Can't believe new Bladestorm will still make enemies invulnerable

[DxAdder]

1 hour ago, -CM-Kinnison said:

what gets me is while i am marking enemies, my cell mates will be killing them before i get a chance to use it.

ALso the energy costs per an attack is higher then the original/old version.   I rather be using a fatal teleport build that mobility and duration for smoke screen now, then bother with bladestorm

Any marked target becomes invulnerable so one is killing anything marked until Ash decides to execute blade storm.

 

 

 

 

[Skaleek]

1 minute ago, SoulEchelon said:

"What's the point of doing anything if something else can do it too? Why use guns if you have WoF? Why use anything but the Simulor? The answer is that's for you to decide. You choose how to play the game. You make the choices based on the tools you have however you see fit." - Rebecca

also, you can kill enemies while they're marked for bladestorm.

So....yeah, this whole thread is dead in the water.

You can kill marked enemies from current bladestorm too, but as soon as the enemy begins to be executed by ash or an ash clone, they are invulnerable. This is the problem present in the current game, and is still present in the future iteration of bladestorm. Thats the issue this thread is discussing, and it is still very present. So no, the thread is not "dead in the water".

[SoulEchelon]

20 minutes ago, Skaleek said:

You can kill marked enemies from current bladestorm too, but as soon as the enemy begins to be executed by ash or an ash clone, they are invulnerable. This is the problem present in the current game, and is still present in the future iteration of bladestorm. Thats the issue this thread is discussing, and it is still very present. So no, the thread is not "dead in the water".

People are mad that you can't kill an enemy while they're getting stabbed? The animations are a fraction of a second, and since he goes from one enemy to another you have more than ample time to kill said enemy before or after the bladestorm. Wow. This is hilarious.

[Skaleek]

7 minutes ago, SoulEchelon said:

People are mad that you can't kill an enemy while they're getting stabbed? The animations are a fraction of a second, and since he goes from one enemy to another you have more than ample time to kill said enemy before or after the bladestorm. Wow. This is hilarious.

The animations are actually more like 2-3 seconds unmodified. But you can increase them with attack speed to become sub 1 second. Yes people are annoyed that when they shoot an enemy they dont do damage. I dont think its hilarious, i think its justified. It's like when a trinity keeps pool of lifing mobs so that it's just that much harder to get what you're trying to get done. It's counter-intuitive to a co-op game. You are also not taking into account his clones are also on these enemies, so more often then not, even if you try to switch, theres another ash there, performing another attack, making another enemy invulnerable. It can be a real problem, many people can attest to this, especially when you have a slow attack speed ash bladestorming a room.

Having your damage invalidated by another player never feels good.

Edited November 25, 2016 by Skaleek

[Cidolfus]

4 minutes ago, Skaleek said:

The animations are actually more like 2-3 seconds unmodified. But you can increase them with attack speed to become sub 1 second. Yes people are annoyed that when they shoot an enemy they dont do damage. I dont think its hilarious, i think its justified. It's like when a trinity keeps pool of lifing mobs so that it's just that much harder to get what you're trying to get done. It's counter-intuitive to a co-op game. You are also not taking into account his clones are also on these enemies, so more often then not, even if you try to switch, theres another ash there, performing another attack, making another enemy invulnerable. It can be a real problem, many people can attest to this, especially when you have a slow attack speed ash bladestorming a room.

Having your damage invalidated by another player never feels good.

what 2-3 seconds no way is it that long at all and it only targets one enemy at a time so unless you're targetting the same enemy at the same exact time is the only time it should a problem. Yeahneeds fixing but come on you're exaggerating.

[Skaleek]

3 minutes ago, Cidolfus said:

what 2-3 seconds no way is it that long at all and it only targets one enemy at a time so unless you're targetting the same enemy at the same exact time is the only time it should a problem. Yeahneeds fixing but come on you're exaggerating.

I am not exaggerating at all. I'm saying exactly what happens. 2 seconds in warframe can feel like an eternity, this isnt a turn based role playing game. This is a shooter. Ask people if 2 seconds of invulnerability in a shooter is a long time. Wukong's defy invulnerability lasts less than one second in conclave, if that adds any perspective.

Edited November 25, 2016 by Skaleek

[Cidolfus]

31 minutes ago, Skaleek said:

I am not exaggerating at all. I'm saying exactly what happens. 2 seconds in warframe can feel like an eternity, this isnt a turn based role playing game. This is a shooter. Ask people if 2 seconds of invulnerability in a shooter is a long time. Wukong's defy invulnerability lasts less than one second in conclave, if that adds any perspective.

So you're saying it FEELS 2-3 seconds?? Then it's not actually 2-3 seconds, so...

[Skaleek]

4 minutes ago, Cidolfus said:

So you're saying it FEELS 2-3 seconds?? Then it's not actually 2-3 seconds, so...

No, it is 2-3 seconds. It can feel like an eternity. please read what i said. Seriously?

Edited November 25, 2016 by Skaleek

[Carnage2K4]

Yeah, the difference now is that only 3 attacks will be possible, instead of the ever-lasting BS on ancients... So I don't see an issue with the new system, it's a very minimal invulnerability.

 

No, it is 2-3 seconds. It can feel like an eternity. please read what i said. Seriously?

...

You said 2-3 second can feel like an eternity, (an infinite amount of time) and that you're not exaggerating... Really? Because saying 2-3 seconds is even close in any way to an infinite amount of time is basically the definition of an exaggeration...

Edited November 25, 2016 by Carnage2K4

[Cidolfus]

7 minutes ago, Skaleek said:

No, it is 2-3 seconds. It can feel like an eternity. please read what i said. Seriously?

I read what you said, don't start being an arse okay? And it's not 2-3 seconds I just went into the game unmodded and did a bladestorm to a group in the simulacrum. 1 second at most.

whatevs doesn't matter, people exaggerating stuff as always to try and get their point across. i'm outta here

Edited November 25, 2016 by Cidolfus

[Skaleek]

14 minutes ago, Carnage2K4 said:

Yeah, the difference now is that only 3 attacks will be possible, instead of the ever-lasting BS on ancients... So I don't see an issue with the new system, it's a very minimal invulnerability.

 

...

You said 2-3 second can feel like an eternity, (an infinite amount of time) and that you're not exaggerating... Really? Because saying 2-3 seconds is even close in any way to an infinite amount of time is basically the definition of an exaggeration...

Sigh. I said i wasnt exaggerating in my previous post. When you say something can feel like an eternity you are implying that a small amount of time can feel longer than it actually is. The point, which you seem to be missing entirely, is that there is a window of time whereby your damage in invalidated because ash has made the enemy combatant invulnerable.

[Skaleek]

12 minutes ago, Cidolfus said:

I read what you said, don't start being an arse okay? And it's not 2-3 seconds I just went into the game unmodded and did a bladestorm to a group in the simulacrum. 1 second at most.

whatevs doesn't matter, people exaggerating stuff as always to try and get their point across. i'm outta here

You need to have no melee attack speed mods on.

[(PSN)Silverback73]

Really, though, no one has ever given me a decisive answer and convinced me one way or another...so, Pirates or Ninjas?

[Skaleek]

Gee guys, patch dropped. It's almost as if i know what i'm talking about. Imagine that. I still think its better than miasma though. Not by a whole lot.

[kaliazane]

Pressing 1 button and then basically watching how game plays itsef was my biggest problem with bladestorm, it's still there. Now you just press that button twice and swipe across screen before again watching.

[White_Matter]

TBH they made the ulti more interactive and versatile. Gotta give them props for that. But again, not exactly a rework. A slight nerf seems like. But the invulnerability thing seems to be there still. So I'm not sure what to make of it just yet. Ash is still OP as ever it feels like. And the smoke screen buff is really nice.

[EmptyDevil]

9 minutes ago, White_Matter said:

TBH they made the ulti more interactive and versatile. Gotta give them props for that. But again, not exactly a rework. A slight nerf seems like. But the invulnerability thing seems to be there still. So I'm not sure what to make of it just yet. Ash is still OP as ever it feels like. And the smoke screen buff is really nice.

That seems to be a thing with all finisher animations from what i can see. It was probably meant to prevent others from interrupting you during executions.

[NativeKiller]

5 hours ago, RoninJed said:

Ha ha ha but I was exaggerating..So again we need to nerf ashes 4th ability more because of this? His 4th would be borderline worthless if DE did what people here are suggesting.  How do you feel about mirage breaking the game with her synoid simulor? Covering the map and killing everything in sight while causing frame rate drops/crashes on low end PC's..I would think that's more annoying and affects more people then ashes 4th.

Let me lay it out for you.

 

An ashhole can drag the game on and on with the invincibility frames.

 

Even the "dreaded" Simulor Mirage doesn't do that, technically it speeds up the game by killing things faster.

 

Also, I personally never experienced frame rate drops/crashes from a post-patch Simulor Mirage even with the low-end computer that I use.

[ichiofmany]

>.> I'm too lazy to find who said it but it was brought up that the invulnerability might be to prevent Ash from  encountering a bug. And then someone mentioned the idea of replacing ash with a third clone to take him out of the attack animation which I assumed was to allow the enemy invulnerability to be removed(unless we care about an ash clone glitching out). But this would also mean ash would most likely lose the invincibility during the attack since he won't be attacking. I like that idea if it would work like that? Does anyone else think that could work? 

Also for those confused about the 2-3 sec wait time and can't seem to reproduce the effect, they are talking about enemies not dying in the first 2 hits....or at all from bladestorm. Try going to wave 20 at Akkad with bladestorm with overextended equipped and no power strength mods on. Then clear up to 20 again with something with good aoe like a modded synoid simulor(with black energy color, noone wants to see that crap). We went to Akkad because of the Ancient Disruptor spawns and there are usually ppl there and so you and your teammates will note the invulnerability time. Also we went with low power strength to display in a more timely manner what will happen in a mission when you can no longer can kill things with a single bladestorm cast while your team not only can kill the mobs quite easily but are waiting for you to finish. I hope this point of reference not only helps you understand the problem but will help you in providing constructive posts to the topic at hand.

[Wolfdoggie]

Right off the bat I noticed one thing that could use tweaking with the new Bladestorm and I'd find it decently acceptable: 

I need to be able to enter mark mode while attacking. If I'm meleeing it doesn't let me till my swing animation ends. 

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

8 hours ago, SoulEchelon said:

"What's the point of doing anything if something else can do it too? Why use guns if you have WoF? Why use anything but the Simulor? The answer is that's for you to decide. You choose how to play the game. You make the choices based on the tools you have however you see fit." - Rebecca

also, you can kill enemies while they're marked for bladestorm.

 

So....yeah, this whole thread is dead in the water.

Killing a target that was marked has never been the issue. It's the fact that ash can spend up to 10 seconds on a single target trying to kill it. during that time the ennemy can't be hurt. This rework doesn't solve the problem people had which is why we're upset. The rework can make ash better or worse. but that's never been anyones focus.

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

8 hours ago, SoulEchelon said:

"What's the point of doing anything if something else can do it too? Why use guns if you have WoF? Why use anything but the Simulor? The answer is that's for you to decide. You choose how to play the game. You make the choices based on the tools you have however you see fit." - Rebecca

also, you can kill enemies while they're marked for bladestorm.

 

So....yeah, this whole thread is dead in the water.

Killing a target that was marked has never been the issue. It's the fact that ash can spend up to 10 seconds on a single target trying to kill it. during that time the ennemy can't be hurt. This rework doesn't solve the problem people had which is why we're upset. The rework can make ash better or worse. but that's never been anyones focus.

[Snargleflax]

oh yay so u pretty much are guaranteed to not be able to kill them with only 3 attacks from bladestorm and noone can suplement the damage isnt that just wonderful

 

[achromos]

On 11/25/2016 at 7:38 AM, Hypernaut1 said:

I can't say I've ever been in a situation where this was ever some huge game stopping problem. if it's not the last enemy, then there's are other things to target... If it is the last enemy, then it's about to be killed. If it's not killed.. then kill it. If Ash can't kill it in one flurry It was going to be a bullet sponge anyway. 

Not really.  I can slice a Ancient Disruptor in one/two shots.  Any Bladestorm however? You could have been there for days doing 1-4k damage... where you were doing much MUCH more to everything else.