with the deconstruction of everything ash u need to boost stealth duration to that of loki at the very minimum

[Snargleflax]

i have a full duration ash - fleeting for endgame sedna arena (for heavy hitters i  do not even use bladestorm so its not that big of a deal) but in bladestorms current setup it is absolutely neccessary to cast it from stealth hence a duration overhaul is needed with the current direction you are taking with ash

[-.A.-Grabbelmann]

10/10 would buff again. #nerfeverything until its op

[Cyborg-Rox]

* Costs 15 Energy less
* AOE stun on cast
* Can be cast while running
* Doesn't have muffled sound and ugly green screen effect

I'd say a tiny bit reduced Duration is a good balance. I mean... if literally the only downside Smokescreen has was removed, then... there's literally no reason to use Loki for invisibility anymore.

[Azur_Fenix]

3 hours ago, Cyborg-Rox said:

* Costs 15 Energy less
* AOE stun on cast
* Can be cast while running
* Doesn't have muffled sound and ugly green screen effect

I'd say a tiny bit reduced Duration is a good balance. I mean... if literally the only downside Smokescreen has was removed, then... there's literally no reason to use Loki for invisibility anymore.

Loki uses invisibility for survival, and his Radial disarm is more valuable. Even if Ashs invis is buffed, he will NEVER replace loki, and Loki will still be the go to frame for those wanting to cheese run with invis.

[John89brensen]

Ash has more armor, more HP, and a good set of offensive abilities including armor debuff with one augment, and you want to give him the invisibility duration of Loki? Isnt he tough enough. Each of the "invisible frames" has their own brand of invisibility, and their own play style, lets not mix them up, Ash is still the offensive ninja he was yesterday.

Edited November 26, 2016 by John89brensen

[Cyborg-Rox]

Just now, Azur_Fenix said:

Loki uses invisibility for survival, and his Radial disarm is more valuable. Even if Ashs invis is buffed, he will NEVER replace loki, and Loki will still be the go to frame for those wanting to cheese run with invis.

Ash doesn't need that survival as much. He has more than 75 bloody health and shield at base. Not to mention that you're crippling your Radial Disarm with an Invisibility build.

[Madway7]

Only buff I think he needs is to the range of the Smokescreen augment

Besides that maybe pending new Bladestorm tests.

[Xekrin]

20 minutes ago, Snargleflax said:

it is absolutely neccessary to cast it from stealth hence a duration overhaul is needed

Most likely the energy cost will be reduced for visible marking as well as invis marking.  Being invisible is supposed to be a bonus not mandatory.  While keeping invis for as long as possible is always nice, Ash doesn't require it as much as loki does.  A small duration boost wouldn't be bad but I'd never expect a loki-type increase.

3 things need to happen though.

• slight reduction to current mark cost (15 is really too high)
• We need a 'mark' counter, because why not.
• allow range to affect smoke bomb augment

Threw that last one in there because why not, people keep asking for it.

[Snargleflax]

14 minutes ago, John89brensen said:

Ash has more armor, more HP, and a good set of offensive abilities including armor debuff with one augment, and you want to give him the invisibility duration of Loki? Isnt he tough enough. Each of the "invisible frames" has their own brand of invisibility, and their own play style, lets not mix them up, Ash is still the offensive ninja he was yesterday.

u also basically have to stand still to cast your ult now and u can mark the targets only 3 times which means a heavy gunner isn't going down even with max power (standing still in a sortie is instant death btw if u forgot)

Edited November 26, 2016 by Snargleflax

[DxAdder]

29 minutes ago, Snargleflax said:

i have a full duration ash - fleeting for endgame sedna arena (for heavy hitters i  do not even use bladestorm so its not that big of a deal) but in bladestorms current setup it is absolutely neccessary to cast it from stealth hence a duration overhaul is needed with the current direction you are taking with ash

All these issues with the "re-work" were brought up and Ignored. this is what you have for now.

 

 

[Snargleflax]

i understand what u guys are saying but with max duration with fleeting on i get 15 seconds it will take 7 to mark everything and then its gonna be 7 to go thru the animation then u will stand still for the heavy gunner u couldn't kill with 3 marks to shoot u in the face in a sortie the instant the animation is over

[John89brensen]

1 hour ago, Snargleflax said:

u also basically have to stand still to cast your ult now and u can mark the targets only 3 times which means a heavy gunner isn't going down even with max power (standing still in a sortie is instant death btw if u forgot)

Not true, you can easily mark targets on the run, although it does require some getting used to. I havent tested a maxed BS on a level 100 gunner yet, but if that is your problem then you need to get more creative with how you kill enemies. There no powers that can one shot an enemy at level 100, so i dont think its a big deal that BS cant do it.

If you use Fatal Teleport and a dagger with Covert Lethality you can kill pretty much any enemy in the game.

[Snargleflax]

17 minutes ago, John89brensen said:

Not true, you can easily mark targets on the run, although it does require some getting used to. I havent tested a maxed BS on a level 100 gunner yet, but if that is your problem then you need to get more creative with how you kill enemies. There no powers that can one shot an enemy at level 100, so i dont think its a big deal that BS cant do it.

If you use Fatal Teleport and a dagger with Covert Lethality you can kill pretty much any enemy in the game.

yea i use that with my duration build for max lvl sedna arena

[Marvelous_A]

I feel like Shuriken will be a better ult now if it throws 7 or maybe 10 shurikens at once and has innate armor reduction augment.

[kaliazane]

I dont see point in duration, with max effi energy is not an issue.

Use 2 Trickery sets for stealth.

[Kyronz]

So why not go loki? it is pretty clear they want only ivarra to have stealth dps dmg for now, i think they should make ash a starter frame since he has weaker skills then mag, excal and volt atm.   At the very least get rid of the silly hi level manic drops for him.

[SDGDen]

9 minutes ago, Kyronz said:

So why not go loki? it is pretty clear they want only ivarra to have stealth dps dmg for now, i think they should make ash a starter frame since he has weaker skills then mag, excal and volt atm.   At the very least get rid of the silly hi level manic drops for him.

aaaand how is murdering entire rooms from the shadows weaker than volt, mag and excal? also. those 3 are not starters since they are weak. if that was the case. hydroid would be a starter. 

[John89brensen]

5 minutes ago, Kyronz said:

So why not go loki? it is pretty clear they want only ivarra to have stealth dps dmg for now, i think they should make ash a starter frame since he has weaker skills then mag, excal and volt atm.   At the very least get rid of the silly hi level manic drops for him.

Weaker skills? He is purely combat oriented, and he is beefier than volt mag or excal. 

Ivara is an infiltrator frame with insane dps, but she is also slow and a complete glass cannon, she plays differently than Ahs which can just charge in and massacre everyone in the room.

Edit: also starter frames are not weak, especially not Excalibur, one of the best melee frames.

Edited November 26, 2016 by John89brensen

[Noobverest]

9 minutes ago, John89brensen said:

Weaker skills? He is purely combat oriented, and he is beefier than volt mag or excal. 

Ivara is an infiltrator frame with insane dps, but she is also slow and a complete glass cannon, she plays differently than Ahs which can just charge in and massacre everyone in the room.

Edit: also starter frames are not weak, especially not Excalibur, one of the best melee frames.

Are you talking about the old ash or the new ash

because the new ash has to charge inside a room, spin like a ballerina, then hit 4 to slash the room

but I mean, if I wanted to massacre a room, i could just use ignis. It'd be faster, and wouldn't cost any energy.

Edited November 26, 2016 by Noobverest

[Kyronz]

8 minutes ago, John89brensen said:

Weaker skills? He is purely combat oriented, and he is beefier than volt mag or excal. 

Ivara is an infiltrator frame with insane dps, but she is also slow and a complete glass cannon, she plays differently than Ahs which can just charge in and massacre everyone in the room.

Edit: also starter frames are not weak, especially not Excalibur, one of the best melee frames.

ahh you have not played him since change, he is worthless in groups targeting takes so long his one other dmg skill is precluded by an aura and pointless.

Even solo you will pop energy buttons and the energy rate kills his dmg anyways, assuming half the targets marked actually get the ult.   The problem is that the ult is  latent targeting so useless.  Yeah in theory you can mark 10 targetr, in group mode half of those will be dead, solo mode ash will be dead from trash invis.

The only solution to salvage this frame is active targeting like mesa *who only screws over the color blind*.

[Cloud]

Double trickery + naramon = trash duration on your build

[John89brensen]

1 minute ago, Noobverest said:

Are you talking about the old ash or the new ash

because the new ash has to charge inside a room, spin like a ballerina, then hit 4 to slash the room

but I mean, if I wanted to massacre a room, i could just use ignis. It'd be faster, and wouldn't cost any energy.

"Oh no... that press to win button is gone, i have to play to get a kill... poor poor me..."

Get real, its not much of a job to mark enemies, you can alternatively go invisible and use a melee weapon, or use Fatal Teleport between enemies.

Yes sure, you can use Ignis, or Tonkor, or Soma Prime, or Boltor Prime, or Synoid Simulor, or Zarr, or Vaykor Hek, or any of the Tigris, if we follow that reasoning why use powers at all.

[Kyronz]

2 minutes ago, John89brensen said:

"Oh no... that press to win button is gone, i have to play to get a kill... poor poor me..."

Get real, its not much of a job to mark enemies, you can alternatively go invisible and use a melee weapon, or use Fatal Teleport between enemies.

Yes sure, you can use Ignis, or Tonkor, or Soma Prime, or Boltor Prime, or Synoid Simulor, or Zarr, or Vaykor Hek, or any of the Tigris, if we follow that reasoning why use powers at all.

marking an enemy has zero effect on them, only on ash energy.

[kaliazane]

2 minutes ago, John89brensen said:

why use powers at all.

Because they kill fast.

My biggest issue is that they said they will increase dmg of bs to compensate basically nerf to killing speed. That would make him more viable in long runs, but they didnt.

[Snargleflax]

looking at my second spec which was bladestorm i now see something that is very annoying they made the character completely linear there is now only one viable build