. Just because you sweep a reticle before hand, doesn't mean there will be interactivity when you are watching Ash teleport around and slash enemies. In both cases once the teleporting starts you can put the controller down and go make a sandwich.

Dude... That's not the point...  anything done during the killing part doesn't matter, at all. People wanted interaction that prevented insta-nuking entire rooms. That's what the marking does.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

15 minutes ago, PoisonHD said:

Dude... That's not the point...

You're wrong because that is literally the only part of the skill that people complained about. You'll notice that they are not complaining about "not being able to pick targets." They are complaining about the lack of interactivity during the teleports and THAT HAS NOT CHANGED.

16 minutes ago, PoisonHD said:

People wanted interaction that prevented insta-nuking entire rooms.

The only people that wanted that were 1. People not playing Ash, and 2. People that were crying about "muh kills." Neither of these are who DE should be listening to when trying to balance Ash.

 

[PoisonHD]

15 minutes ago, (PS4)DesecratedFlame said:

-snip-

Still missing the point I see...

I don't know how to explain it better, the interactivity(marking) before is the fix to the instant nuking. Which something DE is trying to eliminate from most frames. (Saryn's and Mag's rework) The killing part doesn't matter at all in my argument....

Edited November 24, 2016 by PoisonHD

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

49 minutes ago, Awazx said:

You admit that change is annoying, but you have not really changed anything. So why not leave it as it was?

I was agreeing with the counter argument

Edited November 24, 2016 by (XB1)FCastle74

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

3 minutes ago, PoisonHD said:

is the fix to the instant nuking

I know that too. I am just being honest about it and not trying to pretty it up with excuses. They just want to get rid of nuking skills. That is really what this change is all about and it has nothing to do with interactivity, which as I said before, hasn't changed.

[Buzkyl]

3 minutes ago, (PS4)DesecratedFlame said:

I know that too. I am just being honest about it and not trying to pretty it up with excuses. They just want to get rid of nuking skills. That is really what this change is all about and it has nothing to do with interactivity, which as I said before, hasn't changed.

Ash is still going to be able to nuke rooms, it's justt going to take more effort than it did before, and he's gonna be able to hit alot more targets.

They're buffing the damage so it's not a DPS nerf, they're just making players work harder to pull it off. Like mesa they removed auto targeting but buffed the damage considerably to compensate for making players aim.

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

7 minutes ago, (PS4)DesecratedFlame said:

I know that too. I am just being honest about it and not trying to pretty it up with excuses. They just want to get rid of nuking skills. That is really what this change is all about and it has nothing to do with interactivity, which as I said before, hasn't changed.

yes, Experienced Ash players will still nuke rooms. wont be that difficult. The ash change now is more redundant of ashs 3 now more thane ever.  In my opinion its a complete waste of time on the devs part.

Edited November 24, 2016 by (XB1)FCastle74

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

2 minutes ago, Buzkyl said:

Ash is still going to be able to nuke rooms, it's justt going to take more effort than it did before, and he's gonna be able to hit alot more targets.

They're buffing the damage so it's not a DPS nerf, they're just making players work harder to pull it off. Like mesa they removed auto targeting but buffed the damage considerably to compensate for making players aim.

In the time it takes ash to make the whole room I can already have wiped them out with a Tonkor, simulor, atomos, penta, galatine prime's spin to win, etc. So no, it is no longer a nuke. The point of a nuke is that you fire it off, then it clears everything.  This isn't that.

[Buzkyl]

Just now, (PS4)DesecratedFlame said:

In the time it takes ash to make the whole room I can already have wiped them out with a Tonkor, simulor, atomos, penta, galatine prime's spin to win, etc. So no, it is no longer a nuke. The point of a nuke is that you fire it off, then it clears everything.  This isn't that.

Because one takes faster than the other that doesn't make the latter not a nuke. It's a nuke because it wipes the room. What you're talking about is the effort required. Which bladestorm would now require more of, but that doesn't not make it a nuke, that just makes it less easy mode

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

7 minutes ago, Buzkyl said:

Because one takes faster than the other that doesn't make the latter not a nuke. It's a nuke because it wipes the room. What you're talking about is the effort required. Which bladestorm would now require more of, but that doesn't not make it a nuke, that just makes it less easy mode

You know Nukes don't knock over one house at a time, right?

[Buzkyl]

Just now, (PS4)DesecratedFlame said:

You know Nukes don't knock over one house at a time, right?

You know bladestorm is still going to attack them all simultaneously after you mark them? So it's not a nuke because it needs set up?

[-N7-Leonhart]

1 hour ago, (PS4)DesecratedFlame said:

And I am saying you are wrong. You could simply shoot every enemy in the room then tap 4 under the old system, and it would be exactly the same level of interaction as this new version.

Exactly.

Look at you guys getting all fired up trying to find the reason, when the reason is obvious  from the start.

Ash's BS is too effective, so they will nerf it. Simple, right? More interaction and whatever are just the means to change that. Personally, I am just fine with that. I have the most play time on Ash, but I rarely use it lately, since the cheese is too strong with this one. After this change, I may actually have fun again with it.

Edited November 24, 2016 by -BM-Leonhart

[LuckyCharm]

Im just gonna use it to mark only my priority target eg ambulas and then all hits wail on him. saves me plenty of time if i dont have to watch weakling enemies get killed too. Not that i play ash for anything but a brainless killbot while im focused on something else...cough pokemon moon cough

[RistN]

It's community pressuring DE to do stupid reworks ,buffs and nerfs.People who don't have experience in playing this game have majority in voting.

Well said about DE sometimes not understanding thing it created but yet again they are creators not users,but they do listen to lot of misleading voices.

Also well said that this is fast pace game where you kill mobs of enemies.No one will use BS any more.I just pray that they don't change any of other 3 Ashs powers as compensation cause they are very useful right now.

+1

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

50 minutes ago, -BM-Leonhart said:

Ash's BS is too effective

It was never too effective. It didn't attack everyone at once, but it did allow you to target everything at once, which according to your side, made it even less effective.

Edited November 24, 2016 by (PS4)DesecratedFlame

[Awazx]

17 hours ago, (XB1)FCastle74 said:

I was agreeing with the counter argument

Thanks.

[Emulad0or]

Only bad thing about the rework I'd that the skill still deals Finisher damage it seems. I was hoping they changed it to maybe Slash for it to be affected by armour and shield like every other Skill of Mass Destruction (WoF, RJ, Spore Combo, even freaking Mirage/Simulor)

[Weirdiolio]

Not to mention fatal teleport does the exact same thing as this "rework", but more conveniently. Lets hope they change it in more ways than they initially described.